Peloponnesian War [Done]

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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby The Voice on Thu May 20, 2010 6:20 pm

But they do have the right to bring it out of beta unchanged, correct? I want this map to stay, along with everyone else. So why don't we just be honest with ourselves, assume qwert won't change his mind, and bring the darn thing out of beta?
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby natty dread on Fri May 21, 2010 3:14 am

why don't we just be honest with ourselves, assume qwert won't change his mind, and bring the darn thing out of beta?


If I had to guess, I'd say it's because the admin fears it will be a dangerous precedent. Then every mapmaker will think "well, if I don't get my way, I'll just leave the map hanging in beta and they'll have to accept it eventually"...
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Re: [Beta]

Postby tonbomorphew on Wed May 26, 2010 5:01 pm

I found a bug i don't get 2 troops xtra in my active Peloponnesian War game!
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Re: [Beta]

Postby fumandomuerte on Thu May 27, 2010 5:40 pm

tonbomorphew wrote:I found a bug i don't get 2 troops xtra in my active Peloponnesian War game!

Mind posting the details?
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby tonbomorphew on Sat May 29, 2010 10:18 am

Game Type: Quadruples Initial Troops: Automatic Play Order: Sequential Spoils: No Spoils Reinforcements: Unlimited Fog of War: No
Team !:
r:nippersean 4.8 1 6 3
g:InnyaFacce 4.8 11 25 5
b:HippieBroker 4.8 2 5 3
y:L M S 4.8 1 1 3
Team 2:
p:chphe 3.6 0 0 0
c:thanatos11 4.4 2 7 3
o:mole70 4.8 3 7 3
s:tonbomorphew 4.2 6 10 4
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=6958383 :roll:
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby natty dread on Sat May 29, 2010 10:26 am

You need to hold 2 sword symbols to get the +2. You only hold one sword + one helmet, thus you only get +1.
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Bug report: Game 7118466

Postby nevetski on Sun Jun 13, 2010 7:01 am

Greetings,

I'm playing a beta game of this map, and it's pretty nice. (My classicist heart reels with joy!) I have discovered a bug--namely, the Phrygians do not appear to be granting me the +2 bonus that is indicated.

Thanks for the excellent map!
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby natty dread on Sun Jun 13, 2010 7:55 am

natty_dread wrote:You need to hold 2 sword symbols to get the +2. You only hold one sword + one helmet, thus you only get +1.
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby nevetski on Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:03 am

natty_dread wrote:
natty_dread wrote:You need to hold 2 sword symbols to get the +2. You only hold one sword + one helmet, thus you only get +1.

OK. You should clarify that on the legend; your notation is vague at best. Or just make it so that those territories grant the bonus without the jiggery?

In theory, it seems like a neat nuance. In actual gameplay it makes the bonus incidental rather than strategic, only helping to add further momentum to an already powerful side.
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby nevetski on Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:11 am

OK, scanning the thread I see that it's unlikely to be changed. Oh wellz :)
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby The Voice on Mon Jun 14, 2010 6:47 pm

This may sound harsh, but I think the admins are playing a grudge match with qwert. Nobody wins in that scenario. If CC gave us a smilie showing two thumbs pointed down, I would use it to express my frustration with how team CC has handled this mess. Idiots like Oaktown, gimil, and MrBenn have effectively ruined our chances of seeing this map sent out of BETA because they're too busy whining rather than clarifying to a person whose first language is clearly not English.

Other than feeling ashamed for yourselves, you three I singled out should also resign. You are of no help. As for now, this wonderful map has found much more life for lovers of adjacent forting. It is an exceptional map with fewer kinks than shit maps, like the ones being pumped out recently.

Politics have replaced commonsense for these three idiots who give us the semblance of democracy while truly imposing their own biased and fickle--yet collective--will.

Cheers,

V
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby philiplam on Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:41 am

Hi,

I'm playing game 7111710 right now, and appear to have captured all 8 shields. However, the game hasn't ended. What am I doing wrong?

Apologies if viewing it is difficult due to fog-of-war.

Thanks in advance, Philip
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby iancanton on Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:50 am

if u really do have all 8 shields and ur opponent fails to capture at least one of ur shields during his turn, then u will win immediately when u start ur next turn.

u're not the first player to be confused by the wording. it would certainly be clearer if the legend said capture and hold all 8 shields to win the war.
MrBenn wrote:In fact
1. Wording of the objective - "Capture and hold all 8 Shields to win the war"
this is the only thing that actually NEEDS to be done - and is the only thing that is preventing this coming out of Beta...


ian. :)
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby philiplam on Thu Jun 17, 2010 12:34 am

iancanton wrote:if u really do have all 8 shields and ur opponent fails to capture at least one of ur shields during his turn, then u will win immediately when u start ur next turn.

u're not the first player to be confused by the wording. it would certainly be clearer if the legend said capture and hold all 8 shields to win the war.
MrBenn wrote:In fact
1. Wording of the objective - "Capture and hold all 8 Shields to win the war"
this is the only thing that actually NEEDS to be done - and is the only thing that is preventing this coming out of Beta...


ian. :)


Thanks Ian!

Yes, the game was won as you described - had read the description and some postings on this thread, but didn't realise that the holding had to last till the next turn - had assumed holding the 8 shields by the end of the round would be enough.

Cheers again, Philip
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby the.killing.44 on Fri Jun 18, 2010 7:40 am

The Voice wrote:If CC gave us a smilie showing two thumbs pointed down, I would use it to express my frustration with how team CC has handled this mess.

CAN'T YOU SEE HOW SERIOUS THIS IS?!
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby Blitzaholic on Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:09 am

Qwert, this map is great, it really is. What exactly are some of the suggestions the blue men are asking you to change that you refuse? Perhaps we can compromise. Sorry, I have been out of the loop on this, but something has to give here, and my guess is the cartographers are not going to make an exception for you, if so, then they would have to for everyone. So, let me hear what you are challenged with here Qwert, and maybe I could offer some input so we could move forward possibly. Many on CC want this out of Beta, but, it sounds like you need to make a few little changes, so, what are they exactly?
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby oaktown on Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:17 am

The Voice wrote:Idiots like Oaktown, gimil, and MrBenn have effectively ruined our chances of seeing this map sent out of BETA because they're too busy whining rather than clarifying to a person whose first language is clearly not English...

Other than feeling ashamed for yourselves, you three I singled out should also resign.

Ha! Two of us already did resign, over a year ago! :lol:

For the record, I'd personally love to see this map pulled out of BETA. Just as I was thrilled to see that Das Schlos was finally re-released with gameplay fixes, I feel that this map remains a black mark on what I think was a generally productive run as a foundry moderator.

The conundrum that I faced at the time was this: do we stamp this map as is simply because time has passed, or do we hold this map to the same standards that we hold every other map on this site? CC's foundry process is an open one, which relies on community feedback and consensus to craft and perfect a map. Whether or not it's a good system, it's what we've got. When issues about a map's graphics or play are raised thoughtfully, they should be addressed.

The consensus opinion among the mods at the time was that a mapmaker should be willing to at least discuss the concerns that users have about his or map. This has not been the case here, and so foundry standards and expectations have not yet been met. Attempts were made - by me and others - to engage the mapmaker in this discussion, but the mapmaker refused on the grounds that he had done enough work already.

Of course, there are new sheriffs in town now. Gimil and I have been out of the picture for over a year, and the current team has less of a history dealing with this mapmaker. If they think that the rules that apply to CC's other mapmakers should be suspended in this case, and that the concerns raised about this map are not worth discussing, then by all means they should stamp it. 8-)
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby grifftron on Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:13 am

Stamp it!
‹army of nobunaga› me and so many other people including people in your own clan look at you as a joke
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby natty dread on Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:18 am

grifftron wrote:Stamp it!


If you or anyone else want this map quenched, PM Qwert. It's totally up to him to get it quenched, however he doesn't seem to care...
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby saaimen on Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:45 am

And if it's stamped now, this thread will keep thriving with people who have ended their turn with 8 shields and complain because they haven't won yet...
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby b00060 on Wed Jun 30, 2010 12:59 pm

I love this map and agree with blitz, what are some of the issues?
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby MrBenn on Wed Jun 30, 2010 2:14 pm

From the moment this map went into Beta, the CA's have been asking qwert to make an amendment to the legend and increase the user-friendliness of the map.

This evening, that amendment has gone live, which brings the Beta period to a conclusion. This update has not been created nor sanctioned by qwert, who has fully disengaged from the foundry, and refused to respond to our simple and straightforward requests.
MrBenn wrote:In fact
1. Wording of the objective - "Capture and hold all 8 Shields to win the war"
this is the only thing that actually NEEDS to be done - and is the only thing that is preventing this coming out of Beta...

There is no mapmaking medal to be awarded now, as prior to qwert's obstinance with this map, mapmakers were trusted to see their work through to completion and were commended upon the first quenching.

At any time this map was in Beta I could have pulled the map from live play, or stripped qwert of his medal. However, I firmly believe that neither course of action would have been in the best interests of the Foundry or the players of Conquer Club.

While it gives me great pleasure to release this map from the final forge, I should underline that the failure of future mapmakers to adhere to the foundry code of practice will have their work revamped (as happened to pepperonibread and the Germany map) or removed from Live Play until any issues are addressed.

--MrBenn
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby danryan on Wed Jun 30, 2010 2:16 pm

A sad end to this. The map is very good indeed and deserves to be live, so the result works at least.
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Beta]

Postby natty dread on Wed Jun 30, 2010 3:14 pm

Good call Mrbenn. Now if Qwert objects and wants the map taken down because it was changed without his consent, it will be up to him and people can't blame the Foundry for it.

Personally, I respect Qwert for all the maps he has made, but this one map really eats from that respect: if you start something you should have the integrity to follow through and see it to the end. Getting a map to beta and then refusing to work on it is really bad form and shows a bad attitude. No doubt there are people who disagree with me but this is just how I feel.
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Re: Peloponnesian War [Done]

Postby AndyDufresne on Thu Jul 01, 2010 2:37 pm

Good to see a conclusion to this.


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