RIP Foundry Avatars

Topics that are not maps. Discuss general map making concepts, techniques, contests, etc, here.

Moderators: Cartographers, Global Moderators

Forum rules
Please read the Community Guidelines before posting.

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby MrBenn on Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:46 pm

When I stepped down as Foundry Foreman, I deliberately left out my reasons for doing so. I know too well the struggles described by thenobodies80, and I support this action wholeheartedly.

Whatever lackattack has said about the importance of conquerclub's maps is undermined by his complete disregard for the foundry (including the game-finder/map-browser). To lackattack: Orthopraxy (what you do) is more properly basic than orthodoxy (what you think).
Image
PB: 2661 | He's blue... If he were green he would die | No mod would be stupid enough to do that
User avatar
Lieutenant MrBenn
Retired Team Member
 
Posts: 7051
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:32 am
Location: Off Duty
Medals: 67
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (3) Freestyle Achievement (2) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (2)
General Achievement (6) Clan Achievement (1) Map Contribution (7) Tournament Contribution (2) General Contribution (15)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby Pedronicus on Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:53 pm

For someone who has been here from the start, can you map boffins explain what you could or would like to do with maps that is unable to be done with the code at your disposal?

Just coming on here moaning about lack not backing you up, is pretty meaningless to us game players, unless you can explain what new ideas you've had.
Image
Highest position 7th. Highest points 3311 All of my graffiti can be found here
Major Pedronicus
 
Posts: 2081
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2006 2:42 pm
Location: Busy not shitting you....
Medals: 71
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (4) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (3) Freestyle Achievement (3) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (6) General Achievement (5) Clan Achievement (13) Tournament Contribution (4)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby MrBenn on Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:58 pm

Pedronicus wrote:For someone who has been here from the start, can you map boffins explain what you could or would like to do with maps that is unable to be done with the code at your disposal?

Just coming on here moaning about lack not backing you up, is pretty meaningless to us game players, unless you can explain what new ideas you've had.

Here's 47 pages worth of suggestions dating back to 2009: viewtopic.php?f=127&t=17885&start=690#p2178673

And here's the list that was shortlisted back in 2009 following discussions with lackattack, together with any suggestions that have been made since: viewtopic.php?f=127&t=103961
Last edited by MrBenn on Sat Jul 14, 2012 7:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Image
PB: 2661 | He's blue... If he were green he would die | No mod would be stupid enough to do that
User avatar
Lieutenant MrBenn
Retired Team Member
 
Posts: 7051
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:32 am
Location: Off Duty
Medals: 67
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (3) Freestyle Achievement (2) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (2)
General Achievement (6) Clan Achievement (1) Map Contribution (7) Tournament Contribution (2) General Contribution (15)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby isaiah40 on Sat Jul 14, 2012 7:01 pm

While the code we currently have IMHO does the job, after awhile, making maps with the same old XML code gets boring. There are plenty of great XML features that can be done in this thread. Conditional borders, conditional autodeploys etc. Image how many new and exciting maps can be made! We need new features, updates etc. Personally I find the same ole code to be boring. We need new life in our maps!!
User avatar
Lieutenant isaiah40
 
Posts: 3967
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 7:14 pm
Location: To be absent from the body is to be present with Christ
Medals: 37
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (2) General Achievement (4) Map Contribution (5) General Contribution (6)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby Pedronicus on Sat Jul 14, 2012 7:03 pm

MrBenn wrote:When I stepped down as Foundry Foreman, I deliberately left out my reasons for doing so. I know too well the struggles described by thenobodies80, and I support this action wholeheartedly.

Whatever lackattack has said about the importance of conquerclub's maps is undermined by his complete disregard for the foundry (including the game-finder/map-browser). To lackattack: Orthopraxy (what you do) is more properly basic than orthodoxy (what you think).


Oooooh! big words!

MrBenn wrote: I remember with great clarity my first contributions (to Dust Bowl and the British Isles revamp), and the thrill of seeing a suggestion come to life (the Sparkling Cherry on the Conquer Man Cake!).


and pointless foundry shit that idiots like you specialised in.... :roll:

[Mod Edit]
Last edited by thenobodies80 on Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Flame Removed
Image
Highest position 7th. Highest points 3311 All of my graffiti can be found here
Major Pedronicus
 
Posts: 2081
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2006 2:42 pm
Location: Busy not shitting you....
Medals: 71
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (4) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (3) Freestyle Achievement (3) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (6) General Achievement (5) Clan Achievement (13) Tournament Contribution (4)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby MrBenn on Sat Jul 14, 2012 7:09 pm

Last edited by thenobodies80 on Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Flame removed
Image
PB: 2661 | He's blue... If he were green he would die | No mod would be stupid enough to do that
User avatar
Lieutenant MrBenn
Retired Team Member
 
Posts: 7051
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:32 am
Location: Off Duty
Medals: 67
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (3) Freestyle Achievement (2) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (2)
General Achievement (6) Clan Achievement (1) Map Contribution (7) Tournament Contribution (2) General Contribution (15)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby DiM on Sat Jul 14, 2012 8:17 pm

looks like lack is bringing all his multis in this thread :lol:
“In the beginning God said, the four-dimensional divergence of an antisymmetric, second rank tensor equals zero, and there was light, and it was good. And on the seventh day he rested.”- Michio Kaku
Image
User avatar
Major DiM
 
Posts: 10554
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:20 pm
Location: making maps for scooby snacks
Medals: 45
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2) Assassin Achievement (2)
Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1)
Cross-Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (4) General Achievement (4) Map Contribution (10)
Tournament Contribution (4) General Contribution (3)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby natty dread on Sun Jul 15, 2012 12:40 am

Pedronicus wrote:you stepping down as foundry foreman was a complete non event. Until I read you post I wasn't even aware of the fact that you held a position


That's basically an argument from ignorance... it's because you don't spend time in the foundry, you're not here to see the basically amazing amount of time and effort these people contribute to keep things going, in order for you and your pals to get maps to play on... you just see the end result, and maybe show up when the maps are already in beta to complain about a thing or two.

See, it's like you're this fat kid, right, and there's a shortage of meat... and suddenly all the cows start dying of AIDS because the farmers keep fucking them in the ass or something. And then you'd be all like, "I don't care if all the cows die of AIDS, who needs cows when we have hamburgers"...

Pedronicus wrote:Oooooh! big words!


You know, you can always use a dictionary to look them up.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby Robespierre__ on Sun Jul 15, 2012 7:06 am

What I don't understand is why this great bunch of volunteers does not feel supported by Lack. While it seems they have logic and reason behind their dissatisfaction, that actually does not matter. The very fact that they *FEEL* dissatisfied is all that should matter to Lack. That feeling needs to be addressed else you will get what you have here: volunteers not wanting to volunteer. Please, Lack. Care about what these guys feel. They are trying to help. Don't make them feel like they are running into a brick wall.
User avatar
Brigadier Robespierre__
 
Posts: 327
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 2:23 pm
Location: New Jersey
Medals: 76
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (3) Cross-Map Achievement (4) Beta Map Achievement (1)
Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (18) General Achievement (3) Clan Achievement (14) Tournament Contribution (1)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby greenoaks on Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:15 am

Robespierre__ wrote:What I don't understand is why this great bunch of volunteers does not feel supported by Lack. While it seems they have logic and reason behind their dissatisfaction, that actually does not matter. The very fact that they *FEEL* dissatisfied is all that should matter to Lack. That feeling needs to be addressed else you will get what you have here: volunteers not wanting to volunteer. Please, Lack. Care about what these guys feel. They are trying to help. Don't make them feel like they are running into a brick wall.

but why?

they are not required. the foundry is no longer required. maps can be and are now made without the foundry's involvement.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class greenoaks
 
Posts: 9997
Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2007 12:47 am
Medals: 138
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (4) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (3)
Assassin Achievement (3) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (4) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (4)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (4) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (30) General Achievement (3) Clan Achievement (14)
Tournament Contribution (34) General Contribution (4)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby natty dread on Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:16 am

greenoaks wrote:
Robespierre__ wrote:What I don't understand is why this great bunch of volunteers does not feel supported by Lack. While it seems they have logic and reason behind their dissatisfaction, that actually does not matter. The very fact that they *FEEL* dissatisfied is all that should matter to Lack. That feeling needs to be addressed else you will get what you have here: volunteers not wanting to volunteer. Please, Lack. Care about what these guys feel. They are trying to help. Don't make them feel like they are running into a brick wall.

but why?

they are not required. the foundry is no longer required. maps can be and are now made without the foundry's involvement.


Yeah, super crappy maps.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby DiM on Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:23 am

crappy maps?
i wouldn't call those maps.
more like crappy crap. ;)
“In the beginning God said, the four-dimensional divergence of an antisymmetric, second rank tensor equals zero, and there was light, and it was good. And on the seventh day he rested.”- Michio Kaku
Image
User avatar
Major DiM
 
Posts: 10554
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:20 pm
Location: making maps for scooby snacks
Medals: 45
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2) Assassin Achievement (2)
Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1)
Cross-Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (4) General Achievement (4) Map Contribution (10)
Tournament Contribution (4) General Contribution (3)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby DiM on Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:28 am

also you have to realise that the foundry has been ignored for many years and yet it continued to produce maps.
if we were to rebel and boycott CC(*) when this whole neglect started, CC would have less than 50 maps and most of them would be the unrevamped versions. so i doubt greenoaks would come in and say the foundry is not needed when he'd have just a bunch of bad-looking maps to play on.
so probably the foundry's biggest mistake was not making a fuss when lack's first deadline came and he gave us nothing. instead we got fooled with empty promises of things that never came.

(*)assuming all mapmakers would have the balls to participate in such a boycott.
“In the beginning God said, the four-dimensional divergence of an antisymmetric, second rank tensor equals zero, and there was light, and it was good. And on the seventh day he rested.”- Michio Kaku
Image
User avatar
Major DiM
 
Posts: 10554
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:20 pm
Location: making maps for scooby snacks
Medals: 45
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2) Assassin Achievement (2)
Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1)
Cross-Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (4) General Achievement (4) Map Contribution (10)
Tournament Contribution (4) General Contribution (3)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby greenoaks on Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:44 am

DiM wrote:also you have to realise that the foundry has been ignored for many years and yet it continued to produce maps.
if we were to rebel and boycott CC(*) when this whole neglect started, CC would have less than 50 maps and most of them would be the unrevamped versions. so i doubt greenoaks would come in and say the foundry is not needed when he'd have just a bunch of bad-looking maps to play on.
so probably the foundry's biggest mistake was not making a fuss when lack's first deadline came and he gave us nothing. instead we got fooled with empty promises of things that never came.

(*)assuming all mapmakers would have the balls to participate in such a boycott.

exactly, your success lessons your need.

don't get me wrong, my favourite maps are the Realms maps and i run tournaments on Beta maps just to help get you lot some feedback but while you continue to churn out maps you undermine your argument that CC needs to add xml features.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class greenoaks
 
Posts: 9997
Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2007 12:47 am
Medals: 138
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (4) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (3)
Assassin Achievement (3) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (4) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (4)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (4) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (30) General Achievement (3) Clan Achievement (14)
Tournament Contribution (34) General Contribution (4)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby Gigi1 on Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:58 am

I have never made a map before, so I am not a mapmaker. I never heard of lackattack before reading this forum. I never heard of thenobodies80 nor DiM nor Natty Dread before neither. Because I am a member who enjoys playing on this site I would like to express my gratitude to all of you. Thank you very much!

I am interested to hear about this strike. It sounds like its a dictatorship, but the dictator has gone silent. Its really all up to lackattack isn't it? He set up a system whereby he got free mapmakers, and then when he got enough he went silent. He's getting $25 per membership to run the site and he may have enough money that any more or less money doesn't excite him to move or change anymore.

It also sounds like if the mapmakers leave the site survives. But on the other hand, if lackattack leaves then the site dies, unless a successor dictator is appointed.

Even if the mapmakers get 100% support from a majority of the members, what does that accomplish without lackattack's desire to allow the mapmakers to make more maps.

This site is what it is. It is not the real world for most of us. It is an escape from the realities of everyday life. It is fun, mindless entertainment. We get to meet and play games with people from all over the world. And we get to fantasize.

In conclusion, thanks again to lackattack and all the mapmakers for giving me the site to escape reality for a while. I must get back to the real world now.
User avatar
Captain Gigi1
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 8:20 pm
Medals: 53
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (3)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (3) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (4) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (1)
Clan Achievement (7)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby natty dread on Sun Jul 15, 2012 10:03 am

Gigi1 wrote:This site is what it is. It is not the real world


If you imagine in your head a planet with 8 moons where 5-headed sentient antelopes have built a utopian society, that's not the real world. That's just imagination, a fantasy world.

This, however, is the real world. This website exists within the real world. The very fact that people can communicate with other, real people through this site is enough evidence that this site is real. Just because some thing is accessible through the internet does not make it some kind of immaterial abstraction that only exists in your head. Websites are, in fact, actual real things that exist in the real world.

Also, of course it "is what it is". Everything is what it is. That doesn't mean that we should just accept everything as they are and never make any effort to change them.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby Dukasaur on Sun Jul 15, 2012 11:08 am

Robespierre__ wrote:What I don't understand is why this great bunch of volunteers does not feel supported by Lack. While it seems they have logic and reason behind their dissatisfaction, that actually does not matter. The very fact that they *FEEL* dissatisfied is all that should matter to Lack. That feeling needs to be addressed else you will get what you have here: volunteers not wanting to volunteer. Please, Lack. Care about what these guys feel. They are trying to help. Don't make them feel like they are running into a brick wall.

+1
User avatar
Lieutenant Dukasaur
Head Socialite
Head Socialite
 
Posts: 11881
Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:49 pm
Location: Beautiful Niagara
Medals: 136
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (3)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (3)
Cross-Map Achievement (4) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (19)
General Achievement (15) Clan Achievement (9) Training Achievement (2) Challenge Achievement (5) Tournament Contribution (31)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby isaiah40 on Sun Jul 15, 2012 11:24 am

Imagine this if you will. A couple of people from here decide to leave and take some mapmakers with them to start another Risk based game site, (no I'm not talking about Major Command), and those mapmakers decide to tell lack to remove their maps form CC. Just from 3 mapmakers, CC will be down by 50 maps. What if more mapmakers leave and have lack remove their maps, where will CC be then? it would be left with the maps it started out with, you know, the ones not a lot of people play on. Will it take this scenario to get lack's attention?

Just a few random thoughts of what COULD happen.
User avatar
Lieutenant isaiah40
 
Posts: 3967
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 7:14 pm
Location: To be absent from the body is to be present with Christ
Medals: 37
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (2) General Achievement (4) Map Contribution (5) General Contribution (6)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby DiM on Sun Jul 15, 2012 11:26 am

isaiah40 wrote:Imagine this if you will. A couple of people from here decide to leave and take some mapmakers with them to start another Risk based game site, (no I'm not talking about Major Command), and those mapmakers decide to tell lack to remove their maps form CC. Just from 3 mapmakers, CC will be down by 50 maps. What if more mapmakers leave and have lack remove their maps, where will CC be then? it would be left with the maps it started out with, you know, the ones not a lot of people play on. Will it take this scenario to get lack's attention?

Just a few random thoughts of what COULD happen.



+1
“In the beginning God said, the four-dimensional divergence of an antisymmetric, second rank tensor equals zero, and there was light, and it was good. And on the seventh day he rested.”- Michio Kaku
Image
User avatar
Major DiM
 
Posts: 10554
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:20 pm
Location: making maps for scooby snacks
Medals: 45
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2) Assassin Achievement (2)
Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1)
Cross-Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (4) General Achievement (4) Map Contribution (10)
Tournament Contribution (4) General Contribution (3)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby Nola_Lifer on Sun Jul 15, 2012 1:05 pm

I don't see how others can come on here and criticizes the people who make the maps and the people who help run the foundry. How ignorant can you be? Why do you come onto this site? To play on these beautifully made maps. I don't see any other reason why you'd be on this site other than to troll. It is a shame that these people aren't given credit where credit is due. Another point is that these said people are trying to make this site better. Better html means better and more creative maps. Why would you not want this and why would you criticize them for wanting these changes?

Good on you. =D> Glad that we do have people who care enough about this site to rebuke. RIP Foundry!
Image
f*ck THE UNION LOUISIANA WILL RISE AGAIN
User avatar
Major Nola_Lifer
 
Posts: 816
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:46 pm
Location: 雪山
Medals: 61
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (4) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (1)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (1)
Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (11) General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (12) Tournament Contribution (2)
General Contribution (1)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby thehippo8 on Mon Jul 16, 2012 2:42 am

This is an interesting debate from many different directions.

The Internet Chess Club went through a similar issue. Whebn the developers and those involved at the top (mods, programmers, assistants) got into logger-heads it was all about the commercialisation of the site. Thos in charge decided that enough was done and it was the best chess site on the net so it decided to close off certain people and up the fees. The result for those in charge was unexpected. FICS (free internet chess club) was born. People split off and to this day FICS is much larger than ICC. Sure, more grandmasters play on ICC than FICS but most people who play chess online are not grandmasters! Moreover, grandmasters get free entry to FICS and what grandmaster would want to play a 100, 1400, 1800 or even 2000 rated player? Indeed, what's the point in playing there other than to "be seen" or "try new ideas with their mates" or "play other grandmasters". This form of elitism may attract those international masters (the rank below grandmasters) who can usefully learn from mistakes or new idea - but anyone can do that by following grandmaster games. So ICC dwindles and one can only hope can see the error of its ways.

I am impressed by CC (Conquer Club) that it has meshed pay-things (membership and things for sale) with free-things (a limited taste of the website and involvement in extraneous activities by its members (freemium and premiun) such as chat, forums, mafia and most notably the foundry. Sure the heads here own this site and we all partake on the understanding that things may one day change no-one would expect things to change to the extent that the foundry would go. Go, are you kidding?

Frankly, the foundry the the backbone of this website. I believe that lack knows that and I can't help wondering whether all this is about Lack and others finding out whether we as a community really value it too. Well, we do!

And I can only hope and pray that we don't end up going down the track of loosing such amazing talent as Natty Dread or DiM or ... well too many to mention ... or worse people just leaving the site in droves and the inevitability of something else coming along and ruining this site for good! No, we all love this place and spend so much time and effort here. Don't let the foundry die - respect your followers, your people, your strength! And we in turn will respect you right back!

Perhaps now would be a goof time, Lack or other "senior", to pop in and provide some reassurance. I feel the inevitable grip of inevitability and fate's teeth otherwise!
ImageImageImage
show
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class thehippo8
 
Posts: 1814
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2010 5:32 pm
Medals: 48
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (3) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (4) Clan Achievement (4) Tournament Contribution (2) General Contribution (3)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby RjBeals on Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:15 am

Interesting. You all feel the same way me and some old timers did a few years back. I don't mind making maps for free. I still do at cartographersguild, simply because I enjoy it. But cartoguild is not a business, it's a forum for map enthusiasts. The fact that Lack is making money off the maps his users give him for free, while he is completely uninvolved, or unresponsive - it's going to eventually start to be frustrating.

Funny I was just chatting with Oaktown and WidowMakers about the thrill it used to be several years ago when everytime we logged into the forum, there was some kind of action to get involved with. Not so much anymore. Good luck on your revolt. I wonder what will happen If everyone stops making maps in protest.
Image
User avatar
Private RjBeals
 
Posts: 2507
Joined: Mon Nov 20, 2006 5:17 pm
Location: South Carolina, USA
Medals: 21
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (1)
General Achievement (7) Map Contribution (6) General Contribution (2)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby Kabanellas on Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:27 am

Robespierre__ wrote:What I don't understand is why this great bunch of volunteers does not feel supported by Lack. While it seems they have logic and reason behind their dissatisfaction, that actually does not matter. The very fact that they *FEEL* dissatisfied is all that should matter to Lack. That feeling needs to be addressed else you will get what you have here: volunteers not wanting to volunteer. Please, Lack. Care about what these guys feel. They are trying to help. Don't make them feel like they are running into a brick wall.


Precisely!
User avatar
Major Kabanellas
Cartography Assistant
Cartography Assistant
 
Posts: 1475
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:21 pm
Location: "Don’t ever wrestle with a pig. You’ll both get dirty, but the pig will enjoy it."
Medals: 70
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (2)
Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (7)
General Achievement (3) Clan Achievement (17) Map Contribution (7) General Contribution (2)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby oaktown on Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:35 am

Let me tell you all a little story. A few years ago, a bunch of guys with names like Widowmakers and Coleman and RjBeals and DiM and cairnswk and qwert and Keyogi and mibi and gimil and edbeard and oaktown began working on our first maps. Some of these maps weren't very good (Chinese Checkers). But we learned from each other, got better, and took on the running of the foundry. But over time most of us grew frustrated with the lack of attention from above, and started rumbling for development support and higher standards. Many left, and those that stuck it out aren't nearly as active as they once were.

So in answer to Rj's question: if everybody stopped making maps there would just be a new crop of mapmakers with weaker skills and lower standards that would appear in a few months, completely oblivious to the fact that the veteran mapmakers left. They'd gradually improve their skills and become Foundry mods. It's the natural Foundry cycle.

CC's Foundry is largely independent of the management of the site. This is a both a strength and a weakness. You guys run the show and control the output, but you also suffer from a lack of support. It remains a really good model for the user who wants to work on their graphic skills in a supportive environment and see their work published, and for most users it works. But after a time you want it to be more.
Image
User avatar
Captain oaktown
 
Posts: 4552
Joined: Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:24 pm
Location: majorcommand
Medals: 30
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Fog of War Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (1) General Achievement (1) Map Contribution (12)
General Contribution (5)

Re: RIP Foundry Avatars

Postby natty dread on Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:51 am

oaktown wrote:CC's Foundry is largely independent of the management of the site. This is a both a strength and a weakness. You guys run the show and control the output, but you also suffer from a lack of support. It remains a really good model for the user who wants to work on their graphic skills in a supportive environment and see their work published, and for most users it works. But after a time you want it to be more.


Yep, pretty much. However:

oaktown wrote:So in answer to Rj's question: if everybody stopped making maps there would just be a new crop of mapmakers with weaker skills and lower standards that would appear in a few months, completely oblivious to the fact that the veteran mapmakers left. They'd gradually improve their skills and become Foundry mods. It's the natural Foundry cycle.


I can see what you're referencing here... this worked once before, because back then, not all of the old mapmakers left, some who had at least learned somewhat how mapmaking worked stayed to instruct the new mapmakers.

But what if all of the current mapmakers & foundry staff left at once, so there would be no one to instruct the new mapmakers? Would the new crew be able to construct a new foundry, completely from scratch? I'm not sure... maybe with time they could. There's plenty of tutorials on graphics design, and they could benefit from the mapmaking tutorials already on this site, as well. But as to how to run the day-to-day business of the foundry, how to keep the gears rolling and how to keep everything working smoothly... I don't know. Depends on the people I guess.


On the other hand, we who are currently in the foundry don't have the same options as the "old guard" - we can't just up and start another CC-like website, as to my knowledge there isn't anyone among the current mapmakers with the know-how or resources to do that. So if the foundry dies, the future for the current CC mapmakers looks grim, from a mapmaking perspective - there aren't any good alternatives where the current mapmakers could migrate. I expect most would just find some other purpose, other kinds of projects to work their skills on. There are plenty of stuff out there that welcome contributions from even moderately skilled graphic artists, there just isn't anything quite similar to CC mapmaking.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Next

Return to Foundry Discussions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users

Login