New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby MrBenn on Tue Feb 01, 2011 6:35 am

bedub1 wrote:How did you come up with those resolution's? Wouldn't it be possible to follow something that's more along the lines of what fits on a monitor? Looking at, oh, I don't know...every monitor made these days...why not stick to 1080p or something of the sorts? Like 1280x720(720p) for small and 1920x1080(1080p) for Large? Then full screen with no scrolly bars at all...and clickable maps...the average joe blow might be able to play without scrolling... (I might even go 1680x1050 for small maps).

The SuperSize limits were based on typical monitor settings (partially from a poll of CC users and partially from other stats). We've had to allow a couple of hundred pixels for the sidebar and header bar; while we would have liked to go bigger we do need to consider the typical CC user, and not just those who have TaCktiX spec computers! (The small map size is optimised for users with 1280x1024 monitors)

After a bit of playing around with monitor settings, we decided to settle with 1000x800 for a small map image (note that the limit is no longer a square in order to minimise scrolling). To obtain the large map sizes, we multiplied the small sizes by 1/3 and rounded them up to be something more memorable... Like everything in the foundry, it's half-science and half-aesthetics :P
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby bedub1 on Tue Feb 01, 2011 4:40 pm

MrBenn wrote:(The small map size is optimized for users with 1280x1024 monitors)

Why? That's old school square CRT not new school rectangle LCD. Plan for the future...not the past or present.
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby natty dread on Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:02 pm

I have a 1280x1024 TFT monitor. It's definitely not just a CRT resolution.

And if we plan for the future, future monitors will very likely have a higher vertical resolution than 1k anyway, so...
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby TaCktiX on Tue Feb 01, 2011 11:23 pm

The most typical resolution of decent-size LCDs these days is 1980x1080, the so-called 1080p. Granted I'm ridiculous in having 3 monitors at that resolution (one's a TV). 21"-27" monitors all clock in at that resolution, only 30" monitors have the 2560x1600 of absurdity.
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby bedub1 on Wed Feb 02, 2011 12:25 am

TaCktiX wrote:The most typical resolution of decent-size LCDs these days is 1980x1080, the so-called 1080p. Granted I'm ridiculous in having 3 monitors at that resolution (one's a TV). 21"-27" monitors all clock in at that resolution, only 30" monitors have the 2560x1600 of absurdity.

I think you mean 1920x1080. But yes, you are right. Which is why I don't understand why 1400x1200 has been chosen. Why not stretch the 1400 out further closer to 1920 and shrink the 1200 down to 1080?

Otherwise...if you are going for scroll bars...might as well make it even bigger. Given 1200 is 11% larger than 1080, might as well stretch the 1400 out to 2133, which is 11% greater than 1920. Thus the "big" map would be 2133x1200. And if you are going to do that...why even have limitations in the first place?

Is this a change for map makers, or for players? Are maps made for map-makers, or players?
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby Bruceswar on Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:52 am

Laptops are slow to catch up!
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby MrBenn on Wed Feb 02, 2011 5:48 am

bedub1 wrote:
TaCktiX wrote:The most typical resolution of decent-size LCDs these days is 1980x1080, the so-called 1080p. Granted I'm ridiculous in having 3 monitors at that resolution (one's a TV). 21"-27" monitors all clock in at that resolution, only 30" monitors have the 2560x1600 of absurdity.

I think you mean 1920x1080. But yes, you are right. Which is why I don't understand why 1400x1200 has been chosen. Why not stretch the 1400 out further closer to 1920 and shrink the 1200 down to 1080?

It's about scalability. The real limitation is on the small image size (Which as I said previously is optimised for users with 1280x1024 monitors). It would be pretty impractical to apply limits to the large map that did not have similar scalability - it wouldn't be practical to allow the large map to be wider unless there were also additional height.
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby bedub1 on Wed Feb 02, 2011 12:17 pm

MrBenn wrote:
bedub1 wrote:
TaCktiX wrote:The most typical resolution of decent-size LCDs these days is 1980x1080, the so-called 1080p. Granted I'm ridiculous in having 3 monitors at that resolution (one's a TV). 21"-27" monitors all clock in at that resolution, only 30" monitors have the 2560x1600 of absurdity.

I think you mean 1920x1080. But yes, you are right. Which is why I don't understand why 1400x1200 has been chosen. Why not stretch the 1400 out further closer to 1920 and shrink the 1200 down to 1080?

It's about scalability. The real limitation is on the small image size (Which as I said previously is optimised for users with 1280x1024 monitors). It would be pretty impractical to apply limits to the large map that did not have similar scalability - it wouldn't be practical to allow the large map to be wider unless there were also additional height.

So is there any chance of re-optimizing the map for rectangular monitors instead of square monitors? Or is this just a waste of my time?

EDIT: I know wikipedia isn't really considered a source by many...but....

Until about 2003, most computer monitors had a 4:3 aspect ratio and some had 5:4. Between 2003 and 2006, monitors with 16:9 and 16:10 (8:5) aspect ratios have become commonly available, first in laptops and later also in standalone monitors.

It looks to me like you based your standard on something that was great...back in 2003 (8 years ago).

As of 2010 the breakdown according to http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_display.asp was like this. The first two are in fact squares, but the next 7 are rectangles. Do you have stats for CC users monitors resolutions? Rectangles might not currently hold the top 2 spots, but they have the greatest percentage, and the industry trend is moving from square to rectangle. Just go look at a TV now days. Can you even BUY a square one?

1024x768 20%
1280x1024 18.2 %
1280x800 17.3 %
1440x900 10.5 %
1680x1050 10.0 %
1920x1200 4.6 %
1366x768 3.6 %
1920x1080 2.3 %
1152x864 2.1 %
1600x1200 1.4 %
1280x768 1.2 %
800x600 1%

Square Total: 40.6%
Rectangle Total: 49.3%
Unknown: 3%
Other 4.8%

I'm not sure why it doesn't add up to 100%.

Map Resolutions are a little like politics. More often than not, you'll never win someone over to your side with any amount of evidence/hearsay/inference one can muster.--bedub1
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby MrBenn on Wed Feb 02, 2011 1:25 pm

55.5% fall into the top three categories on your list. The small map is optimised for these resolutions (although is slightly too tall for the 1024x768 size). I'm going to stop arguing semantics here, because the important thing is that the map size restrictionhas been increased - this has been something I've ben wanting for a long time (and so have many others)
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby ironsij0287 on Wed Feb 02, 2011 1:54 pm

natty_dread wrote:Those are only the maximum sizes, it doesn't mean that every mapmaker needs to go with those sizes or dimensions.

Most maps will still be made within the old size limits. The supersizes are only for maps that can't be made into a regular size.



Really I can see Supersize helping mapmakers with doing maps of places that are very elongated. The extra size will allow them to keep the same maximum height or width that we currently have but extending the other dimension even further to best fit the area within the map.
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby RjBeals on Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:32 pm

MrBenn wrote:
  • Standard maximum sizes: 630x600 pixels for a small map and 840x800 pixels for a large map.
  • SuperSize limits: 1000x800 pixels for a small map, and 1400x1200 pixels for a large map


Has anyone attempted a supersize map yet? Seems I'm still seeing standard sizes.
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Re: New(ish) Year, New(ish) Foundry!

Postby isaiah40 on Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:40 pm

RjBeals wrote:
MrBenn wrote:
  • Standard maximum sizes: 630x600 pixels for a small map and 840x800 pixels for a large map.
  • SuperSize limits: 1000x800 pixels for a small map, and 1400x1200 pixels for a large map


Has anyone attempted a supersize map yet? Seems I'm still seeing standard sizes.


Right here viewtopic.php?f=64&t=136536
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