*[Abandoned] Feudal England and Wales

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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:59 pm

Concerning the name medieval technically means between the fall of Rome and about the enlightenment however it is normal associated with period between the rises of mounted knights at hasting in 1066 around the 4th or 5th crusade so whilst it is technically correct it is not thought to be. I think Dark Age might be better but I don't it.
Feudal I believe is the system of government associated with William's combination of Norman and English land laws in 1066
Better perhaps would therefore be "Anglo Saxon England", "Anglo Saxon Briton", “The heptarchy”

What about Briton: Dark Ages?

I think a constant naming scheme using ether areas or towns names should be used I would suggest towns would be easier to verify (you’d also take the shire off of Nottingham and Lincoln) preferably place with a castle or cathedral prior to 1066.

Ok I think I agree with that. I'd prefer going with towns because that pesky "shire" takes up a lot of room! For the most part I have been trying to pick Castles that pre-date or arrived right around 1066.

The division wales and England should follow Offa's Dyke... The border of Flintshire should be moved west to better approximate the actual boundary of Offa's Dyke.

Ok, that shouldn't be hard to change.

The northern most Saxon rule is suspiciously Berwick on tweed’e

... what?

The kingdom of Strathclyde would have controlled the regions named Carlisle, Cumbria and Lancaster beyond the existence of Northumbria

I'm not so sure about adding another bonus up there. Is there a major castle that would be associated with defending Strathclyde?

By taking ~ 655 it would be reasonable to establish a Cornish contented of Exeter, Devonshire and Dartmoor.

Again I'm not so sure about adding another bonus. If I added a Cornwall region I would want to add Somerset and Dorchester. Part of the structure of the map is that Castles lie in the center of bonuses rather than on the borders. I want castles to be able to retaliate against border strikes, rather than defend them immediately. I'm sort of designing this map with trench gameplay in mind.
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby Oneyed on Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:58 pm

The Bison King wrote:
I think a constant naming scheme using ether areas or towns names should be used I would suggest towns would be easier to verify (you’d also take the shire off of Nottingham and Lincoln) preferably place with a castle or cathedral prior to 1066.

Ok I think I agree with that. I'd prefer going with towns because that pesky "shire" takes up a lot of room! For the most part I have been trying to pick Castles that pre-date or arrived right around 1066.



you could use anglosaxon names. it gives Dark Age feel to map.
The Bison King wrote:
The division wales and England should follow Offa's Dyke... The border of Flintshire should be moved west to better approximate the actual boundary of Offa's Dyke.

Ok, that shouldn't be hard to change.


...and maybe divide Wales to at least two bonuses. Wales were never realy united.
The Bison King wrote:
The kingdom of Strathclyde would have controlled the regions named Carlisle, Cumbria and Lancaster beyond the existence of Northumbria

I'm not so sure about adding another bonus up there. Is there a major castle that would be associated with defending Strathclyde?


you have a little unused space in Scotland. you can move name of map and here you can add 2 regions and one castle (Whithorn). these regions and Carlisle, Cumbria, Lancaster could be Strathclyde.

The Bison King wrote:
By taking ~ 655 it would be reasonable to establish a Cornish contented of Exeter, Devonshire and Dartmoor.

Again I'm not so sure about adding another bonus. If I added a Cornwall region I would want to add Somerset and Dorchester. Part of the structure of the map is that Castles lie in the center of bonuses rather than on the borders. I want castles to be able to retaliate against border strikes, rather than defend them immediately. I'm sort of designing this map with trench gameplay in mind.


if 655 AD is start of your map you can use Somerset and Dorchester as part of new bonus here. these were conquered by Saxons at the end of the 7th century.

btw, will you change picture of castles to something what will better fit the year 655?

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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Thu Feb 28, 2013 9:53 pm

you could use anglosaxon names. it gives Dark Age feel to map.

I've got an 800Ad map that I'm going to cross reference a lot of the names against.

...and maybe divide Wales to at least two bonuses. Wales were never realy united.

Maybe but perhaps not. If I divide Northumbria and Wales and Cornwall that only leaves Mercia as a double Castle bonus. For the interest of Gameplay I'd rather have multiple large bonuses that can be split between 2 players. It'll make for a more interesting map.

you have a little unused space in Scotland. you can move name of map and here you can add 2 regions and one castle (Whithorn). these regions and Carlisle, Cumbria, Lancaster could be Strathclyde.

You'll see this on my next version.

if 655 AD is start of your map you can use Somerset and Dorchester as part of new bonus here. these were conquered by Saxons at the end of the 7th century.

Again that's a maybe I'll conjure up some alternative versions. However I'm not pinning this down to a specific date in time.

btw, will you change picture of castles to something what will better fit the year 655?

No. As it is the castle is more of a representation of a castle and not an actual rendering of what you'd expect to see there so it shouldn't really matter any way. I know that tradition castles didn't appear until a hundred or so years after this era, but truly and honestly do not care. I really don't. I do not care. Castle's are cool, and this is the style of castle that I, and other people like. Its part of the whole reason I wanted to do this map. There were fortresses and strongholds in these regions and whether or not they looked exactly like the syle of building I represented them with really isn't that important to me or 99% of the people who will be playing this map. Honestly if you can't enjoy this map because the style of building I use to represent a castle isn't exactly period appropriate, that's fine with me, don't play it.
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby Oneyed on Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:02 am

The Bison King wrote:I've got an 800Ad map that I'm going to cross reference a lot of the names against.

Maybe but perhaps not. If I divide Northumbria and Wales and Cornwall that only leaves Mercia as a double Castle bonus. For the interest of Gameplay I'd rather have multiple large bonuses that can be split between 2 players. It'll make for a more interesting map.

Again that's a maybe I'll conjure up some alternative versions. However I'm not pinning this down to a specific date in time.

No. As it is the castle is more of a representation of a castle and not an actual rendering of what you'd expect to see there so it shouldn't really matter any way. I know that tradition castles didn't appear until a hundred or so years after this era, but truly and honestly do not care. I really don't. I do not care. Castle's are cool, and this is the style of castle that I, and other people like. Its part of the whole reason I wanted to do this map. There were fortresses and strongholds in these regions and whether or not they looked exactly like the syle of building I represented them with really isn't that important to me or 99% of the people who will be playing this map.


so you are doing Sci-fi Britain.
The Bison King wrote:Honestly if you can't enjoy this map because the style of building I use to represent a castle isn't exactly period appropriate, that's fine with me, don't play it.


well, very constructive. but thank you for saving my time - I do not "need" look here more.

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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:16 am

Bison, a couple of things.
Some of the castles do not have names.
Why brown for the water? Could a dirty blue be found?
Dartmoor has been cropped of the bottom of the map. Can you round that piece out so it is all on the map.
I do not think you need to be placing any more castles on the map or even towns. But I do like the RJBeals idea where you have the cut outs for the castles with 2 or 3 regions per castle. Can you see if you can fit something like that onto your map. You can keep the +2 auto deploy for the castle region on the map, but have a +1 or +2 deployable bonus for holding the whole castle. If you do not want to go cut out route, a simple grid table like in Spanish Armada would save room, and a lot of game play and be repetitively simple to do.

Let me know what you think. Last thing really now, send isaiah a PM about the size. As soon as you have that answer, we will get this moved on.
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:30 pm

Some of the castles do not have names.

Yeah that's an oops.

Why brown for the water? Could a dirty blue be found?

It was supposed to make it look like an old piece of paper. I could probably go the dirty blue route.

Dartmoor has been cropped of the bottom of the map. Can you round that piece out so it is all on the map.

Yes.

I do not think you need to be placing any more castles on the map or even towns.

Really? I agree that there are enough Castles but I'm still open to the town idea. It might make a nice addition.

But I do like the RJBeals idea where you have the cut outs for the castles with 2 or 3 regions per castle. Can you see if you can fit something like that onto your map. You can keep the +2 auto deploy for the castle region on the map, but have a +1 or +2 deployable bonus for holding the whole castle. If you do not want to go cut out route, a simple grid table like in Spanish Armada would save room, and a lot of game play and be repetitively simple to do.

No, I'm not really into either of these ideas. The castle's are the way they are to emphasis there purpose as a strategic fortification. They have an auto-deploy because they are fortresses, and they are strategically placed in area's that border a large number of territories. All this was on purpose.

Last thing really now, send isaiah a PM about the size. As soon as you have that answer, we will get this moved on.

Roger that. I'm going to hold off just a little longer to make sure it's the size I want, but soon.
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:48 pm

Great news, if you want towns on, find some and bung them on, but another route may be to go battle sites instead. Hold 2 battle sites for a +1 bonus. Plenty in history to choose from to keep the history nuts happy. ;)
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:32 pm

TBK, update?
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:51 am

koontz1973 wrote:TBK, update?

Ugh I know! I meant to put one up today but I didn't get around to it. I've been real busy.
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Mar 15, 2013 5:43 am

Sooner the better if you know what I mean. ;) But either way, it is all good.
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby chapcrap on Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:38 am

First time I've noticed this map. Are you really going to spell it Midieval?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/medieval?s=t&path=/
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:11 am

chapcrap wrote:First time I've noticed this map. Are you really going to spell it Midieval?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/medieval?s=t&path=/

lol. How do I keep screwwing that up???
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:47 pm

[Moved]

No update has been produced for a month now. Moved into ideas as no stamp has been given yet. Produce an update and it will be moved back.

koontz.
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:44 pm

koontz1973 wrote:[Moved]

No update has been produced for a month now. Moved into ideas as no stamp has been given yet. Produce an update and it will be moved back.

koontz.

Got Dang it!

I literally read this message as I was preparing to upload!!!

Click image to enlarge.
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Re: Midieval Britain [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:07 am

The Bison King wrote:Got Dang it!

I literally read this message as I was preparing to upload!!!


Well, if you would wait till the last second. :D

Nice sea now.
Towns are nicely placed, well done, but I think a better symbol can be found. Try two houses next to each other with the tower behind then, a slightly different colour to break it up. Get you symbols into the legend. Sea routes also. Remove Wales from the title. It may of been a separate country at times, but like a lot of the UK, it was classed as England at a lot of times.

TBK, are you happy with this? I am. Get these minor things done and be on your way to gameplay.
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:32 am

Click image to enlarge.
image


Nice sea now.
Towns are nicely placed, well done, but I think a better symbol can be found. Try two houses next to each other with the tower behind then, a slightly different colour to break it up. Get you symbols into the legend. Sea routes also. Remove Wales from the title. It may of been a separate country at times, but like a lot of the UK, it was classed as England at a lot of times.

TBK, are you happy with this? I am. Get these minor things done and be on your way to gameplay.


I will work on the town symbol later on.

Symbols on the legend. I think listing sea routes on the legend is obvious. I've never done it in the past, and it's never been a problem.

As you wished, removed Wales from the title.

I am happy with this and ready to be on my way.
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:08 am

Two days henceforth you will be knighted into the realm of main foundry. Arise Sir bison. ;)
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:55 am

TBK, my last official act in the drafting room is this stamp.
Image
Well done and good luck with the rest.

koontz.

Game play time, and what do you know, me again. :D

Have you decided on this yet?
To be determined:
Should players start randomly while Castle are protected by neutrals?
or
Should players start on the Castles and have to expand to the surrounding farmland that'll be neutral?

To be honest, whilst I do not like the feudal game play, it might be better for this map. So castle starts and rest of the map neutral.
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:35 am

koontz1973 wrote:TBK, my last official act in the drafting room is this stamp.
Image
Well done and good luck with the rest.

koontz.

Game play time, and what do you know, me again. :D

Have you decided on this yet?
To be determined:
Should players start randomly while Castle are protected by neutrals?
or
Should players start on the Castles and have to expand to the surrounding farmland that'll be neutral?

To be honest, whilst I do not like the feudal game play, it might be better for this map. So castle starts and rest of the map neutral.

Actually I'll be taking a queue from the new Baltic Crusades map and do the reverse of that. So players will start randomly and Castles will be protected by neutrals.
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:29 am

The Bison King wrote:Actually I'll be taking a queue from the new Baltic Crusades map and do the reverse of that. So players will start randomly and Castles will be protected by neutrals.

Fine with me as I like that over feudal. Can you do the starting list for the 8 game sizes and bung it in the first post for me.

Will look at the map tonight and think about neutrals for you.
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby Teflon Kris on Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:06 pm

In the South-East, I believe Rochester was a significant castle? Arundel in W Sussex? Lindsfarne in the far N.East (Lothian)? Cardiff = Caerphilly castle?


Possibly useful for medieval region names:

http://www.timeref.com/map3.htm

http://research.uvu.edu/mcdonald/anglo-saxon/wife%27slament/wifemaps&images.html

http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/art ... n-kingdoms

http://www.edmaps.com/anglo-saxon_kingdoms.jpg
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:15 pm

OP needs updating with the starting regions.
Castles need to go to a 5 neutral. All need to start neutral or bonuses will be dropped for small games if a player starts with a castle like York or Oxford. Towns can be a 2 or 3 neutral.


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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:20 am

koontz1973 wrote:OP needs updating with the starting regions.
Castles need to go to a 5 neutral. All need to start neutral or bonuses will be dropped for small games if a player starts with a castle like York or Oxford. Towns can be a 2 or 3 neutral.


Image

I know I know I've taken a real lackadaisical approach to the whole map making process lately.

I'm think 5 is a little high for castles. I'm thing 3 on castles and 2 on towns.

DJ Teflon wrote:In the South-East, I believe Rochester was a significant castle? Arundel in W Sussex? Lindsfarne in the far N.East (Lothian)? Cardiff = Caerphilly castle?


Possibly useful for medieval region names:

http://www.timeref.com/map3.htm

http://research.uvu.edu/mcdonald/anglo-saxon/wife%27slament/wifemaps&images.html

http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/art ... n-kingdoms

http://www.edmaps.com/anglo-saxon_kingdoms.jpg

These are awesome thank you.
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby koontz1973 on Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:27 am

The Bison King wrote:I'm think 5 is a little high for castles. I'm thing 3 on castles and 2 on towns.

2 for towns is fine as you need three of them. The reason for the 5 on the castles is to make players think twice over taking them. You get a good drop in one of the larger areas, you can take a castle in round one (3n) easily for a bonus of 1/2. Making the neutral 5, players will have to work for it if they want it. Also, you have to consider you are giving an auto deploy as well to the castles.
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Re: Feudal England and Wales [14/2] pg 1/8

Postby The Bison King on Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:48 am

koontz1973 wrote:
The Bison King wrote:I'm think 5 is a little high for castles. I'm thing 3 on castles and 2 on towns.

2 for towns is fine as you need three of them. The reason for the 5 on the castles is to make players think twice over taking them. You get a good drop in one of the larger areas, you can take a castle in round one (3n) easily for a bonus of 1/2. Making the neutral 5, players will have to work for it if they want it. Also, you have to consider you are giving an auto deploy as well to the castles.

hmm interesting point.
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