Nordic Countries [Quenched]

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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby lostatlimbo on Thu Aug 18, 2011 5:26 pm

Looks good to me, but I'm not the person you need to hear that from. :)
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [16.8.11]

Postby isaiah40 on Thu Aug 18, 2011 5:41 pm

gimil wrote:At the risk of sounding like the bad guy, I am still not feeling the impassable stuff. Unfortunately I am not being much help in a solution. Does anyone else feel like this?


I'm with gimil on this one. Especially the mountains/glaciers. To be honest they look more like you took your greatwall from Transsib, colored it white and placed it this map. IMO, the mountains are the only thing wrong with this revamp. We all know you can do better mountains, so let's see some different varieties on here.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:10 pm

isaiah40 wrote:To be honest they look more like you took your greatwall from Transsib, colored it white and placed it this map.


I don't recycle my (or anyone else's) graphics. Everything here is drawn from scratch, by me, for this project only.

isaiah40 wrote:IMO, the mountains are the only thing wrong with this revamp.


IMO, they're fine and fit the style of the map.

Can I get some kind of reasoning here? People keep telling me they hate this and that, but it would help if I could get some actually constructive feedback here. What exactly is wrong with the mountains, or what kind of mountains would you rather see on the map and why?
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby Seamus76 on Thu Aug 18, 2011 8:33 pm

Personally I think the mountains look great. There's some very nice detail and shadow-play that really brings them to life. The only one I'm not a fan of, and it may just be me, is the top left glacier. I think it may need a little something where it meets the ocean, maybe a faint line, or ripple. Other than that, I'm not sure you can get better mountains. I mean they're hand drawn! Great work natty.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby gimil on Fri Aug 19, 2011 5:12 am

natty_dread wrote:
IMO, they're fine and fit the style of the map.

Can I get some kind of reasoning here? People keep telling me they hate this and that, but it would help if I could get some actually constructive feedback here. What exactly is wrong with the mountains, or what kind of mountains would you rather see on the map and why?


They really don't fit though. The impassables themselves are good artistically but they do not fit on this map in their current state. Every other detail on this map blends together beautifully and as far as graphics stamping it, I would argue is ready. Just the impassables stick out in a negative manner, they sort of sit on top of the map rather than feeling integrated like everything else.

They are more like blocks of colour put on top of the map, rather than something that is PART of the map.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Fri Aug 19, 2011 6:17 am

Why do you think they do not fit the map? What about them makes you think they don't fit the map? What kind of impassables would you rather see on the map?

See, personally I think they fit the map just fine. So I'm afraid unless I get some specifics there's nothing I can do about it. If I try to "fix" them without seeing what is wrong with them, I'll just end up with another set of impassables that you think don't fit the map. So I'm going to need some details, some specific answers, instead of just vague "they don't fit" or "they look ugly" comments.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby DiM on Fri Aug 19, 2011 6:25 am

the mountains don't look like mountains at all. there are no peaks, no size variations, no colour changes, nothing. basically they're very uniform from start to finish and look very artificial.
the forests have been improved greatly since the version where they looked like green gummy bears and i am pleased with them.

as for the glacier perhaps try to add some volume to it and then add some broken ice parts in the water with a few ripples and waves. that should be enough to let people know that's a glacier.

other than that, i'd like to see the bold black country borders be smoother. there are places where they feel unnecessarily jagged especially on the large map.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby gimil on Fri Aug 19, 2011 6:29 am

natty_dread wrote:Why do you think they do not fit the map? What about them makes you think they don't fit the map? What kind of impassables would you rather see on the map?

See, personally I think they fit the map just fine. So I'm afraid unless I get some specifics there's nothing I can do about it. If I try to "fix" them without seeing what is wrong with them, I'll just end up with another set of impassables that you think don't fit the map. So I'm going to need some details, some specific answers, instead of just vague "they don't fit" or "they look ugly" comments.


they sort of sit on top of the map rather than feeling integrated like everything else.


That is exactly what is wrong with them, as well as what DiM has said about them being to uniform. I have said this a couple of times now.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Fri Aug 19, 2011 6:51 am

gimil wrote:That is exactly what is wrong with them, as well as what DiM has said about them being to uniform. I have said this a couple of times now.


UGH... head explodes.

Dim basically wants me to do photorealistic mountains that look like real mountains. You want me to do mountains that "fit the style of the map" (without specifying what you think would fit the map...)

However, I can't do both. Since the style of the map is very stylistic and abstract, not an imitation satellite image, photorealistic mountains would look very out of place on the map. So it's either or, it's mountains that look like real life mountains, or mountains that fit the style of the map.

Anyway, here's one more alternate set of forests and mountains.

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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby DiM on Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:07 am

i don't want photorealistic mountains, i just want them to differ in size shape and colour.
your mountains have the same height width and colour from start to finish.

look at the mountains in dawn of ages or japan or middle east then translate those into a graphic style that suits your map.

why did you change the forests?
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:10 am

DiM wrote:why did you change the forests?


Because people keep asking me to change the impassables.

Anyway,

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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:21 am

Or maybe,

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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby DiM on Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:24 am

i think with a little more refining the latest version could be on the right track.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:26 am

Out of those two, the second one. Just a tad of adjustment though.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:26 am

How about

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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:28 am

Me like, but do you like them.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby gimil on Fri Aug 19, 2011 12:02 pm

I think if you brought down the tone of the mountains so it is the same shade of white/grey as Iceland the new mountains will look fab.
Last edited by gimil on Fri Aug 19, 2011 12:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [17.8.11]

Postby isaiah40 on Fri Aug 19, 2011 12:07 pm

Fast posted by gimil! I agree with gimil, this looks much better! I think this can be stickied for now, until this minor tweak gets done, and we await any other graphical concerns.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [19.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Fri Aug 19, 2011 12:21 pm

gimil wrote:I think if you brought down the tone of the mountains so it is the same shade of white/grey as Iceland the new mountains will look fab.


I don't know... I tried it, and if I bring the contrast too low, they lose all of their depth... nullifying all the things DiM and you wanted me to do for the mountains.

But I tweaked them a bit, also small version:

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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [19.8.11]

Postby isaiah40 on Fri Aug 19, 2011 12:35 pm

That I can deal with! Good job natty!
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [19.8.11]

Postby gimil on Fri Aug 19, 2011 12:47 pm

Those sit nicely with me natty, good job.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [19.8.11]

Postby TaCktiX on Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:02 pm

Agreed on the look, it's a major improvement over the original, my only niggle about the mountains. I realize that your current technique has its limits, but if it's possible to make them a smidge darker to match the darker theme of the entire map? I realize this sounds counter-intuitive with the icy colors on the map, but I think the contrast will be good.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [19.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:06 pm

TaCktiX wrote:Agreed on the look, it's a major improvement over the original, my only niggle about the mountains. I realize that your current technique has its limits, but if it's possible to make them a smidge darker to match the darker theme of the entire map? I realize this sounds counter-intuitive with the icy colors on the map, but I think the contrast will be good.


You mean like this?

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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [19.8.11]

Postby isaiah40 on Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:12 pm

One other thing, can you blur the edges just a smidgen to make them blend in a little more? You don't need much.
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Re: Nordic Countries [Graphics Revamp] [19.8.11]

Postby natty dread on Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:19 pm

You mean like the very 1st version of mountains I had on this map? The one RjBeals asked me to change because the mountains looked too blurry?

This is getting ridiculous. Did you guys even notice that my last post had the previous version of the map posted again, you know... the one before gimil asked me to make the mountains lighter?

This stuff is just going in circles now. I'm not doing any more edits unless some actual, valid, non-made-up concerns are brought up.
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