XML Update: Finally!! LOL

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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby greenoaks on Sat Jul 28, 2012 9:24 am

DiM wrote:lack successfully drove away a lot of mapmakers and it's time he did something to keep the ones he has and even bring some new ones. otherwise in a couple of years the only person in the foundry will be cairnswk. :lol:


i don't have a problem with more australian maps
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby Oneyed on Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:57 am

at the first, I ask if anybody active in the site (blue guys, green guys, brown guys...) have any bonuses for time, energy spent here? they all are volunteers so I assume not. or at least get these people premium from CC?

the site needs also mapmakers who will do new, best maps and who will do maps with new XML updates. with current situation it is almost impossible to move any map forward in valid time. there are only 6 Carthographers. if I good understand their role they are here for comments on maps, for holdback graphics standards, for moving maps forward in Map Foundry, to be candid some of them are not much active. this is not blame, just constatation (everybody has real life and other thigs to do). but why is impossible to have more blue guys? I am not long time here, but I found some guys realy active in Foundry and helpfull (natty_dread, koontz, DiM, cairnswk, pamoa, Gilliping, Nola_Lifer - just some who become to my mind. sorry if I forgot anybody). why they can not be Carthographers? I agree with DiM - more people, more options, more help = shorter time to get updates.

conditional borders do not seem for me as any wonder. in XML Suggestions and Modifications II are more ideas for update and much of them are more important and interesting (look at spoiler).

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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby zimmah on Sat Jul 28, 2012 11:09 am

oneeyed. almost everyone you mentioned does not even WANT to be a cartographer.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby Oneyed on Sat Jul 28, 2012 11:13 am

zimmah wrote:oneeyed. almost everyone you mentioned does not even WANT to be a cartographer.


why? I forgot you, sorry :)

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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby DiM on Sat Jul 28, 2012 11:34 am

greenoaks wrote:
DiM wrote:lack successfully drove away a lot of mapmakers and it's time he did something to keep the ones he has and even bring some new ones. otherwise in a couple of years the only person in the foundry will be cairnswk. :lol:


i don't have a problem with more australian maps


that wasn't even remotely the point i was trying to make. :roll:

it was more of a praise to cairnswk's resilience and an attempt to raise an alarm about how the foundry will become an empty place.


updates have been promised since 5 years ago and time after time the promises were broken.
it took a strike of the CAs and the map makers for lack to quickly compile the code and give us conditional borders.
some people's reaction is "praise the allmighty lack for giving us this update"
my reaction is "wow, for so many years we were taken for granted and treated like obedient morons"
lack just showed us that if he wants to, or if he's pressured to, then he can come up with updates in a reasonable amount of time. and the fact that he hasn't done it so far proves my previous point that we were taken for granted.
if now things go back to the way they were before the strike then you can kiss goodbye any update in the next couple of years.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby MrBenn on Sat Jul 28, 2012 2:09 pm

The other thing that this updates demands is a change to the UI / Game selection options to avoid new/inexperienced players from inadvertently choosing/playing/being invited to more complicated games that deviate ever further from the game of risk that brought most of us here in the first place.

Somebody need to make inroads to map categorisation; I would gladly have headed that project up years ago if I were certain the results of my efforts were ever to have been implemented on the site.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jul 28, 2012 2:12 pm

Dim, i have to say that one should be grateful for all things small when they are given, instead of exepecting gigantic expressions of your idealism.

It is the small steps in life that create the journey, you should know that by now. :)
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby pamoa on Sat Jul 28, 2012 2:19 pm

cairnswk wrote:It is the small steps in life that create the journey
said the wise man who could have wrote the hitchhiker's guide to the CC foundry galaxy ;)
de gueules à la tour d'argent ouverte, crénelée de trois pièces, sommée d'un donjon ajouré, crénelé de deux pièces
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby DiM on Sat Jul 28, 2012 3:12 pm

cairnswk wrote:Dim, i have to say that one should be grateful for all things small when they are given, instead of exepecting gigantic expressions of your idealism.

It is the small steps in life that create the journey, you should know that by now. :)


i've never been one to take small safe steps. i'm more a man of risky leaps. sometimes i fail, sometimes i win, but it's always exciting.

plus, i never said i'm not grateful for this update. it's a good update and i appreciate it but it's nowhere near what was promised all these years. and it would take several such updates for lack to catch up to everything that the foundry needs.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby OliverFA on Sat Jul 28, 2012 4:41 pm

Great news! Good to see so many updates being implemented recently =D> =D> =D> =D>
Welcoming the long awaited Trench Warfare Setting (Previously Adjacent Attacks).

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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby Nola_Lifer on Sat Jul 28, 2012 4:51 pm

DiM wrote:
cairnswk wrote:Dim, i have to say that one should be grateful for all things small when they are given, instead of exepecting gigantic expressions of your idealism.

It is the small steps in life that create the journey, you should know that by now. :)


i've never been one to take small safe steps. i'm more a man of risky leaps. sometimes i fail, sometimes i win, but it's always exciting.

plus, i never said i'm not grateful for this update. it's a good update and i appreciate it but it's nowhere near what was promised all these years. and it would take several such updates for lack to catch up to everything that the foundry needs.


It is important to have both, is it not?
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby ManBungalow on Sat Jul 28, 2012 5:57 pm

Questions about conditional borders;

Is the conditional border activated immediately after the dependent region/continent is taken, or does one have to wait until their next turn to make an attack along the conditional route ?

My thinking is that the game log doesn't explicitly recognise a bonus as having been captured until it actually grants the bonus next turn.

If it does immediately take effect, then some creative people could have fun adding killer neutrals to the mix.

Similarly - if one is in a freestyle game and holds the trigger region at the start of a turn, and loses it during the turn but before making an attack, can you still attack through the conditional route ?

etc
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby Teflon Kris on Sun Jul 29, 2012 4:29 am

Power to the People

=D> =D> =D> =D>

Well played Nobodies.

=D> =D> =D> =D>
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby x-raider on Sun Jul 29, 2012 6:37 am

So now we can look forward to an influx of 'recycle bin' maps coming out through XML and into BETA...
One concrete change to be thankful for in the direct aftermath...
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby DiM on Sun Jul 29, 2012 8:10 am

x-raider wrote:So now we can look forward to an influx of 'recycle bin' maps coming out through XML and into BETA...
One concrete change to be thankful for in the direct aftermath...


nope, not really.
first of all there aren't that many maps that would have required these updates.
second, all of those maps should have to earn again their graphics badge if they've been in the bin for a long time.
so straight to beta.... certainly not. but we might have a few (1-2) resurrected maps.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby zimmah on Sun Jul 29, 2012 8:28 am

DiM wrote:
x-raider wrote:So now we can look forward to an influx of 'recycle bin' maps coming out through XML and into BETA...
One concrete change to be thankful for in the direct aftermath...


nope, not really.
first of all there aren't that many maps that would have required these updates.
second, all of those maps should have to earn again their graphics badge if they've been in the bin for a long time.
so straight to beta.... certainly not. but we might have a few (1-2) resurrected maps.


like dim said, only about 1 or 2 maps wee really waiting for this. even though the chances may be huge to those maps, they're totally useless for all others. not saying they're bad, just niche.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby x-raider on Sun Jul 29, 2012 9:34 am

yeh. My point is, for anyone who's really depressed about the situation, this is something of substance that is happening.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby zimmah on Sun Jul 29, 2012 10:29 am

well, i agree that it is nice, but i also agree with dim hat it should have been much sooner and it should not need a strike for it to finally happen.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby Bruceswar on Sun Jul 29, 2012 3:52 pm

zimmah wrote:well, i agree that it is nice, but i also agree with dim hat it should have been much sooner and it should not need a strike for it to finally happen.



There are lots of things in wait... but I do see the pace picking up as of late... This is a step in the right direction. If the pace keeps picking up, CC will pick up steam again.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby Nola_Lifer on Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:54 pm

When was the last XML update prior to this one? How many updates do we get a year on average? 1 or 2?
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby zimmah on Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:00 pm

Nola_Lifer wrote:When was the last XML update prior to this one? How many updates do we get a year on average? 1 or 2?


lol, more like one every 4 years.
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby thenobodies80 on Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:58 pm

MrBenn wrote:Secondly, there needs to be some clarification about how conditional borders and conditional bonuses work...
Imagine a French Revolution map, where there was a condition required to be able to attack the Bastille. Holding French Revoutionaries would be required to build up a bonus (imagine there's 7 key leaders, which are coded to give a bonus for holding 3 or more). The condition is coded that you need to hold the Revolutionary Leaders to attack the Bastille. Do you need to hold all 7 of them to open the attack option, or any three of them?


lackattack wrote:For conditional borders (or anything else like subcontinent references), a continent is considered "held" if you hold the continent-level required irrespective of the bonus levels.


So, if you want to set a specific number you need to code an additional/separated bonus with its own name and use it for the conditional border.
If you want i can post some code using your example. ;)

ManBungalow wrote:Questions about conditional borders;

Is the conditional border activated immediately after the dependent region/continent is taken, or does one have to wait until their next turn to make an attack along the conditional route ?

My thinking is that the game log doesn't explicitly recognise a bonus as having been captured until it actually grants the bonus next turn.

If it does immediately take effect, then some creative people could have fun adding killer neutrals to the mix.

Similarly - if one is in a freestyle game and holds the trigger region at the start of a turn, and loses it during the turn but before making an attack, can you still attack through the conditional route ?

etc


Like losing conditions:

lackattack wrote:The conditional border is activated/disactivated immediately when you conquer or lose the condition.

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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby Kabanellas on Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:46 am

Congrats on the updates, the conditional borders seem like a very 'juicy' option...

Still waiting on that 'killer neutral' change to make The Age of Buccaneers viable :)
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby dolomite13 on Wed Aug 08, 2012 12:58 pm

I have been away for a while and just started playing a game or two lately. I love the conditional border piece. This may prompt a sequel to Monsters! or a return to my "stalled" Conquer 500 map.

Any chance that an update was ever done to allow territories to degrade to zero. I know we have degrade by X amount with a minimum of 1 and reset to X neutral every turn. I am looking for degrade by X every turn and reset to X neutral when 0 is reached.

Thanx

=D=
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Re: XML Update: Finally!! LOL

Postby -=- Tanarri -=- on Wed Aug 08, 2012 11:48 pm

Nola_Lifer wrote:When was the last XML update prior to this one? How many updates do we get a year on average? 1 or 2?


They've been coming at a rate of around 1 per year. Though admittedly this year it seems like they've been picking up a bit. It was really nice to see Adjacent Attacks/Trench Warfare implemented. It's nice to see the XML finally start to take some baby steps. I do agree that Lack needs to put some serious effort in the XML over the next few months to get the foundry back. There's a bunch of XML updates which should be really easy to code that would really help make the foundry a better place with much more variety. Decay to Neutral and Conditional Autodeploys being the two major ones that come to mind.

I remember when I first saw this site years ago (when my aunt and uncle first joined) the updates were coming at a rate of about one per month, maybe two months at most. At some point they took a drop and never recovered. I'm hoping the recent increase in updates is an indication that we'll be returning to the previous frequency of updates to the site.
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