The King's Court [Quenched]

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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby danryan on Wed Jan 19, 2011 3:17 pm

Same here. I have a ton of games on this map, in a variety of formats, and the only thing I think is ironclad right now are the king & counselors - everything else can be tweaked still, but those feel right at this point and although it is a viable strategy to plow through the king, it is not a game ender - it is very vulnerable to a backhand blow from another noble.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby MarshalNey on Wed Jan 19, 2011 7:24 pm

chipv wrote:MarshalNey, you have played a grand total of TWO games on this map, NONE of which have been with the new changes.

For your information what you have described is patently NOT a winning strategy , neither does it occur often at all.
(I have only seen another team try this once and we beat them easily without resorting to stacking).

Could you please devote more effort into playing the game before issuing what amounts to a comprehensive
whitewash of the multiple strategies this map has to offer, we have have put much more effort into analysing the
gameplay that you may even be aware of after your 2 games.

If you don't see how to play the game yet, I suggest play some more, what you have described is basically a noob tactic.

On the other hand I think the proposal to raise the king neutrals is worth thinking about, let me do some proper maths first.


Yes indeed you are correct about the number of games I have played on the map. I don't have the time to play a huge number of games but the ones I do play I take a fair amount of time to analyze.

I'm sorry if the comments I posted offended you, but from information I received from those in my clan and others I felt justified in at least offering them. It was not meant to be a whitewash of the multiple strategies; rather my concern was that in Triples and Quads games these multiple strategies would be ignored for what you might call a 'noob' tactic but as I see it is hard to ignore while the King is at 7 neutral.

In any case, if you don't find my suggestions- and that is all that they are- constructive or grounded then please let me know and I'll not devote any more energy to posting in this thread. My time is as limited as I'm sure yours is, and there's no point in wasting it to the detriment of us both.

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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Joodoo on Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:53 am

How many territories are on this map?
TheSaxlad wrote:The Dice suck a lot of the time.

And if they dont suck then they blow.

:D
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:34 am

Joodoo wrote:How many territories are on this map?


161
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:45 pm

Ok I think this experiment failed, we will be reverting to the starting positions before.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:50 pm

LIVE CHANGE

Reverted to old starting positions - 1 on the Noble, 2 on the Castle. Unassigned is 3 on Noble, 8 on Castle as before
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby MrBenn on Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:41 pm

Was it just the starting positions that have reverted? Was there some more discussion about bonus values and attack ranges?
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Fri Jan 28, 2011 1:36 pm

MrBenn wrote:Was it just the starting positions that have reverted? Was there some more discussion about bonus values and attack ranges?


Just the starting positions, everything else has been discussed to death now.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Brutal Assassin on Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:55 pm

Just something of note - With Archers/Catapults only being able to assault like tiles, I ended up stuck in a scenario where I had around 30 troops which were stranded with no way of winning. All I could do was attack around the map in a circle. Being an honorable player, I opted to not suicide on someone, but really that is the only option I have that would impact the game. Otherwise I'm just stuck making men waiting for someone to kill me since there is no way to expand outward.

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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Fri Jan 28, 2011 5:08 pm

Brutal Assassin wrote:Just something of note - With Archers/Catapults only being able to assault like tiles, I ended up stuck in a scenario where I had around 30 troops which were stranded with no way of winning. All I could do was attack around the map in a circle. Being an honorable player, I opted to not suicide on someone, but really that is the only option I have that would impact the game. Otherwise I'm just stuck making men waiting for someone to kill me since there is no way to expand outward.

Game: http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8271553


This is part of the strategy of the map. Obviously avoid getting into this scenario whilst trying to get your opponent into it for example.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Brutal Assassin on Fri Jan 28, 2011 8:02 pm

chipv wrote:
Brutal Assassin wrote:Just something of note - With Archers/Catapults only being able to assault like tiles, I ended up stuck in a scenario where I had around 30 troops which were stranded with no way of winning. All I could do was attack around the map in a circle. Being an honorable player, I opted to not suicide on someone, but really that is the only option I have that would impact the game. Otherwise I'm just stuck making men waiting for someone to kill me since there is no way to expand outward.

Game: http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8271553


This is part of the strategy of the map. Obviously avoid getting into this scenario whilst trying to get your opponent into it for example.


Just making sure it was intentional. Accidentally reinforced an archer unit without realizing that it was a loop and essentially stranded my entire army -_-
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Lubawski on Sat Jan 29, 2011 6:09 am

Does this mean we are close to getting this out of Beta?
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Sat Jan 29, 2011 7:54 am

It's ready to go, up to MrB now
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby GoranZ on Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:25 am

8 castles for 2 players... well that screw the map big time, congrats to the incompetent players that wanted that change to be returned.

P.S. Can someone tell me how can second player win one vs one game?
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Blitzaholic on Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:39 am

chipv wrote:LIVE CHANGE

Reverted to old starting positions - 1 on the Noble, 2 on the Castle. Unassigned is 3 on Noble, 8 on Castle as before



I agree with this chip.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:40 am

GoranZ wrote:8 castles for 2 players... well that screw the map big time, congrats to the incompetent players that wanted that change to be returned.

P.S. Can someone tell me how can second player win one vs one game?


It is possible, having played this a number of times there are ways to win playing second, although if you're playing the top 3 on this map
it would be difficult.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby GoranZ on Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:57 am

chipv wrote:
GoranZ wrote:8 castles for 2 players... well that screw the map big time, congrats to the incompetent players that wanted that change to be returned.

P.S. Can someone tell me how can second player win one vs one game?


It is possible, having played this a number of times there are ways to win playing second, although if you're playing the top 3 on this map
it would be difficult.


it is only possible and difficult if I play agents noob or if the other player decides to make deliberate mistake. where is the fun in that?

I played a game now and one of my castles was over run in round 3(that give we whole 2 rounds to expand and defend).

what I want to say is... I CANT WIN IF A PLAYER WITH SIMILAR SKILLS AS ME PLAYS FIRST, AND IF I'M FIRST TOP 3 CAN ONLY WATCH AS I TAKE THEIR POINTS AND THAT WONT BE BECAUSE THEY ARE WEAK ;)

P.S. plz don't destroy such a beautify designed map. ty in front
Last edited by GoranZ on Sat Jan 29, 2011 9:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby ben79 on Sat Jan 29, 2011 9:00 am

GoranZ wrote:
chipv wrote:
GoranZ wrote:8 castles for 2 players... well that screw the map big time, congrats to the incompetent players that wanted that change to be returned.

P.S. Can someone tell me how can second player win one vs one game?


It is possible, having played this a number of times there are ways to win playing second, although if you're playing the top 3 on this map
it would be difficult.


it is only possible and difficult if I play agents noob or if the other player decides to make deliberate mistake. where is the fun in that?

I played a game now and one of my castles was over run in round 3(that give we whole 2 rounds to expand and defend).

what I want to say is... I CANT WIN IF A PLAYER WITH SIMILAR SKILLS AS ME PLAYS FIRST, AND IF I'M FIRST TOP 3 CAN ONLY WATCH AS I TAKE THEIR POINTS AND THAT WONT BE BECAUSE THEY ARE WEAK ;)


he's right
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Sat Jan 29, 2011 12:31 pm

I'm investigating a change at the moment, I'm not willing to release this from BETA until this investigation is complete.

Basically I want to see if we can get a mechanism to force 1 castle per player for all settings.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Kabanellas on Sat Jan 29, 2011 2:35 pm

GoranZ wrote:8 castles for 2 players... well that screw the map big time, congrats to the incompetent players that wanted that change to be returned.

P.S. Can someone tell me how can second player win one vs one game?


Then I must be one of those incompetent players :)

....the thing is that though it worked better for 1v1, the last settings worked definitly worst for all the others settings. We just wouldn't want that.

If chip manages to do what is intending to, and limits the starting positions to 1 Castle (and Noble) per player the issue with 1v1 will be solved .... And we a
will all be a lot happier :D
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby GoranZ on Sat Jan 29, 2011 7:01 pm

Kabanellas wrote:
GoranZ wrote:8 castles for 2 players... well that screw the map big time, congrats to the incompetent players that wanted that change to be returned.

P.S. Can someone tell me how can second player win one vs one game?


Then I must be one of those incompetent players :)

....the thing is that though it worked better for 1v1, the last settings worked definitly worst for all the others settings. We just wouldn't want that.

If chip manages to do what is intending to, and limits the starting positions to 1 Castle (and Noble) per player the issue with 1v1 will be solved .... And we a
will all be a lot happier :D


The thing is, that with 4 castles per player the opponent already knows where the other player is, he should only attack when the time comes(round 3), no strategy involved. For 1v1 the best setting is 2 castles per player, since now we have 8 neutrals per castle. For other settings 1 castle per player should be perfect solution.

OK lets analyze Kabanellas games 1vs1(sorry I took you as example)
6/10 ended with win of the first player
3/10 ended with win of the second player but first player attacked prematurely(round 2) or attacked council member(not too ordinary strategy)
1/10 ended with win of the second player, could be considered as clean win but luck could had good influence in this game

1. Kabanellas second, wins but other player attacks Lord Chamberlain in round 1(smart move lol)... Game ends in Round 6
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8067164

2. Kabanellas second, eliminated in Round 5
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8067929

3. Kabanellas first, wins in Round 6
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8077452

4. Kabanellas second, eliminated in Round 8
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8091887

5. Kabanellas second, wins, the other player in round 2 reaches to your castle but fails to take it, catapults have bigger range. game ends in Round 15
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8092822

6. Kabanellas first, wins, game ends in Round 11
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8093444

7. Kabanellas second, wins, from round 2 the other player attacks council member(not too common), game ends in Round 11
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8098588

8. Kabanellas first, eliminated, first player doesnt attack in round 3(first player drop is 6, second is 13)
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8119045

9. Kabanellas second, eliminated in Round 7
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8119047

10. Kabanellas first, wins in Round 7
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8176553

P.S. Plz make another calculation on the wins and loses for 1v1, its needed.
ty in front

Other then this, the map should become them most popular very soon :)
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby chipv on Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:14 am

There is no way to force different limits for castles per player per game type at this time.
I have asked for a general limit on castles per player, that would be easiest to implement.

The problem then is whether or not to use 1 or 2 castles as a maximum.

1 does not work for 1v1, 2 does.
1 does work for doubles, 2 does not.

I am tempted to bite the bullet and use 2 as I think 1 would destroy 1v1 in a more spectacular way.
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Kabanellas on Mon Jan 31, 2011 6:40 am

I'd definitely prefer 2 castles per player on 1v1
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Lalloq on Mon Jan 31, 2011 7:24 am

Hello,

I began several games on this map and I read the last two pages of this topic.

Maybe put 2 or 3 neutral on regions which are close from catsle would enable people who are not in top 3 to get two rounds more to defend.

I think there is a problem of equity with Knight K3. On the second round, the castle B is able to conquer it AND to attack catsle C. It's impossible from C to B, I think it's not fair... Maybe put it on N11. What do you think about that ?

Thanks for reading



See you in another game


PS : I love this map !
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Re: The King's Court [GP,GX,XML,BETA]

Postby Kabanellas on Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:09 pm

Thank you Lalloq.

Actually both Castle's Knights (B2 Knight and C5 Knight) distant 4 hexes from K3 (and K3 is at range of 3 from both Castles) - so they are equal in this case ;)
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Location: "Don’t ever wrestle with a pig. You’ll both get dirty, but the pig will enjoy it."
Medals: 70
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (2)
Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (7)
General Achievement (3) Clan Achievement (17) Map Contribution (7) General Contribution (2)

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