[Abandoned] - Vietnam

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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v2.1

Postby kengyin on Fri Sep 24, 2010 6:26 pm

i just checked it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Linebacker_II
this is from 1972 much later than when my map was set anyway, in which time, i havent seen an actual map but by this time usa was clearly losing which is why they would have had to resort to such measures. my map is set in 1964 when it was more balanced
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v2.1

Postby kengyin on Fri Sep 24, 2010 7:28 pm

3 votes against 1? do i suck at this or something because i honestly find yellow on blue for example much easier to read than black on blue :?
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v2.1

Postby kengyin on Fri Sep 24, 2010 7:36 pm

any more ideas? so far i have just de-saturated the image by 10 and darkened it by 5 plus made hanoi and saigon yellow with red and blue stars respectively. i am doing these changes on both images so the change of coloured text if happens will already be taken care of.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v2.1

Postby kengyin on Sat Sep 25, 2010 1:56 am

v2.2
-desaturated by a further 10 points
-darkened by 5 points
-hanoi and saigon now yellow to be more easily distinguised
-army digits added to check fit
Image

goals accomplished
-not much but we can see how the army digits fit, they fit nicely now but some adjustment is in order for the small version

continued discussion
-black or coloured text
-should i include operation linebacker 2 in 1972

notes
-these adjustments so far are being done on the image with coloured text but if i decide to use the other one i can change it later
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby porkenbeans on Sat Sep 25, 2010 2:09 am

It is really starting to look nice.
The colors of the Central Highlands and the Mekong Delta do not match the mini-map. I would use the Mini-map colors.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sat Sep 25, 2010 4:01 am

i made the smaller version only to see if the digits fit. they do
Image

the text is now small but that can be worked on later, i'll do the actual smaller version once i have finished the large version to completion (if ever) this is just to see how the sizes of image and text are. in terms of size, the font is actually about the same as in classic so maybe i can also add shadows or other effects to make the text stand out like in classic but as long as i dont have to resize everything then im good, thats what i was worrying about the most anyway. in this copy i didnt make it sharper or anything it was just to test the digits. by the way do most people on here use small or large when they are playing?
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sat Sep 25, 2010 4:07 am

wait i cant actually do much to my text as all the lettering is 1 pixel wide! that means i cant have lighter inside with darker sides or whatever. how do other people do it???
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby natty dread on Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:55 am

Actually you need to be able to fit 3 8:s
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:58 am

someone might get 100 troops?????
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby natty dread on Sat Sep 25, 2010 6:12 am

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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sat Sep 25, 2010 6:04 pm

you jest! is that like on purpose or something?
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sat Sep 25, 2010 8:09 pm

a lot less comments now for some reason :? i mean the text colour is still in discussion and so is the bombing of hanoi, apart from that all i have done is fix up some colours and also background proportions and soon add another digit to each army digits. is my map a lost cause or something?
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby jefjef on Sat Sep 25, 2010 8:39 pm

Nice start and work. Stay with it.

Try to go with a progressive color flow. Take a look at how this map was done. Other than the brightness of the yellow it has a nice color flow.

Go with black text imo.

Ho Chi Minh trail looks more like a land mass than a trail. I think you could get a better feel/look if ya play with it. Try it like a route 66 highway. You could also do away with red route arrows by just using connections. You also don't need the entire trail for a bonus. Say +1 for any 3. Something to think about.

I see in your legend intro it's 1964. Hanoi bombing not an issue.

I would do away with the "puppet of US" crack though...

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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:33 am

so i tried out your advice and made a different colour scheme going red to orange to green to blue instead of orange to red to blue to green. comparison (note that i havent bothered to change the text and legend colours in the new scheme yet)

new scheme

Image

vs

old scheme

Image

too bad i cant have two polls at once, so this can just be for discussion. so please discuss

cant really tell to be honest one has dark colours near the middle going to light colours near the top and bottom and the other vice versa.
the top of the new one is pretty good but the dark green looks a bit out of place
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:38 am

also how come there has been so much talk about the graphics but not much about gameplay? the only gameplay thing i remember is sully saying that ho chi minh trail was overpowered. things that could be discussed: how good are the bonuses? how good are the impassables? would this map allow many strategies? is the strategies for this map quite different from others? which region would you go for first provided you had a decent drop on each one? etc
please discuss (you can also discuss my continuing use of the word discuss)
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:49 am

not much in this update, mostly stuff still needs to be discussed (theres that word again)

v2.3
-background proportions corrected
-central highlands colour darker shade
-glow around legend re-added
-digits changed to 3 digits each

Image

discussion points
-black or coloured text
-which colour scheme
-should i include hanoi bombings
-should i change ho chi minh trail to something like route 66
-and of course im still thinking of a better title

major updates wont really progress until i have figured out sorted out some major issues
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 7:25 pm

maybe i need to make a major overhaul of the map so that more people will comment?
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby natty dread on Sun Sep 26, 2010 7:44 pm

Don't be so impatient. People come here on their free time and comment when they can, you can't expect to get tons of comments after every post. Sometimes you can go days without comments.

My advice is, if you don't get comments for a while, make some change to the map. People will either like or dislike the change, but either way it is likely to get you more feedback.

Mapmaking requires tons of patience. Just keep on working on your map, listen to feedback when you get it, and eventually it'll all work out.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 8:10 pm

right now what im doing is looking at other maps and seeing what makes them so good, so far i am looking at the western front map and the fonts are quite good so i experimented on my map having a colour behind the text and shadows.
just a small example
Image

i think that is looking a lot better, serif bold font at the same size with background colour and shadow. it makes the text stand out more AND also means that with black text it still is easily readable. which means that i have solved the text colour problem. i think i'll just be working on this major font changes for the next few days
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 8:52 pm

a major update is coming it will include
-all text to serif bold and black
-all text with glow background and shadow
-all borders darkened with burn
-slight change of wording in the briefing

other stuff yet to be discussed
-territory colour schemes
-title

decisions
-i will not include hanoi bombings because it was much later than when this was set
-i dont think i will change the ho chi minh trail much as the trail was not actually a marked path or road it was just regular jungle landscape that they went through simply outside of the border of the country so i personally think it makes more sense to look like a landmass then a route 66 type road.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:14 am

also some time in the future i really have to revamp the whole legend so i probably wont make those text modifications yet for the text in the legend, when i do revamp it, it will probably be in a different font anyway. right now im thinking maybe like those HUDs in aircraft or just any military computer screen type. i'll figure that out later maybe if it gets past this stage i might bother otherwise whats the point
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby porkenbeans on Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:50 am

:D
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby cairnswk on Wed Sep 29, 2010 5:51 pm

kengyin...yes i think this does have potential, and i like the concept behind the design, even thought some of the colours simply need tweaking, but that will happen by the end process.
As natty pointed out, your size is an issue.
I have a golden rule for mapmaking that has served me really well.
Develop your map as the small size (630 x 600) first to ensure that everything (army shadows if you want them or numbers plus names in whatever font) will fit adequately.
Good luck!
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby TaCktiX on Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:24 pm

The map has potential, but I must protest against the choices. Saying that a map will stall out somewhere is A: really pessimistic, and B: neglectful of the fact that each map is constantly improving through each stage. There is no predictor of when something will stall out, if it does at all.

As for the map itself, it's got way too much text on it. The briefing is a good touch, but it's a wall of text that doesn't add very much in return. Cut it down to the bare basics or perhaps reword it to something shorter.
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby kengyin on Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:33 pm

yes, i am going to revamp the legend some time, maybe have a short intro then just like situation: ......, objective: ......, bonuses: ....... or something like it, and have like a military computer type dashboard kind of thing as if you were in a military vehicle with suitable font
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