Das Schloß [QUENCHED #2]

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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby tonbomorphew on Sat Jun 26, 2010 2:41 pm

Could it say Das Skloss That how swiss write it?
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby natty dread on Sat Jun 26, 2010 2:52 pm

tonbomorphew wrote:Could it say Das Skloss That how swiss write it?


Where do you see Swiss people on this map?
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby bbzed on Sun Jun 27, 2010 3:31 am

Im not sure if this has been mentioned in the 88 pages, surely it has but this map really doesnt work well with flat rate spoils, we have had many people complaining and leaving the game here http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=6688108, its a great map but really needs to be played with escalating spoils.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby tonbomorphew on Sun Jun 27, 2010 11:06 am

Maybe the swiss are neutral and colored is nazis
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby natty dread on Sun Jun 27, 2010 11:17 am

tonbomorphew wrote:Maybe the swiss are neutral and colored is nazis


Well no one's stopping you from imagining that they are.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby thesheeit on Sun Jun 27, 2010 4:40 pm

ths has got to be the stupidest map ever now it was better before
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby MrBenn on Sun Jun 27, 2010 4:46 pm

thesheeit wrote:ths has got to be the stupidest map ever now it was better before

I guess by "before" you're referring to the deeply flawed version from when the map first went live?

What in your opinion was better previously? What specifically do you think is bad? If you put forward some suggestions about how you think the map could be improved, then it gives the mapmaker something to work with ;-)
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby AAFitz on Tue Jun 29, 2010 8:01 am

cairnswk wrote:
MrBenn wrote:http://h1.ripway.com/cairnswk/das_schloss_250610.xml

I have forwarded the above XML to lackattack ;-)


And this has been updated this morning. :)



awesome, I made more and will continue to do so...

that last revision before all the spots went away wasnt bad. its still pretty skewed to the castle, but i dont know hot to play it any other way so i could be wrong
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby AAFitz on Thu Jul 01, 2010 8:23 am

Seems to be playing pretty well. I myself dont know how to use the other bonuses all that well, so Im not sure if they work, but all in all, there are no massively unbalanced sections on 1v1 or for going first now.

If I were to suggest any change, Id say one or two more could be given in upper right, to really contend the castle, but I honestly dont have enough experience over there, to know for sure.

The AA resetting actually is a nice touch, though theoretically it does reduce the usefulness of the chuttes for gaining advantage over other areas

every game so far as been good, ive seen no problems whatsoever, but its still early, and half of them are still ending when someone accidentally gets reset on AA so it will take a few more to know for sure.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby cairnswk on Thu Jul 01, 2010 11:41 am

Thanks for that Feedback AA Fitz. I'll wait and see if anyone else has some f/back also.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby thesheeit on Tue Jul 06, 2010 8:08 pm

so far i like the change im not sure about the random drop though might be better to make it even again but i guess its like whining about the drop on any other map...sometimes your good sometimes bad ill try another game or two ans see how it goes
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby tokle on Wed Jul 07, 2010 8:20 am

It is possible to get a bonus from the drop now. I much preffered it when you had a fixed amount of starting locations in each of the areas.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby AAFitz on Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:12 am

tokle wrote:It is possible to get a bonus from the drop now. I much preffered it when you had a fixed amount of starting locations in each of the areas.


yeah, you can get dropped in castle or upper right which will get a bonus of +3...however, the more spots you take on one, the more likely your opponent did the same.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby AAFitz on Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:19 am

The gameplay is fine Id say. I think its still more favored for the castle than it has to be, but I cant say for sure, not ever trying the other bonus.

I do have one other request, that would help out all click map users and everyone however:

If you change the name of timms, and yves to something lower in the alphabet, more specifically, lower than "S" the many forts can be made much, much easier out of the chuttes. This will be a huge change for freestyle play.

I dont know if renaming them is possible, but the benefits are more than you would think.

By doing that, the option of fort from would always be from the chuttes, and it would save at least 8 extra individual forts if you are in those two chutte areas.

The other option would be to change one of the spots near AA to Zeppelin Landing or something like that. Not only would it be badass to have Zeppelin on the map to fort to....it would save some serious time....and in the case of two dueling freestylers, would become a battle in and of itself.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby Queen_Herpes on Mon Jul 12, 2010 5:10 pm

I don't have time to read 88 pages....could you edit the description in the original post or edit the second post by the mapmaker to tell me how to attack the 60 army neutral hubschraubers? I don't know how to reach them.

edit: I just figured it out, but I doubt anyone else will know how to do it. I doubt anyone will ever try to take the hubschraubers unless in a nuclear game (as I just did) and one of the hubschraubers got nuked. The landeplatz territories attack the hubschraubers, right? If so, this needs to be made more clear on the map.

edit: Is there a way to earn enough armies/troops to reasonably attack the hubschraubers? I like that they are there and they could be used if, perhaps, they had fewer than 60 neutrals.
Last edited by Queen_Herpes on Tue Jul 13, 2010 11:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby natty dread on Mon Jul 12, 2010 5:37 pm

I have to agree with QH here. Unless I'm really missing something, the current version indeed doesn't explain which territories can attack the hubschraubers. The explanation was in the previous versions though, I wonder why it was removed (or was it by mistake?)
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby AAFitz on Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:17 am

Queen_Herpes wrote:I don't have time to read 88 pages....could you edit the description in the original post or edit the second post by the mapmaker to tell me how to attack the 60 army neutral hubschraubers? I don't know how to reach them.

edit: I just figured it out, but I doubt anyone else will know how to do it. I doubt anyone will ever try to take the hubschraubers unless in a nuclear game (as I just did) and one of the hubschraubers got nuked. The landeplatz territories attack the hubschraubers, right? If so, this needs to be made more clear on the map.

edit: Is there a way to earn enough armies/troops to reasonably attack the hubschraubers? I like that they are there and they could be used if, perhaps, they had fewer than 60 neutrals.


it should be listed...they certainly could stand to have fewer armies, but even at 60 they are indeed important to the game and and an interesting twist, and in multiplayer escalating, they are the essential of the game itself. I myself have only attacked them maybe three times ever though in hundreds of games.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jul 17, 2010 9:09 am

AAFitz wrote:
Queen_Herpes wrote:I don't have time to read 88 pages....could you edit the description in the original post or edit the second post by the mapmaker to tell me how to attack the 60 army neutral hubschraubers? I don't know how to reach them.

edit: I just figured it out, but I doubt anyone else will know how to do it. I doubt anyone will ever try to take the hubschraubers unless in a nuclear game (as I just did) and one of the hubschraubers got nuked. The landeplatz territories attack the hubschraubers, right? If so, this needs to be made more clear on the map.

edit: Is there a way to earn enough armies/troops to reasonably attack the hubschraubers? I like that they are there and they could be used if, perhaps, they had fewer than 60 neutrals.


it should be listed...they certainly could stand to have fewer armies, but even at 60 they are indeed important to the game and and an interesting twist, and in multiplayer escalating, they are the essential of the game itself. I myself have only attacked them maybe three times ever though in hundreds of games.



Will this sording suffice?

Killer Neutral resets: Access Point (to 2) & AA (to 5) and
Landeplatz A & B (to 14) which border each Hubschrauber (each 60)


I would not like to reset the 60....there was much debate that this figure was required to assist maintenance of the objective being achieved, and that the helicopters should only be used as a absolute stalemate game escape. Not everyone plays that of course...
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby Queen_Herpes on Tue Jul 20, 2010 6:41 pm

cairnswk wrote:
AAFitz wrote:Will this sording suffice?

Killer Neutral resets: Access Point (to 2) & AA (to 5) and
Landeplatz A & B (to 14) which border each Hubschrauber (each 60)

Good enough for me...


carinswk wrote:I would not like to reset the 60....there was much debate that this figure was required to assist maintenance of the objective being achieved, and that the helicopters should only be used as a absolute stalemate game escape. Not everyone plays that of course...


It seems that the armies at the Landeplatzen and the Hubschrauberen along with the fact that they reset back to those numbers means that NO ONE would reaonably EVER attack them. Is it possible to attempt to find out a better number on each of those? There really is no way to earn 75 troops at the beginning of a turn to reasonably attack your way through those positions. Then, you've got the enemy territories to conquer, so you've probably need at least 100 armies to effectively attack through. I think 60 needs to be reduced. 15 may be ok at the landeplatzen.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby cairnswk on Tue Jul 20, 2010 7:14 pm

Queen_Herpes wrote:
cairnswk wrote:
AAFitz wrote:Will this sording suffice?

Killer Neutral resets: Access Point (to 2) & AA (to 5) and
Landeplatz A & B (to 14) which border each Hubschrauber (each 60)

Good enough for me...


carinswk wrote:I would not like to reset the 60....there was much debate that this figure was required to assist maintenance of the objective being achieved, and that the helicopters should only be used as a absolute stalemate game escape. Not everyone plays that of course...


It seems that the armies at the Landeplatzen and the Hubschrauberen along with the fact that they reset back to those numbers means that NO ONE would reaonably EVER attack them. Is it possible to attempt to find out a better number on each of those? There really is no way to earn 75 troops at the beginning of a turn to reasonably attack your way through those positions. Then, you've got the enemy territories to conquer, so you've probably need at least 100 armies to effectively attack through. I think 60 needs to be reduced. 15 may be ok at the landeplatzen.


I really don't want to do that.
You should be aiming at achieving the objective of the game as the way to win, not knocking out your opponents.
As previously stated, the helipcopters were included as the final way to overcome stalements, so it makes sense that those numbers need to be high in order to build towards that.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby MrBenn on Wed Jul 21, 2010 5:07 pm

cairnswk wrote:You should be aiming at achieving the objective of the game as the way to win, not knocking out your opponents.
As previously stated, the helipcopters were included as the final way to overcome stalements, so it makes sense that those numbers need to be high in order to build towards that.

I don;t see any need to change the helicopters - I think they're fine as they are.

The suggested wording sounds fine to me.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby cairnswk on Fri Jul 23, 2010 5:27 pm

MrBenn wrote:
cairnswk wrote:You should be aiming at achieving the objective of the game as the way to win, not knocking out your opponents.
As previously stated, the helipcopters were included as the final way to overcome stalements, so it makes sense that those numbers need to be high in order to build towards that.

I don;t see any need to change the helicopters - I think they're fine as they are.

The suggested wording sounds fine to me.


New Version 45 with wording alteration.

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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V45 Word Adjustment?

Postby tonbomorphew on Sun Jul 25, 2010 1:20 pm

LOVE IT!
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby AAFitz on Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:26 pm

cairnswk wrote:
Queen_Herpes wrote:
cairnswk wrote:
AAFitz wrote:Will this sording suffice?

Killer Neutral resets: Access Point (to 2) & AA (to 5) and
Landeplatz A & B (to 14) which border each Hubschrauber (each 60)

Good enough for me...


carinswk wrote:I would not like to reset the 60....there was much debate that this figure was required to assist maintenance of the objective being achieved, and that the helicopters should only be used as a absolute stalemate game escape. Not everyone plays that of course...


It seems that the armies at the Landeplatzen and the Hubschrauberen along with the fact that they reset back to those numbers means that NO ONE would reaonably EVER attack them. Is it possible to attempt to find out a better number on each of those? There really is no way to earn 75 troops at the beginning of a turn to reasonably attack your way through those positions. Then, you've got the enemy territories to conquer, so you've probably need at least 100 armies to effectively attack through. I think 60 needs to be reduced. 15 may be ok at the landeplatzen.


I really don't want to do that.
You should be aiming at achieving the objective of the game as the way to win, not knocking out your opponents.
As previously stated, the helipcopters were included as the final way to overcome stalements, so it makes sense that those numbers need to be high in order to build towards that.


The helos definitely dont bother me at whatever number they are at. They only really come into play in large escalating games anyways, so the 60 is nearly irrelevant, and certainly not too big, given their intended purpose. It adds way more strategy to the map...but again, I have nearly never used them.

As far as the rest of the changes go, I know they are close, because while I still usually win, Ive been losing randomly, and from random players and even players with no real idea, which means there is not one sure fire place to drop to win. You have to take a risk where you drop, the dice come into play, and timing is huge as well. I simply have no complaints about it, and only wish I tried the upper right bonus a few times, so I could comment on its effectiveness, but simply havent wanted to take the chance. Ive seen people do it though, which means it certainly can work. Whether its a good idea, or a great one or a bad one though, I honestly have no idea.

Thanks for being so patient on this one cairns, the map is simply awesome with all thats going on, on it...and on fog, and after playing more games on it by far, I still have no idea what to expect from the other players....It is by far the best manual fog map on CC in my opinion, especially on 1v1, because it is hardly ever just a dice shoot out.
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Re: Das Schloß [BETA] V44 Adjustment?

Postby cairnswk on Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:33 pm

AAFitz wrote:...
Thanks for being so patient on this one cairns...

AAFitz, i'm just pleased that somewhere along the line we've managed to reach some sort of configuration that is pleasing for you, as well as hopefully, many others. :)
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