Castle Lands [Quenched]

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Re: Castle Lands (updated 01-08:version 5.2 with new names pg 4)

Postby MrBenn on Sat Jan 10, 2009 4:05 pm

I like the look and feel of the map, but there are several things that still need a bit of work - the territory borders seem a bit too big and bright, while the background texture brings too much attention to itself.

My biggest concern at the moment is gameplay.... I'm not sure there's been a lot of discussion about how things will turn out during a game? Part of me thinks that the castle bonuses are a bit too high, and I'm not entirely sure how the attack routes work - particularly in the Castle and the Bridges.

Anyway, despite my concerns, this map is beginning to feel like it's coming to life...

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Re: Castle Lands (updated 01-08:version 5.2 with new names pg 4)

Postby pikkio on Sat Jan 10, 2009 8:12 pm

wow!!! :D
you cant understand how i'm happy!!! =D>

so, i corrected the name of the West Bridge, and i made smaller the territory borders (now it looking really better! thanx!).

the gameplay it's only an example at this time, and i need your help to fix it. please suggest!! :)

relased version 5.3

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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-11: v. 5.3 pg 5 - Advanced Draft)

Postby EagleofGreenErth on Sun Jan 11, 2009 4:01 am

Thats a beautiful map. :D

I'm so happy it is moving along! Congrats!
But yes, the gameplay in the center is confusing right now.... what can attack the towers? What can attack the castle? What can the castle attack?
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-11: v. 5.3 pg 5 - Advanced Draft)

Postby pikkio on Sun Jan 11, 2009 8:29 am

the castle can attack the towers and all the courts.
the towers can attack the castle and 2 courts heac (for example, mountain tower can attack bishop e vicair), and can bombard the territories on its quadrant adjacent the fosse (mountain tower can bombard Precipice, Ridge and Peak)
the catapults can bombard the tower in its quadrant, but someone has suggest they maybe can bombard something else (like the opposite catapult, or the left and right catapults).

i thought that the gameplay become more similar to an assault at the castle if it has a more interesting bonus. at this moment i don't know how it's better to do this, and if it's a good idea.. maybe it can give 1 or 2 army a round to the owner, but deployed directly in the castle and not in the army deploy at the start of the turn...
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-11: v. 5.3 pg 5 - Advanced Draft)

Postby EagleofGreenErth on Sun Jan 11, 2009 4:43 pm

Ok thats what I thought.... but the castle has like 12 spots that can attack it? o_O
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-11: v. 5.3 pg 5 - Advanced Draft)

Postby The Neon Peon on Sun Jan 11, 2009 7:39 pm

The graphics are improving, but they need to flow from one region to another. Right now, the mountains/forest/plains come to an abrupt end when they hit each other. You need to transition from one region to another.

the map itself is way too symetrical. The territories are fine, but I would suggest adding a bend in the river or something. Make it seem more natural, and less drawn. Same with the bonuses. They don't have to extend in almost a straight line. Add a territory to one and subtract one from another.

This will make the map more visually appealing.
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-11: v. 5.3 pg 5 - Advanced Draft)

Postby sailorseal on Wed Jan 14, 2009 9:50 pm

I like the idea of catapults
Could you make some sort of drawbridge kind of thing where each drawbridge can only be used once every other turn or does the current xml not support that?
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-11: v. 5.3 pg 5 - Advanced Draft)

Postby LED ZEPPELINER on Wed Jan 14, 2009 9:52 pm

sailorseal wrote:I like the idea of catapults
Could you make some sort of drawbridge kind of thing where each drawbridge can only be used once every other turn or does the current xml not support that?

maybe try reading the xml guide bye yeti c
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BRIDGES & SOME SUGGESTIONS

Postby thenobodies80 on Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:37 am

LED ZEPPELINER wrote:
sailorseal wrote:I like the idea of catapults
Could you make some sort of drawbridge kind of thing where each drawbridge can only be used once every other turn or does the current xml not support that?

maybe try reading the xml guide bye yeti c


thank you led zeppeliner...
I'll develope the xml for this map, sailorseal , and i think that now isn't possible to do that. :|


For pikkio:
Now bridge are territories, but not continets.
You decided to put them on the line with a +1 for bridge owned...
I think it's better to do something similar to that:
  • 1 bridge = +1
  • 2 bridges = +3
  • 3 bridges = + 4
  • 4 bridges = + 6
obviously i did only an example...but i think it's a good thing to involve players to take and keep bridges, because bridges are a focusing point of your map...If you have the tower, castle or courts you need to prevent that some try to attack you from two lines ( catapultes and bridges) and if you are try to take courts or castle, or tower, you can try to pass the bridges to take castle...
I think that castle, for position, is the center of this map and this bonus can make game more funny and players will be involved to try to take it!
What do you think?

Another last little suggestion,
i think that is more immediately to see the fosses drawn on the working legend than to write down that fosses are impassable borders, you can do that like this:

http://www.conquerclub.com/maps/BeNeLux.S.jpg

all the impassable borders are drawn on legend.

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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-11: v. 5.3 pg 5 - Advanced Draft)

Postby pikkio on Thu Jan 15, 2009 2:37 pm

i made a substantial change on gameplay.

i put some walls around the castle that are impassable borders and protect it from the courts. in this mode, the only way to conquer the castle is by attacking from the towers.

i also lowered the power of the towers and reduce theirs bombard range only to the territory with catapult (in the same quadrant).

then i recalculated the bonuses, and give at the bridges more importance like the suggest of thenobodies (thanx to him for the idea of the walls, too).

now relase the version 6. tell me what do you think!

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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-15: change on gameplay pg.5)

Postby thenobodies80 on Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:45 am

perfect Pikkio,
i think you are going on the right way now!
I think map is better now.
i will check all bonuses, because bonuses i've made are on the 5.3 map.
You have to show to community the bonuses formula...read here
oaktown wrote:Reasonable bonus structure. Bonuses should make sense given the size/style of the map, and be based on a consistent formula.
.
Anyways, i will send to you the new bonuses if something change in my opinion.

For me is ok the V6 map.

Good work =D>

Ps. I think you have to cut the older V.4 on the first post, left it in the first post as a link but remove the bigimg, because now the first post it's a little too "bigimged" :lol:

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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-15: change on gameplay pg.5)

Postby EagleofGreenErth on Fri Jan 16, 2009 7:19 pm

Looks GREAT! Castle walls may be a bit hard for some to see but yeah. Lets get the bonuses down first!
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-15: change on gameplay pg.5)

Postby LED ZEPPELINER on Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:07 am

are there any certain starting positions
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-15: change on gameplay pg.5)

Postby pikkio on Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:16 am

LED ZEPPELINER wrote:are there any certain starting positions


at this moment no, but it can be an idea.. what do you think in particular?
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-15: change on gameplay pg.5)

Postby LED ZEPPELINER on Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:03 am

I was thinking that you started on the outside, and the couryards and castle and towers and bridges were all neutral, but i don't know whether that would take a way from the gameplay, but with 8 players in 4 regions, it could probably be devided evenly
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-15: change on gameplay pg.5)

Postby thenobodies80 on Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:33 pm

LED ZEPPELINER wrote:I was thinking that you started on the outside, and the couryards and castle and towers and bridges were all neutral, but i don't know whether that would take a way from the gameplay, but with 8 players in 4 regions, it could probably be devided evenly


we will discuss about, we're chosing starting position because gameplay is stricly correlated with starting position....
We post some about in future...
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Fix bonus legend...

Postby thenobodies80 on Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:00 pm

Pikkio you erronely wrote that towers can bombard castle, but really towers are adjacent with castle so towers can conquer it not only bombard.
In this way,nobody can conquer it!
Infact tower are the only passege to castle because walls are impassable borders.
:)

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Re: Fix bonus legend...

Postby pikkio on Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:58 pm

thenobodies80 wrote:Pikkio you erronely wrote that towers can bombard castle, but really towers are adjacent with castle so towers can conquer it not only bombard.
In this way,nobody can conquer it!
Infact tower are the only passege to castle because walls are impassable borders.
:)


uoooppss! you're right! i must stop to work on the map when i was tired.. :P
i mean that the catapults can attack the castle. i will correct it! ;)
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Re: Castle Lands (update 01-15: change on gameplay pg.5)

Postby pikkio on Sun Jan 18, 2009 7:10 pm

relased version 6.1 with fixed bonuses and new graphic for the bonus caption.
i also changed the walls graphics, to make they more easy to see.
and i try to make more "natural" the border between the desert and the mountains.
tell me what do you think! ^_^

version 6.1
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Re: [Ad. Draft] Castle Lands (update 01-19: fixed bonuses pg.6)

Postby MrBenn on Mon Jan 19, 2009 7:31 pm

The map feels like it's coming to life, and it's good to see some serious thought going into gameplay.

I'm still not sold on the cropfield, grass and forest textures, but I think you're ready for the next stage ;-)

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Re: [Draft] Castle Lands (update 01-19: fixed bonuses pg.6)

Postby pikkio on Mon Jan 19, 2009 8:42 pm

thanx a lot! ^_^

i try to do my best. thanx to all for the great suggests and to had trust in me. :D
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Re: Castle Lands [D] (update 01-19: fixed bonuses pg.6)

Postby AndyDufresne on Tue Jan 20, 2009 3:07 pm

Ahoy pikkio, nice to see you here. :)

I'm liking the general feel you have going for the map. It's developing into something of its own, and as MrBenn noted, seemingly coming to life.

And speaking of life, the addition of some...maybe tiny animals, maybe tiny peasants/soldiers, might add that vibrant life touch to the map, if that is a route you are interested in pursuing.

Title and gameboard bordering feel appropriate, but some of the textures on the gameboard itself feel a little too intense...more so the Fields and Mountains than the other quadrant regions.

A stylistic thing to consider, eliminating the perfect circular moat, making it more of island rather than a cookie cutout. But this isn't much of an issue.

The catapult icons and desert grasses are alright, I'm not completely sold on them, but I'm sure you'll be tweaking for a while, so not much worry there.

Maybe consider adding some "Height" to the towers, perhaps through more contrast between lighter and darker tones.

I haven't looked into the game play, so I'll save those comments for later.

Good luck!


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Re: Castle Lands [D] (update 01-19: fixed bonuses pg.6)

Postby pikkio on Tue Jan 20, 2009 8:31 pm

thanx a lot! in the next days i will work on your suggestion! :D
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Re: Castle Lands [D] (update 01-19: fixed bonuses pg.6)

Postby gimil on Wed Jan 21, 2009 8:11 am

Hi Pikkio,

Just wanted to ask you a small question before I begin giving your map feedback. How realistic a look are you going for? If you are going for a proper terra forming look?
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Re: Castle Lands [D] (update 01-19: fixed bonuses pg.6)

Postby pikkio on Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:49 am

gimil wrote:Hi Pikkio,

Just wanted to ask you a small question before I begin giving your map feedback. How realistic a look are you going for? If you are going for a proper terra forming look?


well, first i don't want to make a map looking realistic, but when someone suggest me to completely change the textures, the first idea (the ONLY idea, i mean..) it's to make something more realistic..

now i really don't know if it's possible to keep this map on the edge of realistic and cartographic style, but i'm not sure that i'm able to make it totally (and well done) realistic. for a realistic map, probably i may make the castle and the bridges in prospective (false 3D), for example..
but my biggest problem now it's that i don't know how i should change the textures.. i looked for adeguate textures around the internet, but i didn't find anything better.. any suggest??

anyway, my dubt is that this map with a totally realistic style will be too similar at the Siege map.. :?
Last edited by pikkio on Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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