josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Chewie1 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:48 pm

Interesting how these C&A reports more often than not come about with the big high flying clans looking for ways to point score of each other/ or penalise each other.

Sorry its off topic but couldnt help making the observation.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Denise on Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:22 pm

Josko did not break the rules. I’m glad to hear it because I think Josko is a great player and I was afraid if he was found guilty he would leave the game for good. I don’t want to see that happen. He raises the bar for all of us.

Josko, I understand what you are saying about how you are trying to play fair by not contributing to more games than you should. I think though that this is mostly a show (not genuine). The reason I think that is it doesn’t really matter that you are not entered into your max games or not, because you have gained too much control over your unlimited games. That is your forte and how you win challenges for your clan. Whether it’s strictly against the rules or not, you are playing the very important turns for other players in a very time consuming game, in which doing so gains you an advantage. So you see, all this debate about what’s fair and bringing up past history and justification doesn’t really mean anything to those who will look at the situation with perspective and some common sense.

The only good thing that can come of this report is that the practice stops. There is no good reason to enter a player in a clan game, if that player cannot take most of his turns. Unexpected absences are one thing, but this is not that. I think the responsibility for that belongs to whoever is deciding teams and inviting players to their games, mostly. They should know better, especially if they happen to be a CD.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby ad10r3tr0 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:26 pm

C'mon, lets be real here. This whole account sitting issue is getting way out of hand! I don't even have anymore interest in playing in clan games..I mean this is ridiculous. You don't know who you are playing against, its like 1 guy is taking every single fucking turn..

Why not just ban account sitting all together? You can't make it here in a 24 hour period, then you miss your turn it's as simple as that. You don't have internet on the weekends, then go find an internet cafe, or some shit.. I mean, what a joke the clan scene has become with this stupid account sitting. Its ridiculous!

And come on, how hard is it to lie to have your best player take your turn because it is a vital one? Hey guys, I cant play on Wednesday, Thursdays or Sundays. So i need someone to sit my account for those days, k? thanks!

you get the point?? You either take the turn in 24 hours or you dont! get rid of this overusused, abused system that is called "account sitting"
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Funkyterrance on Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:37 pm

I think what metsfanmax was pointing out is that there seems to be a discrepancy between this ruling and a previous one or at least no weight given to the fact that this is not the first time this has come up. Furthermore, king achilles expressed that it was not something that should become a long term pattern yet it appears that Moonchild will continue to miss turns indefinitely on weekends and josko will continue to sit in. The whole thing just doesn't jel.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Foxglove on Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:51 pm

Denise wrote:Josko did not break the rules. I’m glad to hear it because I think Josko is a great player and I was afraid if he was found guilty he would leave the game for good. I don’t want to see that happen. He raises the bar for all of us.

Josko, I understand what you are saying about how you are trying to play fair by not contributing to more games than you should. I think though that this is mostly a show (not genuine).


It is, though, very genuine. We are aware that some CC players take any and every possible chance to accuse josko of breaking the rules, and josko responds to this by being completely open and honest about his turn-sitting. He always announces when he sits for another player. He never conspires to hide the turns that he sits in any way (flag switching, team chat only notifications, etc.).

Denise wrote: Whether it’s strictly against the rules or not, you are playing the very important turns for other players in a very time consuming game, in which doing so gains you an advantage.


This report accused josko of taking turns for moonchild as a regular pattern on the weekends. Important turns take place every day of the week. Additionally, we have no control over which player gets the starting turn when a game is initialized, and hence which players will have their first turns take place on a specific day of the week - it's random.

Denise wrote: So you see, all this debate about what’s fair and bringing up past history and justification doesn’t really mean anything to those who will look at the situation with perspective and some common sense.


I believe that what is fair or not fair is incredibly important. Honesty is equally important.

Denise wrote:There is no good reason to enter a player in a clan game, if that player cannot take most of his turns.


Agreed. In this case though, Moonchild *does* take most of his turns. What percentage of a player's turns should a sitter be allowed to take? This is a good example of why the site desperately needs a sitting feature to track those sort of stats. They could be used by the C&A team to make decisions, and by clans, as well, to determine acceptable maximums for clan wars.

I have no idea what the current status of a site-wide account sitting feature is, but it could be beneficial to implement in stages, with a first stage simply being a tracking and notification system. Numbers and information gathered from this system could then be analyzed to determine site rules to make it easy to figure out exactly where the lines are.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Nicky15 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:06 pm

Hello there everyone. The CDs have been addressing all of these issues over the past few months (not just this one) and until we get a sitting feature, we will have to rely on a new set of rules that we are in the process of finalizing. We will post them over the next few days.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Chewie1 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:14 pm

ad10r3tr0 wrote:C'mon, lets be real here. This whole account sitting issue is getting way out of hand! I don't even have anymore interest in playing in clan games..I mean this is ridiculous. You don't know who you are playing against, its like 1 guy is taking every single fucking turn..

Why not just ban account sitting all together? You can't make it here in a 24 hour period, then you miss your turn it's as simple as that. You don't have internet on the weekends, then go find an internet cafe, or some shit.. I mean, what a joke the clan scene has become with this stupid account sitting. Its ridiculous!

And come on, how hard is it to lie to have your best player take your turn because it is a vital one? Hey guys, I cant play on Wednesday, Thursdays or Sundays. So i need someone to sit my account for those days, k? thanks!

you get the point?? You either take the turn in 24 hours or you dont! get rid of this overusused, abused system that is called "account sitting"



Dont be an ass.. account sitting is great if used correctly why should the minority spoil it for the majority.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby eddie2 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:16 pm

deathcomesrippin wrote:As for sitting, like we said, as long as it is announced and made clear that this would happen, and the sitter didn't break any of the Account Sitting rules (Forum Posting, joining/starting new games, playing as an opponent of the person you are sitting for) then this would be ok.


I think think dcr you are getting muddled up with the sitting rules for clan games, when masli was head clan mod he put a vote within the cla, this rule was to clarify what sitting rules clans were going to follow with the following 2 options..

1) follow site rules as quoted above..

2) follow tournament rules

the final result was to follow tournament rules... but there was no modification to these rules because it was around the time masli stood down as moderator.

So the problem i see is that in tournaments it is ok to sign a player up to games and play all his shots in them games to stop the delaying of any rounds matchs... in other words when a player posts in there challenge thread in private forums that they are going to take part in it then they are allowed to have a sitter sign up and play a full match for them if they are away and carry on indefinite until the war is over . also like in this case if they are not present at weekends then this is ok....

I do really hope that after another sitting case involving clan areas that clan mods with or without the help of the cla (this part meaning if they want input from clan leaders.) all start a thread and discuss a proper set of rules for sitting in clan challenges and post a public thread in the clan pages saying what is and what is not allowed.. this will stop any confusion, also if this is accepted as needing to be done the 2 previous cases of josko and cof are rescinded as these were both after the vote in the cla to allow tourney sitting rules.
Last edited by eddie2 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Metsfanmax on Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:23 pm

deathcomesrippin wrote:
Funkyterrance wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:But the admins have done something about it in the past:

viewtopic.php?f=239&t=145859&start=255#p3229429

king achilles wrote:For this case, at some point, josko.ri could/should have simply told the other players to stop relying on him to take turns for them. Account sitting is for a definite period of time and NOT for an indefinite period. You can't assign an account sitter to account sit for you for as long as his blood is running into his veins. Then you can now sleep soundly whenever or do other stuff because you know he is going to save you from missing a turn. If you are capable of taking your turn, then take it. Do not make someone be responsible for your own account or lean too much for his advise.


Here, ka is quite clearly saying that indefinitely sharing a password to take turns when needed, violates account sitting rules.


Very interesting. This seems grounds for reopening?


This case is of one person, who cannot play on weekends, every weekend and only weekends, having Josko cover for him. Again, this is within the rules. If Moonchild misses a turn during the week, but Josko jumped in, then that would be different. But he doesn't, Moonchild is just guaranteed to miss all of his turns on weekends. During the week- Moonchild. On weekends- Josko. It hasn't crossed over, and if it would have then it would be a different outcome. The player is declared, the player returns, that's it. Josko did not jump in when he saw Moonchild was approaching a missed turn, he announced it in chat to make sure everyone knew he was sitting in, Josko broke no rules.

Where would you all like the line to be drawn? There is no number we could come to that would be in any way shape or form fair, and if we removed account sitting completely, then the moment someone else logged into your account and we found out about it, it would be an infraction. According to the rules in place now, there was no rule broken.


Look, I don't claim to have a good answer for where the line should be drawn; I haven't thought about it that much. But ka says quite clearly that account sitting for an indefinite period of time is not acceptable, and that's exactly what we have here; josko plays turns for Moonchild every single weekend. That is account sharing at that point, because josko is now basically an equal partner in the goal of managing Moonchild's games, instead of someone who just sits in from time to time when Moonchild can't get to the computer. There is no question in my mind that wherever the line currently is, this steps over it. Now, ka's post is really kind of ambivalent about this matter, and as a result these things continue to happen because no one is taking a firm stance on the matter. This sort of thing will continue to happen as long as the C&A staff throw up their hands and say "we can't find a good line to draw." It's better to have a line that is arguable than to make the mistake of having no line at all.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Funkyterrance on Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:30 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:

But ka says quite clearly that account sitting for an indefinite period of time is not acceptable, and that's exactly what we have here; josko plays turns for Moonchild every single weekend. That is account sharing at that point, because josko is now basically an equal partner in the goal of managing Moonchild's games, instead of someone who just sits in from time to time when Moonchild can't get to the computer. There is no question in my mind that wherever the line currently is, this steps over it.


Put in this way I have to agree ; this is account sharing. Two people are undoubtedly playing the same account. One person plays on the weekdays, the other on the weekends. It actually doesn't get much more clear cut than that when put in this light. Thanks for providing this more "clear" way of viewing the situation ; I couldn't put my finger on what bothered me so much about it but there you have it.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby deathcomesrippin on Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:49 pm

A line was drawn. He didn't break a rule. Just because we didn't rule in your favor doesn't mean that we did nothing. Whenever a "big" case or a complicated case comes through us, we all discuss it, the entire department. This is a ruling we discussed, examined each of our opinions, and came to a consensus. Contrary to everyones belief, we don't just look at a case and say "Damn, this is too complicated, screw it." and walk away. I know this won't change any opinions on us but it is the truth regardless.

I am going to leave this open for a handful more hours, and then lock this up and put it away. I always appreciate feedback even if it frustrates me, and I thank everyone for their input. If one wishes to attempt to re-open the case he can do so by following the instructions at the top. Here is a link to opening a ticket:
http://www.conquerclub.com/eticket/index.php#openticket

Thank you.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Metsfanmax on Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:00 pm

deathcomesrippin wrote:A line was drawn. He didn't break a rule. Just because we didn't rule in your favor doesn't mean that we did nothing. Whenever a "big" case or a complicated case comes through us, we all discuss it, the entire department. This is a ruling we discussed, examined each of our opinions, and came to a consensus. Contrary to everyones belief, we don't just look at a case and say "Damn, this is too complicated, screw it." and walk away. I know this won't change any opinions on us but it is the truth regardless.


I don't think anyone is accusing you of doing nothing. I am pointing out that the line that was drawn, in king achilles' post, was clearly crossed. You have not suggested an alternate line; you have simply said, in effect, that account sharing is acceptable as long as it is openly announced to the community.

deathcomesrippin wrote:One could easily assume this could be deliberate or another form of account sharing. For Josko and Moonchild to come out not suspicious or if any other players would be in the same situation as this, the right thing to do is to openly announce it as your signature or state it on your profile wall, and must be mentioned in all your games.


This ruling essentially nullifies the rule against account sharing, even if it was not intended. Again, I am not accusing you of not having thought about it. I am saying that you came to a conclusion that is in sharp contradiction to an established principle of the site, and it muddies the waters instead of clearing them up.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Foxglove on Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:01 pm

deathcomesrippin wrote:A line was drawn. He didn't break a rule. Just because we didn't rule in your favor doesn't mean that we did nothing. Whenever a "big" case or a complicated case comes through us, we all discuss it, the entire department. This is a ruling we discussed, examined each of our opinions, and came to a consensus. Contrary to everyones belief, we don't just look at a case and say "Damn, this is too complicated, screw it." and walk away. I know this won't change any opinions on us but it is the truth regardless.

I am going to leave this open for a handful more hours, and then lock this up and put it away. I always appreciate feedback even if it frustrates me, and I thank everyone for their input. If one wishes to attempt to re-open the case he can do so by following the instructions at the top. Here is a link to opening a ticket:
http://www.conquerclub.com/eticket/index.php#openticket

Thank you.


Thank you for being transparent about the process with this reasonable explanation!!
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Dako on Wed Dec 05, 2012 4:34 pm

The ruling from KA that metsfanmax has brought does indeed raise questions.

Is every weekend a definite period of time (2 days, quite definite) or is it not (every weekend for many months - quite indefinite)? Is it ok if different players play weekend games for me and rotate all the time? Ie player A for week 1, then player B for week 2, then player C for week 3 and then player A for week 4. Is three months too long to share the accounts or not? Is one day an "ok" amount of time for other player to sit continuously? Are two days? The list can go on and on.


I have a lot of questions and none of them are answered yet. Can C&A mods do that please? Because right now every C&A case has a verdict but each time they decide what is above board and what is below from scratch. I would like to see C&A to define numbers and periods for at least such important things as account sitting, farming/ranching, point dumping. Those 3 issues create most complicated cases of the C&A department and got to be clarified asap. That will help both community and the C&A department. It is even ok to choose wrong numbers, we can always alter them later. But living in this turmoil without any standards is getting harder and harder.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Ishihara on Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:16 pm

Agreed. In this case though, Moonchild *does* take most of his turns. What percentage of a player's turns should a sitter be allowed to take? This is a good example of why the site desperately needs a sitting feature to track those sort of stats. They could be used by the C&A team to make decisions, and by clans, as well, to determine acceptable maximums for clan wars.


I'm surprised someone hasn't done the math yet, but out of curiousity, exactly what percentage of the games did Moon take himself? IMHO, the anti-sitting hard liners are just plain being silly. One of the benefits of the clan life is that you can have a few friends cover your back - the benefits overall to the quality of the games on this site (from not having a missed turn) far, far outweigh the abuses of a few when they occur. And we do have a system in place to address problems when we think they are occurring (thanks again, C&A mods).
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Chewie1 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:20 pm

Ishihara wrote:
One of the benefits of the clan life is that you can have a few friends cover your back - the benefits overall to the quality of the games on this site (from not having a missed turn) far, far outweigh the abuses of a few when they occur. And we do have a system in place to address problems when we think they are occurring (thanks again, C&A mods).




+1 =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Chariot of Fire on Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:42 pm

Sitting is a necessary feature of the site as everyone at some stage or another has occasion to be away for more than 24 hours.

What is not a necessary feature of the site is to continue joining games in the knowledge you cannot take your own turns, yet this is exactly what is going on here and has been for three months already.

Metsfanmax brought up the pertinent ruling, in KA's own words:

"Account sitting is for a definite period of time and NOT for an indefinite period. You can't assign an account sitter to account sit for you for as long as his blood is running into his veins. Then you can now sleep soundly whenever or do other stuff because you know he is going to save you from missing a turn"

Three months so far seems pretty indefinite to me don't you think? With all the players available in that clan why do they insist on fielding a player whose turns have to be taken by another? And if you can't already see the advantage being gained from such an arrangement then you need only look at the stats again in the OP.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Eddy_26 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:11 pm

Chariot of Fire wrote:Metsfanmax brought up the pertinent ruling, in KA's own words:

"Account sitting is for a definite period of time and NOT for an indefinite period. You can't assign an account sitter to account sit for you for as long as his blood is running into his veins. Then you can now sleep soundly whenever or do other stuff because you know he is going to save you from missing a turn"

Three months so far seems pretty indefinite to me don't you think? With all the players available in that clan why do they insist on fielding a player whose turns have to be taken by another? And if you can't already see the advantage being gained from such an arrangement then you need only look at the stats again in the OP.

Nice try, but you know it meant something different. Josko's sitting is not indefinite. it starts every Saturday, and ends every Sunday. That is a defined length of time.

Chariot of Fire wrote:and the real crux of the matter is that he is being entered into games that require a great deal of patience and knowledge on the part of the player (unlimited forts, first turn) and it's no coincidence that a majority of these moves have been taken by his sitter.


Denise wrote:you have gained too much control over your unlimited games. That is your forte and how you win challenges for your clan. Whether it’s strictly against the rules or not, you are playing the very important turns for other players in a very time consuming game, in which doing so gains you an advantage.


Do you guys play your first turn unlimited clan games on your own or something? I figured most teams do it together, or atleast with a teammate around. I was entered into an unlimited game for the cup. My first real competitive game with the setting. Soooo, why wasn't I sat for in the all important first turn? Obviously the biggest advantage to be gained was by sitting for me. And even more interesting, why was moon also discussing the turns?

Because that's just it, we actually discuss the turns. It's Josko's forte, but it's still a team game, and we play it as a team. Josko is actually one of the more involving players. You guys have assumed it's a dictatorship. It's clear what CoF's thinking was here, that since he'd covered turns in the past out of just wanting to do it himself (there's your dictatorship) that Josko shared the same practices.

I'm wondering, why did you enter Pedro into clan games when you consistently had to sit for him one night a week. For months. Oh, that's right! He didn't actually need sitting...
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Chariot of Fire on Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:32 pm

It is indefinite Eddy - unless you can categorically state on which Sunday this practice is going to stop.

As for the remainder of your post it really bears no relevance as it's immaterial how you as a clan plan your strategy or collaborate on turns. What's pertinent is why a player is being entered into team games beyond the point where it was known he had no internet.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Eddy_26 on Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:57 pm

Chariot of Fire wrote:It is indefinite Eddy - unless you can categorically state on which Sunday this practice is going to stop.

As for the remainder of your post it really bears no relevance as it's immaterial how you as a clan plan your strategy or collaborate on turns. What's pertinent is why a player is being entered into team games beyond the point where it was known he had no internet.

I believe the previous ruling took the same view I did. The problem was that people were just being sat for whenever it looked like they were going to miss, or something like that, where as this is something different.
As for you thinking the rest is irrelevent, your main problem is that we're apparently gaining some sort of advantage from this, and my post pointed out that that's not true. I suppose it is immaterial, as Josko was already cleared of that :D
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby Chariot of Fire on Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:30 pm

Yes, I do believe it is an unfair advantage for a player to enter 40% of his games in an unlimited forts setting and have the majority of his first turns played by one of the site's best exponents at this format. With a 100% record it's also rather difficult to refute that. Has it affected me personally? No. Will it if the practice is allowed to continue and TOFU face KORT in January? Yes. It seems unreasonable that a player is allowed to keep entering games which he cannot undertake to play himself.

If Moonchild plays 62% of the time and Josko plays 38% of the time week after week (month after month) on the same account, what better example of account sharing is there? And it's not a simple case of Josko taking Moonchild's spot in those games because he is already in them himself, thus in effect controlling two players on the same team.

Just making a declaration that you'll be sitting for someone and posting such in chat does not absolve you from the rights and wrongs - and what is so wrong here is that it is unnecessary and yet it continues.

A simple ruling that restricts Moonchild from entering team games until such time as he has internet access is all that is really required. I'd have thought that was a fairly obvious resolution from a site that requires a player to log in every 24 hours.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby josko.ri on Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:29 pm

Chariot of Fire wrote:Yes, I do believe it is an unfair advantage for a player to enter 40% of his games in an unlimited forts setting and have the majority of his first turns played by one of the site's best exponents at this format. With a 100% record it's also rather difficult to refute that. Has it affected me personally? No. Will it if the practice is allowed to continue and TOFU face KORT in January? Yes. It seems unreasonable that a player is allowed to keep entering games which he cannot undertake to play himself.

as for the numbers, my winning % in unlimited is not 100%, it is about 80-85% (read page 2 for more accurate info).

About % of turns sit by Moonchild (also related to Ishihara's post who asked that):
I have counted all games together that we played from end of September until 30th Nov, the day of counting data, used R3 of CL3 like starting point.

here are results:
25 games played together
0 sitting 1 game (just 3 rounds played)
1 sitting 7 games
2 sitting 11 games
3 sitting 4 games
4 sitting 1 game (of 13 rounds)
5 sitting 1 game (of 17 round)

% hours per week when Moonchild is absent (64/168 hours) 38,1%
% turns sat by me in all those games together (50/174) 28,7%
% hours per week that sitting need to be done in IDEAL situation, assuming that Moonchild is always on his job at 4 p.m., and that I am always online so I can play his last turn 24 exactly hours before his coming back time (64-24=40/168) 23,8%

So the fact that in 23,8% of time (ideal situation) it is no way to avoid sitting for Moonchild and that I sat only 28,7% of his turns in the said period of 2 months, which is much less than 38,1% of the time that he is absent from his computer, proves enough that I also take care about making my own turns which are prior to his turns faster/slower in order that his turn do not come in period of his absence.

I can harder manage this if our games are joined in thursday by away team, like it was in OSA challenge. Not once it happened that start of games were delayed by low days due to some players absence, so delay joining away games until sunday evening when knowing for a player absence is ideal way to avoid sitting in round 1 as you call it the most important round. Round 1 lasts in general shorter than 5 days, so opening turn of absent player would come until Friday if games are joined by away team in sunday. and this is what I propose if sitting in round 1 bothers you so lot. When I have 5 days to forecast when moonchild's will come, then hasting or stalling turns can be done much more effective than when away games are joined on thursday, which was in OSA challenge.

Chariot of Fire wrote:If Moonchild plays 62% of the time and Josko plays 38% of the time week after week (month after month) on the same account, what better example of account sharing is there? And it's not a simple case of Josko taking Moonchild's spot in those games because he is already in them himself, thus in effect controlling two players on the same team.

As stated in previous comment, number of turns sat is relevant, not number of time absent. for example, if you sleep 8 hours per day, that means at least 33% of your time you are absent from CC, but regardless of that you need 0% of the time someone sit for you. It is irrelevant how much time moonchild is absent, relevant info is how much of his turns need to be sit. and that is 28,7% from the time when he lost internet at home (if you disagree, you are free to provide more accurate data with links)

Chariot of Fire wrote:A simple ruling that restricts Moonchild from entering team games until such time as he has internet access is all that is really required. I'd have thought that was a fairly obvious resolution from a site that requires a player to log in every 24 hours.

When it was case about you, as part of your defense you stated that Pedronicus needed sitting at least one day per week due to his poker nights. So why did you put him into games if his absence for one day per every week was known?

... and another proof that I in any way do not want to gain unfair advantage but I try all my best to minimize sitting for Moonchild as much as possible:
from Ishihara wall, 5 days before the case was oppened. it can be still found on his wall to check.

"11962356 Moonchild is away this weekend, I am sitting maybe better join the 5 set on monday

by josko.ri
on Sat Nov 24, 2012 2:06 am"

I realized that Ishihara sent invites to his player in british isles games on Friday and therefore walled him, to avoid sitting in opening turn(s). he then sent invites on Monday. Another example of my honor and no wishing to gain any advantage by sitting for moonchild during weekends. not team games though (1v1 challenge) but still clan challenge.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby king achilles on Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:35 pm

I believe deathcomesrippin has already explained how this has been noted. Most of the games presented in this case are related to clan games so we see this case also connected to clan wars. If a person is really unable to take his turn, he can have an account sitter to cover for him. It only becomes questionable if it was intentional which is how past similar cases were all about. Indefinite, definite, scheduled, etc. = first, establish if the owner was ever available during any time when a sitter was taking turns for him or even when he could have taken the turn by himself. Do we have anything to show that they were talking or planning when the owner would be intentionally unavailable? If there is none, and they even informed the other clan of what the situation would be, we can give the benefit of doubt to both parties and note the report for now.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby The Voice on Wed Dec 05, 2012 9:36 pm

Indeed, this is a case for the CDs. I'm anxious to learn what new rules are in the works and how they apply to sitting in clan games. With implementation of new rules, there will be those who perceive themselves as being winners or losers, as with every decision on this site, but life goes on. (This is a preemptive counter to the inevitable whining.)

CoF, I believe you when you say this case was nothing personal. However, I would argue there is a better way of addressing your concern about Josko's ability in unlimited. It's sticking to the old adage "practice makes perfect." Josko's great, but he's not infallible, as he pointed out.

EDIT: There's also the adage, "if you can't beat them, join them." Maybe KoRT is accepting applications.
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Re: josko.ri & Moonchild [Noted] DCR

Postby josko.ri on Wed Dec 05, 2012 10:04 pm

Chariot of Fire wrote:What is not a necessary feature of the site is to continue joining games in the knowledge you cannot take your own turns


Your post from 5 months ago:
viewtopic.php?f=239&t=174462&start=75#p3812587
Chariot of Fire wrote:Pedro has trouble at work taking turns and on Thursday evenings is unavailable (as well as many weekends if he is away doing his art)


So, even when you knew that Pedro is unavailable Thursday evenings as well as many weekends, he was put in 15 of 28 games which were maximal allowed to play in CL4 Phase 2.

Isn't that pretty hypocrite doings from you?
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