WWI Ottoman Empire [Quenched]

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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V5(P4) - Colour Changes

Postby Cdkutusu on Fri Aug 22, 2008 2:56 am

Things look better now, but maybe you should move Beirut a little right, now it looks like its a territory in Cyprus :)

And Kenia (Konya) is still left out ))

Keep up the good work :)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V4(P3) - New Stuff

Postby cairnswk on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:24 am

Current version 5
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V5(P4) - Colour Changes

Postby Juan_Bottom on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:29 am

Incandenza wrote:
whitestazn88 wrote:seas look good. but i was wondering... why are italy and france neutral starts, but ottoman europe isnt?


'cause the former are 1-terit continents, whereas the latter is a 2-terit continent.


What if Italy and France together counted as a +1?
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V5(P4) - Colour Changes

Postby cairnswk on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:38 am

Juan_Bottom wrote:
Incandenza wrote:
whitestazn88 wrote:seas look good. but i was wondering... why are italy and france neutral starts, but ottoman europe isnt?


'cause the former are 1-terit continents, whereas the latter is a 2-terit continent.


What if Italy and France together counted as a +1?


That could be a possibility...i'll have a think about that because ottoman europe is also a challenge with those two terts over there.

one of those terts: Gallipoli or Adrianople should start neutral also.

to get around that, we could have o.europe a a bonus if it is held in conjunction with Constantinople.
That would give them something to fight for and alleviate the two terts issue, although there is still a probability that someone will get an easy drop there and hold that after one attack.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V5(P4) - Colour Changes

Postby Juan_Bottom on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:42 am

Adding a port there(was there one? a makshift one?) might also take care of the problem. But I would prefer to keep the map as accurate historically as you can...
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V5(P4) - Colour Changes

Postby Cdkutusu on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:44 am

maybe if you add a path to attack from egypt to Gelibolu, it would make sense. In that case if somebody takes over those 2 and moves inside anadolu he must leave some armies to guard Gelibolu too (there was a huge battle there back in time)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V5(P4) - Colour Changes

Postby Cdkutusu on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:45 am

Juan_Bottom wrote:Adding a port there(was there one? a makshift one?) might also take care of the problem. But I would prefer to keep the map as accurate historically as you can...


In Gelibolu? Maybe, not sure though... But there was a huge battle there, Allies tried to push through the Straits towards Black See.

So that would be accurate
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V5(P4) - Colour Changes

Postby Juan_Bottom on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:48 am

Cdkutusu wrote:
Juan_Bottom wrote:Adding a port there(was there one? a makshift one?) might also take care of the problem. But I would prefer to keep the map as accurate historically as you can...


In Gelibolu? Maybe, not sure though... But there was a huge battle there, Allies tried to push through the Straits towards Black See.

So that would be accurate

No on the Italian-French border. Each of those are worth +1, and start nuetral. But with a port, or by combining them into a single "continent" for a +1 you would have to start them as nuetral.

I'd bet Gelibolu turns into a huge battle as is....
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V5(P4) - Colour Changes

Postby Cdkutusu on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:54 am

I'd suggest connecting them into one as well, otherwise it can be unfair for those who gets a lucky drop
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6 - Gallipoli added

Postby cairnswk on Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:11 am

Juan_Bottom wrote:
Cdkutusu wrote:
Juan_Bottom wrote:Adding a port there(was there one? a makshift one?) might also take care of the problem. But I would prefer to keep the map as accurate historically as you can...


In Gelibolu? Maybe, not sure though... But there was a huge battle there, Allies tried to push through the Straits towards Black See.

So that would be accurate

No on the Italian-French border. Each of those are worth +1, and start nuetral. But with a port, or by combining them into a single "continent" for a +1 you would have to start them as nuetral.

I'd bet Gelibolu turns into a huge battle as is....


I'm reading everything guys.....i was thinking of having the british being able to attack in Gelibolu from Egypt....this would replicate the Gallipoli Campaign that the Allies lost in 1915, but i'm not sure if the attack was launched from Egypt or somewhere else.

Version 6...the Gallipoli Campaign added as a one-way attack.

Image


OK, just did a search and there is a link here
http://www.nashos.org.au/21_hist_II.htm
that states the embarkation point for this battalion was Alexandria...so that would fit in perfectly. I'll have to add a port to alexAndria, and hope the hell that it doesn't confuse everyone.

That might also alleviate the need to have neutrals in O. Europe.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby Juan_Bottom on Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:21 am

I like it and don't want it gone... but!..
Doesn't it give an overwhelming advantage to anyone who can take and hold the south of the map?
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby cairnswk on Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:26 am

Juan_Bottom wrote:I like it and don't want it gone... but!..
Doesn't it give an overwhelming advantage to anyone who can take and hold the south of the map?

yes, you're probably correct...so what about if i had a one wya attack from Bursa also to Gelibolu....that would allow that area to be fortified by someonw looking top hold the turkish side.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby Juan_Bottom on Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:29 am

I will say, maybe...

With all the smaller and eaiser to hold bonuses to the south, that one way looks deadly. If someone gets stuck trying to capture the North, that little +1 is going to be their only bonus. But someone in the South with a +3 should be able to take it pretty easily.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby cairnswk on Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:34 am

cairnswk wrote:
Juan_Bottom wrote:I like it and don't want it gone... but!..
Doesn't it give an overwhelming advantage to anyone who can take and hold the south of the map?

yes, you're probably correct...so what about if i had a one wya attack from Bursa also to Gelibolu....that would allow that area to be fortified by someonw looking top hold the turkish side.

and it would replicate the gollipoli campaign admirably....

Juan_Bottom wrote:I will say, maybe...

With all the smaller and eaiser to hold bonuses to the south, that one way looks deadly. If someone gets stuck trying to capture the North, that little +1 is going to be their only bonus. But someone in the South with a +3 should be able to take it pretty easily.


but even though Gallipoli was unsuccessful historically, what might have been the outcome if the turks didn't have the reinforcement and mines in the dardenelles to stop the allies getting through to the black sea.

i think the one-way from bursa would be good. :)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby yeti_c on Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:39 am

Click image to enlarge.
image


OK first time viewing this one. (apologies if I've repeated anything)...

Points I can see upon first look.
a) "Italy& France start neutral" Consider renaming to "French & Italian territories start neutral" (feel free to swap "Territorry" with zone or whatever)
b) "Andrianople" -> "Adrianople" (Haven't looked at any other spellings) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrianople
c) Eqypt appears to have 2 ports?
d) Consider adding width so that the sea can connect Kuwait visually.
e) Bursa <-> Gelipolu border is tricky to see (Is it actually a border or some sea?)
f) (N) - I would remove - or replace with (Neutral) as you have the space for it.
g) Perhaps make Suez Canal wider by 1px? (as to show transport down it)
h) Love the sea texture.
i) Consider I (captial i) instead of 1 in the WW1 title. (Or "The Great War")

Once again a great looking map Cairns...

C.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby Cdkutusu on Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:47 am

Now it looks better, I agree. But one more point, maybe you can add a special bonus for Ottoman zones, if player has both Europe Ottomans and Anatolian, +1 more? Or maybe Ottoman Europe can be +2, now it doesn't make so much sense to try holding it while there are easier targets in south.


By the way, there are 2 ports in Egypt, and Konya is still mistaken :)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby cairnswk on Fri Aug 22, 2008 8:01 am

yeti_c wrote:OK first time viewing this one. (apologies if I've repeated anything)...
Points I can see upon first look.
a) "Italy& France start neutral" Consider renaming to "French & Italian territories start neutral" (feel free to swap "Territorry" with zone or whatever)

Done
b) "Andrianople" -> "Adrianople" (Haven't looked at any other spellings) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrianople
Changed to Anadolu - Turkish as suggested by Cdkutusu
c) Eqypt appears to have 2 ports?

Yes - right is Port Said on Suez, although i think i have wrong side, and the other is Alexandria
d) Consider adding width so that the sea can connect Kuwait visually.
I'll leave that for now
e) Bursa <-> Gelipolu border is tricky to see (Is it actually a border or some sea?)
yes...might have to do something like an inset window to handle that area for Gallipoli
f) (N) - I would remove - or replace with (Neutral) as you have the space for it.
Done
g) Perhaps make Suez Canal wider by 1px? (as to show transport down it)
Done
h) Love the sea texture.
Good
i) Consider I (captial i) instead of 1 in the WW1 title. (Or "The Great War")
Done
Once again a great looking map Cairns...
C.
Thanks C.

Version 7 below from changes above.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby cairnswk on Fri Aug 22, 2008 8:04 am

Cdkutusu wrote:Now it looks better, I agree. But one more point, maybe you can add a special bonus for Ottoman zones, if player has both Europe Ottomans and Anatolian, +1 more? Or maybe Ottoman Europe can be +2, now it doesn't make so much sense to try holding it while there are easier targets in south.

By the way, there are 2 ports in Egypt, and Konya is still mistaken :)

Konya is fixed above. :)
I will consider the bonuses....i think O Europe can be +2. yes?
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby yeti_c on Fri Aug 22, 2008 8:11 am

cairnswk wrote:
yeti_c wrote:a) "Italy& France start neutral" Consider renaming to "French & Italian territories start neutral" (feel free to swap "Territorry" with zone or whatever)

Done


You need to change "Italy" -> "Italian" & "France" -> "French" for it to make sense now though.

cairnswk wrote:
yeti_c wrote:c) Eqypt appears to have 2 ports?


Yes - right is Port Said on Suez, although i think i have wrong side, and the other is Alexandria


Probably be less confusing if you remove the * from the 1 way to Bursa then?

Otherwise - good job - also - Gelibolu & Bursa looks a bit better already - did you lighten it slightly? (Ar am I seeing somethnig!)

C.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby MrBenn on Fri Aug 22, 2008 8:13 am

yeti_c wrote:
cairnswk wrote:
yeti_c wrote:a) "Italy& France start neutral" Consider renaming to "French & Italian territories start neutral" (feel free to swap "Territorry" with zone or whatever)

Done


You need to change "Italy" -> "Italian" & "France" -> "French" for it to make sense now though.

C.

Do you even need to put that on the legend? By the time the game starts, people are going to nitoce the neutrals ;-)
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby yeti_c on Fri Aug 22, 2008 8:15 am

MrBenn wrote:
yeti_c wrote:
cairnswk wrote:
yeti_c wrote:a) "Italy& France start neutral" Consider renaming to "French & Italian territories start neutral" (feel free to swap "Territorry" with zone or whatever)

Done


You need to change "Italy" -> "Italian" & "France" -> "French" for it to make sense now though.

C.

Do you even need to put that on the legend? By the time the game starts, people are going to nitoce the neutrals ;-)


Also a valid point - but Cairns likes that info to be available on the map - and not in the thread. (And if he can fit it in - then that's all fine by me!)

C.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby Cdkutusu on Fri Aug 22, 2008 8:18 am

Found the best version for old Adrianople (now Anadolu) - its Trakya, what we call to European part of Modern day Turkey.

One more thing, I guess you can add a separate territory for Alexandria, and add a bonus for Alexandria and Gelibolu together? Meaning that Gelibolu battle have been won and allies can drop reinforcements, or Ottoman empire held the attack and use reinforcements from there? +1 would look good, I guess

Maybe french can be connected to Sudan somehow, that way it will be more vulnerable to attacks, so it can balance the gameplay?
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby AndyDufresne on Fri Aug 22, 2008 2:40 pm

I'm liking the graphics to this map, Cairnswk...the graphics hook me in better than some of your recent maps (I don't mean that as insult!).

The port icons look a little out of place, for the era and graphic feel of the map...though I suppose it could be considered similar to the star on the Empire's flag.

I'd also consider lightening the background a little more behind the Historic Text in the legend, to make it slightly easier to read.

Additionally, I'm not sure I like the graphic effect of the horizontal line and color variation in the legend. What would it look like altered? Actually, I'm not sure about the whole legend, but it might just be the current colors.

Are you going to name this map, WW1: Ottoman Empire ?


--Andy
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby ZeakCytho on Fri Aug 22, 2008 5:40 pm

Am I the only one who has trouble telling some of the continents apart? I'd prefer some more contrasting colors, if possible. The worst area is the junction of O. Armenia, O. Mesopotamia, and Russia.
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Re: WW1 1914 - THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE V6(P5) - Gallipoli added

Postby cairnswk on Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:04 pm

yeti_c wrote:...
d) Consider adding width so that the sea can connect Kuwait visually...
C.

C, I checked the map size and adding the right side of the Arabian Peninsula would place the map outside the current restrictions. So to answer, I think this will have to remain as is. I don't want to scale down the tert sizes any less which is what would happen if i squeezed the map inwards. :)

yeti_c wrote:You need to change "Italy" -> "Italian" & "France" -> "French" for it to make sense now though.

Done
Probably be less confusing if you remove the * from the 1 way to Bursa then?
Otherwise - good job - also - Gelibolu & Bursa looks a bit better already - did you lighten it slightly? (Ar am I seeing somethnig!)
C.

Port Said * gone - Until i think about creating Alexandria as seperate tert.
The Dardenelles, no i just widened the Straights. :)

MrBenn wrote:Do you even need to put that on the legend? By the time the game starts, people are going to nitoce the neutrals ;-)

Well, i like it on the map while it is in development...so i don't have to answer the same silly bloody question all the time about who is starting starting neutral. It also reminds me when i program the xml about who starts neutral, and it can come off before the map goes live. So for now it is needed ;)

Cdkutusu wrote:Found the best version for old Adrianople (now Anadolu) - its Trakya, what we call to European part of Modern day Turkey.

Can we stick with Anadolu?

One more thing, I guess you can add a separate territory for Alexandria, and add a bonus for Alexandria and Gelibolu together? Meaning that Gelibolu battle have been won and allies can drop reinforcements, or Ottoman empire held the attack and use reinforcements from there? +1 would look good, I guess

Oh, OK i get what you mean, that's probably a good idea to have Alexandria as a seperate tert.

Maybe french can be connected to Sudan somehow, that way it will be more vulnerable to attacks, so it can balance the gameplay?[/quote]
Mmmmm, let me think on that one please.

AndyDufresne wrote:I'm liking the graphics to this map, Cairnswk...the graphics hook me in better than some of your recent maps (I don't mean that as insult!).[/quote[
No offence taken, but i don't understand why you even have to go there :roll:

The port icons look a little out of place, for the era and graphic feel of the map...though I suppose it could be considered similar to the star on the Empire's flag.

They can be worked on.

I'd also consider lightening the background a little more behind the Historic Text in the legend, to make it slightly easier to read.
Done, and moved next version.

Additionally, I'm not sure I like the graphic effect of the horizontal line and color variation in the legend. What would it look like altered? Actually, I'm not sure about the whole legend, but it might just be the current colors.

I think the whole legend is going in for rework so hold on there....

Are you going to name this map, WW1: Ottoman Empire ?
--Andy

Yes, that would good for the game finder/starter screen also. Thanks Andy for dropping in. :)

ZeakCytho wrote:Am I the only one who has trouble telling some of the continents apart? I'd prefer some more contrasting colors, if possible. The worst area is the junction of O. Armenia, O. Mesopotamia, and Russia.

Probably, until oaktown arrives and changes everything anyway, so once again....hold one and watch this space :)
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