The New World [Quenched]

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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby gimil on Wed May 21, 2008 9:10 pm

What do you know about map making, bitch?

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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby Renee_W on Wed May 21, 2008 10:58 pm

This map is rather unfair with starting positions even with 5 players. If you start on a European country you can easily get the landing point for +3 or +4(if you take 1 more territory) your next turn. If you start on a new world homeland you have no practical means to get comparable numbers.
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Bug in New World

Postby DomQuebec on Wed May 21, 2008 11:05 pm

That's possible to attack from Inuit 6 to Comanche 4, but not from Inuit 6 to Comanche 3. It seems illogical.
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby rocky mountain on Thu May 22, 2008 12:01 am

personally, i like the map. the first game i play on it and i win. Game 2488785 it's not quite done yet, but he has 2 terits and can't hand in cards, so i'd say its over... :D great map!!!
(of course i've only played a 2 player game where both of us get 4 homelands, and have not come into the circumstance above)
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby Bruceswar on Thu May 22, 2008 12:22 am

OK first game on this map and I fear we have problems... http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=2489698

Check that game and tell me why I cannot attack those last 3 places... I want to end this one....
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby Crissipos on Thu May 22, 2008 5:27 am

Well done to the creator :) nice map

But sorry, I don't think this map is finished.. it still has bugs
I joined a 5 player map, and there are 5 european homelands, and I didn't get one, while the other players did.
this resulted in me not having a landing point, thus having a huge disadvantage
fix this please!
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Re: Bug in New World

Postby Crissipos on Thu May 22, 2008 5:35 am

Please post this in the new world topic :)
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby Crissipos on Thu May 22, 2008 5:54 am

Even more bugs: Inuit 6 cannot attack Inuit 3, instead it is able to attack Comanche 4, and those 2 don't share a border
Also Comanche 4 cannot attack Comanche 9

Please look at the XML again too :)
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby Skiman on Thu May 22, 2008 6:08 am

Yup, this map is not ready for prime time...the errors are substantial and are likely to determine who wins. Because of the flaws on what can attack what, I've not got a pile of trapped armies. Suggest we fix this one, maybe pull it fom production until that's done
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby gimil on Thu May 22, 2008 6:47 am

Crissipos wrote:Well done to the creator :) nice map

But sorry, I don't think this map is finished.. it still has bugs
I joined a 5 player map, and there are 5 european homelands, and I didn't get one, while the other players did.
this resulted in me not having a landing point, thus having a huge disadvantage
fix this please!


Instead of landing points the homeland terrs have it easier to gain the same level of bonus by taking terr in their empire.
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby Crissipos on Thu May 22, 2008 7:15 am

well that's maybe right :) allthough I think it's easier to defend an european homeland
so when the what can attack what bugs are gone I think this map is ready then
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby gimil on Thu May 22, 2008 7:50 am

Crissipos wrote:well that's maybe right :) allthough I think it's easier to defend an european homeland
so when the what can attack what bugs are gone I think this map is ready then


All the borders should now be fixed in the XML. I did the map a once over with BOB and everything should now be fixed.
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby gimil on Thu May 22, 2008 8:00 am

Lack just uploaded the XML. so there should be no more problems!

*touch wood*
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Re: Bug in New World

Postby bryguy on Thu May 22, 2008 8:33 am

this doesnt even belong in final forge, but foundry discussion
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Re: Bug in New World

Postby gimil on Thu May 22, 2008 8:42 am

This shouldnt be here. Should be in the new worlds thread.

[merged]
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby Bruceswar on Fri May 23, 2008 2:25 am

Thanks and hope it all fixed :)
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby BENJIKAT IS DEAD on Fri May 23, 2008 6:42 am

I am surprised that Coleman has agreed to a map where you can eliminate someone "fairly" easily before they even have a turn.

There are a couple of places where you can attack 11(10)v4,4,1,3, which is a 21% chance of success - or even 10v4,4,3 (35%!!!) - not that high maybe, but certainly high enough to try it.(If you win your first 2 rolls - "the test", then 9v4,1,3 is over 50%, and 9v4,3 is 67%!!).

Just as the neutral numbers were increased for AoR:1 soon after it came out, the same needs to happen here I think.


To get to sub-5%, the 4s would need to be 8s - to be below 1% chance they would need to be 11s.


Coleman from AoR:Might thread wrote:I think it's impossible to fix the possibility of being killed in the first round by someone crazy enough to try it, but it needs to be a lower chance than 40%

Right now the average chance is 6-7% which sounds higher than ideal, but most players won't make a move that gives them a 94% chance of not winning. Let's call it the cook's gamble. :lol:

I highly favor tweaking neutral values to fix any issues we discover over changing the layout or general game play of the map in any way, as it leaves current games intact.
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby gimil on Fri May 23, 2008 11:03 am

BENJIKAT IS DEAD wrote:I am surprised that Coleman has agreed to a map where you can eliminate someone "fairly" easily before they even have a turn.

There are a couple of places where you can attack 11(10)v4,4,1,3, which is a 21% chance of success - or even 10v4,4,3 (35%!!!) - not that high maybe, but certainly high enough to try it.(If you win your first 2 rolls - "the test", then 9v4,1,3 is over 50%, and 9v4,3 is 67%!!).

Just as the neutral numbers were increased for AoR:1 soon after it came out, the same needs to happen here I think.


To get to sub-5%, the 4s would need to be 8s - to be below 1% chance they would need to be 11s.


Coleman from AoR:Might thread wrote:I think it's impossible to fix the possibility of being killed in the first round by someone crazy enough to try it, but it needs to be a lower chance than 40%

Right now the average chance is 6-7% which sounds higher than ideal, but most players won't make a move that gives them a 94% chance of not winning. Let's call it the cook's gamble. :lol:

I highly favor tweaking neutral values to fix any issues we discover over changing the layout or general game play of the map in any way, as it leaves current games intact.



I agree. I think ill tweek it to 8.
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby t-o-m on Fri May 23, 2008 11:16 am

i just killed someone in their 1st round, it was completely unfair on them as they didnt get a go!

also, this is supposed to be a map about expanding, hence the +1 for every 2 terits, but people come into conflict WAY too soon! feudal, on the other hand, is a lot more expansionist. people tend to attack more terits, army build, then attack other places. this map. however, is different as you are able to get into conflict with someone too quickly.
as you said gimil, the neutrals need to be addressed/changed.

you dont want it to be harder to get terits, just harder to get other people's terits.
i suppose its a too late now to add more terits in lol
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby gimil on Fri May 23, 2008 9:20 pm

tomorrow ill go over the gameplay and have something that works better.
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby seamusk on Fri May 23, 2008 10:40 pm

I will say that I like the variation that this map is. It is not feudal in ways that make it really fun, especially after multiple plays. Yes you can get attacked early but its extremely risky (though I agree the chance of 1st turn elim needs to be fixed). But I don't think it necessarily needs more territories or anything. I've had some great games. It is really interesting to watch as homelands switch hands and it happens VERY often. But in a way that leaves most players with the ability to retaliate. More territories would make it more like feudal, but I personally like it as it is as its own unique map. I personally like that organized chaos that forms.
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby _big_easy_ on Sat May 24, 2008 4:21 am

Just played a 2 player game where the other guy dropped 3 European Homelands to my 1.

Needless to say, I lost fairly easily.
Would have been even quicker had he realized to attack the Landing Points his first turn.
From Rd 3 on, he was getting 24 auto-deployed (4 x 3EuroHomeland, 3 x 3LandPoints + 3 Ind.Homeland),
while I was getting 16 auto-deployed (4 x 1EuroHomeland, 1 x 3LandPoint, 3 x 3Ind.Homelands)

That's a pretty big discrepancy for a 2 player game.
I think it would improve the gameplay if you could make the distribution of European Homelands as equal for 2-5 players.
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby hulmey on Sat May 24, 2008 5:08 am

_big_easy_ wrote:Just played a 2 player game where the other guy dropped 3 European Homelands to my 1.

Needless to say, I lost fairly easily.
Would have been even quicker had he realized to attack the Landing Points his first turn.
From Rd 3 on, he was getting 24 auto-deployed (4 x 3EuroHomeland, 3 x 3LandPoints + 3 Ind.Homeland),
while I was getting 16 auto-deployed (4 x 1EuroHomeland, 1 x 3LandPoint, 3 x 3Ind.Homelands)

That's a pretty big discrepancy for a 2 player game.
I think it would improve the gameplay if you could make the distribution of European Homelands as equal for 2-5 players.


Thats coz ur a bad player....Its better to start out with the native kingdoms than the homelands.........

I like the map the way it is, dont turn it into another Feudel please..Dont forget the homelands have an advantage by gettting the 3 for the landing zone but obviously this is then out wayed by the natives being able to take out those 1's early on!!!

I really dont think anybody can be killed off in the first turn and whoever tries it is stupid and leaving themselves almost defenseless
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby wcaclimbing on Sat May 24, 2008 12:52 pm

I have decided that this map is amazing. good job!
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Re: The New World [Quenched]

Postby Qwert on Sat May 24, 2008 6:10 pm

Here mine point of view.
These map have 69 terits(i read in first page),and these mean that map is not create to be suitabile for 1v1 player.If we want to create map to be suitabile for 1v1 player game then he must change gameplay to be like Feudal war,and these not will be good.I hope that people will understand that map with big numbers of terittories who dont have same gameplay like Feudal,give big advance in 1v1 games. ;)
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