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The Soviet Union [Quenched]

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Postby yeti_c on Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:55 am

edbeard wrote:
Ogrecrusher wrote:
oaktown wrote:would it be possible to flip those "2"s in the legend upside down, so they look like 2s and not 5s?


If they were flipped they'd look like 5s. Try it :D


he means turned 180 degrees. to him, I think, it looks like someone took a 5 and did a horizontal flip with it.


So the tail would become the start of the number - yeah I agree that would work better.

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Postby yeti_c on Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:59 am

PS - I just had a look at the XML to check for BOB compatibility - But as it's all written in roman instead of cyrillic - there is no issue!!

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Postby pepperonibread on Mon Jan 14, 2008 7:17 am

oaktown wrote:would it be possible to flip those "2"s in the legend upside down, so they look like 2s and not 5s?


Thanks, that should look better. I'll try it.
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Postby oaktown on Mon Jan 14, 2008 11:23 pm

pepperonibread wrote:
oaktown wrote:would it be possible to flip those "2"s in the legend upside down, so they look like 2s and not 5s?


Thanks, that should look better. I'll try it.

I did, indeed, mean to turn them 180° rather than "flip" them - sorry to be less than precise in my language.
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Postby wrightfan123 on Tue Jan 15, 2008 3:20 pm

Marvelous job, Pep. I'm sure this will be quenched along with Waterloo and Dustbowl. Coons everywhere are dancing.

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Postby oaktown on Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:34 pm

anybody know what page had the last discussion around the size of bonuses? I'd like to see what people were saying... flipped around a bit and didn't come across it.

i ask because western republics seems high at +3, especially since they are poised to take moscow and make it a +4 for holding 5 territories. I'd like to read the discussion on it.
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Postby AndyDufresne on Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:54 pm

Page 20 Oaktown, I was perhaps the last speaking about some game play changes.


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Postby oaktown on Wed Jan 16, 2008 9:11 am

AndyDufresne wrote:Page 20 Oaktown, I was perhaps the last speaking about some game play changes.


--Andy

Ha! Here I was scanning the old discussion, and I ignored the last page! Thanks Andy.

I was pouring over the image in the first post, which it seems isn't the latest version of the map.
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Postby pepperonibread on Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:00 pm

oaktown wrote:
AndyDufresne wrote:Page 20 Oaktown, I was perhaps the last speaking about some game play changes.


--Andy

Ha! Here I was scanning the old discussion, and I ignored the last page! Thanks Andy.

I was pouring over the image in the first post, which it seems isn't the latest version of the map.


My mistake, everything was updated but the 1st post.
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Postby iancanton on Fri Jan 18, 2008 9:15 am

oaktown wrote:I still wish those rivers went somewhere, but I guess that's Gimil's department. :wink:


we can make one of the rivers go somewhere by removing most of the dnipro (dnepr) river boundary between moscow and leningrad (because the dnipro doesn't go that far north-east, nor does that part of the river have any gameplay function), while extending the dnipro river, which is an impassable between moscow and byelorussia, to the black sea, to form the western boundary of kiev territory.

if we do this, then we'll also need a bridge from kiev to lvov, which can be represented very simply by two thin black parallel lines that cross the river, with the area between the lines having the same turquoise colour as kiev.

http://www.grid.unep.ch/product/map/ima ... nieprb.gif

it also doesn't look right that, although there is no difference in function between the rivers and lakes, both being impassable water, the rivers are light blue while the lakes (and seas) are dark blue. is it possible to make the blue colours more alike without compromising the overall appearance of the map?

ian. :)
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Postby pepperonibread on Fri Jan 18, 2008 11:53 pm

New Update:

Large:

Image

Small:

Image

Large Test:

Image

Small Test:

Image

Large 3-Digit Test:

Image

Small 3-Digit Test:
Image

Changes:
-Flipped 2's in legend 180 degrees.
-Redid river in W. Republics, added bridge.
-Darkened W. Republics to make the river easier to see.
-Changed river color slightly to better blend with the lakes.
-Moved army circles/terit. names when necessary.
-Adjusted XML accordingly.

To do:
-Comments?
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Postby oaktown on Sat Jan 19, 2008 2:54 am

ah, what the hell...
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Postby edbeard on Sat Jan 19, 2008 6:16 am

I don't like that bridge.

maybe tone down the black of it.

or make the lines a bit thinner

it just jumps out at me



also, the river seemingly blends in with the continent colour. Maybe switch this one with the green in the southwest there. currently, you have to look carefully to see where the river ends.
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Postby militant on Sat Jan 19, 2008 6:56 am

I was going to say the same thing as Edbeard the bridge looks really bold and could do with being toned down a bit.

Great looking map so for :D
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Postby yeti_c on Mon Jan 21, 2008 10:32 am

You may need to change your continents...

Anything that was written <component> is now <territory>

Note you can also use <continent> in your components if your logic needs it!!

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Postby lanyards on Mon Jan 21, 2008 11:18 am

yeti_c wrote:You may need to change your continents...

Anything that was written <component> is now <territory>

Note you can also use <continent> in your components if your logic needs it!!

C.

Fixed XML:
http://h1.ripway.com/lanyards/TheSovietUnionXML.xml

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Postby iancanton on Mon Jan 21, 2008 1:06 pm

militant wrote:I was going to say the same thing as Edbeard the bridge looks really bold and could do with being toned down a bit.

Great looking map so for :D


agreed. although the dnipro river itself looks good now, thin lines for the bridge will divert less attention from the rest of the map. extending the river by a couple of millimetres into the orange part of leningrad before fading it out will remove doubt as to whether byelorussia can attack leningrad.

this leaves one orphaned river on the tuva boundary. the map below shows the yenisei river veering north and running straight through the western side of krasnoyarsk and turukhansk before reaching the arctic ocean. extending the river like this means putting in bridges and possibly eliminating some attack routes to reduce the number of bridges (if we do the latter, then it will help the western siberia player, but we’ll need to update the xml accordingly).

http://www.holidays-in-russia.co.uk/rou ... nisei.html

a solution without bridges is to replace the existing river by the sayan (sajan) mountain range, which appears to form a barrier on the northern and eastern side of tuva that is the same curved shape as our tuva border.

http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~cirillo/tuvanew.jpg

whether the river or mountain range is used will, i suppose, depend on which one is easier to draw convincingly. there is still a marked difference in colour between the light blue of the yenisei river at tuva and the dark blue of nearby lake baikal.

ian. :)
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Postby RobinJ on Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:40 pm

Very very nice this.

No chance of a Stalin image as well (you could do their faces back to back). After all, I think Lenin was dead before (or shortly after) the name actually changed.

(Sorry if already mentioned - haven't been here in a while)
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Postby pepperonibread on Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:20 pm

New Update:

Large:

Image

Small:

Image

Large Test:

Image

Small Test:

Image

Large 3-Digit Test:

Image

Small 3-Digit Test:

Image

Changes:
-Swapped colors of Central Asia & Western Republics.
-Edited W. Republics river to clarify borders.
-Lightened bridge over river (is this good?).
-Darkened rivers.
-Extended Tuva river into the lake next to it. I did this instead of other options for a few reasons: a) I didn't want to add a long river w/ a lot of bridges, as that part of the map is already crowded, b) a mountain range looked odd on the border went I tried it out, and c) it's accurate, or just as accurate as the other rivers.
-Made the mountains slightly thinner.

To do:
-Comments?
Last edited by pepperonibread on Fri Jan 25, 2008 11:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby pepperonibread on Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:35 pm

RobinJ wrote:Very very nice this.

No chance of a Stalin image as well (you could do their faces back to back). After all, I think Lenin was dead before (or shortly after) the name actually changed.

(Sorry if already mentioned - haven't been here in a while)


A Stalin image was there before, but it was decided that Lenin would work better. If I did use both, I wouldn't want them to be too small, and this would I think be the case with the layout of the map.
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Postby gimil on Fri Jan 25, 2008 11:02 pm

I see your missing a few stamps pep:

Image
Image

If there is no further major concerns can you post all images with double and triple fixutres :)

See if we can get those last few stamps :)
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Postby pepperonibread on Fri Jan 25, 2008 11:40 pm

Edited my above post.
Now it's off to bed for me...
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Postby iancanton on Sat Jan 26, 2008 1:06 pm

the kiev bridge still looks bold. have u tried using thinner lines?

i have two remaining gameplay concerns. european russia, with six borders and ten territories, looks very difficult to hold. how about removing one of the borders by expanding arkhangel to eliminate the komi coastline, so that yamalia can attack arkhangel but not komi? to achieve this objective, the urals will need to be extended northward so that komi does not border yamalia. the map below shows komi with no coastline (the coast in that area all belongs to arkhangelsk), so there is some geographical justification to do this.

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/commonwe ... n_1989.jpg

even with five borders, european russia deserves one more bonus army when compared with the smaller continents. the current bonus of 6 (plus 1 additional for moscow) makes it equal to classic asia, which has only four borders on a smaller map. i think 7 (plus 1 additional for moscow) is appropriate. for comparison, on the iberia map, castilla la mancha, which has a bonus of 7, has five borders and seven territories.

finally, can we redraw kiev so that the crimea has its distinctive rhombus shape that almost touches stalingrad territory?

http://www.euronet.nl/users/sota/krimgeo.html

ian. :)
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Postby pepperonibread on Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:50 pm

New Update:

Large:

Image

Small:

Image

Large Test:

Image

Small Test:

Image

Large 3-Digit Test:

Image

Small 3-Digit Test:

Image

Current XML (Clicky)

Changes:
-Adjusted borders in European Russia continent.
-Edited Amur-Irkutsk and Perm borders to clarify connections on small map.
-Redrew Kiev to give Crimea correct shape.
-Cleaned up some odd edges on playable area.
-Made bridge over river thinner.

To do:
-Decide European Russia's bonus. I think it should go to 5, because of the bonus for Moscow and how it compares with Western Siberia. I'll put up a week-long poll, tho I may take it off early.
-Comments?
Last edited by pepperonibread on Mon Jan 28, 2008 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby oaktown on Mon Jan 28, 2008 9:33 am

relative to the other territories on the map, I' think you'd be safe making the Eur. Rus. bonus either five or six. Six (plus the one for moscow) makes the most sense because it is the same size and has the same number of borders to defend as Western Siberia, which is at seven. I recognize that the +1 auto deploy is less attractive than a normal bonus that you get to place, but between the auto deploy and the location of this region next to the western republics it will be much easier to seize and control than Wes. Sib., so I wouldn't give it a higher bonus value.
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