[Abandoned] - SlovakNationalUprising

[Industrial Helix]

I dunno about a bonus system like that. It's already very hard to hold the German route anyway... if it has a negative result, it might become impossible. Though, you could make it -1 without the whole route and add in an autodeploy on each town on the route.

It would be realistic because the Nazi's would be using supplies from the town to strengthen their army and it would support the idea that once taken, it is hard to get the Nazi's out.

Plus, it would make the route stations more easy to defend as there is always an autodeploy strengthening the armies there.

AND it would discourage players from taking the towns unless they were planning to take the route. Because if you commit to the route, then you're deployable armies are going to disappear in favor of the autodeploys.

[theBastard]

I dunno about a bonus system like that. It's already very hard to hold the German route anyway... if it has a negative result, it might become impossible. Though, you could make it -1 without the whole route and add in an autodeploy on each town on the route.

hm, this sounds logic... but I can not have so much autodeploys. WE NEED CONDITIONAL AUTODEPLOYS!

It would be realistic because the Nazi's would be using supplies from the town to strengthen their army and it would support the idea that once taken, it is hard to get the Nazi's out.

the truth is that only few towns was retaken by partisans...
what about to do only towns (not with garison, not battle sites, not airports) +1 autodeploy?

Plus, it would make the route stations more easy to defend as there is always an autodeploy strengthening the armies there.

AND it would discourage players from taking the towns unless they were planning to take the route. Because if you commit to the route, then you're deployable armies are going to disappear in favor of the autodeploys.

I want to have any negative bonus here... will think about this a little...

EDIT: if towns will be +1 autodeploy, then the German unit routes will be more easy to hold.

[theBastard]

what is needed to resolve here? graphics? gameplay? bonuses?

[Industrial Helix]

Nothing that I can think of is wrong with this map. Let's sticky it and see what happens in two days, if no one has any objections then I will stamp it.

[Industrial Helix]

Whoa... I moved this without stamping and posting... Sorry about that.

[thenobodies80]

thebastard, first of all I'm really happy to see that your mapmaker ability is increasing day after day, continue in this way.
Now, about your supersize request....try to keep the extra space at the minimum but the map is worth some additional pixels, so go with it.

Good Work!

Nobodies

[theBastard]

thanks for stamp, Helix

thebastard, first of all I'm really happy to see that your mapmaker ability is increasing day after day, continue in this way.

yes my thumb is better. hope it will be more better...

Now, about your supersize request....try to keep the extra space at the minimum but the map is worth some additional pixels, so go with it.

I know the explantations and legend cover much place. I can not see any way how to reduce it. maybe I could reduce map to 840x600/620, but it does not means that it would helps...

Good Work!

Nobodies

thanks for supersize, thanks for nice words, nobodies...

[Industrial Helix]

What's going on with this map? I want to play!

[Dukasaur]

I'm actually really impressed with this map... it seems to convey the military events quite well and enables players to re-enact the event. Plus, it covers a region not on CC already and an area of WWII largely overlooked. So you've got my support.

Strongly concur with both of those points. Plus, it's nice to see some work from a brother Slav..

I am glad that you (both) feel what was my goal where are you from? it shows Canada now...

I've been in Canada most of my life but I was born in Praha...

About the only thing I would say is that the little yellow dotted lines for the railroad will be very hard to see for old farts like me with bad eyes. I would make big thick yellow lines there, with a diameter at least 1/2 of the diameter of the train station boxes.

Same thing with the one-way arrows... bigger and bolder.

there is needed some edits. will see what I can do for you.

Yes, the new railroads and arrows are much better!

[theBastard]

I've been in Canada most of my life but I was born in Praha...

so we can speak CzechoSlovak... Praha is beautiful city, did you visit it after arrival?

Yes, the new railroads and arrows are much better!

thanks. glad you like it.

[Nola_Lifer]

Update! Update! Update!

[theBastard]

Update! Update! Update!

thanks Nola for interest and support. but there will be no more updates.

this is my end in this page. I mean not only in drawing maps, but I will not be active here more.
I came back after my thumb injury. I think that this map is interesting (as gameplay, also WWII theme) and only few people had interest here.

look how much guys are active on Foundries. where is Victor Sullivan, cairnswk, Kabanellas, The Bison King, Evil DIMwit, isaiah40, MrBenn, gimil, rdsrds2120, DJ Teflon, 40kguy, OliverFA, AndyDufresne, Bruceswar, RedBaron0, TaCktiX... these guys are permanent active and look how much they posted on my maps (Baltic Crusade, Medieval Oligarchy, Invasions map pack, Slovak National Uprising). I tried to help or post my ideas to much of their maps and also they posted to each other. so realy guys thanks for interest and your ideas...

I would like to thanks some guys for support and help. I found here some realy cool guys. at the first place Industrial Helix and thenobodies80 for everything, Nola_Lifer, ender516. also natty_dread for his mainly graphics help, MarshalNey for some genial inputs.

I understand that everybody has own real life, family, job but me too...

[The Bison King]

A bummer. You had a lot of really great idea's, it's a shame that none of them ever came into completion

[cairnswk]

I am sorry you feel like this theBastard.
I for one have only just returned to being active since early June after almost 12 months away, so i have not been permanently active, and i do have other projects and RL to consider. In fact my posting will soon decline for the next semester at uni.
Also, you should know, that you don't always get back in life from those you give to. Sometimes it comes back from others, and sometimes not for long time. If you fall down, then get up and keep trying. If your trying is not hard enough, then perhaps you will keep falling down, and your heart was not really in your projects. But whatever your decision, i wish you luck.

[Kabanellas]

thebastard, first of all I'm really happy to see that your mapmaker ability is increasing day after day, continue in this way.

Bastard, I really agree with nobodies here. So you can't leave when you're getting better by the day. Things can move quite slowly on the Foundry, you'll just have to get used to it....

I'm sorry I don't post much around here, but most of the times, I honestly don't feel comfortable enough to do it. I feel that to give a valid and honest opinion that goes a little beyond superficiality one must have the time to really dig into the map and be totally in sync with the thread. With all my real life issues, wife, work and all, plus my involvement on the foundry has a mapmaker just keep me a bit overwhelmed... and I also play (yup I do like to roll and get 1's and 2's) and have a somewhat strong involvement with clan issues, so I permanently have a reasonable amount of games going on which can really take a lot of time from you.

Anyway, I hope you do consider that decision of yours. I'd like to continue to see you hanging around this house.

[koontz1973]

Do not say bye as the map have been coming along great guns. Keep at it and in the end we can all play it. Never posted in your thread as I never had anything to say that could be deemed worthy.

[natty dread]

If you decide to continue with this map, I have one advice:

Take the img tags off from old versions on the first page. I wanted to check out your latest version, but since you have all the images in tags and they all have to load, the images load too slowly...

I'll try to check out your map if you continue working on it.

[natty dread]

I'm not really good on analyzing gameplay, so I'll leave that to someone more capable and give you some graphical advice...

The background you have doesn't really fit with the style & theme of the map. The paper background looks like something that would go well with some of your other projects, the medieval maps... it has that old, worn parchment look. Which doesn't really go well with a WWII era map - you should have a slightly newer looking paper for it.

Secondly, the graphical elements you have on the map are not working well with the background. They don't look like they belong on that background, sort of like they're just pasted on it. However, like said, I'd rather you'd try finding a background that would work better with the elements you have, since I don't think the background really works for the theme.

Also, the "worn parchment style" has been really overdone lately... not that that counts for a reason on it's own, but like I said, you could do better for the theme of the map with some other kind of background.

I'm a bit concerned that 2/3 of your map is legend & instructions, and only 1/3 is playable area. You need to make it simpler - not necessarily simplify the gameplay, but try making it easier for the player to understand... streamline the instructions - no one wants to have to read a novel just to understand how a map works... try using more visual elements for the legend, replace as much of the text with visual elements as you can.

To that effect... perhaps you could also tilt the playable area a bit and zoom in to it, to also make it less cluttered... then arrange the legend & other instructions, title, etc. around the map. The title could also be more prominent - current title is a bit boring.

Anyway, I hope I'm not writing all this for nothing

[Victor Sullivan]

where is Victor Sullivan

Right here

Actually, I've been watching this map. Just sometimes it takes a bit to hunker down and type all that needs to be said for gameplay (I'm like the opposite of natty in that respect - graphics aren't my forte), especially when you've got a gameplay-giant of a map like this one. Just give me some time I've had other things that I've been busy with lately. And feel free to shoot me a PM. I'll be out of town this week, but I may be able to pop in from time to time.

-Sully

[TaCktiX]

I apologize on not posting, but while you had those other maps up I was literally indisposed to providing feedback, only doing the bare minimum. And when I would have posted on SNP, Helix had already stated what I was going to say. I like seeing the first update AFTER a Draft stamp before making a long critique. I'm sorry that my reticence was a reason for driving you away, but I do ask that you please stay for this once. You won't regret it, I promise.

[Dukasaur]

I've been in Canada most of my life but I was born in Praha...

so we can speak CzechoSlovak... Praha is beautiful city, did you visit it after arrival?

Yeah, I've been home five times total since coming here... although most recent was in 1996, I'm overdue for another.

Yes, the new railroads and arrows are much better!

thanks. glad you like it.

I do. Don't be giving up now, you've got some good stuff here!

[theBastard]

A bummer. You had a lot of really great idea's, it's a shame that none of them ever came into completion

Baltic Crusade is in Final foundry...

I am sorry you feel like this theBastard.

yes I feel it so. but it is not only my feeling - it is fact, a very little interest in my maps...

I for one have only just returned to being active since early June after almost 12 months away, so i have not been permanently active, and i do have other projects and RL to consider. In fact my posting will soon decline for the next semester at uni.
Also, you should know, that you don't always get back in life from those you give to. Sometimes it comes back from others, and sometimes not for long time. If you fall down, then get up and keep trying.

I know you had big pause, but look how much posts I have in your maps and how much you in my...

If your trying is not hard enough, then perhaps you will keep falling down, and your heart was not really in your projects. But whatever your decision, i wish you luck.

do you think? did you see my first attempts of mapping? I am sure no - I was totaly "analphabet" in using Photoshop or GIMP. and I learn everything from nothing. and I have 6 maps in site, each one with different idea and gameplay...

I'm sorry I don't post much around here, but most of the times, I honestly don't feel comfortable enough to do it. I feel that to give a valid and honest opinion that goes a little beyond superficiality one must have the time to really dig into the map and be totally in sync with the thread. With all my real life issues, wife, work and all, plus my involvement on the foundry has a mapmaker just keep me a bit overwhelmed... and I also play (yup I do like to roll and get 1's and 2's) and have a somewhat strong involvement with clan issues, so I permanently have a reasonable amount of games going on which can really take a lot of time from you.

everybody has his real life, women or girl friend, job, friends... and I do not think that anybody could says "I am the most busy in real life". you have one post in my 6 maps. could you tell me how much have I in yours?

Anyway, I hope you do consider that decision of yours. I'd like to continue to see you hanging around this house.

no, I will not continue more.

Do not say bye as the map have been coming along great guns. Keep at it and in the end we can all play it. Never posted in your thread as I never had anything to say that could be deemed worthy.

this is not my only thread/map. do you know about this...?

I'm not really good on analyzing gameplay, so I'll leave that to someone more capable and give you some graphical advice...

therefore I thanks you for your graphics inputs. but do not believe that you are not good in analyzing gameplay - you are old and skilled member...

The background you have doesn't really fit with the style & theme of the map. The paper background looks like something that would go well with some of your other projects, the medieval maps... it has that old, worn parchment look. Which doesn't really go well with a WWII era map - you should have a slightly newer looking paper for it.

Secondly, the graphical elements you have on the map are not working well with the background. They don't look like they belong on that background, sort of like they're just pasted on it. However, like said, I'd rather you'd try finding a background that would work better with the elements you have, since I don't think the background really works for the theme.

Also, the "worn parchment style" has been really overdone lately... not that that counts for a reason on it's own, but like I said, you could do better for the theme of the map with some other kind of background.

I'm a bit concerned that 2/3 of your map is legend & instructions, and only 1/3 is playable area. You need to make it simpler - not necessarily simplify the gameplay, but try making it easier for the player to understand... streamline the instructions - no one wants to have to read a novel just to understand how a map works... try using more visual elements for the legend, replace as much of the text with visual elements as you can.

To that effect... perhaps you could also tilt the playable area a bit and zoom in to it, to also make it less cluttered... then arrange the legend & other instructions, title, etc. around the map. The title could also be more prominent - current title is a bit boring.

Anyway, I hope I'm not writing all this for nothing

good input. but too late when I must beseech for any feedback...

Actually, I've been watching this map. Just sometimes it takes a bit to hunker down and type all that needs to be said for gameplay (I'm like the opposite of natty in that respect - graphics aren't my forte), especially when you've got a gameplay-giant of a map like this one. Just give me some time I've had other things that I've been busy with lately. And feel free to shoot me a PM. I'll be out of town this week, but I may be able to pop in from time to time.

-Sully

Sully, you have (with this one) three posts in my maps. do you remeber my Medieval Oligarchy? you posted there "how much intrigues you gameplay and that you will post more later" - and you was never more there, as example. you have more as 4000 posts anywhere. and I must say that you have mainly good points about gameplay. but never in my threads.

I apologize on not posting, but while you had those other maps up I was literally indisposed to providing feedback, only doing the bare minimum. And when I would have posted on SNP, Helix had already stated what I was going to say. I like seeing the first update AFTER a Draft stamp before making a long critique. I'm sorry that my reticence was a reason for driving you away, but I do ask that you please stay for this once. You won't regret it, I promise.

ok, if Helix outruned you here, but how much posts you have in my other maps?

Yeah, I've been home five times total since coming here... although most recent was in 1996, I'm overdue for another.

great. and do you know czech language?

I do. Don't be giving up now, you've got some good stuff here!

thanks. but there are very little interest in my maps, so what for I would spend my time, energy?

guys, I do not cry here. it is not my style. just I see very little interest in my maps. maybe I am not enough patient (I do not thing this - Helix and natty know my start here and I teach some skills, also I started new and new maps...).

[natty dread]

Bastard, all mapmakers go through periods when they get less feedback than they'd like - particularly at this time, when there are more map threads calling for attention and not enough commenters. It's a competitive arena out there for map threads these days... if you aren't constantly posting for attention your thread will fall to the bottom where no one will remember it's existence.

You're not alone feeling like this. Heck, with every map I've made, I've had times when I've thought "damn, no feedback again... is it worth it going on, should I just give this up?"

Look at any map thread on this forum... each has had periods when they have been for days - even weeks - without any feedback.

Now, hopefully the situation gets corrected sometime in the near future - lots of bright minds are trying to come up with solutions for it - but meanwhile, all you can do is grit your teeth and keep churning forward. If you don't get feedback, make some noise: keep working on the map, make updates - see how many posts you got just by telling everyone you're quitting the map? If you just post an update, and then wait silently and politely for people to comment, it's up to chance really whether you'll get any feedback - whether your update hits in a point in people's schedules when they are capable of giving feedback or not... and if you just keep waiting for it, patiently and politely, others, more aggressive mapmakers will grab the spotlight and people forget you.

No, it's not an ideal situation. And it's a damn shame and tough shit for all the humble, meek-mannered mapmakers who don't like making a big fuss & noise about themselves. But it is what it is, at least for now, and if you want to succeed, you have to adapt.

Don't think that you're alone with this. Heck, your last map got to FF quite well, and your other threads did receive plenty of feedback, I was there. This map just got to a slow start, if you keep on working on it, and keep making updates, you will get feedback, and you will eventually get the map done - you have the talent, you have good eye for gameplay design - let me tell you this straight out: there's nothing keeping you from being a succesful mapmaker other than your own self-doubt.

Just look around... the maps that get the most feedback are also the maps where the mapmaker makes the most updates. It happens with any map thread. Even for Kabanellas, who's pretty much a genius when it comes to mapmaking, and yet his map threads go quiet as a cemetery if he stops updating for a while.

So it's up to you. The system is not ideal, and we all wish it could work better, but for the moment, we have to work with what we got. If you think it's not suitable for you, and you see it as too much effort, then you probably should quit - there's no sense in doing something like this if you don't enjoy it. You're not getting any money off it. However, if you really want to get this map done... then you should keep on working on it, no matter what.

[cairnswk]

...
I know you had big pause, but look how much posts I have in your maps and how much you in my...

I did, and after doing a search in the threads, i found exactly three posts in Spanish Armada...nowhere else. I'd hardly call that hard core posting in my threads, would you?

Still that is three more posts than i have probably given you particularly when like stated i have been away for nearly 12 months.
And to be honest, the Slovak National Uprising doesn't exactly grab me as a good subject of interest for me. But as it progressed towards graphics, you might have got more interest from me towards completing the graphics ready for FF. I beleive this map was still progressing through gameplay, was it not?

And yes i agree with what Natty said above. Lots of maps go through periods of quietness.
And like i said, if you're determined enough to see a project through then you'll persist with it, otherwise your heart may not have been in the project at all. You're not the only one who has been in this position.

[MarshalNey]

I feel like a major culprit in getting out late or unevenly-timed feedback. A large part of this is my hardware situation, which if anyone has noticed has put me into 2 separate involuntary 'vacations' from CC altogether. However, another part of it is that I try to give long thoughtful replies instead of several sentences that talk about a single, possibly minor, issue. Which makes my commenting either a feast-or-famine sort of situation. Either a mapmaker gets a crap-ton of feedback, or none at all.

What I wish, actually, is that I could somehow communicate that I'm watching a thread and keeping current on its progress without spamming the thread with posts like, "Hey, just wanted to say I'm keeping on eye on this and the progress looks good so far." That way, at least, a mapmaker could know that their work is appreciated and under review.

The Foundry, at various times, has stated a goal of trying to keep a fortnightly (every two weeks) review system where each map gets a mod review within that time period (or shorter). And in the old gameplay and graphics workshops, there were periods of several months at least when that goal was met. However, the hard cold truth is that it takes a lot of devoted time from the CAs, and some good luck in their real lives, to avoid a situation where the map reviews devolve into 3-sentence queries that show a disheartening lack of effort rather than giving good guidance to the mapmaker.

Anyway, this thread is devolving into a Foundry Discussions topic, but it's a good discussion to have certainly.

TheBastard, I apologize heartily for not giving you more feedback. But I can say in all honesty that I have loved every single one of your map ideas. I love history and your maps hit some great topics that I never even knew existed- The Batlic Crusades, and Medieval Oligarchy, for instance. The Reconquista, although it had a somewhat similar look to Baltic Crusades, I still hold as my #1 choice for a map revival. It's an awesome, fascinating topic.

If you're resolved to leave, I understand. CC can be a drain on time, and mapmaking on CC can be an outright killer. Perhaps, though, it may just be a vacation to recharge- who knows?

In any case, let me say thank you for the good map ideas and helpful comments. And thank you for educating me about periods of history that I never even knew about, and may never have looked into otherwise.

-- Marshal Ney