WWI Ottoman Empire [Quenched]

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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V2

Postby Blitzaholic on Sun Aug 17, 2008 12:22 am

cairnswk wrote:Version 2.

1. I've adjusted the spacing issue...Turkey should look less cramped now.
2. Anatolia (Turkey) has been divided into East and West to break them down bonus wise.
3. Also changed the font on the title

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yes qwert, I like this, wish it was a little bigger, but nice
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V2

Postby cairnswk on Sun Aug 17, 2008 12:32 am

Blitzaholic wrote:...yes qwert, I like this, wish it was a little bigger, but nice

Ah blitzaholic. you talking with cairnswk here, not qwert.
and this si the latest version 3.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V3(P2) - New Gameplay

Postby edbeard on Sun Aug 17, 2008 1:44 am

new gameplay makes this a much better map (at a glance anyway). I'll talk gameplay later but after a while of producing maps that don't do it for me personally, this one does.


The Good:

1. The shape of the playable part of the map itself is nice.

2. The unique colours: we don't usually see these on maps. At least not these tones.


The Bad:

1. I know it's the small map and the space is a slight problem but some of these names are too close or confusing. I'm not talking territory names for the most part (though a few need slight moving as you probably know) but your neutral areas (Arabia and Abyssina are too close to playable parts of the map). The port names seem like double trouble to me. Is it called this or that? It's nice for the historical aspect but maybe they can be put in a different font or something to distinguish them.

2. Legend fonts and format. The title just doesn't seem to go with the rest of the map. I think it's the font. The bottom notes are two points but the format combines them. Ports and neutral starts don't mix.

3. some of your borders have weird things going on in them (you probably know). Kenia-antep to angora. I thought I saw more but I can't find them at this moment and maybe they just don't exist.


The Ugly:

1. The continent names in the legend are horribly illegible. I think the silver is the problem. The bright/light colours also probably hinder it but try putting a stroke round the names and/or a shadow to add contrast so the light colours don't mix with the bright background.

2. you continent colours and/or how you've put them on the map make it hard for me to tell what continent is which in some spots. Well this is really continuing on the last point. But, the other problem is while two territories belong to the same continent, the way the colour is spread in each one differs and gives a weird affect. This is most prominent in the southern west Ottoman continent (Syria?). The colours in british egypt and anglo-egyptian sudan (spelled eyptian on the map - error or just how they spelled it there?) seem a shade different to me. Look at the line that borders the neutral abyssina and the line (in british egypt) that borders the red sea
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V3(P2) - New Gameplay

Postby whitestazn88 on Sun Aug 17, 2008 1:46 am

wow... completely different, but very good. i like what you did a lot with the continents
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V3(P2) - New Gameplay

Postby Qwert on Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:47 am

Blitzaholic wrote:
...yes qwert, I like this, wish it was a little bigger, but nice

Thanks i will fix that :lol:
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V3(P2) - New Gameplay

Postby foregone on Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:50 am

I'm considerably more fond of the version 3 shape of the map thingy. The dome feels much nicer than the oblongy shape.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - new stuff

Postby cairnswk on Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:44 pm

edbeard wrote:new gameplay makes this a much better map (at a glance anyway). I'll talk gameplay later but after a while of producing maps that don't do it for me personally, this one does.

You mean i get a star for this one? ;)


The Good:
1. The shape of the playable part of the map itself is nice.
2. The unique colours: we don't usually see these on maps. At least not these tones.

Good i guess.

The Bad:
1. I know it's the small map and the space is a slight problem but some of these names are too close or confusing. I'm not talking territory names for the most part (though a few need slight moving as you probably know) but your neutral areas (Arabia and Abyssina are too close to playable parts of the map). The port names seem like double trouble to me. Is it called this or that? It's nice for the historical aspect but maybe they can be put in a different font or something to distinguish them.

neutral names moved and faded
port names removed

2. Legend fonts and format. The title just doesn't seem to go with the rest of the map. I think it's the font. The bottom notes are two points but the format combines them. Ports and neutral starts don't mix.

I like the title font, so i think unless others complain i'll keep it.
the port and neutral mix unmixed.

3. some of your borders have weird things going on in them (you probably know). Kenia-antep to angora. I thought I saw more but I can't find them at this moment and maybe they just don't exist.

yes still having issues with borders, i might put an overlay of black borders over the top later.

The Ugly:
1. The continent names in the legend are horribly illegible. I think the silver is the problem. The bright/light colours also probably hinder it but try putting a stroke round the names and/or a shadow to add contrast so the light colours don't mix with the bright background.

those should be fixed

2. you continent colours and/or how you've put them on the map make it hard for me to tell what continent is which in some spots. Well this is really continuing on the last point. But, the other problem is while two territories belong to the same continent, the way the colour is spread in each one differs and gives a weird affect. This is most prominent in the southern west Ottoman continent (Syria?). The colours in british egypt and anglo-egyptian sudan (spelled eyptian on the map - error or just how they spelled it there?) seem a shade different to me. Look at the line that borders the neutral abyssina and the line (in british egypt) that borders the red sea

i've changed some on the colours around, but finally just waiting for oaktown to visit. ;)

Version 4
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby MrBenn on Sun Aug 17, 2008 5:07 pm

It looks like another well-thought-out and attractive map..
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby cairnswk on Sun Aug 17, 2008 5:10 pm

MrBenn wrote:It looks like another well-thought-out and attractive map..

I would hope so. Thanks MrBenn :)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby Juan_Bottom on Mon Aug 18, 2008 7:38 am

Ok... allow me to break the chain of lovin'.

Not a fan.
I mostly enjoy classic, and super strategy maps, and as for this particular map it doesn't fit into either catagory.

I hate the French, and Italian bonuses. You have two +1s right on top of each other. So If a player captures them both, they have a +2, for holding two territories. Plus, these two +1s are isolated, so they are harder to break. And another one... not a fan of that H. of Mecca bonus either...
Personally, I never liked those maps with a +1 for holding one spot. But this map takes it a bit farther...

Now, your newest version is a terrific visual improvement over the original though. Strange though, cause they look so similer....lol

I guess my quibble is that unlike e'ryone else, I hate the bonuses.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby cairnswk on Mon Aug 18, 2008 8:05 am

Juan_Bottom wrote:Ok...
I guess my quibble is that unlike e'ryone else, I hate the bonuses.

Well i guess they can be worked on, there might be other options available there. :) but i wouldn't want to upset the balance of history...iykwim
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby Juan_Bottom on Mon Aug 18, 2008 8:31 am

cairnswk wrote:
Juan_Bottom wrote:Ok...
I guess my quibble is that unlike e'ryone else, I hate the bonuses.

Well i guess they can be worked on, there might be other options available there. :) but i wouldn't want to upset the balance of history...iykwim



I have a feeling that when I teach my children about history someday... Hitler will be riding a T-Rex, and Stalin will shoot lazers from his belly button. Churchill will be normal though.. he was already magical to begin with...
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby cairnswk on Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:00 am

Juan_Bottom wrote:...Churchill will be normal though.. he was already magical to begin with...

What do ya mean? He will be shooting cigar bullets from his mouth and bombarding the ruins of the empire.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby Cdkutusu on Mon Aug 18, 2008 2:09 pm

Hey! Map looks really nice, and I'd surely play this one very often, but the names there needs some fixing :) I'm a Turkish, so can help you with them :)

First of all, its Istanbul since 1453 :) No more Constantinople :) We buried that name next to Byzantine )
Brusa - I think you meant Bursa
Trabizon - Trabzon
Angora - Ankara?
Erzerum - Erzurum
Diyrkablr - Diyarbakir
Kenia-Antep = Konya, Antep
Smyrna - Izmir
Gallipoli (its ok actually, cause this is the English version but if you wanna put Turkish version) - Gelibolu
Andrianople - Can't understand what you wanted to say there :)


My point here is, if you wanna put 1914 Ottoman Empire status, you shouldn't use Latin versions (or Greek), you ought to use Turkish ones.

By the way, in 1914 Kars was in the hands of Ottoman Empire, we lost it later (then took it back) :) Just to let you know


Other than that, you can arrange the continent colors with bigger difference... Can't find the exact word, but right now they look alike, would be better if you use different colors in Anatolia at least..

And one question, Vilayet's give bigger bonuses or what? If not, I think you can remove the sign V?

Thats all I can say, I must say it looks very good and I would be happy to play it :)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby cairnswk on Mon Aug 18, 2008 2:19 pm

Cdkutusu wrote:Hey! Map looks really nice, and I'd surely play this one very often, but the names there needs some fixing :) I'm a Turkish, so can help you with them :)

First of all, its Istanbul since 1453 :) No more Constantinople :) We buried that name next to Byzantine )
Brusa - I think you meant Bursa
Trabizon - Trabzon
Angora - Ankara?
Erzerum - Erzurum
Diyrkablr - Diyarbakir
Kenia-Antep = Konya, Antep
Smyrna - Izmir
Gallipoli (its ok actually, cause this is the English version but if you wanna put Turkish version) - Gelibolu
Andrianople - Can't understand what you wanted to say there :)

My point here is, if you wanna put 1914 Ottoman Empire status, you shouldn't use Latin versions (or Greek), you ought to use Turkish ones.

By the way, in 1914 Kars was in the hands of Ottoman Empire, we lost it later (then took it back) :) Just to let you know


Thanks greatly Cdkutusu :)
Please realize that the reference maps i used...there were several versions of some names and Kars was shown in most of them as being in Russian hands -> it also makes for good gameplay to have it this way.
I will adjust the map to include the Turkish names, but should i use Turkey or Anatolia.

Other than that, you can arrange the continent colors with bigger difference... Can't find the exact word, but right now they look alike, would be better if you use different colors in Anatolia at least..

Yes expect the colours to undergo a change in some way, i am just waiting on oaktown to visit to give his color-blind slant on these before making the changes.

And one question, Vilayet's give bigger bonuses or what? If not, I think you can remove the sign V?
i had said in previous comments that the Vilayet statement would probably be removed, but i could leave it there with your suggestion.

Thats all I can say, I must say it looks very good and I would be happy to play it :)
Thanks again. :)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby Qwert on Mon Aug 18, 2008 4:53 pm

i must say that Name Constantinople is correct,and that these whas capital of Ottoman empire from 1453-1922.

It was officially renamed to its modern Turkish name Istanbul in 1930[
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby cairnswk on Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:14 pm

qwert wrote:i must say that Name Constantinople is correct,and that these whas capital of Ottoman empire from 1453-1922.

It was officially renamed to its modern Turkish name Istanbul in 1930[


Yes that's the story i get also qwert. :)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby edbeard on Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:29 pm

for the most part, everything is better.

I think you know some borders are still weird. armenia mostly.


the colours still are a problem for me. not the actual colours themselves but how you've spread them in the territories. If you compare Gallipoli and Andrianople, you'll see the contrast I'm talking about. this occurs throughout the map and I don't think it looks good.

another problem is that armenia on the legend on the map don't appear to have the same colour. I think the problem I talked about above contributes to this.



gameplay:

syria is worth more than +3. 5 territories and each are a border territory. it touches 5 continents and is attackable from 7 territories. +5 is probably more apt.

I might consider giving hussein of mecca +1 instead of +2
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby whitestazn88 on Mon Aug 18, 2008 7:12 pm

i really like the color changes in the legend, and like i said earlier, like the bonus changes. keep up the good work
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby Cdkutusu on Tue Aug 19, 2008 1:33 am

cairnswk wrote:

Thanks greatly Cdkutusu :)
Please realize that the reference maps i used...there were several versions of some names and Kars was shown in most of them as being in Russian hands -> it also makes for good gameplay to have it this way.
I will adjust the map to include the Turkish names, but should i use Turkey or Anatolia.


In Turkish, Turkey (Turkiye) is the whole country, European side and Asian side together, Anatolia (Anadolu) is the Peninsula only. So in this version it looks correct, since you use it for the Asian side only

Yes expect the colours to undergo a change in some way, i am just waiting on oaktown to visit to give his color-blind slant on these before making the changes.


That would be good :)

i had said in previous comments that the Vilayet statement would probably be removed, but i could leave it there with your suggestion.


I guess you can remove them, since they don't mean anything significant (almost every location you put had Vilayet status back in time :) ) and it would just complicate the map :)


Thanks again. :)

Not at all :)

Oh and about Constantinople, it was not used inside Ottoman Empire. We were calling it Istanbul as far as I remember. :)

Keep up the good work :)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby gimil on Tue Aug 19, 2008 5:19 pm

[adv. idea]

lovely looking map cairns :)
What do you know about map making, bitch?

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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - new stuff

Postby cairnswk on Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:01 pm

gimil wrote:[adv. idea]

lovely looking map cairns :)

Thanks Gimil :)

Current Version 4
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby foregone on Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:16 pm

May just be me but the seas are kinda looking like territories at the moment. They seem raised and the colour/texture/something gives it a feel of conquerability rather than water.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby Juan_Bottom on Wed Aug 20, 2008 4:19 pm

Think they should be dark?
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby cairnswk on Thu Aug 21, 2008 6:32 am

foregone wrote:May just be me but the seas are kinda looking like territories at the moment. They seem raised and the colour/texture/something gives it a feel of conquerability rather than water.


Juan_Bottom wrote:Think they should be dark?



Version 5 Changes.
1. Sea made darker as per request above.
2. V. removed as is Vilayet.
3. Borders asjusted
4. Some territory colours adjusted

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