Charleston, SC [Quenched]

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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby TaCktiX on Fri May 16, 2008 7:46 pm

That's the shape of the state, and I think it's fine there. I think the star could be less prominent, as it gives a "cheese" look to the map that doesn't really suit Charleston's historic character. Perhaps age that?
Last edited by TaCktiX on Fri May 16, 2008 7:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby Kaplowitz on Fri May 16, 2008 7:50 pm

TaCktiX wrote:That's the shape of the state, and is good. I think the star could be less prominent, as it gives a "cheese" look to the map that doesn't really suit Charleston's historic character. Perhaps age that?

It could still look like SC and fit the theme of the map better ;)
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby RjBeals on Fri May 16, 2008 9:25 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:The words "Charleston, South Carolina" have no hook for me. --Andy


Hmmm.. Maybe change the title to Low Country ? Or are you speaking of the actual city. Charleston is not as famous as LA or New York, but if the game is fun, you're down? Any comments so far on the style? Or I guess your style is to wait until the foundry picks it over, then comment ;)
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby gimil on Fri May 16, 2008 9:27 pm

[Adv. idea]
What do you know about map making, bitch?

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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby AndyDufresne on Fri May 16, 2008 9:34 pm

RjBeals wrote:Hmmm.. Maybe change the title to Low Country ? Or are you speaking of the actual city. Charleston is not as famous as LA or New York, but if the game is fun, you're down? Any comments so far on the style? Or I guess your style is to wait until the foundry picks it over, then comment ;)

Low Country perhaps, but then that seems to do a disservice to the area...would a large number of people know where you are reffering to? :)

I'll comment more when it wanders in the Main Foundry. ;)


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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby Incandenza on Fri May 16, 2008 10:22 pm

I think calling it anything but Charleston would be a mistake.
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby Ruben Cassar on Sat May 17, 2008 5:21 am

RjBeals wrote:
Ruben Cassar wrote:Does the legend follow some kind of order?

Not really. It's kind of Left to Right. Would you think a minimap would work better with so many different shades of colors?


I don't know but you could give it a shot so that we can compare both versions.
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby Ruben Cassar on Sat May 17, 2008 5:24 am

Incandenza wrote:I think calling it anything but Charleston would be a mistake.


I agree. Keep the current name.

Low countries is more synonymous with Holland to me. I'm not American. ;)
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby Optimus Prime on Sun May 18, 2008 12:49 am

I agree with Incandenza, keep the title as Charleston.
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby bryguy on Mon May 19, 2008 9:02 am

first time for me to comment on this map that i know of, but it does look pretty good


1) The territory text is a little hard to read for me
2) Looking closely at the historic district, i see that you seem to have a bunch of little lines going up and down and lieft and right, could u remove them?
3) I dont care for how i seems the bridges are above the map, and the rest seems flat (to me), could u either add the same effects as the bridges to the rest of the map or take those effects off the bridges?
4) Down in the left corner, i see some trees that are on something that really annoys me, i cant really explain it that well, but could u remove it?


eh hopefully more later
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby Optimus Prime on Mon May 19, 2008 9:29 am

I believe the lines in the Historic District are supposed to be representative of the city proper. Like viewing the streets from above and such. I think it looks nice, so my vote is to keep them the way they are. They are very subtle, so they aren't distracting in any way.
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby RjBeals on Mon May 19, 2008 9:56 am

Optimus Prime wrote:I believe the lines in the Historic District are supposed to be representative of the city proper. Like viewing the streets from above and such. I think it looks nice, so my vote is to keep them the way they are. They are very subtle, so they aren't distracting in any way.


You are correct OP. That is like the downtown area, so the lines are suppose to be streets. I want to dress up the other regions a bit also. I tried to make the subtle enough so they do not make anything confusing.

bryguy wrote: The territory text is a little hard to read for me

A little hard because of the font style? Or because of the contrast / colors. I tried to get a very plain font, with no effects on it. I like it for this size map, and it will make the small map a little easier to read also. I could adjust the colors / contrast if that's what you mean.

bryguy wrote: Down in the left corner, i see some trees that are on something that really annoys me, i cant really explain it that well, but could u remove it?
If you mean that dark line along the bottom. That bothers me also. It's because I was stupid and didn't oversize the canvas in Photoshop before starting the map. So when I added the bevel, it screws up along the edges. I'll fix it before too long. And don't get too attached to the trees. I'm not happy with them or the bridges.

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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby bryguy on Mon May 19, 2008 10:39 am

Response in red

RjBeals wrote:
bryguy wrote: The territory text is a little hard to read for me

A little hard because of the font style? Or because of the contrast / colors. I tried to get a very plain font, with no effects on it. I like it for this size map, and it will make the small map a little easier to read also. I could adjust the colors / contrast if that's what you mean. yep that should do it, its just the color that makes it hard to read

bryguy wrote: Down in the left corner, i see some trees that are on something that really annoys me, i cant really explain it that well, but could u remove it?
If you mean that dark line along the bottom. That bothers me also. It's because I was stupid and didn't oversize the canvas in Photoshop before starting the map. So when I added the bevel, it screws up along the edges. I'll fix it before too long. And don't get too attached to the trees. I'm not happy with them or the bridges. yea thats the word, bevel. And thanks, cant wait to see it gone! and i wont mind losing the trees or bridges (although the trees werent that bad)

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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby Optimus Prime on Mon May 19, 2008 1:11 pm

I just noticed that "Folly Beach" seems to float out in the middle of the water. Any way to fit it on the actual territory or no?
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby RjBeals on Wed May 21, 2008 3:43 pm

Click image to enlarge.
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Previous Version:
http://www.rjbeals.com/charleston/Charleston_Rev4.jpg


I need a break.

  • Took out bridges & made these connectors.
  • Took out trees
  • Changed some colors
  • Changed some borders & territ names
  • Added mini-map legend & region name bonus. I'm happy with these bonus amounts, but let me know if you feel different.
  • Added slight land & sea textures
  • Took out circles where water routes connected. It added junk to the map that wasn't needed.
  • Fixed type-o's
  • Probably other stuff I can't think of now

As I said before, I'm not going for the awesome graphics on this map. I'm going for simple yet really fun straightforward gameplay. I want territs & names & borders & bonuses to be clear. I want many bonus regions, and all players to quickly be able to secure a bonus region. I don't need impassible borders. I don't want trees or shrubs or anything that will distract from the basic gameboard.

Currently, the only thing I'm thinking of doing is moving the mini-map up, then moving the name bonus lines under it, maybe 2 columns or something. I've got some unused space above the Title that I could utilize.

I read back through the posts, and I changed everything I could. Tac I know you're going to say something about the bridges, as you've mentioned the East Ashley bridge before, but I had to improvise bridge placement based on game-play.
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Re: Charleston, SC (Best 60 territ map on CC... pg.4)

Postby TaCktiX on Wed May 21, 2008 3:56 pm

You missed Harbor View again and there's an L missing in CentervilLe, but I digress. ;) The good news is we're no longer contemplating navels.

I'd say my major gripe with the map's gameplay right now is how many one-off +1 territories there are. Wild Dunes, Gray Bay, Drum Island, Goat Island, Long Island, and West Morris are just out there hanging, serving no other purpose but to make the continent more powerful. I got the same gripe on The Citadel, and I'm fixing it by adding a few more inter-continent attack routes. I would suggest doing these:

- Goat Island to Westchester (use artistic license and squish Westchester a little bit so the route will show up nicely)
- Long Island to Sol Legare Island (you can take the route off the tip of Long Island and back down to Sol Legare to make it obvious)
- Wild Dunes to Gray Bay
- West Morris to Long Island
- Drum Island to Daniel Island (poor Daniel Island, out there stuck between two continents not its own)

Looking at the bonuses, all of them are good, and should remain so when you add the connections I noted. Daniel Island DOES need to attach to its own continent, as not doing so is not straightforward gameplay (I'm reminded of Greater China, with its impassable-split continents...weird gameplay). One point you might consider is making East Ashley a +4 bonus instead of a +3 (West Ashley defends 2 territories, holds 5, East Ashley defends 3 territories, holds 5). That's up for debate though.

Graphics-side, Mt. Pleasant the bonus text washes out to sea. The new texture is beautifully subtle, and the bevel is just-right. I would consider some other small-scale fonts, as the map can be hard to read at points, and this is the large map we're talking about. Some of it could be rectified by having a slightly darker/lighter color contrast (say, in North Charleston, West Ashley).
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Re: Charleston, SC (WaterRoutes & Trees - pg.3)

Postby RjBeals on Wed May 21, 2008 3:57 pm

Click image to enlarge.
image


RjBeals wrote:
Previous Version:
http://www.rjbeals.com/charleston/Charleston_Rev4.jpg


I need a break.

  • Took out bridges & made these connectors.
  • Took out trees
  • Changed some colors
  • Changed some borders & territ names
  • Added mini-map legend & region name bonus. I'm happy with these bonus amounts, but let me know if you feel different.
  • Added slight land & sea textures
  • Took out circles where water routes connected. It added junk to the map that wasn't needed.
  • Fixed type-o's
  • Probably other stuff I can't think of now

As I said before, I'm not going for the awesome graphics on this map. I'm going for simple yet really fun straightforward gameplay. I want territs & names & borders & bonuses to be clear. I want many bonus regions, and all players to quickly be able to secure a bonus region. I don't need impassible borders. I don't want trees or shrubs or anything that will distract from the basic gameboard.

Currently, the only thing I'm thinking of doing is moving the mini-map up, then moving the name bonus lines under it, maybe 2 columns or something. I've got some unused space above the Title that I could utilize.

I read back through the posts, and I changed everything I could. Tac I know you're going to say something about the bridges, as you've mentioned the East Ashley bridge before, but I had to improvise bridge placement based on game-play.


Quoted to Bring to Page 5
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Re: Charleston, SC (Best 60 territ map on CC... pg.4)

Postby AndyDufresne on Wed May 21, 2008 4:31 pm

I like the simpler graphics of this map actually, they are unique and refreshing.

Currently, the only thing I'm thinking of doing is moving the mini-map up, then moving the name bonus lines under it, maybe 2 columns or something. I've got some unused space above the Title that I could utilize.

I was going to suggest something similar, but I see that you are already thinking toward it!

A few of the territorial division lines seem fuzzy, when compared to others. Those in Folly Beach south look different from those in the Folly Beach north. There are a few other examples also

Regarding game play, I'd like to see at least one of the bonus 3's changed to an additional bonus 2. Perhaps S. St. James Island. (Or Folly Beach, but Folly Beach looks like it's worth a 3 due to it being a great connector to far reaches around the map).


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Re: Charleston, SC (Best 60 territ map on CC... pg.4)

Postby Optimus Prime on Wed May 21, 2008 4:53 pm

I like the idea of no trees or impassable borders as well. I like the idea of it being open and easy to get places.

My only question is about Daniel Island. Is there a particular reason it is not directly connected to any of the rest of the continent it is a part of? That is going to make getting that particular continent bonus a bit difficult.
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Re: Charleston, SC (Best 60 territ map on CC... pg.4)

Postby RjBeals on Thu May 22, 2008 11:59 am

Tac -

* The spelling will be corrected, I promise
* I will add some more connections between the stand-alone regions, but only to other territories in the same regions. I don't want more bordering territs.
* I think I'll keep the bridge up north connecting naval to Daniel is, But I'll add another bridge from State Arsenal to Daniel is also. Or... maybe change Daniel Island to Dark Yellow, and make it part of North Charleston instead. Then the bonus amounts may change
* I'll look at clearing up some of the washed up legend font, but I'm keeping the map territory fonts. The small maps will most likely have different fonts.


Andy -

* Not sure what territ lines are fuzzy? I don't see them on my monitor.
* You want another bonus 2 - why? I'm totally stumped on where. I could always split the green st. johns island up again into a north & south, but then I think there would be too many small bonuses.


Prime -

* Daniel Island will be addressed. Maybe turn it dark yellow, or maybe connect it to it's bonus region.
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Re: Charleston, SC (Best 60 territ map on CC... pg.4)

Postby AndyDufresne on Thu May 22, 2008 5:48 pm

S. St. James is a duplicate of East Cooper, no? They both have 4 territories, and 2 borders. East Cooper touches 3 enemy territories, and S. St. James touches 4, essentially the same. Unless I'm missing something (which is very likely always :)) I would think S. St. James would be a bonus of 2 rather than 3.


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Re: Charleston, SC (Best 60 territ map on CC... pg.4)

Postby edbeard on Thu May 22, 2008 5:51 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:S. St. James is a duplicate of East Cooper, no? They both have 4 territories, and 2 borders. East Cooper touches 3 enemy territories, and S. St. James touches 4, essentially the same. Unless I'm missing something (which is very likely always :)) I would think S. St. James would be a bonus of 2 rather than 3.


--Andy

well it also touches three continents to East Cooper's two so the argument for +3 could be a valid one
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Re: Charleston, SC (Best 60 territ map on CC... pg.4)

Postby AndyDufresne on Thu May 22, 2008 5:54 pm

Perhaps, but I think it's an over valued 3. I'd much rather it a 2!


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Re: Charleston, SC (Best 60 territ map on CC... pg.4)

Postby RjBeals on Fri May 23, 2008 12:51 pm

Click image to enlarge.
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okay Andy - I agree. It wouldn't hurt to have the south st. james as a +2 also. Done.

Here's the latest.

* Spelling errors fixed.
* Water-routes changed just a bit
* Bridge style changed just a bit
* Legend changed.

Dunno - I've been tweaking things for days now.

oh yeah, combined some of the islands so they are not hanging alone (like Tac suggested).
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Re: Charleston, SC (New Legend, Pg-5)

Postby ZeakCytho on Fri May 23, 2008 1:01 pm

I think St. Johns island should be split into two continents, like you had in the other versions. I'm still not crazy about the bridges, but they're better than before. Maybe consider putting an attack line or bridge beween West Morris and Parrot Point or Goat Island to eliminate the dead end?

Other than that, I really like this new update.
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