Northwest Passage [Quenched]

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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 18]

Postby ender516 on Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:44 pm

A sea territory with its troop counter in a coloured circle is part of one or more expedition routes, each of which can earn a bonus, if held completely.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 18]

Postby Victor Sullivan on Tue Oct 19, 2010 10:37 pm

But nothing happens if you hold a sea that's not apart of an expedition route?
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 18]

Postby ender516 on Tue Oct 19, 2010 10:42 pm

I think that non-route sea territories are just territories like any other ordinary territory. I suppose they contribute to the usual +1 deploy for every three territories.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 18]

Postby Victor Sullivan on Tue Oct 19, 2010 10:51 pm

Ah, okay. It seems like they should do something, though.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 18]

Postby shakeycat on Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:44 am

None, unless they're part of the expedition route, then it's +1 for each 2 owned.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 18]

Postby ender516 on Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:29 pm

So is there a classic +1 for every three territories owned, with a minimum deployment of 3? If not, the map should clarify how its gameplay differs from this typical behaviour.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 18]

Postby shakeycat on Thu Oct 21, 2010 12:38 am

The default +1 for 3 territories is not changed.

[quote=MarshalNey] Under that scheme, the expeditions if all held would be worth the following:
Henry Hudson +2 (1 + 1), 2 regions
Franklin +10 (5 + 5), 10 regions
Parry +6 (3 + 3), 6 regions
McClure +4 (2 + 2), 4 regions [/quote]

If you add in the default bonus, you can earn more armies than regions you are holding. Is it too much? It actually all seems on par with other maps, which are roughly even (give or take 1 army) between territories held in a group and total bonus received. And it's not like the larger bonuses can be held by fortifying 2 or 3 territories either.

I realize now why I started all the expedition territories at neutral - the bonus. I can put starting positions on the remaining 4 land-expedition spots, but there would still be a chance of someone starting with +1, wouldn't there. And 3/4 are neutral-locked, protected. If I put spots on all 4, in a 1v1 there would be a chance of a player getting 2/3 locked territories and having a protected +1 to start. If I only put spots on the 3 locked ones, if anyone starts with a bonus, the 2nd territory will be Devon, which at least borders one other territory in the random drop.

..then match those up with (3 or 4) start positions for Northwest Territories to keep it from dropping to one person. Perhaps it has already been said that S. Qikiktaaluk (Melville Peninsula, Igloolik, Prince Charles Island, and Mansel Island) probably doesn't need start positions, considering the bonus will be so easy to break.

(with the neutral on Disko Island instead of Yellowknife)
Click image to enlarge.
image
Last edited by shakeycat on Fri Dec 31, 2010 3:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 18]

Postby iancanton on Tue Nov 09, 2010 2:41 am

shakeycat wrote:start positions for Northwest Territories to keep it from dropping to one person.

u're saying that u'll have 3 or 4 start positions for nwt only? if so, then 3 works, but 4 doesn't, since 3 results in 17 starting regions each in 1v1, while 4 positions gives 18 each.

is it a fact that franklin landed on king william island? if it's only conjecture, then it's better for gameplay that kwi belongs only to the yellow amundsen route because it makes up a red bonus when combined with devon island. if kwi belongs to both red and yellow, then it's possible to have 2 (and only 2) start positions on kwi and devon island instead of 2 or 3 on nwt.

u're correct that the level of bonuses is in line with that of many other maps and not excessively high.

ian. :)
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 20]

Postby shakeycat on Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:55 pm

Yeah. 3 and 3 starting positions.

I don't understand what you mean about making up a red bonus with Devon: Whether KWI is red/yellow or just yellow, if KWI and Devon are held, there is +1. Am I mistaken? Were were going under the idea that colours had to match to make a bonus?
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Re: Northwest Passage [Oct 20]

Postby MarshalNey on Fri Dec 17, 2010 12:53 am

shakeycat wrote:Yeah. 3 and 3 starting positions.

I don't understand what you mean about making up a red bonus with Devon: Whether KWI is red/yellow or just yellow, if KWI and Devon are held, there is +1. Am I mistaken? Were were going under the idea that colours had to match to make a bonus?


Um, yeah I'll think I was assuming at least that only expedition regions of the same color would give a bonus.

My how the time flies... has it really been over a month? :oops: Mea culpa.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby shakeycat on Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:57 am

Click image to enlarge.
image


Small change to the wording: "In addition, earn +1 for each 2 Expedition territories held on the same route", to make it clear.

And there will be only one set drop, for Devon Island, King William Islad, and Melville Island, to prevent the +2 bonus by dropping two red territories. I'm not even sure if THAT is necessary.

The rest looks really straight forward. It looks like I've opted for neutrals where someone might drop with something, leaving no need for a controlled drop. Are there any loose ends I'm forgetting?
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby Joodoo on Thu Jan 06, 2011 6:57 am

I like the map, are the Expedition Territories all going to be neutral starters? If it is, may I recommend putting around 5 neutrals for the non-Amundsen routes and 10 neutrals for the Amundsen routes?
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby MarshalNey on Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:44 am

Joodoo wrote:I like the map, are the Expedition Territories all going to be neutral starters? If it is, may I recommend putting around 5 neutrals for the non-Amundsen routes and 10 neutrals for the Amundsen routes?


Yes, the white 88's will start as neutral 2.

I think that such a high number would hurt the theme of the map. Ideally, players should look at the expeditions as opportunities, not barriers. Generally, 10 neutral is in the range that I think of as a barrier/objective/Wrath of God tert. In the case of Amundsen, although it is an objective, it covers a lot of terts and so doesn't deserve a high neutral count. Putting a slightly higher value on the Amundsen routes is not a bad idea though- it might work to make them neutral 3 (?)

Overall, I think that 2 or 3 neutrals should be fine. Beta testing can easily prove this wrong (or right).

I'm going to sticky this topic, as it's long past overdue ;)
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby shakeycat on Sat Jan 08, 2011 2:19 pm

I'd be fine with Amundsen's routes being neutral 3, and the rest being 2. It would make Parry, McClure, and especially Franklin slightly harder to capture too, if we're okay with that. 3 seems pretty standard, 2 gives you a bit of a break.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby Victor Sullivan on Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:52 am

Is it time for a Map Surveyors announcement? ;)
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby MarshalNey on Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:21 am

It should be in the next bulletin.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby MarshalNey on Wed Jan 26, 2011 2:21 am

If there are no objections within the next two days, this map will be promoted.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby AndyDufresne on Wed Jan 26, 2011 4:48 pm

I do not think I have any issues with the game play. For the most part, I like this map.


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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby MarshalNey on Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:34 am

Seeing no further comments, I hereby present this map with a long overdue stamp.

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Congratulations shakeycat on the fine work and patience =D>

Hopefully this one has a glowing tenure in graphics, I'm anxious to see how to it plays :D

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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby shakeycat on Fri Jan 28, 2011 2:18 pm

Woohoo! Thanks Marshal Ney.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby isaiah40 on Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:14 pm

=D> =D> =D> Congrats shakey! =D> =D> =D>
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Re: Northwest Passage [Jan 6]

Postby isaiah40 on Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:54 pm

Okay so I gave this a glance over (will look at it at little closer later), and just a couple of things pop out at me. I don't know if it is my monitor so I'll mention them anyways. The legend area is a little hard to read, if you either lighten them or use a lighter color that would likely do the the trick. I believe it is the Parry Route in the bonuses, I'm having a hard time reading that as well. Maybe use a contrasting outer glow for it?

Like I said these couple of things could just be my monitor, so if anyone else can let us know that would be great! Looking forward to your next update. :)
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Re: Northwest Passage [Feb 11]

Postby shakeycat on Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:00 pm

Thanks Isaiah.

Does this help?

Click image to enlarge.
image


Brightened all the names in the minimap, though they still have a little colour. If one is worse than the others, I can brighten it more.

Does a patch like that behind the four expedition bonuses look funny? Does it help? The problem here is that the other three stand out better on white, while Parry would need black. It looks off when three are white and one is black, for me. If it's same degree of bad or worse, I can try something else.
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Re: Northwest Passage [Feb 11]

Postby isaiah40 on Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:54 pm

Yes much better. I don't have a problem with the subdued white under the legend.

Looking at his closer, I think you can do away with the army circles with the exception of course those denoting each route. Where you have "In addition, you earn +1 ..." can you lower it down by a couple of pixels. The +1 is blending in with that new white area making it a tad bit hard to see. Also where you have the impassables listed, lower the ice and tundra down underneath the words. This will make them easier to see. You have plenty of room to move them.

On another note, I have an idea. Can you make the ice on the land solid and then for the ice on the water do something like this:

Image

You can extend the ice out into the water a little more in a few places as well. I'm thinking that it would work quit well here.

Can you also do a small map with the 888's please.

I look forward to seeing your next update soon!
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Re: Northwest Passage [Feb 11]

Postby ender516 on Sun Feb 13, 2011 1:51 am

I prefer the ice as it is, in terms of uniformity and transparency. Making it look different over land and water will just add unnecessary visual details which would add no information and would not fit well stylistically. As far as its extent, I would only change it if it makes a boundary clearer, and I don't see anyplace where that is needed.
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