TRAFALGAR [12.4.2012] QUENCHED (V65)

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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V7(P5) - New legend

Postby LED ZEPPELINER on Sat Jan 10, 2009 9:38 am

cairnswk wrote:
LED ZEPPELINER wrote:what i think might be a cool idea is if you were to make it so some boats can only reainforce each other (not attack) and others can attack another but not reinforce it, just throwing that ou thiere, maybe with like ally boats and enemy boats


And sorry for this, but totally don't understand this one. Please expand. :?

what i mean is if you were in a real naval battle, you wouldn't be attacking ships from your own fleet, so some connecting ships, maybe could just be able to reinforce one another, but not attack one another, i hope it makes sense
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V7(P5) - New legend

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:41 am

LED ZEPPELINER wrote:
cairnswk wrote:
LED ZEPPELINER wrote:what i think might be a cool idea is if you were to make it so some boats can only reainforce each other (not attack) and others can attack another but not reinforce it, just throwing that ou thiere, maybe with like ally boats and enemy boats


And sorry for this, but totally don't understand this one. Please expand. :?

what i mean is if you were in a real naval battle, you wouldn't be attacking ships from your own fleet, so some connecting ships, maybe could just be able to reinforce one another, but not attack one another, i hope it makes sense


Ah OK, i see now....i had this issue with Pearl Harbour also.
Unfortunately you cannot replicate a real life battle with the drop from this game, so you have to be able to conquer your own fleet, if it is held by someone else. reinforcement are thus enabled.
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V10

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:43 am

Current version 10.

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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V10(P5) - Adjusted layout

Postby The Neon Peon on Sat Jan 10, 2009 12:38 pm

Looks really nice. Good updates.

What I was saying about the left legend is that you should not outline some of the parts of the ship, like you have currently done to the lanterns and some of the ropes on the legend ship.

Thanks for doing the bonus suggestion. I like the amounts you chose. Was thinking that some like the French should be worth more, but when I actually thought about it, I came back to your choices.

The Spanish "W" is not capitalized in the legend.

The text should read: "Any commander +1" I am not sure why you added "Plus" at the start.

Who does Monarco belong to?
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V11

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 3:36 pm

The Neon Peon wrote:Looks really nice. Good updates.

What I was saying about the left legend is that you should not outline some of the parts of the ship, like you have currently done to the lanterns and some of the ropes on the legend ship.

Thanks for doing the bonus suggestion. I like the amounts you chose. Was thinking that some like the French should be worth more, but when I actually thought about it, I came back to your choices.

The Spanish "W" is not capitalized in the legend.

The text should read: "Any commander +1" I am not sure why you added "Plus" at the start.

Who does Monarco belong to?


Monarco -> Monarca belongs to the Spanish.
1. The left legend will be tidied
2. I think i have eliminated the bottlenecks - don't like them after Das Schloss fiasco
3. re-arrranged the bonus legend
4. Cannon are starting to get sorted.

Version 11
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V11(P6) - Gameplay

Postby MrBenn on Sat Jan 10, 2009 5:35 pm

I love the 'build-your-own' bonuses - I think that is exactly the way that battles would work on the ground - a combination of strategic territories, and strength in depth ;-)

I wonder if there is something that can be done to emphasise the difference between Broadside attacks and Raking attacks? Part of me wonders whether some of the ships could be turned, and add in more one-way attacks?

As a minor aside, I noticed that you only have 31 French/Spanish vessels, when there were 33 in total?

(I've just watched this: http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/empire_seapower/launch_ani_trafalgar.shtml)
During the engagement at Trafalgar, on 21 October 1805, the Royal Navy annihilated the greatest threat to British security for 200 years, but lost Britain's national hero in the process. Little wonder the battle transcended the mundane calculation of ships and men, victory and defeat. It guaranteed Britain's control of the oceans, the basis of her global power for over a century.


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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V11(P6) - Gameplay

Postby The Neon Peon on Sat Jan 10, 2009 5:43 pm

I think that the cannons are perfectly fine now. They are all clear as to where they are pointing.
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V11(P6) - Gameplay

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:04 pm

MrBenn wrote:I love the 'build-your-own' bonuses - I think that is exactly the way that battles would work on the ground - a combination of strategic territories, and strength in depth ;-)

I wonder if there is something that can be done to emphasise the difference between Broadside attacks and Raking attacks? Part of me wonders whether some of the ships could be turned, and add in more one-way attacks?

As a minor aside, I noticed that you only have 31 French/Spanish vessels, when there were 33 in total?

(I've just watched this: http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/empire_seapower/launch_ani_trafalgar.shtml)
During the engagement at Trafalgar, on 21 October 1805, the Royal Navy annihilated the greatest threat to British security for 200 years, but lost Britain's national hero in the process. Little wonder the battle transcended the mundane calculation of ships and men, victory and defeat. It guaranteed Britain's control of the oceans, the basis of her global power for over a century.


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Thanks for Stamp Mr Benn.
1. i'll have to investiage the broadside and raking attack thing, i am sure there might be something that can be done.
Can you explain further.
2. Yes there were 33, and i have deliberately left 2 out - the British Achille and the French Redoubtable, i was waiting to see if someone noticed. I left the Achille out because of there being two of each name, although now i think my argument was piss-poor because there are 2 Neptune. I'll fix it.


The Neon Peon wrote:I think that the cannons are perfectly fine now. They are all clear as to where they are pointing.

Thanks, someone may still think they need fixing though. ;)
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V11(P6) - Gameplay

Postby MrBenn on Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:26 pm

cairnswk wrote:1. i'll have to investiage the broadside and raking attack thing, i am sure there might be something that can be done.
Can you explain further.
2. Yes there were 33, and i have deliberately left 2 out - the British Achille and the French Redoubtable

1. The cannons on the ships only fire from the sides... check out the animation on the page I linked to...
    Broadside attacks are when two ships are parrallel to each other, and firing upon each other.
    Raking attacks are when one ship has its side facing the bow/stern of the enemy, and can fire without return.

2. The Redoutable blocked Victory's way through the enemy line - how dare you leave it out :lol:
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V12

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:35 pm

MrBenn wrote:
cairnswk wrote:1. i'll have to investiage the broadside and raking attack thing, i am sure there might be something that can be done.
Can you explain further.
2. Yes there were 33, and i have deliberately left 2 out - the British Achille and the French Redoubtable

1. The cannons on the ships only fire from the sides... check out the animation on the page I linked to...
    Broadside attacks are when two ships are parrallel to each other, and firing upon each other.
    Raking attacks are when one ship has its side facing the bow/stern of the enemy, and can fire without return.

2. The Redoutable blocked Victory's way through the enemy line - how dare you leave it out :lol:


I looked at your video....good stuff. :)
Yes i left the Redoubtable out. :oops:

Still it's back in....Version 12 below fixes some of the broadsides and there should be 33 vessels now.

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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13 XML Preview

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 10:11 pm

XML Preview

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Code: Select all
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<map>

    <title>trafalgar</title>
    <smallwidth>630</smallwidth>
    <smallheight>600</smallheight>
    <largewidth>800</largewidth>
    <largeheight>762</largeheight>
    <filetype>jpg</filetype>

<!-- Beginning of Continents -->

<continent>
      <name>French (W)</name>
      <bonus>2</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Mont Blanc</territory>
         <territory>Formidable</territory>
         <territory>Dugary-Trouin</territory>
         <territory>Scipion</territory>
         <territory>Heros</territory>
         <territory>Bucentaure</territory>
         <territory>Redoubtable</territory>
         <territory>Neptune(F)</territory>
      </components>
      <required>5</required>
</continent>

<continent>
      <name>Spanish (W)</name>
      <bonus>1</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Neptuno</territory>
         <territory>San Augustin</territory>
         <territory>Rayo</territory>
         <territory>San Fracisco de Asis</territory>
         <territory>Santissima Trinidad</territory>
         <territory>San Justo</territory>
      </components>
      <required>3</required>
</continent>

<continent>
      <name>British (W)</name>
      <bonus>3</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Africa</territory>
         <territory>Minotaur</territory>
         <territory>Ajax</territory>
         <territory>Agamemnon</territory>
         <territory>Conqueror</territory>
         <territory>Spartiate</territory>
         <territory>Orion</territory>
         <territory>Britannia</territory>
         <territory>Hortense</territory>
         <territory>Neptune(B)</territory>
         <territory>Leviathon</territory>
         <territory>Victory</territory>
         <territory>Temaraire</territory>
      </components>
      <required>7</required>
</continent>

<!-- Lee Line -->

<continent>
      <name>French (L)</name>
      <bonus>3</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Indomptable</territory>
         <territory>Aigle</territory>
         <territory>Fougueux</territory>
         <territory>Intrepid</territory>
         <territory>Themis</territory>
         <territory>Achille(F)</territory>
         <territory>Pluton</territory>
         <territory>Swiftsure</territory>
    <territory>Berwick</territory>
      </components>
      <required>5</required>
</continent>

<continent>
      <name>Spanish (L)</name>
      <bonus>2</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Santa Anna</territory>
         <territory>San Leonardo</territory>
         <territory>Monarca</territory>
         <territory>Montanez</territory>
         <territory>Principe De Astuckis</territory>
         <territory>Bahama</territory>
         <territory>San Ildefenso</territory>
         <territory>Argonauta</territory>
         <territory>San Juan de Nepomuceno</territory>
      </components>
      <required>4</required>
</continent>

<continent>
      <name>British (L)</name>
      <bonus>4</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Royal Sovereign</territory>
         <territory>Mars</territory>
         <territory>Tonnant</territory>
         <territory>Colossus</territory>
         <territory>Belleisle</territory>
         <territory>Achille(B)</territory>
         <territory>Bellerphon</territory>
         <territory>Defence</territory>
         <territory>Revenge</territory>
         <territory>Euryalis</territory>
         <territory>Thunderer</territory>
         <territory>Defiance</territory>
         <territory>Polyphemus</territory>
         <territory>Dreadnought</territory>
         <territory>Prince</territory>
      </components>
      <required>8</required>
</continent>

<continent>
      <name>Bucentaure</name>
      <bonus>1</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Bucentaure</territory>
      </components>
</continent>

<continent>
      <name>Victory</name>
      <bonus>1</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Victory</territory>
      </components>
</continent>

<continent>
      <name>Santissima Trinidad</name>
      <bonus>1</bonus>
      <components>
         <territory>Santissima Trinidad</territory>
      </components>
</continent>

<!--  End of Continents  -->


<!-- Beginning of Territories -->
<territory>
   <name>Mont Blanc</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Africa</border>
          <border>Dugary-Trouin</border>
   <border>Scipion</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Africa</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>404</smallx>
         <smally>61</smally>
         <largex>514</largex>
         <largey>72</largey>
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</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Dugary-Trouin</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Mont Blanc</border>
          <border>Formidable</border>
          <border>Heros</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>477</smallx>
         <smally>72</smally>
         <largex>607</largex>
         <largey>85</largey>
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</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Formidable</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Dugary-Trouin</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>512</smallx>
         <smally>41</smally>
         <largex>651</largex>
         <largey>46</largey>
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<territory>
   <name>Scipion</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Mont Blanc</border>
          <border>Bucentaure</border>
          <border>Heros</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Conqueror</bombardment>
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         <smallx>394</smallx>
         <smally>133</smally>
         <largex>502</largex>
         <largey>163</largey>
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</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Heros</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Dugary-Trouin</border>
          <border>Scipion</border>
          <border>Neptune(F)</border>
   <border>San Fracisco de Asis</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Africa</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
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         <smallx>441</smallx>
         <smally>113</smally>
         <largex>561</largex>
         <largey>138</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Bucentaure</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Temaraire</border>
          <border>Scipion</border>
          <border>Victory</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Conqueror</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Neptune(B)</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Temaraire</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Victory</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>410</smallx>
         <smally>185</smally>
         <largex>522</largex>
         <largey>229</largey>
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<neutral>5</neutral>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Neptune(F)</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Heros</border>
          <border>Redoubtable</border>
          <border>Indomptable</border>
   <border>Santissima Trinidad</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Temaraire</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>507</smallx>
         <smally>244</smally>
         <largex>645</largex>
         <largey>304</largey>
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</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Redoubtable</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Neptune(F)</border>
          <border>Victory</border>
          <border>Temaraire</border>
   <border>Indomptable</border>
   <border>Aigle</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Victory</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>455</smallx>
         <smally>265</smally>
         <largex>579</largex>
         <largey>330</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<!-- End of French (W) -->

<!-- Start Spanish (W) -->

<territory>
   <name>Neptuno</name>
   <borders>
        <border>San Augustin</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>599</smallx>
         <smally>60</smally>
         <largex>762</largex>
         <largey>70</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>San Augustin</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Neptuno</border>
        <border>Rayo</border>
        <border>San Justo</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>555</smallx>
         <smally>81</smally>
         <largex>706</largex>
         <largey>97</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Rayo</name>
   <borders>
        <border>San Augustin</border>
        <border>San Fracisco de Asis</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>517</smallx>
         <smally>103</smally>
         <largex>657</largex>
         <largey>125</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>San Fracisco de Asis</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Rayo</border>
        <border>Santissima Trinidad</border>
        <border>Heros</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>477</smallx>
         <smally>131</smally>
         <largex>607</largex>
         <largey>160</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Santissima Trinidad</name>
   <borders>
        <border>San Justo</border>
        <border>San Fracisco de Asis</border>
        <border>Neptune(F)</border>
        <border>San Leonardo</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>546</smallx>
         <smally>191</smally>
         <largex>695</largex>
         <largey>236</largey>
            </coordinates>
<neutral>5</neutral>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>San Justo</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Santissima Trinidad</border>
        <border>San Augustin</border>
        <border>Montanez</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>594</smallx>
         <smally>247</smally>
         <largex>755</largex>
         <largey>308</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<!-- End Spanish (W) -->

<!-- Start British (W) -->

<territory>
   <name>Africa</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Mont Blanc</border>
        <border>Agamemnon</border>
        <border>Conqueror</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Mont Blanc</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>347</smallx>
         <smally>64</smally>
         <largex>442</largex>
         <largey>75</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Minotaur</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Ajax</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>102</smallx>
         <smally>161</smally>
         <largex>130</largex>
         <largey>199</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Ajax</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Minotaur</border>
        <border>Agamemnon</border>
        <border>Orion</border>
   <border>Britannia</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>165</smallx>
         <smally>157</smally>
         <largex>210</largex>
         <largey>193</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Agamemnon</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Ajax</border>
        <border>Conqueror</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>236</smallx>
         <smally>155</smally>
         <largex>301</largex>
         <largey>191</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Conqueror</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Africa</border>
        <border>Agamemnon</border>
        <border>Neptune(B)</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Scipion</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Bucentaure</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>330</smallx>
         <smally>157</smally>
         <largex>420</largex>
         <largey>194</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Spartiate</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Orion</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>77</smallx>
         <smally>187</smally>
         <largex>99</largex>
         <largey>232</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Orion</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Spartiate</border>
        <border>Britannia</border>
        <border>Ajax</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>149</smallx>
         <smally>196</smally>
         <largex>190</largex>
         <largey>243</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Britannia</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Orion</border>
        <border>Hortense</border>
        <border>Ajax</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>224</smallx>
         <smally>190</smally>
         <largex>285</largex>
         <largey>235</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Hortense</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Britannia</border>
        <border>Leviathon</border>
        <border>Neptune(B)</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>280</smallx>
         <smally>201</smally>
         <largex>356</largex>
         <largey>249</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Neptune(B)</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Conqueror</border>
        <border>Hortense</border>
        <border>Victory</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Bucentaure</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>358</smallx>
         <smally>202</smally>
         <largex>456</largex>
         <largey>251</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Leviathon</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Hortense</border>
        <border>Victory</border>
        <border>Mars</border>
   <border>Royal Sovereign</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>306</smallx>
         <smally>248</smally>
         <largex>390</largex>
         <largey>309</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Victory</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Leviathon</border>
        <border>Bucentaure</border>
        <border>Neptune(B)</border>
        <border>Royal Sovereign</border>
        <border>Temaraire</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Redoubtable</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Bucentaure</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Santa Anna</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>403</smallx>
         <smally>248</smally>
         <largex>513</largex>
         <largey>309</largey>
            </coordinates>
<neutral>5</neutral>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Temaraire</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Bucentaure</border>
        <border>Victory</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Santissima Trinidad</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Bucentaure</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Neptune(F)</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>467</smallx>
         <smally>198</smally>
         <largex>594</largex>
         <largey>245</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<!-- End British (W) -->

<!-- Start French (L) -->

<territory>
   <name>Aigle</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Redoubtable</border>
        <border>Monarca</border>
        <border>Fougueux</border>
        <border>Intrepid</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Belleisle</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>423</smallx>
         <smally>377</smally>
         <largex>538</largex>
         <largey>473</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Indomptable</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Neptune(F)</border>
        <border>Fougueux</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>472</smallx>
         <smally>324</smally>
         <largex>601</largex>
         <largey>405</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Fougueux</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Aigle</border>
        <border>Principe De Astuckis</border>
        <border>Swiftsure</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>481</smallx>
         <smally>383</smally>
         <largex>612</largex>
         <largey>481</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Intrepid</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Aigle</border>
        <border>Themis</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Belleisle</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>369</smallx>
         <smally>413</smally>
         <largex>470</largex>
         <largey>519</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Themis</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Intrepid</border>
        <border>Bellerphon</border>
        <border>Swiftsure</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Belleisle</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Bellerphon</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Euryalis</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>317</smallx>
         <smally>449</smally>
         <largex>404</largex>
         <largey>564</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Swiftsure</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Fougueux</border>
        <border>Themis</border>
        <border>Pluton</border>
        <border>Berwick</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Euryalis</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>371</smallx>
         <smally>479</smally>
         <largex>472</largex>
         <largey>602</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Pluton</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Euryalis</border>
        <border>San Ildefenso</border>
        <border>Swiftsure</border>
        <border>Achille(F)</border>
        <border>Polyphemus</border>
        </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Polyphemus</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Euryalis</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>291</smallx>
         <smally>538</smally>
         <largex>370</largex>
         <largey>677</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Achille(F)</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Prince</border>
        <border>Pluton</border>
        <border>Berwick</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Polyphemus</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Prince</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>286</smallx>
         <smally>594</smally>
         <largex>364</largex>
         <largey>748</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Berwick</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Argonauta</border>
        <border>Achille(F)</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>346</smallx>
         <smally>594</smally>
         <largex>440</largex>
         <largey>749</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<!-- End French (L) -->

<!-- Start Spanish (L) -->

<territory>
   <name>Santa Anna</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Monarca</border>
        <border>San Leonardo</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Victory</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Royal Sovereign</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>418</smallx>
         <smally>305</smally>
         <largex>532</largex>
         <largey>381</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>San Leonardo</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Santissima Trinidad</border>
        <border>Montanez</border>
        <border>Santa Anna</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>513</smallx>
         <smally>302</smally>
         <largex>653</largex>
         <largey>378</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Montanez</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Principe De Astuckis</border>
        <border>San Leonardo</border>
        <border>San Justo</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>556</smallx>
         <smally>331</smally>
         <largex>707</largex>
         <largey>415</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Monarca</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Santa Anna</border>
        <border>Royal Sovereign</border>
        <border>Aigle</border>
        <border>Bahama</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Royal Sovereign</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Colossus</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>378</smallx>
         <smally>353</smally>
         <largex>481</largex>
         <largey>442</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Principe De Astuckis</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Montanez</border>
        <border>Fougueux</border>
        <border>San Juan de Nepomuceno</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>509</smallx>
         <smally>411</smally>
         <largex>647</largex>
         <largey>516</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Bahama</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Monarca</border>
        <border>San Ildefenso</border>
        <border>San Juan de Nepomuceno</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>428</smallx>
         <smally>476</smally>
         <largex>545</largex>
         <largey>599</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>San Juan de Nepomuceno</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Principe De Astuckis</border>
        <border>Bahama</border>
        <border>Argonauta</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>465</smallx>
         <smally>476</smally>
         <largex>592</largex>
         <largey>599</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>San Ildefenso</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Pluton</border>
        <border>Argonauta</border>
        <border>Bahama</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Euryalis</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>354</smallx>
         <smally>538</smally>
         <largex>450</largex>
         <largey>677</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Argonauta</name>
   <borders>
        <border>San Ildefenso</border>
        <border>Berwick</border>
        <border>San Juan de Nepomuceno</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>399</smallx>
         <smally>557</smally>
         <largex>508</largex>
         <largey>701</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<!-- End Spanish (L) -->

<!-- Start British (L) -->

<territory>
   <name>Mars</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Leviathon</border>
        <border>Tonnant</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>250</smallx>
         <smally>317</smally>
         <largex>318</largex>
         <largey>397</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Royal Sovereign</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Leviathon</border>
        <border>Victory</border>
        <border>Colossus</border>
        <border>Monarca</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Santa Anna</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Monarca</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>346</smallx>
         <smally>303</smally>
         <largex>440</largex>
         <largey>379</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Colossus</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Belleisle</border>
        <border>Royal Sovereign</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Monarca</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>293</smallx>
         <smally>346</smally>
         <largex>373</largex>
         <largey>433</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Tonnant</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Mars</border>
        <border>Achille(B)</border>
        <border>Belleisle</border>
   <border>Revenge</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>244</smallx>
         <smally>376</smally>
         <largex>311</largex>
         <largey>472</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Belleisle</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Tonnant</border>
        <border>Colossus</border>
        <border>Bellerphon</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Intrepid</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>330</smallx>
         <smally>392</smally>
         <largex>420</largex>
         <largey>492</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Achille(B)</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Tonnant</border>
        <border>Defence</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>201</smallx>
         <smally>425</smally>
         <largex>256</largex>
         <largey>534</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Bellerphon</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Belleisle</border>
        <border>Revenge</border>
        <border>Euryalis</border>
        <border>Themis</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Themis</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Intrepid</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>275</smallx>
         <smally>436</smally>
         <largex>350</largex>
         <largey>548</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Revenge</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Tonnant</border>
        <border>Bellerphon</border>
        <border>Defiance</border>
        <border>Defence</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Themis</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>231</smallx>
         <smally>468</smally>
         <largex>295</largex>
         <largey>588</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Defence</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Achille(B)</border>
        <border>Revenge</border>
        <border>Thunderer</border>
        <border>Dreadnought</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>161</smallx>
         <smally>484</smally>
         <largex>205</largex>
         <largey>609</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Euryalis</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Bellerphon</border>
        <border>Pluton</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Themis</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Swiftsure</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Pluton</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>290</smallx>
         <smally>489</smally>
         <largex>369</largex>
         <largey>615</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Thunderer</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Defence</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>117</smallx>
         <smally>505</smally>
         <largex>150</largex>
         <largey>636</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Defiance</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Revenge</border>
        <border>Polyphemus</border>
        <border>Dreadnought</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>197</smallx>
         <smally>515</smally>
         <largex>251</largex>
         <largey>648</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Polyphemus</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Defiance</border>
        <border>Pluton</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Achille(F)</bombardment>
      <bombardment>Pluton</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>243</smallx>
         <smally>542</smally>
         <largex>310</largex>
         <largey>682</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Dreadnought</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Defence</border>
        <border>Prince</border>
   </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>137</smallx>
         <smally>579</smally>
         <largex>175</largex>
         <largey>730</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

<territory>
   <name>Prince</name>
   <borders>
        <border>Achille(F)</border>
        <border>Dreadnought</border>
   </borders>
      <bombardments>
      <bombardment>Achille(F)</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>217</smallx>
         <smally>594</smally>
         <largex>277</largex>
         <largey>748</largey>
            </coordinates>
</territory>

</map>
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13(P6) - Gameplay/XML Preview

Postby LED ZEPPELINER on Sat Jan 10, 2009 10:30 pm

try centering the 88's a little better,
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13(P6) - Gameplay/XML Preview

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:18 pm

LED ZEPPELINER wrote:try centering the 88's a little better,

I appreciate you wanting to post...but that centering suggestion is a post for Final Forge or Stickied Foundry.

Right now, i'd appreciate some input on gameplay please, and is ther any way that the connections can be bettered!
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13(P6) - Gameplay/XML Preview

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:25 pm

Are there too many lines for instance?
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13(P6) - Gameplay/XML Preview

Postby The Neon Peon on Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:43 pm

cairnswk wrote:Are there too many lines for instance?

I like this map a lot for its gameplay, so to me it is all good already.

I think you should limit the amount of 2 way border and bombard. I highly doubt that the bombard feature will be used a lot in that instance. How will this work with clickable maps?
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13(P6) - Gameplay/XML Preview

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:53 pm

The Neon Peon wrote:
cairnswk wrote:Are there too many lines for instance?

I like this map a lot for its gameplay, so to me it is all good already.

I think you should limit the amount of 2 way border and bombard. I highly doubt that the bombard feature will be used a lot in that instance. How will this work with clickable maps?


Who's talking about clickable maps?
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13 XML Preview

Postby cairnswk on Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:54 pm

Version 13 with armies

Image

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image
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13(P6) - Gameplay/XML Preview

Postby Telvannia on Sun Jan 11, 2009 4:59 am

If you are going to do this 'build your own bonus' bonus scheme it might be worth getting rid of the weather/lee for the French and the Spanish...
Also on the bonus front, it could be worth changing it so instead of gaining 1 army for the commanders instead they double the fleet bonuses above for their own fleet only. I think it would give the commanders a more tactically significant position on the map.
You also seem to have a lot of bombard and attack routes doubling up, which if i remember rightly from feudal wars does not work, an example of this is Victory and Bucentaure where they can both bombard and attack each other.
To slightly show the tactic of Nelson at Trafalgar a bit more you could cut down on the attack routes between French and Spanish ships where the British have cut the line, because the basic tactic of Nelson was to create a bottle necks in the French and Spanish line so if you removed the attack lines between: Neptune - Heros and between: Pluton - Themis for example
Slight nitpicking realism (so only do if it is a simple job which i fear it will not be, but i will put it out there) constant wind direction, the sails on the ships are not pointing largely in the direction. (Once again i wish to point out this is NOT important)
Back to HMS Africa, i always thought this ship was not part of the weather line, having been separated from the fleet it attacked in a completely different way, but i think giving it its own bonus might just cause confusion so it might not be worth the confusion just for a slight addition to realism




I would like to add that i love this map, and even without the above suggestions i think it could easily become my favourite map :D Keep going on this and it will end up an amazing map =D>
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13(P6) - Gameplay/XML Preview

Postby cairnswk on Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:29 am

Telvannia wrote:....
I would like to add that i love this map, and even without the above suggestions i think it could easily become my favourite map :D Keep going on this and it will end up an amazing map =D>

Thanks Telvannia....i answer your suggestions shortly. :)
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V13(P6) - Gameplay/XML Preview

Postby cairnswk on Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:36 pm

Telvannia wrote:If you are going to do this 'build your own bonus' bonus scheme it might be worth getting rid of the weather/lee for the French and the Spanish...
Also on the bonus front, it could be worth changing it so instead of gaining 1 army for the commanders instead they double the fleet bonuses above for their own fleet only. I think it would give the commanders a more tactically significant position on the map.
You also seem to have a lot of bombard and attack routes doubling up, which if i remember rightly from feudal wars does not work, an example of this is Victory and Bucentaure where they can both bombard and attack each other.
To slightly show the tactic of Nelson at Trafalgar a bit more you could cut down on the attack routes between French and Spanish ships where the British have cut the line, because the basic tactic of Nelson was to create a bottle necks in the French and Spanish line so if you removed the attack lines between: Neptune - Heros and between: Pluton - Themis for example
Slight nitpicking realism (so only do if it is a simple job which i fear it will not be, but i will put it out there) constant wind direction, the sails on the ships are not pointing largely in the direction. (Once again i wish to point out this is NOT important)
Back to HMS Africa, i always thought this ship was not part of the weather line, having been separated from the fleet it attacked in a completely different way, but i think giving it its own bonus might just cause confusion so it might not be worth the confusion just for a slight addition to realism
...

Telvannia....i'm going to have to re-arrange these deck chairs.
There are vessels in places that don't belong, and i 've just discovered that the Spanish flagship was not Santassima Trinidad but Principe de Asturias...so please bare with me....sorry.
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V14

Postby cairnswk on Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:31 am

Version 14.

OK...i think this version was absolutely necessary to get more than half of the actions correct in this gameplay, therefore i had to re-arrange the ships completely and their gameplay links.
I discovered a site that gave me a list of the British ships, and moved these into gameplay position according to which vessel they broadsided or raked.
There is also a movement of the Spanish Commander to the Principe de Asturias at the bottom of the map, which for me is pleasing because previously i had three commanders at the top of the map.
The other thing is that the top half of the map is left much as it was before with proper continents. This could work in players favour as it might be easier to take the top fo the map before moving to the bottom where the majority of the bombardment occurs.

Here are the results:

Image

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image
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V14(P7) - Gameplay alteration

Postby cairnswk on Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:18 am

V14 above changes to 61 terts....how is this number affected for a good start?
Refer below.
Last edited by cairnswk on Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V14(P7) - Gameplay alteration

Postby cairnswk on Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:19 am

Thanks to Gimil...here is the drop for 61 terts.

No. of Territories 61 - 3 neutral starters

A. Number of players
B. Number of territories each player starts with
C. Number of neutral territories start
A. B. C.
2 19 23
3 19 4
4 14 5
5 11 6
6 9 7
7 8 5
8 7 5
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V14(P7) - Gameplay alteration

Postby Telvannia on Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:49 pm

Very nice update, i think it is defiantly better now. I still think the weather/lee line bonus is not necessary with the French and Spanish fleet. Also while on the bonuses i think that the commanders could play a bit of a bigger part in the tactics with them doubling the respective nations bonus.
By the way i think you have Neptune and Africa the wrong way round.


I will come back with more comments but i think that will do for now still think it is an amazing map, you have made me get on with something i have wanted to do for awhile, making a 3D model of Victory.
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Re: BATTLE OF TRAFALGAR - V14(P7) - Gameplay alteration

Postby cairnswk on Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:55 pm

Telvannia wrote:Very nice update, i think it is defiantly better now.

Thanks Telvannia. :)

I still think the weather/lee line bonus is not necessary with the French and Spanish fleet.

But with out them, there would only be four continental type bonuses.

Also while on the bonuses i think that the commanders could play a bit of a bigger part in the tactics with them doubling the respective nations bonus.

I think i understand this....but would it not be too much and make the continents lop-sided....tow in the north and one in the south and the one on the south might be much hard to obtain.

By the way i think you have Neptune and Africa the wrong way round.

Well, according to some maps this is so, but the Neptune ended up beside Santissima Trinidad and i was going to put the Neptune in there for cannon purposes, but well... what do you think.

I will come back with more comments but i think that will do for now still think it is an amazing map, you have made me get on with something i have wanted to do for awhile, making a 3D model of Victory.

Very nice. hope you keep at it. :)
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