USA 2.1 [10 Mar 2013] Beta Baby!!

[isaiah40]

Found that mojo yet? Really want this one to come out.

Not yet, hopefully I'll find it after I take a couple weeks vacation from CC.

[Pirlo]

wow so big.. but looks fun!

[isaiah40]

Changes made:

1. Each bonus regions now is a single color
2. Removed the mega bonuses
3. Interstates are now +1 for every 5 cities on the interstates
4. Merged Pacific and Western bonuses into one
5. Removed Nome and Barrow Alaska
6. Added back in the road from Cleveland to Cambridge
7. Removed the secondary highways going into the Rocky Mountain Bonus

Click image to enlarge.

[nolefan5311]

MOVED back to the Main Foundry Workshop!

[koontz1973]

Freaking sweet man. Best news all day. Long live USA 2.1.

Have some dancing bananas.



All things considered, I like the new slimmed down look to this map. It looks a lot less cluttered with the singles colours.

[crazymilkshake5]

It looks good with the single colors, but i think you should put back in the mega bonuses.

[koontz1973]

crazymilkshake5, you are crazy. There is going to be enough on this map without going completely overboard. I liked the mega bonuses, but I am gladder to see them go.

[isaiah40]

:mrgreen:


It looks good with the single colors, but i think you should put back in the mega bonuses.

I would like to have the mega bonuses! iancanton does have a point that no one would go for them, so they have been tossed into file 13.

[AndyDufresne]

You know, I kind of like the white text for region names. Black text seems to blend in with all of the graphics and kind of adds to a crazy-eye effect, while white kind of pops out in a good way. Unfortunately you'd probably have to adjust the colors of your bonus zones to make white text work, but I am fond of it.

Nice to see this map back in production.


--Andy

[iancanton]

i note that there are 42 state capitals of states that have 4 or more cities. rather than having the capitals start neutral and troops everywhere else, have u considered starting everyone from these 42 state capitals only, with the rest of the map (except capitals) as single neutrals? this has the advantage of not letting player 1 starting with a huge attacking force without setting an artificial cap which slows down the game in the later stages, though it does wreck the isaiah trademark capital bonus.

ian.

Actually, it was a passing thought, though the way you put it makes total sense. There are 3 capitals that have an airport attached to them, I think those should start as 3 neutral. Instead of everything else starting with 1 neutral, how about if we have them start with 2? What should we have the initial placement be 2 or 3? What about capitals having an autodeploy of 1 or 2?

If you went down this route, and it would be a nice route even though it spoils the initial idea of the map pack copy, you could give...
each capital a +1 auto
airport capitals 3 neutral (as you said)
D.C. a 5 neutral but a +3 auto
Elsewhere, 2 neutrals. Easier to kill than one.

have u decided whether the starting regions will be the 42 (or 39) state capitals mentioned above, with single or double neutrals everywhere else? if we start on the capitals, then the capital bonus of +1 for every 2 capitals needs to be modified. on the other hand, if we start everywhere except on the capitals, then the new interstate bonus of +1 for every 5 cities has to be changed.

moorehead MN ought to be moorhead. is it possible to move it along I-94 much closer to st paul (but not so close that the road disappears), then rename it as minneapolis, without changing the connections? the position won't be exactly right, but minneapolis is on I-94 and the best-known place in the state.

have u considered changing moorehead to minneapolis, or is it there for a special reason (for example, someone's request)?

ian.

[ManBungalow]

Extremely nice.

Generally speaking, I see very few flaws in this map. Granted, I haven't analysed each individual bonus, but they mostly seem fair enough.

The part of the legend which says "All Hawaiian cities can attack each other". At least 95% of people on this site know what the map of Hawaii looks like, or could work it out from the map. Some of the others will go look it up. However, it doesn't show the word 'Hawaii' anywhere else on the map. For one of those 12 year-old international players we have on this site, that part may not make sense. Eh, it's not a big problem, but just something to consider looking at.

Similarly, I guess you could highlight an interstate route in the part of the legend which says "+1 for every 5 interstate cities".
I assume this means any 5 cities on one interstate line, and that they don't have to adjoining. This is, I'm sure, much more efficient in terms of the XML.

I'm still not quite sure how you want the starting neutrals to be placed, but all in due course..

Good luck with the progress of this map.

[isaiah40]

You know, I kind of like the white text for region names. Black text seems to blend in with all of the graphics and kind of adds to a crazy-eye effect, while white kind of pops out in a good way. Unfortunately you'd probably have to adjust the colors of your bonus zones to make white text work, but I am fond of it.

Nice to see this map back in production.


--Andy

I could place a dark outer glow around the white text, that way it will be easier to see on the lighter colors.

i note that there are 42 state capitals of states that have 4 or more cities. rather than having the capitals start neutral and troops everywhere else, have u considered starting everyone from these 42 state capitals only, with the rest of the map (except capitals) as single neutrals? this has the advantage of not letting player 1 starting with a huge attacking force without setting an artificial cap which slows down the game in the later stages, though it does wreck the isaiah trademark capital bonus.

ian.

Actually, it was a passing thought, though the way you put it makes total sense. There are 3 capitals that have an airport attached to them, I think those should start as 3 neutral. Instead of everything else starting with 1 neutral, how about if we have them start with 2? What should we have the initial placement be 2 or 3? What about capitals having an autodeploy of 1 or 2?

If you went down this route, and it would be a nice route even though it spoils the initial idea of the map pack copy, you could give...
each capital a +1 auto
airport capitals 3 neutral (as you said)
D.C. a 5 neutral but a +3 auto
Elsewhere, 2 neutrals. Easier to kill than one.

have u decided whether the starting regions will be the 42 (or 39) state capitals mentioned above, with single or double neutrals everywhere else? if we start on the capitals, then the capital bonus of +1 for every 2 capitals needs to be modified. on the other hand, if we start everywhere except on the capitals, then the new interstate bonus of +1 for every 5 cities has to be changed.

moorehead MN ought to be moorhead. is it possible to move it along I-94 much closer to st paul (but not so close that the road disappears), then rename it as minneapolis, without changing the connections? the position won't be exactly right, but minneapolis is on I-94 and the best-known place in the state.

have u considered changing moorehead to minneapolis, or is it there for a special reason (for example, someone's request)?

ian.

I was thinking of having all the capitals start with 5 neutral, and have starting groups as in Salem's Switch - probably a grouping of 5 territories? With the interstate cities, after talking with nolefan, it would probably be a good idea to start a few of those territories as neutral as well to prevent any drop. Maybe start them with 5 neutral as well?? Or would 3 be better? Maybe place neutrals on every 3rd city along an interstate. For instance Phoenix to Baton Rouge has 6 cities that can possibly be dropped. If I can make El Paso and Houston start as neutral. Between Salt Lake City and San Diego is another example. I can make Beaver and Colton neutrals. If I do this then would I have to change the Interstate bonus?

I forgot to change Moorhead to Minneapolis, I'll get it done next update.

[nolefan5311]

What do you think about making the interstate bonus +1 for every 5 consecutive cities?

[AndyDufresne]

The part of the legend which says "All Hawaiian cities can attack each other". At least 95% of people on this site know what the map of Hawaii looks like, or could work it out from the map. Some of the others will go look it up. However, it doesn't show the word 'Hawaii' anywhere else on the map. For one of those 12 year-old international players we have on this site, that part may not make sense. Eh, it's not a big problem, but just something to consider looking at.

Why not just add the outline of the Hawaiian Islands behind the text? Since you have some other images in the legend, it may not look out of place.


--Andy

[isaiah40]

What do you think about making the interstate bonus +1 for every 5 consecutive cities?

It could be done, at the same time I don't think I want to make it too hard to get the bonus. I'll see what ian has to say.

The part of the legend which says "All Hawaiian cities can attack each other". At least 95% of people on this site know what the map of Hawaii looks like, or could work it out from the map. Some of the others will go look it up. However, it doesn't show the word 'Hawaii' anywhere else on the map. For one of those 12 year-old international players we have on this site, that part may not make sense. Eh, it's not a big problem, but just something to consider looking at.

Why not just add the outline of the Hawaiian Islands behind the text? Since you have some other images in the legend, it may not look out of place.


--Andy

That can be done easy enough.

[AndyDufresne]

What do you think about making the interstate bonus +1 for every 5 consecutive cities?

It could be done, at the same time I don't think I want to make it too hard to get the bonus. I'll see what ian has to say.

I kind of like the idea. I am not sure it would be too hard, but with the plethora of bonuses and combinations on this map, I kind of like adding the consecutive to the mix, since Capitals are just 'every'. But I'll leave the real discussion to those who know best.


--Andy

[isaiah40]

A couple of changes:
1. Hawaii outline added to legend
2. Capital star added to legend
3. D.C. Capitol Building added to legend
4. New England on the mini-map now matches the main map

Forgot about changing Moorhead to Minneapolis.

Changed the text color in Alabama to white with a dark outerglow. Peronally, I prefer the black text with the light outer glow.

Click image to enlarge.

[iancanton]

What do you think about making the interstate bonus +1 for every 5 consecutive cities?

It could be done, at the same time I don't think I want to make it too hard to get the bonus. I'll see what ian has to say.

good move. coding the bonus as 5 consecutive reduces or even eliminates the chances of dropping an interstate bonus without having so many neutral starts. increasing the bonuses to +2 or even +3 for every 5 consecutive is more realistic if u want the interstates to play a part in deliberate strategy rather than someone trying for the fifth city just because he already has four from other attacks. n3 is probably enough for any city that starts neutral, otherwise we have players tiptoeing round the neutrals wherever possible.

The route from Great Falls to Tok is actually heavily traveled. Though in reality there are about 4 different roads you travel on. You would actually drive through Calgary, Edmonton then on up to Dawson Creek which is the beginning of the Alaska Highway. That being said I could put a killer neutral and have it as Calgary for example.

a killer neutral is fine. it just shouldn't be as easy as, for example, san francisco to san jose.

how about a killer neutral of 1 to represent the canadian border?

ian.

[isaiah40]

how about a killer neutral of 1 to represent the canadian border?

ian.

Argh!!! I forgot that one as well! It is now done!

Changes made:

1. Moved Alaska down to the bottom left by Hawaii
2. Moved the title to the bottom
3. Spread out the mini-map across the top so it will be easier to see what each bonus is
4. Cropped the height down from 800 pixels to 710 pixels
5. Changed the Interstate city bonus from "+1 for every 5 interstate cities" to "+3 for 5 consecutive interstate cities"
6. Added in Calgary as a killer neutral between Great Falls and Tok
7. Changed Moorehead to Minneapolis and moved it to the right a tad bit

Click image to enlarge.

Still needing:
1. Should I go with the white text with dark outer glow like what is on Alabama, or the black text?

[koontz1973]

1. Moved Alaska down to the bottom left by Hawaii

This is so wrong, words fail me.

2. Moved the title to the bottom

but OK.

3. Spread out the mini-map across the top so it will be easier to see what each bonus is

Clearer so it is a good move but it seems to of gone in the wrong direction. By moving the title to the bottom, you already had room to spread the mini map out some, so why not put Alaska back where it should be. This would be clearer for game play.

4. Cropped the height down from 800 pixels to 710 pixels

How can this map be made more condensed and confusing? You seem of found it. I know that size is being an issue right now, but this map should not be one to be cropped, squeezed, squashed, crushed, flattened or any other word that comes to mind. I understand the height thing, but it feels as if you went too far this time. By putting Alaska back at the top, you grow some, and have the room for the mini map. You will not need the amount lost but somewhere in between should be good.

5. Changed the Interstate city bonus from "+1 for every 5 interstate cities" to "+3 for 5 consecutive interstate cities"

Good.

6. Added in Calgary as a killer neutral between Great Falls and Tok

Good move, but with Alaska down at the bottom, your arrows go no where.

1. Should I go with the white text with dark outer glow like what is on Alabama, or the black text?

Black on white IMO.

[isaiah40]

Done as koontz suggested. Had to expand the map up to 750 pixels in height.

Click image to enlarge.

[koontz1973]

Much better. Sorry for being negative in the last post.

[isaiah40]

Much better. Sorry for being negative in the last post.

Not a problem. You didn't see any punches being thrown your way right?

[nolefan5311]

I much prefer the black text.

Is there supposed to be a connection between Manchester and Boston? If not, the New Hampshire bonus should probably be reduced to a +1.

The border lines between states in the NE is a little hard to tell. Is there something you could do to fix that? Or something you could do is because there are already so many lines on the map, maybe getting rid of the border lines completely and just having a gap there similar to how the regions are split up.

Also, you should probably indicate somewhere in the legend that Calgary is a killer neutral. I can see someone parking a stack there not realizing that.

[isaiah40]

I much prefer the black text.

Yes, I prefer the black text better.

Is there supposed to be a connection between Manchester and Boston? If not, the New Hampshire bonus should probably be reduced to a +1.

Good catch! Yes there is. I'm thinking that maybe NH should be +1 anyways.

The border lines between states in the NE is a little hard to tell. Is there something you could do to fix that? Or something you could do is because there are already so many lines on the map, maybe getting rid of the border lines completely and just having a gap there similar to how the regions are split up.

I will be redoing all the borders and such as time goes on. As for the gap, I did have it that way way back when but it was making the map look way too cluttered.

Also, you should probably indicate somewhere in the legend that Calgary is a killer neutral. I can see someone parking a stack there not realizing that.

Done!