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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:49 am

not much in this update, mostly stuff still needs to be discussed (theres that word again)

v2.3
-background proportions corrected
-central highlands colour darker shade
-glow around legend re-added
-digits changed to 3 digits each

Image

discussion points
-black or coloured text
-which colour scheme
-should i include hanoi bombings
-should i change ho chi minh trail to something like route 66
-and of course im still thinking of a better title

major updates wont really progress until i have figured out sorted out some major issues
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 7:25 pm

maybe i need to make a major overhaul of the map so that more people will comment?
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby natty dread on Sun Sep 26, 2010 7:44 pm

Don't be so impatient. People come here on their free time and comment when they can, you can't expect to get tons of comments after every post. Sometimes you can go days without comments.

My advice is, if you don't get comments for a while, make some change to the map. People will either like or dislike the change, but either way it is likely to get you more feedback.

Mapmaking requires tons of patience. Just keep on working on your map, listen to feedback when you get it, and eventually it'll all work out.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 8:10 pm

right now what im doing is looking at other maps and seeing what makes them so good, so far i am looking at the western front map and the fonts are quite good so i experimented on my map having a colour behind the text and shadows.
just a small example
Image

i think that is looking a lot better, serif bold font at the same size with background colour and shadow. it makes the text stand out more AND also means that with black text it still is easily readable. which means that i have solved the text colour problem. i think i'll just be working on this major font changes for the next few days
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Sun Sep 26, 2010 8:52 pm

a major update is coming it will include
-all text to serif bold and black
-all text with glow background and shadow
-all borders darkened with burn
-slight change of wording in the briefing

other stuff yet to be discussed
-territory colour schemes
-title

decisions
-i will not include hanoi bombings because it was much later than when this was set
-i dont think i will change the ho chi minh trail much as the trail was not actually a marked path or road it was just regular jungle landscape that they went through simply outside of the border of the country so i personally think it makes more sense to look like a landmass then a route 66 type road.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please discuss black or coloured text

Postby kengyin on Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:14 am

also some time in the future i really have to revamp the whole legend so i probably wont make those text modifications yet for the text in the legend, when i do revamp it, it will probably be in a different font anyway. right now im thinking maybe like those HUDs in aircraft or just any military computer screen type. i'll figure that out later maybe if it gets past this stage i might bother otherwise whats the point
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby porkenbeans on Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:50 am

:D
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby cairnswk on Wed Sep 29, 2010 5:51 pm

kengyin...yes i think this does have potential, and i like the concept behind the design, even thought some of the colours simply need tweaking, but that will happen by the end process.
As natty pointed out, your size is an issue.
I have a golden rule for mapmaking that has served me really well.
Develop your map as the small size (630 x 600) first to ensure that everything (army shadows if you want them or numbers plus names in whatever font) will fit adequately.
Good luck!
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby TaCktiX on Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:24 pm

The map has potential, but I must protest against the choices. Saying that a map will stall out somewhere is A: really pessimistic, and B: neglectful of the fact that each map is constantly improving through each stage. There is no predictor of when something will stall out, if it does at all.

As for the map itself, it's got way too much text on it. The briefing is a good touch, but it's a wall of text that doesn't add very much in return. Cut it down to the bare basics or perhaps reword it to something shorter.
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby kengyin on Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:33 pm

yes, i am going to revamp the legend some time, maybe have a short intro then just like situation: ......, objective: ......, bonuses: ....... or something like it, and have like a military computer type dashboard kind of thing as if you were in a military vehicle with suitable font
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby army of nobunaga on Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:51 pm

i like the map man, I know the time you have put into this.

And I love southeast asia with a passion ....


Vietnam is a special country. I miss it. this map would reflect this.


The vietnam war was a slaughter on proportions noone really knows.... The tet offensive was literally a horror house... America killed the enemy at a scale never recorded before.. and NV lost people with a fervor never seen before. I have received a classical unbiased education on this.. and I love the map, just not sure if it does the war credit.
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby Victor Sullivan on Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:55 pm

I know this map needs a lot of work yet, but doesn't it meet the qualifications to move on to Gameplay?
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby kengyin on Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:56 pm

i wouldnt really know i have only been here for under 3 weeks, but im still working on v3.0 right now so i preferably want to finish that and get some comments first ;)
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Re: Vietnam war map - does this map have potential?

Postby kengyin on Thu Sep 30, 2010 3:50 am

v3.0
-all playable area text changed to serif bold 10
-background colour added to all main text involving 3 shades of colour
-shadows also added to all main text
-dark glow added to all border areas
-top flag backgrounds confined to inside the text itself

Image

goals accomplished
-borders stand out more
-text stand out more
-all text can now be black solving that problem
-top area less cluttered

notes
-the title itself is not changed yet but i want to see how the new background does, i havent come up with a better name yet
-i did nothing to the legend, i am currently brainstorming new ideas for it and how to proceed, so thats for the next update

so please dont comment on the title or legend because those were not the goals for this update,
enjoy :D
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v3.0 new text style

Postby kengyin on Fri Oct 01, 2010 8:36 pm

v4.0
-new legend
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new legend, i went for the computerised look, kind of like those screens where you put your mouse over a tab and then the text comes out.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby Victor Sullivan on Sat Oct 02, 2010 11:38 am

I actually like the legend. I think it looks great! Though I have a feeling that others may not like it as much...
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby porkenbeans on Sun Oct 03, 2010 10:15 pm

I like the new legend as well. However, the text will not be very easy to read on the small version. I suggested before that all you need to do is, expand the legend out to the edge of the map. You can also make it a little bit taller too.

Also, I love what you have done with the colors. It kinda reminds me of the silk jackets with the brightly colored embroidery that was made in Nam during the war. See if you can google it or something. You will see what I mean, and maybe you might get a cool idea or two.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby kengyin on Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:31 pm

bump
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby Industrial Helix on Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:53 pm

This map is progressing pretty well and its come a long way, but I do have some issues to throw out there.

1) The whole land invasion of North Vietnam is not correct. The USA never made the massive land invasion that you're depicting here. What I suggest is maybe keeping one boat heading north (to keep the flow of the map) and then throw in an air power option. Put some carriers in the South China Sea that can be attacked by bases in S Vietnam. The carriers can bombard North Vietnam. Do this and I will give you my utmost support to see this map quenched. Nothing bothers me more than inaccurate historical maps, and the land invasion from the south is the only major point.

2) You need a small map. This is important because you need to know as soon as possible whether or not everything will fit on the small map.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby jefjef on Mon Oct 11, 2010 10:00 pm

Listen to IH. He knows what it takes.

I would also work on the bonus color flow some more and make Ho Chi Minh trail a trail.. Not a land mass.

As for your current poll. Do away with that. Gameplay and graphics will be worked on in their proper forums. All you really need to know is if peeps are interested and they sure appear to be.

Just do what IH sugg'd (small map) and you'll move forward.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby kengyin on Tue Oct 12, 2010 5:42 am

Industrial Helix wrote:This map is progressing pretty well and its come a long way, but I do have some issues to throw out there.

1) The whole land invasion of North Vietnam is not correct. The USA never made the massive land invasion that you're depicting here. What I suggest is maybe keeping one boat heading north (to keep the flow of the map) and then throw in an air power option. Put some carriers in the South China Sea that can be attacked by bases in S Vietnam. The carriers can bombard North Vietnam. Do this and I will give you my utmost support to see this map quenched. Nothing bothers me more than inaccurate historical maps, and the land invasion from the south is the only major point.

2) You need a small map. This is important because you need to know as soon as possible whether or not everything will fit on the small map.

if the carriers only bombard then does that mean there is only one assault point via the one boat onto north vietnam? :?:
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby Industrial Helix on Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:25 am

That's what I'm thinking. The strength of the USA wasn't in land invasions during the war, it was my bombing the hell out of North Vietnam. I imagine that people will be able to make a dive for North Vietnam via the boat if they have to, thus keeping the flow of the map. Perhaps the boat can have an entrance point in the north or the south of N. Vietnam, so two entrance points making it difficult to block up by any player wishing to secure the whole of North Vietnam, and make the boat itself a killer neutral, like 2.

After that, maybe raise the value of the bonuses in N.V. so as to encourage players to grab them despite US airattacks.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby The Bison King on Tue Oct 12, 2010 8:29 am

Don't you think it's about time you make a design brief?
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby Industrial Helix on Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:46 pm

The Bison King wrote:Don't you think it's about time you make a design brief?


Small map is required first.
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Re: Vietnam war map - please comment on v4.0

Postby Victor Sullivan on Tue Oct 12, 2010 9:03 pm

Industrial Helix wrote:
The Bison King wrote:Don't you think it's about time you make a design brief?


Small map is required first.

:?: I only had a large version when Pachisi went to Gameplay.
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