[Abandoned] - Chess

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Postby Keredrex on Mon Sep 10, 2007 12:15 pm

Few More Suggestions...
Obviously Graphics...Get some Clean Images For the Pieces

I think the pieces on the board should be sort of like turrets....Example

I dont think the pieces should attack every square around them...
They should only attack as they do in chess...

A Pawn Should attack the 2 diagnol Front Squares... But be attacked from any adjacent....
A Bishop Should Attack all Diagnol squares (Like Bombardment)...
A Knight Should Attack JUST like his Chess moves...L...Like Bombardment
( the knight Is only a bombardment Unit-it can be attacked from any adjacent Square)
A Rook...Like the Bishop But Up Down Left Right
A Queen - Bishop & Rook Combined Essentially
A King - Again easy... But Aonly Adjacent Squares

I also think that the PIECES should only advance armies on to other PIECES...example if a knight attakked a pawn it can advance... But not to a square

Since All PIECES are bonus areas... the board should have some Automatically designated Neutrals... I see this game becoming a conquest of the Squares Using the Pieces as Strength to take over the land....again See my previous post for the Bonus ideas...

But for this to work the positions should be thought out a bit... you may not want certain pieces to imeadiately attack others... also the Strong pieces should be THREATENED by other pieces which justifies the bonuses...The KNIGHT is important... it is the only "turret" that can threaten a Strong piece (Queen) and Not Face retaliation....WHAT DO YOU THINK? I just want to see a map like this become reality I think it will be HOT... If you need help (Idea Or Graphically- i don't do XML)Let me know.
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Postby turtle32 on Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:53 pm

the above post is very good, the positions should be though out to stergically place the bonuses, i am a chass player and i might have a few suggestions soon
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Postby john9blue on Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:47 pm

Awesome post, Keredrex. As far as graphics, this is about the extent of what I can do on MS Paint, so I would need a real map artist to work on it once all the ideas are hammered out here.

Also, I agree that the pieces should only attack as they would in chess, because, come to think of it, the instructions can be confusing, and having the pieces attack adjacent empty squares would give them too much power. I guess that would mean that blank squares in the piece's movement zone could be attacked, which makes sense, since they could move there anyway. The bishop, for instance, would attack every piece of the other color, plus every square that it could move to in real life chess. (All the ones on its diagonals.) The pawn could attack pieces on a one square diagonal, but would move only to the empty square in front of it. Then, the empty squares would attack up, down, left, or right.

There's one problem with pieces not being able to put armies on empty squares, that being that all of the units would eventually condense onto the pieces, and not be able to get off. If you had no empty squares, then, you couldn't deploy there, and you'd be stuck on the pieces forever.

Regarding the queens, I put knights where they are for exactly that reason... one queen is under attack by two knights, the other by one. And, they can't attack back. Makes them a bit easier to capture, I'd say. 8)
Last edited by john9blue on Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Keredrex on Wed Sep 12, 2007 11:30 pm

john9blue wrote:Awesome post, Keredrex. As far as graphics, this is about the extent of what I can do on MS Paint, so I would need a real map artist to work on it once all the ideas are hammered out here.

Also, ....


I can help with some of the graphic work.... I think we are on to something big here... If we get good ideas from the club this could be a spectacular map

Maybe the pieces can advance men only to the immediate attacking square... for example..
the bishop can bombard their diagonals and advance in to the four immediate corners...
or maybe the pieces can attack and advance to just pieces...
but the king can advance to Pieces and squares...
bascially you use the pieces to fight the all the pieces to the king then you can travel the squares... of course if you own squares then you can advance on the squares also.....this could potentially create impassable borders that become bridges.... Yeah this is gonna be friggin awesome !!
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Postby turtle32 on Sat Sep 15, 2007 10:44 am

Keredrex wrote:
john9blue wrote:Awesome post, Keredrex. As far as graphics, this is about the extent of what I can do on MS Paint, so I would need a real map artist to work on it once all the ideas are hammered out here.

Also, ....


I can help with some of the graphic work.... I think we are on to something big here... If we get good ideas from the club this could be a spectacular map

Maybe the pieces can advance men only to the immediate attacking square... for example..
the bishop can bombard their diagonals and advance in to the four immediate corners...
or maybe the pieces can attack and advance to just pieces...
but the king can advance to Pieces and squares...
bascially you use the pieces to fight the all the pieces to the king then you can travel the squares... of course if you own squares then you can advance on the squares also.....this could potentially create impassable borders that become bridges.... Yeah this is gonna be friggin awesome !!


the thing i don't like about this is that it would be extremly hard to conqueor if you got eliminated to just the peices. I like the idea of all the peices being able to attack any square they were gona be on, that way it's easier to attack the whole board, we just have to make sure that there are squares that are unatackable by other peices.
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Postby dominationnation on Sat Sep 15, 2007 10:53 am

I have an idea. You can make all of the pieces neutral to start out. Everyones armies start on the empty squares. Then Make it so that you can use the new objective feature. Make an objective to own all of one color and the opposing teams king. Also I like the idea that all of the empty territorys attack any adjecent squares. THe pieces bombard any of the territorys that they can normally attack.
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Postby Keredrex on Sat Sep 15, 2007 12:45 pm

turtle32 wrote:the thing i don't like about this is that it would be extremly hard to conqueor if you got eliminated to just the peices. I like the idea of all the peices being able to attack any square they were gona be on, that way it's easier to attack the whole board, we just have to make sure that there are squares that are unatackable by other peices.


Why would it be hard???? the Pieces have there own bonuses... my earlier post......
Keredrex wrote:Try Making every square a playbel area...
and having the continents designated by:

Blank Spaces connected (No Chess Pieces) have a bonus value
for example: the top left corner has
7 Blank Spaces connected - this could be considered a continent

also, Make the pieces continents: for example
Any Pawn = +1 men
Any Knight/Bishop = +3 man
Any Rook = +6
Any Queen = +8
Any King = +10

Maybe even give Negatives If you have off color pieces... (ie. 3 White Pawns a black Rook = 9 but since there off color you get a minus 3)

Maybe having both queens negate each other or having King & Queen together give a special bonus.... Maybe the king is actually worth Nothing or you need the king to get the bonus for the pieces………Interesting and Fun I think

.... a Pawn by itself is +1... if someone is solely on Pieces they have plenty of bonuses to accommodate advancement to the King...... think of it like a pyramid.........
...You have the Squares - holding a group gives you a small bonus lets say +2...
.. you attack and take over a rook and a pawn... now you have +7...
You advance along whatever pieces to get to the king....
from the king you can go back to the Squares... essentially the king will be the end of the BRIDGE to another territory of squares...

maybe the king could be less valuable bonus wise cause it is essentially a defensive piece....whoever has the squares around the king would want to defend that king
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Postby Shelter417 on Thu Sep 27, 2007 6:55 pm

Probably a bit late to suggest this, but it'd be neat if the map started off with the pieces in the opening position. Don't know if you could program a 1-1 game so that one player would get all white and the other would get all black, leaving the open territories neutral, sort of like a no man's land, but that'd be cool.
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Postby NESconqueror on Thu Sep 27, 2007 7:43 pm

I say that this map is GENIUS! :D
Go for it I say and maybe include the en passant deal or likely castling. :D
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Postby Keredrex on Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:43 am

I think it would lose its eplayability if it was a map of the Starting positions of A chess Game.... ...It would be a Symmetrical board...not very appealing......Also en passant and Castling would require the designation of the Territory ( King-For Example) to somehow Change...Put we don't have animated maps yet so it doesn't really work here.....I really wnat to know what the club thinks of my ideas...READ MY POSTS IN THIS TOPIC, PLEASE and let me know what you think and who wants to help me make it ..... I can do CONCEPT, and GRAPHICS WORK... But I need a master of XML to let me know if this is at all possible
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Postby Coleman on Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:56 am

All that xml seems possible to me. I might even be willing to code it myself if there isn't anyone else available.
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Postby Keredrex on Fri Sep 28, 2007 1:06 pm

Coleman wrote:All that xml seems possible to me. I might even be willing to code it myself if there isn't anyone else available.


Awesome Ill Work on an Image
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Postby turtle32 on Fri Oct 05, 2007 11:40 pm

is this map still going to happen, i was really looking forward to it
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Absolutely

Postby Keredrex on Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:16 am

YES...YES...YES....I am working on the image
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Postby The Weird One on Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:15 pm

mibi wrote:i think this is an excellent idea, however, i think it would be cool if every space had a chess piece that could attack in the manner of its piece. that way, it may not look like a usualy board but it would still take some of the critical thinking involved in chess.


I agree, it's a good idea, but, if possible, it should have as much of actual chess incorporated into it as possible.
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Postby The Weird One on Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:18 pm

also, there shouldn't be a bonus for the empty squares (unless, maybe it's for once you have ALL of them)
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Postby Keredrex on Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:18 am

The Weird One wrote:
mibi wrote:i think this is an excellent idea, however, i think it would be cool if every space had a chess piece that could attack in the manner of its piece. that way, it may not look like a usualy board but it would still take some of the critical thinking involved in chess.


I agree, it's a good idea, but, if possible, it should have as much of actual chess incorporated into it as possible.

also, there shouldn't be a bonus for the empty squares (unless, maybe it's for once you have ALL of them)


If the board had a piece on every square...then What pieces would go where...it would be a mess....who knows how many of each piece and there would be debates about not enough of this or that.... If you make it a Game situation with all the pieces in a Mid Game stance then you could have strategic positions for each piece.... it would be a cleaner looking map...

ALSO, Chess is essentially a representation of 2 (OR 4)
armies on a battle field... Or 2 kingdoms fighting for conquest.... So the squares could essentially be Areas of Value....In chess Holding the center is to have the advantage .. So the empty squares Should have Some value since the pieces that occupy the board are All gonna have bonus value... This makes for a balanced Conquer Club Map since you may have 6 players on this board.....I will have an Image up on thursday
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Postby john9blue on Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:06 pm

Sorry I haven't posted in a while, I've been busy with school, college apps, and such. Looks like this map is making progress without me being here, which is great! I think the next step is to finalize what the rules will be.

It seems from the posts that the movement will go as follows:
-Pieces attack all empty squares they can normally move to, and any opposite color pieces in range.
-Empty squares attack the 4 adjacent squares.

We haven't really decided on the bonuses yet, though. Here is what I propose:
-All pieces start off neutral, and all players start on empty squares.
-+1 for each pawn, +2 for each bishop/knight/rook, +3 for each queen/king. These should be small, or else the game could quickly get very chaotic.
-+4 for holding all bishops, knights, or rooks.
-If King and Queen of a color are held, +2 for each piece of same color, and +1 for each empty square of same color.

Ideas are welcome.

A few notes for Keredrex:
-In a later draft of the map, I put a black pawn on B2. This is a good idea for two reasons: it gives the blank squares in the upper left corner more access, and it endangers the white queen even more. I recommend you do this, unless you have a reason not to.
-Remember to put john9blue on the map somewhere, I'd like credit for my idea. I figured you were gonna do this anyway, just wanted to make sure.
-You, sir, are awesome, and have been a huge supporter of this map. Thanks!
Last edited by john9blue on Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Unit_2 on Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:41 pm

is there going to be a update?
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Postby Keredrex on Tue Oct 09, 2007 7:35 pm

john9blue wrote:Sorry I haven't posted in a while, I've been busy with school, college apps, and such. Looks like this map is making progress without me being here, which is great! I think the next step is to finalize what the rules will be.

It seems from the posts that the movement will go as follows:
-Pieces attack all empty squares they can normally move to, and any opposite color pieces in range.
-Empty squares attack the 4 adjacent squares.

We haven't really decided on the bonuses yet, though. Here is what I propose:
-All pieces start off neutral, and all players start on empty squares.
-+1 for each pawn, +2 for each bishop/knight/rook, +3 for each queen/king. These should be small, or else the game could quickly get very chaotic.
-+4 for holding all bishops, knights, or rooks.
-If King and Queen of a color are held, +2 for each piece of same color, and +1 for each empty square of same color.

Ideas are welcome.

A few notes for Keredrex:
-In a later draft of the map, I put a black pawn on B2. This is a good idea for two reasons: it gives the blank squares in the upper left corner more access, and it endangers the white queen even more. I recommend you do this, unless you have a reason not to.
-Remember to put john9blue on the map somewhere, I'd like credit for my idea. I figured you were gonna do this anyway, just wanted to make sure.
-You, sir, are awesome, and have been a huge supporter of this map. Thanks!


thanks..... Glad to collaborate with you John for this map...it is progressing nicely and there should be an image by MONDAY
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Postby john9blue on Wed Oct 17, 2007 8:49 pm

I've made a third draft, which looks more realistic than the previous two. It actually has easy to understand bonuses this time! I displayed it on my first post as well.

Image

Anyway, since it's Wednesday already, I figured Keredrex was maybe too busy with his schedule to do the map or something. Which is fine by me, it's not like he's obligated or anything. If you are working on a map, Keredrex, feel free to post it whenever you're done, so people can comment on it.

Thoughts on the new map? :P
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Postby DiM on Wed Oct 17, 2007 9:19 pm

john9blue wrote:Thoughts on the new map? :P


1. the frame you used is copyrighted by stockphoto. get rid of it.
2. you're still working in paint. because i admire your efforts i feel the need to urge you to learn a better software. until you do that you'll never get this map quenched. paint simply sux no matter how talented you are.
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Postby Coleman on Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:18 pm

DiM wrote:paint simply sux no matter how talented you are.
We could make you eat those words, but I'll hold back... For now...
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Postby oaktown on Thu Oct 18, 2007 12:25 am

DiM wrote:1. the frame you used is copyrighted by stockphoto. get rid of it.
2. you're still working in paint. because i admire your efforts i feel the need to urge you to learn a better software. until you do that you'll never get this map quenched. paint simply sux no matter how talented you are.

The frame looks very nice, but is more appropriate for a painting on a wall than as the border of a chess board. Even if it wasn't stock image I'd say lose it.

And I don't know Paint at all, but how is it that the frame can look so clear yet the text is so terribly pixelated?

some aspects of the legend aren't clear: "With King & Queen of same color: chess piece 2, empty square 1" - I thought this meant you get +1 for any empty square (empty being a bad choice of words to being with, because if it has armies on it it's not empty), which would be a crazy huge bonus in addition to the +6 you alread get for owning the king and queen, but in reading above it's only a +1 for squares of the same color... still a crazy bonus.

Bonuses: I'm not sure about giving a bonus for holding all four rooks, etc... seems like you'd want to give bonuses for holding rooks of the same color if that's the kind of play you're encouraging with the king/queen bonus.

I'd even suggest NOT giving bonuses for single pieces, but only for pairing them up with like colors... if somebody gets lucky on their first turn they'll grab a king on round 1, start round 2 with six armies, take the like color queen in round 2 and the game is over. Make players earn that first bonus - pair the king/queen of each color, knights, rooks, and bishops; give a +1 for holding any two like color pawns. It'll take some work writing the code, but it's workable.

You have two different types of pawns on the same map - inconsistent graphic element.
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Postby DiM on Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:22 am

Coleman wrote:
DiM wrote:paint simply sux no matter how talented you are.
We could make you eat those words, but I'll hold back... For now...


yes i know by showing me one of those cool videos where a guy draws monalisa in paint. but even if that guy would come and use his great skill in paint to make a map he still wouldn't be able.

one simple request like. move that border or put bevel into that text and stuff like that would mean he has to redo the image instead of applying a simple effect with 2 clicks. :roll:
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