Conquer Club

Evil DIMwit wrote:Newtown:
I'm not sure if it's clear that to get a bonus in Newtown you have to hold every territory of the corresponding color. I need a way to state that more succinctly, though.

Haha, okay. I remember asking about this before and thought you said the opposite, but okay. You could probably stand to increase them by one a piece, except Industrial, then. Rather difficult to hold any one color except green.

Evil DIMwit wrote:Enclave:
I might increase Barley to 3. Meadow might be worth 4, maybe.

You really should...

Evil DIMwit wrote:Aeternum:
Yes, castles count in region calculations, just as they do in Feudal War.

Ah, okay. Thanks for clearing that up.

Evil DIMwit wrote:Fahrenheit:
To get to the Oases, you need to break through some neutrals, so I want them a bit overvalued.I'm thinking something like 3 for every oasis territory, 3 for every desert territory one away from the twins, 2 for the next layer, and 1 for the next layer (maybe 2 for FL3).
The brown lines are pretty much just there to delineate which region of the desert corresponds to which Classic territory, and accordingly separate the regions that the letter codes refer to.

Ah, okay. I just made the assumption they'd all be neutral 1's like Oasis, but your idea seems good. And with it I think the bonuses would be fine with that.

Oasis is not all neutral 1s. They do get higher as you get closer to the Grand Oasis.

Evil DIMwit wrote:Oasis is not all neutral 1s. They do get higher as you get closer to the Grand Oasis.

Do they? *goes to check...* Oh, I guess you're right. Silly me!

Edited Enclave and Newtown zone bonuses; adjusted Newtown legend and moved helipad legend to a more thematic spot.



I think my next step is neutral counts. My current thoughts:
3 for every oasis territory (including each twin oasis)
3 for each FT desert territory; 2 for FJ and FL; 1 for FN
Newtown: 2 for each house, 3 for each factory and store
Enclave: 4 on the Throne
Seascape and Ocean: 3 on each market
Aeternum: 2 for each territory in a castle's realm; 5 for each castle that isn't a starting position; 3 for each village; 1 for every other territory in AD, AL, AB, AO

Your neutrals seem good. It might also be worth it to put 2 on EM1 or EM2, OE1 or OE2, and all of the territories with local markets. EM and OE, just cuz they're 2-territory bonuses, and the markets because it would help against too much of a starting bonus since resource pairs wouldn't be too difficult to drop.

Victor Sullivan wrote:Your neutrals seem good. It might also be worth it to put 2 on EM1 or EM2, OE1 or OE2, and all of the territories with local markets. EM and OE, just cuz they're 2-territory bonuses, and the markets because it would help against too much of a starting bonus since resource pairs wouldn't be too difficult to drop.

As I've noted, I'm putting 3 neutrals on each market.

As for EM and OE, they're 1 troop each and on a map this big, I'd think it wouldn't make much difference.

Evil DIMwit wrote:

Victor Sullivan wrote:Your neutrals seem good. It might also be worth it to put 2 on EM1 or EM2, OE1 or OE2, and all of the territories with local markets. EM and OE, just cuz they're 2-territory bonuses, and the markets because it would help against too much of a starting bonus since resource pairs wouldn't be too difficult to drop.

As I've noted, I'm putting 3 neutrals on each market.

As for EM and OE, they're 1 troop each and on a map this big, I'd think it wouldn't make much difference.

(Sorry, I guess I need to read more thoroughly ) I suppose you could adjust starting positions if you wanted to as well, but that's fine. What's next on the agenda?

Now...



Now we wait for more input.

A lot of the maps on this map are objective maps. Yet this map doesn't have an objective.

Have you considered one?

An objective would be tricky to balance. It'd have to be big enough that you have to be active in a large part of the map but small enough that it doesn't require you to take over the whole map already. I can see it being balanced if it's something like...
Hold 3 of the following:
- The Twin Oasis
- 6 Castles
- 4 Markets
- The Throne
- All Stores

But that's quite complex so I don't know if it's a good idea.

I like the idea. If only you can find the legend space for it...

What I could do is, I could make a little special icon, and then distribute it throughout the map -- say, one on each castle, store, and market, two on each Twin Oasis terr., three on the Throne, say, and then say "Hold 12 to win" or some such. But then people would have to count, too.

Evil DIMwit wrote:But then people would have to count, too.

Oh noes, brain hurt!

natty_dread wrote:

Evil DIMwit wrote:But then people would have to count, too.

Oh noes, brain hurt!

I thought the same thing also! LOL If someone is holding 12 that likely means they are going to win anyhow... just a thought...

Bruceswar wrote:

natty_dread wrote:

Evil DIMwit wrote:But then people would have to count, too.

Oh noes, brain hurt!

I thought the same thing also! LOL If someone is holding 12 that likely means they are going to win anyhow... just a thought...

Well, it's borderline, which I think the good objectives (e.g. Europe 1914, Third Crusade) are. You can get it with all the Castles and the Twin Oasis; with the Throne, half the castles, and all the Markets; with Newtown, Seascape, and Fahrenheit; but it might be easier to go with a mix. It actually might be an interesting way to incentivize people to spread their interests out over the map and to prevent games from going on too long.

I like the objective you suggested. I say roll with it. Like you said, it could counteract those nastily long No Spoils games.

Continents can be part of objectives, so there's no problem with the "hold any 3 of these 6 mini-objectives" concept. As for legend, if more space is needed, we can make the map a little wider.

You know, I almost doubted for a minute that I could cram those victory conditions in, but here they are plain as day.



I hope that's clear.

Evil DIMwit wrote:You know, I almost doubted for a minute that I could cram those victory conditions in, but here they are plain as day.

I hope that's clear.

Yes, clear enough for anyone with reasonable intelligence.

Maybe, just to pronounce the importance of Helipads - the Helipad in the legend could be at the tope of the Newtown legend right-hand column - creates a bit of symmetry with the ports legend position.

Good progress here evil.

DJ Teflon wrote:Maybe, just to pronounce the importance of Helipads - the Helipad in the legend could be at the tope of the Newtown legend right-hand column - creates a bit of symmetry with the ports legend position.

A fine suggestion. Done.

Here's that version implemented:

Lookin' mighty fine! My only quibble would be that the icon used to depict the Twin Oasis is somewhat incorrect, as it shows the surrounding desert as well, and could be a tad misleading.

-Sully

That's a good point. I'll change it around once I have enough changes to justify a new update.

long-ish comment forthcoming (likely tomorrow). Beyond my first reaction (which is "Supersize this cramped puppy") I think that I will restrict myself to the general things that grab my attention, as analyzing this in detail might take two or three solar years. If anyone notices any details (or anything for that matter) which are amiss, speak up!

-- Marshal Ney

MarshalNey wrote:Beyond my first reaction (which is "Supersize this cramped puppy")

That'd be nice. I think this map could benefit from supersize. IMO it'd be especially nice to see Ocean not as a inset, I just think it's a little odd thaty the entire Ocean section is about the size of one territory.

-Sully