[Abandoned] Escape [19/5] Pages 1/9

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Re: Escape [3/2] V11 P1/6

Postby koontz1973 on Tue Feb 05, 2013 2:02 pm

Nole, in that sense you are right, leaving a single all over the place may allow you to get that extra troop, but singles are also easily taken. Hence the reason for the thinking before deploying. By round 3, a lot of singles are going to be everywhere, getting and keeping a foothold in any of the three areas is going to be differcult. Where you place your troops is going to become paramount. What is more important here, grabbing a gun and getting a secure place to defend from or getting the cards to advance to the winning condition. I had still planned to keep with the 15 starting regions max even for 1v1 games. So you only get 7 troops to start with on the first drop. You lose one, so if you place them all on one region, you only get to attack with 9. You will need to take two lots of threes to get player 2 down to a drop of 6. But this will leave all of yours undefended.

thanks isaiah. Hope you are not in too much pain. O:)
ManBungalow wrote:koontz, I think most of your maps would benefit from nicer background texture and better fonts.

What is wrong with stucco for the background and marble for the map?
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Re: Escape [3/2] V11 P1/6

Postby ManBungalow on Tue Feb 05, 2013 2:29 pm

koontz1973 wrote:
ManBungalow wrote:koontz, I think most of your maps would benefit from nicer background texture and better fonts.

What is wrong with stucco for the background and marble for the map?

I can't quite put into words why, but the 'stucco' background in particular just looks...tacky. It feels almost 'cheap'.

For contrast, let's take a quick look at the background of Supermax. It's little more than a gradient of two colours, but it still looks cool and has a certain richness to it.

And while I hesitate to use Draknor as an example, because it really is in a league of its own, it's well worth looking at. Just look at how awesome it is.
I recognise that Escape and Draknor have different themes, but you can see the similarities in the "overhead of rooms with doors" aspect.

I'm aware that you're still in the gameplay stage here, but I mention this now because I know you won't want to totally change the graphics later on in the development process.

Keep at it koontz.
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Re: Escape [3/2] V11 P1/6

Postby koontz1973 on Tue Feb 05, 2013 11:47 pm

Alright ManB, will change the stucco but will keep the marble. Do you have anything that you think might look better but keeping with the theme of government/secret labs? Both examples you gave are wrong. The supermax one is just plain but has that bevelled metal in the legend part. Not really suitable for a wall. Draknor has stone. Both are great for those maps.

Any ideas anyone for the main part of the background? Will be keeping it one colour though with the blood drips.

On a side note MB, "Keep at it koontz." when you post this, I find it insulting and I feel you are trying to bait me, can you please stop it.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby koontz1973 on Sat Feb 09, 2013 3:51 am

New background. Glows. Mini map. Moved some icons around.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby Funkyterrance on Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:01 pm

koontz1973 wrote:New background. Glows. Mini map. Moved some icons around.
Click image to enlarge.
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The background and other changes are an improvement for sure. It looks more finished already.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby koontz1973 on Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:52 am

Funkyterrance wrote:The background and other changes are an improvement for sure. It looks more finished already.

Cheers FT, anything else you spotted that might need a look at?
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby nolefan5311 on Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:54 pm

I think the knife, pistol, and medicine symbols need to be more pronounced. For medicine, I only see 4, so perhaps just make those rooms different colors, and call them like Pharmacy 1, 2, and 3, or something like that?

Also, for the regions with two names in them (Security 1/Security 2, Manager 3/Sec 4, Sec 1/Manager 1, etc), are these two separate regions? If so, can they both attack out into the hallway? If not, I think you need to draw a clear line showing they do not border the hallways. I see them in previous drafts...perhaps they just got lost in this latest one.

"Virus Carries" should be "Virus Carriers", or better yet, "Infected".

I still don't think the mini-map is as clear as it should be. Is there any way you can split the mini map so there is a clear gap between bonus zones?

Also, I need to examine the conditional borders more, but I'll have to do that once everything else is sorted out. I'm still not keen on the 1 troops for every two regions. In 1v1, a player starts with 15 regions, so 7 troops. It's not hard to conceive me taking my opponent down to 11 regions and his drop to 5 for his first turn.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby koontz1973 on Sun Feb 10, 2013 1:18 pm

nolefan5311 wrote:I think the knife, pistol, and medicine symbols need to be more pronounced. For medicine, I only see 4, so perhaps just make those rooms different colors, and call them like Pharmacy 1, 2, and 3, or something like that?

Can do. Probably not different colours but will look into getting them more pronounced.
nolefan5311 wrote:Also, for the regions with two names in them (Security 1/Security 2, Manager 3/Sec 4, Sec 1/Manager 1, etc), are these two separate regions? If so, can they both attack out into the hallway? If not, I think you need to draw a clear line showing they do not border the hallways. I see them in previous drafts...perhaps they just got lost in this latest one.

New rules for the latest couple of drafts. Instead of the free for all, I am going to use attack lines. Tried to put in region borders and that did not work. So am going really old school and use attack lines. But with a twist and use blood trails. Does this need explaining? (guess so as you did not pick up on it, will add to legend).
nolefan5311 wrote:"Virus Carries" should be "Virus Carriers", or better yet, "Infected".

I like infected. Nice one nole. =D>
nolefan5311 wrote:Also, I need to examine the conditional borders more, but I'll have to do that once everything else is sorted out. I'm still not keen on the 1 troops for every two regions. In 1v1, a player starts with 15 regions, so 7 troops. It's not hard to conceive me taking my opponent down to 11 regions and his drop to 5 for his first turn.

But if you did that, you would end up leaving yourself vulnerable to a counter attack. To get him down to a 5 drop, you need to take 6 regions. 17-6=11=5 drop. Dice would need to be bloody good for that as that would be 15 troops to knock out in one round. Been thinking about this one though as you seem unhappy with it. how about the bonuses go like Route66 and the Vertex/Austrum maps. +1 for every 4 connected in a bonus zone. Keep the 3 bonus zones only though. This would mean hallways become part of the bonus zones for each of the 3 areas.
Hallways 1-8 admin only, 9-15 dorms and labs, 16-20 labs only.
Doing this though, I will keep the decays as is and the drops will still be a random 15 max now including the hallways (previous thoughts was to have these all start neutral).

Update tomorrow.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby nolefan5311 on Sun Feb 10, 2013 1:32 pm

koontz1973 wrote:
nolefan5311 wrote:Also, I need to examine the conditional borders more, but I'll have to do that once everything else is sorted out. I'm still not keen on the 1 troops for every two regions. In 1v1, a player starts with 15 regions, so 7 troops. It's not hard to conceive me taking my opponent down to 11 regions and his drop to 5 for his first turn.

But if you did that, you would end up leaving yourself vulnerable to a counter attack. To get him down to a 5 drop, you need to take 6 regions. 17-6=11=5 drop. Dice would need to be bloody good for that as that would be 15 troops to knock out in one round. Been thinking about this one though as you seem unhappy with it. how about the bonuses go like Route66 and the Vertex/Austrum maps. +1 for every 4 connected in a bonus zone. Keep the 3 bonus zones only though. This would mean hallways become part of the bonus zones for each of the 3 areas.
Hallways 1-8 admin only, 9-15 dorms and labs, 16-20 labs only.
Doing this though, I will keep the decays as is and the drops will still be a random 15 max now including the hallways (previous thoughts was to have these all start neutral).

Update tomorrow.


To get him to a 5 drop you would only need to take 3 regions to get him to 11 (1 troop for every two regions - 10 regions is 5 troops). I'm I'm dropping 7 that's 10 troops to take 9, which is better than 50%. At that point you might be exposing yourself to counter attack, but you've also put your opponent in a big hole. I'm basing this off of the OP where you state each player starts with 15 in 1v1.

I don't like the connected bonuses either, not with the guns and knives and the standard continent bonuses. And you'd have to do something about the killer neutral getting in the way.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby koontz1973 on Sun Feb 10, 2013 2:21 pm

Sorry nole, let me start again as even I am getting confused with this one. I need to update the OP and will do so after the next draft is posted.

Go back to the normal +1 for 3 regions gives a drop of 5. So an extra 2 troops is not that much. But a normal 1/3 means only 1 region gone and we end up with a loss of a troop for player 2 in two player games.
I'm dropping 7 that's 10 troops to take 9,

9 to take 12 troops as you have lost one in the decay at the start and need to take 4 regions. But I take your point which is why I am trying to come up with a solution.
standard continent bonuses

No continent bonuses anywhere on this map. The 3 so called continents (admin, dorms and labs) are just regions in which a different scale of bonus can be had. This will become flat though.

Let me have a think about it tonight and see what I can come up with.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby ManBungalow on Sun Feb 10, 2013 2:39 pm

Changing the background makes a big difference.

I'll be back with more comments some point soon.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby frankiebee on Tue Feb 12, 2013 4:35 pm

Very cool theme and map!
One question pops in my mind. Is it the objective to reach the helipad as first player or do you have to hold it for 1 turn to win. Most maps with an objective requires to hold a certain area for 1 turn. If this is the case on this map, i think it should be a bit clearer in the map description, because when I read the map, I got the feeling that when you reach the helipad you win instantly.

Can't wait to play this one!
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby nolefan5311 on Mon Feb 18, 2013 9:29 am

frankiebee wrote:Very cool theme and map!
One question pops in my mind. Is it the objective to reach the helipad as first player or do you have to hold it for 1 turn to win. Most maps with an objective requires to hold a certain area for 1 turn. If this is the case on this map, i think it should be a bit clearer in the map description, because when I read the map, I got the feeling that when you reach the helipad you win instantly.

Can't wait to play this one!


Any map with a winning condition requires that the player hold it until the start of their next turn, and this map isn't any different. However, perhaps you can come up with some wording, koontz, to make it clearer?

Looking forward to your update...think it's pretty close to being moved up.
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Re: Escape [3/2] V11 P1/6

Postby iancanton on Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:25 pm

koontz1973 wrote:So you only get 7 troops to start with on the first drop. You lose one, so if you place them all on one region, you only get to attack with 9. You will need to take two lots of threes to get player 2 down to a drop of 6.

aren't both players in 1v1 virtually certain to start with 1 or 2 of the admin, dorm or labs bonuses? if so, it'll be probable that u're able to knock out the other player's bonus.

ian. :)
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby koontz1973 on Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:26 am

Sorry guys, trying to get an update out, but it is going slower than I hoped. Every time I solve a problem, another crops up.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7

Postby -=- Tanarri -=- on Thu Feb 28, 2013 10:48 pm

Hey Koontz and Nolefan, interesting looking map here and I look forward to playing it one day :)

Just a quick note for something I caught while looking at the map: The bottom right note, where it gives the story, it says 'Closits connect', whereas it should be 'Closets connect'. Keep up the great work :)
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7 Vacation please.

Postby koontz1973 on Sat Mar 02, 2013 2:41 am

Bung this on vacation for a while please guys. I am having trouble finding the time to work on it. Should get back to it in a few months though.
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Re: Escape [9/2] V12 P1/7 Vacation please.

Postby isaiah40 on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:54 am

[Moved]

At the request of the mapmaker, this map has been placed on vacation for a period of 6 months. After the 6 months the map will be considered Abandoned. If the mapmaker wants to continue with the map, then one of the Cartographer Assistants will be able to help put the thread back into the Foundry system, after an update has been made. ;-)

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Re: * [Vacation valid until Sept 2013] Escape

Postby koontz1973 on Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:18 am

Can we move this back into the foundry please.
OK, I think I got all of the things and sorted out most problems. Fixed all spellings and what not. Added the winning condition in plain English, changed to normal reinforcements of 1/3, min of 3. The only thing now is to decide how to deploy initial forces.
show: idea 1

show: Idea 2

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Re: * [Vacation valid until Sept 2013] Escape

Postby isaiah40 on Mon Apr 08, 2013 9:50 pm

[Moved]

Welcome back to the Main Foundry!!
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Re: Escape [9/4] Pages 1/9

Postby koontz1973 on Mon Apr 08, 2013 10:03 pm

Thanks isaiah for the move. OK, not much done graphically for this since hiatus, but I would like to focus on GP for now only.

Any suggestions for this now.
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Re: Escape [9/4] Pages 1/9

Postby nolefan5311 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:31 am

I prefer the first idea koontz. 3 regions per player, so there is no bonus dropping. I also like the bonus structure for the 3 zones.

Maybe you can start regions off at 4 or 5, to offset the -1 decay for regions? So players can drop 3 onto a 4 or 5 stack to begin attacking?

I also think you need to put some sort "open barriers" in the regions with 2 names (Manager 3, Sec 4) and in the hallways, sort of like how you have 2 half walls in Admin 4
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Re: Escape [9/4] Pages 1/9

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:15 pm

nolefan5311 wrote:I prefer the first idea koontz. 3 regions per player, so there is no bonus dropping. I also like the bonus structure for the 3 zones.

I do as well. Give a more alone feeling, mainly in foggy games. Head round a corner and hit a stack will be like coming face to face with a hoard of zombies.
nolefan5311 wrote:Maybe you can start regions off at 4 or 5, to offset the -1 decay for regions? So players can drop 3 onto a 4 or 5 stack to begin attacking?

Again, a good idea. I like the five. This will allow the decay and still give enough troops to head out and attack.
nolefan5311 wrote:I also think you need to put some sort "open barriers" in the regions with 2 names (Manager 3, Sec 4) and in the hallways, sort of like how you have 2 half walls in Admin 4

Not sure. I understand the reason, but most offices would not have barriers between these sort of areas in every office where space is tight. How to do the dorm rooms and the lounge areas? Would bringing out the blood trails more help I wonder and have the army circles on the trails.

Thanks nole. Vote large. :D
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Re: Escape [9/4] Pages 1/9

Postby nolefan5311 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:29 pm

koontz1973 wrote:
nolefan5311 wrote:I also think you need to put some sort "open barriers" in the regions with 2 names (Manager 3, Sec 4) and in the hallways, sort of like how you have 2 half walls in Admin 4

Not sure. I understand the reason, but most offices would not have barriers between these sort of areas in every office where space is tight. How to do the dorm rooms and the lounge areas? Would bringing out the blood trails more help I wonder and have the army circles on the trails.


I only say this because it's a little ambiguous if the interior of the two regions attack out into the hallway as well (Security 2, Finance 1, Manager 3). Similarly, do Dorms 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5 all border each other, and all attack out into the hallway, and do they all border Lounge 1, 2, and 3? Or do they only border regions adjacent along the blood trail? If so, perhaps you need to make the blood trail a little more conspicuous.
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Re: Escape [9/4] Pages 1/9

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:32 pm

nolefan5311 wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:
nolefan5311 wrote:I also think you need to put some sort "open barriers" in the regions with 2 names (Manager 3, Sec 4) and in the hallways, sort of like how you have 2 half walls in Admin 4

Not sure. I understand the reason, but most offices would not have barriers between these sort of areas in every office where space is tight. How to do the dorm rooms and the lounge areas? Would bringing out the blood trails more help I wonder and have the army circles on the trails.


I only say this because it's a little ambiguous if the interior of the two regions attack out into the hallway as well (Security 2, Finance 1, Manager 3). Similarly, do Dorms 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5 all border each other, and all attack out into the hallway, and do they all border Lounge 1, 2, and 3? Or do they only border regions adjacent along the blood trail? If so, perhaps you need to make the blood trail a little more conspicuous.

Now I understand. Less ambiguous. Just make it clearer what attacks what then. I will redo the trails and bring them out a tad so it will all be in a line with the odd on going on to attack more than one in the larger areas like the dorm and atrium.
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