Three Kingdoms of Korea [Quenched]

Care to peruse completed maps? Take a stroll through the Atlas.

Moderators: Cartographers, Global Moderators

Forum rules
Please read the Community Guidelines before posting.

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby natty dread on Mon Mar 07, 2011 3:18 pm

Hwang-sanbeol would make sense from gameplay perspective. Not sure about the historical perspective though. I'll let IH elaborate on that.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby Industrial Helix on Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:11 pm

My reasoning behind the green junk is that Gaya had trade relations with Japan and were the primary exporter of technology to Kyushu. They also had political ties of some sort to Yamato Japan. So it makes sense for them to have some sort of sea ability and relation with Japan.

Though, if you guys want the junk to be place at Hwangsanbeol, that would work too as Wa was defeated by Goguryeo in the mouth of the Geum River (which is right about there).

My most favored solution would be another green junk to form a triangle between these three places.
Sketchblog [Update 07/25/11]: http://indyhelixsketch.blogspot.com/
Living in Japan [Update 07/17/11]: http://mirrorcountryih.blogspot.com/
Russian Revolution map for ConquerClub [07/20/11]: viewtopic.php?f=241&t=116575
User avatar
Cook Industrial Helix
 
Posts: 3469
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2008 6:49 pm
Location: California
Medals: 36
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (3)
Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (1)
Training Achievement (1) Map Contribution (5) Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (3)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby theBastard on Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:43 am

Industrial Helix wrote:My reasoning behind the green junk is that Gaya had trade relations with Japan and were the primary exporter of technology to Kyushu. They also had political ties of some sort to Yamato Japan. So it makes sense for them to have some sort of sea ability and relation with Japan.

Though, if you guys want the junk to be place at Hwangsanbeol, that would work too as Wa was defeated by Goguryeo in the mouth of the Geum River (which is right about there).

My most favored solution would be another green junk to form a triangle between these three places.


if there are records that gaya had relations with Japan, why there is -4 if you hold wa and any capital? what about -4 for wa and any capital except bon-gaya?
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class theBastard
 
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:05 am
Medals: 5
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby natty dread on Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:21 am

theBastard wrote:if there are records that gaya had relations with Japan, why there is -4 if you hold wa and any capital? what about -4 for wa and any capital except bon-gaya?


I think that would be too complicated. It would also make Gaya too strong, since you could hold Wa + Gaya. Gaya never conquered Japan, nor vice versa.

Gaya is meant more as a small, easy bonus that is easy to annex to either Baekje or Silla.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby natty dread on Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:29 am

For the green junk, we have 3 options:

- add a 4th green junk to hwangsanbeol
- move the bon-gaya junk to hwangsanbeol
- move the bon-gaya junk to aragaya
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby theBastard on Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:55 pm

the second is the best, I think.
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class theBastard
 
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:05 am
Medals: 5
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby natty dread on Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:45 pm

I don't know, IH has a good point about Gaya & Japan having had past relations, so having the connection in Aragaya would make sense.

Then again, Hwangsanbeol would make sense too, in the sense that the owner of Silla could easily use it to take Tamna which gives additional bonus to Silla - so it would sort of reward Silla for assaulting Baekje, which fits historical facts well.

So there are historical arguments for both options.

Then again, we could also have a green junk in both Aragaya and Hwangsanbeol (or Bon-Gaya & Hwangsanbeol), but it seems a little redundant to me since they are already adjacent to each other.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby theBastard on Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:44 pm

there are 3 green junks while others are only 2. what about to do also other colour junks 3?

green junk move from bon-gaya move to aragaya.

add red junk to hwang-sanbeol. - historical connection as IH said. and hwang-sanbeol will be not connect by aragay over sea.

maybe add brown to lelang. - there will be more connections for tang bonus. and I think when these striped areas were part of tang there were any connections.
I had broken my right hand (4-5 month ago) and now I have wrong adherent knucklebone of the thumb. therefore I have some problems with it and I must end my works on maps.sorry my english
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class theBastard
 
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:05 am
Medals: 5
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby Industrial Helix on Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:44 pm

Aragaya and Hwangsanbeol.... this seems like the best option.

It just occurred to me... what happens if a player holds Namgyeong and Bongaya... a player shouldn't get both bonuses, the Baekje/Silla bonus system should override. Can we fit this in somewhere?
Sketchblog [Update 07/25/11]: http://indyhelixsketch.blogspot.com/
Living in Japan [Update 07/17/11]: http://mirrorcountryih.blogspot.com/
Russian Revolution map for ConquerClub [07/20/11]: viewtopic.php?f=241&t=116575
User avatar
Cook Industrial Helix
 
Posts: 3469
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2008 6:49 pm
Location: California
Medals: 36
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (3)
Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (1)
Training Achievement (1) Map Contribution (5) Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (3)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v7.3

Postby natty dread on Thu Mar 10, 2011 12:31 am

Yes. How about "If both capitals are held, larger bonus applies to striped territories"
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby natty dread on Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:26 am

Click image to enlarge.
image
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby theBastard on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:15 am

it would be better with red junk in hwangsanbeol. for what have hwangsanbeol and aragaya connection over sea when they have land border?
I had broken my right hand (4-5 month ago) and now I have wrong adherent knucklebone of the thumb. therefore I have some problems with it and I must end my works on maps.sorry my english
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class theBastard
 
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:05 am
Medals: 5
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby natty dread on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:29 am

The connection is not just between them. Both can also connect to Kyushu or Tamna.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby theBastard on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:41 am

natty_dread wrote:The connection is not just between them. Both can also connect to Kyushu or Tamna.


and why not to add red junk to hwangsanbeol? it will has connection with kyushu and honshu. four green junks give too mush assault possibilities. do not forgot that hwangsanbeol and aragaya have land border, so there will be short acess to green junk.
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class theBastard
 
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:05 am
Medals: 5
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby natty dread on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:50 am

The green junk in hwangsanbeol is because Tamna gives bonus to Silla, so it gives Silla a reason to invade Baekje.

Also there are other historical reasons for the connections. If you want to know more ask IH, he's the one designing the gameplay.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby theBastard on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:53 am

natty_dread wrote:The green junk in hwangsanbeol is because Tamna gives bonus to Silla, so it gives Silla a reason to invade Baekje.

Also there are other historical reasons for the connections. If you want to know more ask IH, he's the one designing the gameplay.


then add red junk to aragaya...
and you will have historical connections between gaya and japan as IH mentioned.
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class theBastard
 
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:05 am
Medals: 5
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby natty dread on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:58 am

Well, that might make sense, we'll have to see what IH thinks of it.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby Industrial Helix on Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:09 am

Well technically, the historical connections were between Kyushu and Gaya, not Honshu and Gaya... but that can be overlooked ;) I could be ok for a Red Junk there in Aragaya.

But here's a though... what about getting rid of the Red Junks and just making them green? I mean, all they do is serve a connection between the Japanese Islands. One could have just as sailed to Honshu rather than Kyushu. Plus, I'm starting to like this open sea that is developing in the region and connecting all the islands.

Thoughts?
Sketchblog [Update 07/25/11]: http://indyhelixsketch.blogspot.com/
Living in Japan [Update 07/17/11]: http://mirrorcountryih.blogspot.com/
Russian Revolution map for ConquerClub [07/20/11]: viewtopic.php?f=241&t=116575
User avatar
Cook Industrial Helix
 
Posts: 3469
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2008 6:49 pm
Location: California
Medals: 36
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (3)
Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (1)
Training Achievement (1) Map Contribution (5) Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (3)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby natty dread on Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:39 am

But here's a though... what about getting rid of the Red Junks and just making them green?


This could be a good solution. We could have one less Junk in Wa and make the whole southeast area easier to "read".

---

Anyway... me & IH have been discussing the starting territories by pm, and we have them mostly figured out...

The plan is to make capitals into neutral 2:s, and code all the territories that are adjacent to capitals as starting positions, so everyone has an equal chance to grab the capitals at the beginning. The only problem with this is that coding 9 starting positions would cause bad drops for 2-player games (they would start with 12 territories).

The solution for this would be making the territory bonus into 1 for every 4 territories, with a minimum of 3. This way the 12 territory drops wouldn't matter, and it would further highlight the importance of the capitals and castles as sources of troops.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby Riskismy on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:50 pm

The legend has 6 bonus areas, but I can find only 5 capitals (bon-gaya, gyaongju, narig, pyon and qing). Wa is not supposed to have a capital, I gather? In that case, how would you gain the bonus for holding wa territories?

I don't like the idea of having the starts being adjacent to capitals. Narig and qing would have a ball, starting very far from any other player. Maybe it would be an idea to re-arrange the junks and have them work as starting territories. At least that way no players would be safe to take their associated capital right away.
Image
Lieutenant Riskismy
 
Posts: 392
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 8:21 pm
Location: Copenhagen
Medals: 10
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby natty dread on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:59 pm

You misunderstand the concept. All territories except for Wa, capitals or castles start with non-neutral troops. Territories adjacent to capitals are coded as starting positions to ensure everyone has a fair chance to grab a capital in the start.

Having junks as starting territories would be a terrible idea, seeing as they all assault each other.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby Riskismy on Thu Mar 10, 2011 5:00 pm

You're right, I don't get it at all. How are 'starting positions' and 'non-neutral' different concepts?

Having junks as starting territories would be a terrible idea, seeing as they all assault each other.


Now you're the one misunderstanding, and intentionally so I suspect. I did say 're-arrange the junks', did I not? I'm not saying it's a good idea 'as is' - just trying to give you an alternative perspective on the problem you're having. And you're welcome. ;)
Image
Lieutenant Riskismy
 
Posts: 392
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 8:21 pm
Location: Copenhagen
Medals: 10
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby natty dread on Thu Mar 10, 2011 5:41 pm

How are 'starting positions' and 'non-neutral' different concepts?


You can see a combination of starting positions and regular starting territories on eg. Third Crusade map, where capitals start with 6 each, each player getting an equal amount of capitals, and other territories starting normally with 3:s.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby theBastard on Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:26 am

when you do red junks green and the south sea become so open, it would be huge change to the concept of junks. but it could works. but, will be then others junks as they are - so the rest of sea will be more "closed"?

about starting points. if bordering regions with capitals will be starting points there could be any disadvantages. there are few capitals with only one/two bordering regions what gives to some players hue advantage from the start.
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class theBastard
 
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:05 am
Medals: 5
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)

Re: Three Kingdoms of Korea v8

Postby natty dread on Fri Mar 11, 2011 2:15 am

Again, the starting points wouldn't be the only starting territories. Without these starting positions someone could still drop in those territories. With them, at least everyone gets a chance at some capital.

Yeah, only red junks will be changed. Other junks stay as they are.

What I'm really looking feedback on though, is the 1 troop for every 4 idea. I think this is the only thing that needs to be questioned at this point.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class natty dread
 
Posts: 13324
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:58 pm
Location: just plain fucked
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (12) Map Contribution (12) General Contribution (7)

PreviousNext

Return to The Atlas

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users

cron
Login