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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby natty dread on Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:19 pm

Great! Anyone know when this will be up for playing?
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby ender516 on Tue Dec 08, 2009 11:28 pm

MrBenn wrote:
          Beta - Quenching

---The Final Forge period has concluded for the XXX Map. All objections have had their time. The Foundry and I hereby brand this map with the Foundry Beta Brand. Let it be known that this map is now ready for BETA Play. After an extended period of time in BETA and once all quirks and issues have been resolved, the map will be put into Full Play (barring any Lack vetoes).

Conquer Club, enjoy!

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Say, I thought this was a family-rated site! :lol: ;)
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby MrBenn on Wed Dec 09, 2009 8:13 am

ender516 wrote: XXX Map.

Your eyes deceive you...
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby natty dread on Wed Dec 09, 2009 8:17 am

But he has teh quotes to prove it! :geek:
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby captainwalrus on Wed Dec 09, 2009 4:45 pm

MrBenn wrote:Your eyes deceive you...

Lol, your becoming andy!
AndyDufresne wrote:Your eyes are deceiving you.


--Andy
~ CaptainWalrus
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby the.killing.44 on Wed Dec 09, 2009 4:49 pm

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oak posted this a while back :P
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby neanderpaul14 on Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:35 am

Let me start by saying that I love this map, another excellent job Cairns. However I believe I located an Xml or coding error having to do with the bonuses. I noticed in Game 6185499 when I captured Seville Le Nueva then Pedro it told me that I was holding A Slave and A Sugar for a +1 bonus, but none of the regions I'm currently holding appears to be a slave.

Edit: Was just playing in a few others, capturing any Sugar gives you the Slave/Sugar bonus.
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby Forza AZ on Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:04 am

neanderpaul14 wrote:Let me start by saying that I love this map, another excellent job Cairns. However I believe I located an Xml or coding error having to do with the bonuses. I noticed in Game 6185499 when I captured Seville Le Nueva then Pedro it told me that I was holding A Slave and A Sugar for a +1 bonus, but none of the regions I'm currently holding appears to be a slave.

Edit: Was just playing in a few others, capturing any Sugar gives you the Slave/Sugar bonus.

Just noticed the same. In Game 6184707 pink has 2 sugars but also gets a bonus for 2 Slaves + 2 Sugar, while he hasn't got any slave.
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby dolomite13 on Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:27 am

Forza AZ wrote:
neanderpaul14 wrote:Let me start by saying that I love this map, another excellent job Cairns. However I believe I located an Xml or coding error having to do with the bonuses. I noticed in Game 6185499 when I captured Seville Le Nueva then Pedro it told me that I was holding A Slave and A Sugar for a +1 bonus, but none of the regions I'm currently holding appears to be a slave.

Edit: Was just playing in a few others, capturing any Sugar gives you the Slave/Sugar bonus.

Just noticed the same. In Game 6184707 pink has 2 sugars but also gets a bonus for 2 Slaves + 2 Sugar, while he hasn't got any slave.


We are going to have to examine the xml again. I thought we had it right as did the foundry folks that checked it for me. But we must have the overrides wrong somewhere.

=D=
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby Forza AZ on Wed Dec 30, 2009 1:21 pm

dolomite13 wrote:
Forza AZ wrote:
neanderpaul14 wrote:Let me start by saying that I love this map, another excellent job Cairns. However I believe I located an Xml or coding error having to do with the bonuses. I noticed in Game 6185499 when I captured Seville Le Nueva then Pedro it told me that I was holding A Slave and A Sugar for a +1 bonus, but none of the regions I'm currently holding appears to be a slave.

Edit: Was just playing in a few others, capturing any Sugar gives you the Slave/Sugar bonus.

Just noticed the same. In Game 6184707 pink has 2 sugars but also gets a bonus for 2 Slaves + 2 Sugar, while he hasn't got any slave.


We are going to have to examine the xml again. I thought we had it right as did the foundry folks that checked it for me. But we must have the overrides wrong somewhere.

=D=


I found the mistake. You have put required tags in the Slave and Sugar bonusses, that shouldn't be there. That is why it now gives the bonus when you just have x amount of Slaves or x amount of Sugars. So you just have to remove the required tags in these 5 bonusses, and then all should be OK.
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby natty dread on Wed Dec 30, 2009 1:35 pm

I found the mistake. You have put required tags in the Slave and Sugar bonusses, that shouldn't be there.


He's right, I checked. The <required> tags should only be in the individual Sugar and Slave bonuses that give 0 bonus, but should not be in the "Slave and Sugar" bonuses that actually give the bonus.
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby dolomite13 on Wed Dec 30, 2009 2:17 pm

Ah totally missed that :(
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby cairnswk on Wed Dec 30, 2009 2:32 pm

dolomite13 wrote:Ah totally missed that :(

Thanks dolomite13 :)
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby -=- Tanarri -=- on Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:01 pm

Just started a game on this map and have to say that it looks like it's going to be great fun.

I am noticing that in the bonus area it says that the normal +1 per 3 territories doesn't apply to the map, but when I start my first turn I get 3 to deploy. I am guessing this is an error in the XML?
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby dolomite13 on Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:02 pm

-=- Tanarri -=- wrote:Just started a game on this map and have to say that it looks like it's going to be great fun.

I am noticing that in the bonus area it says that the normal +1 per 3 territories doesn't apply to the map, but when I start my first turn I get 3 to deploy. I am guessing this is an error in the XML?


It is set to no standard bonus for +1 every 3 territories however it is set for a minimum of 3 no matter how many territories held.

=D=

Code: Select all
<minreinforcement>3</minreinforcement>
<reinforcements>
<reinforcement>
<lower>1</lower>
<upper>52</upper>
<divisor>53</divisor>
</reinforcement>
</reinforcements>
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby dolomite13 on Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:23 pm

I removed "required" tags from the combined "slave and sugar" continents

http://www.bigottergames.com/downloads/jamaicaV31.xml

Code: Select all
<continent>
  <name>A Slave and A Sugar</name>
  <bonus>1</bonus>
  <components>
      <continent>A Slave</continent>
      <continent>A Sugar</continent>
  </components>
  <overrides>
    <override>A Slave</override>
    <override>A Sugar</override>
  </overrides>
</continent>

<continent>
  <name>2 Slaves and 2 Sugar</name>
  <bonus>2</bonus>
  <components>
      <continent>2 Slaves</continent>
      <continent>2 Sugar</continent>
  </components>
  <overrides>
    <override>2 Slaves</override>
    <override>2 Sugar</override>
    <override>A Slave and A Sugar</override>
  </overrides>
</continent>

<continent>
  <name>3 Slaves and 3 Sugar</name>
  <bonus>3</bonus>
  <components>
      <continent>3 Slaves</continent>
      <continent>3 Sugar</continent>
  </components>
  <overrides>
    <override>3 Slaves</override>
    <override>3 Sugar</override>
    <override>A Slave and A Sugar</override>
    <override>2 Slaves and 2 Sugar</override>
  </overrides>
</continent>

<continent>
  <name>4 Slaves and 4 Sugar</name>
  <bonus>4</bonus>
  <components>
      <continent>4 Slaves</continent>
      <continent>4 Sugar</continent>
  </components>
  <overrides>
    <override>4 Slaves</override>
    <override>4 Sugar</override>
    <override>A Slave and A Sugar</override>
    <override>2 Slaves and 2 Sugar</override>
    <override>3 Slaves and 3 Sugar</override>
  </overrides>
</continent>

<continent>
  <name>5 Slaves and 5 Sugar</name>
  <bonus>5</bonus>
  <components>
      <continent>5 Slaves</continent>
      <continent>5 Sugar</continent>
  </components>
  <overrides>
    <override>5 Slaves</override>
    <override>5 Sugar</override>
    <override>A Slave and A Sugar</override>
    <override>2 Slaves and 2 Sugar</override>
    <override>3 Slaves and 3 Sugar</override>
    <override>4 Slaves and 4 Sugar</override>
  </overrides>
</continent>
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby dolomite13 on Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:30 pm

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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby jefjef on Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:06 pm

Strange map. Well any who perhaps "slave" should be replaced by "worker". Just saying. Can't change history but some believe it should be more PC.
This post was made by jefjef who should be on your ignore list.
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby the.killing.44 on Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:08 pm

jefjef wrote:Strange map. Well any who perhaps "slave" should be replaced by "worker". Just saying. Can't change history but some believe it should be more PC.

Ehh, when it's historically correct I think it's fine.
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby Vace Cooper on Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:36 pm

jefjef wrote:Strange map. Well any who perhaps "slave" should be replaced by "worker". Just saying. Can't change history but some believe it should be more PC.

i agree wholly. i doubt jamaicans glorify their past enslavement and occupation by foreign countries. change it to workers, as it is it is borderline racist. and is there any way to denote these maps as build maps? i hate this style of game play, as there are a few strategies used by everyone and they rely mostly on the luck of the dice when you roll out your big armies, and i don't want to play them. luckily i was warned that this was another "realms" style map, so i dodged the disappointment. anyway, i agree with jef, the slavery should go. just because it happened in the past doesn't make it ok to have on a map. hasn't this reasoning been found to be lacking when discussing nazi germany?
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby natty dread on Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:36 pm

jefjef wrote:Strange map. Well any who perhaps "slave" should be replaced by "worker". Just saying. Can't change history but some believe it should be more PC.


I think it would be more offending to try to "sweet talk" and show the history as a happy-happy-joy-joy-thing that it was not. Renaming slaves as "workers" would belittle the sufferings of the slaves and imply that slavery was "ok".

It's kinda like how the nazis called their murdering centers "concentration camps".

Then again, some people would rather pretend history never happened, but if we forget we cannot learn from their mistakes.
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby neanderpaul14 on Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:53 pm

natty_dread wrote:
jefjef wrote:Strange map. Well any who perhaps "slave" should be replaced by "worker". Just saying. Can't change history but some believe it should be more PC.


I think it would be more offending to try to "sweet talk" and show the history as a happy-happy-joy-joy-thing that it was not. Renaming slaves as "workers" would belittle the sufferings of the slaves and imply that slavery was "ok".

It's kinda like how the nazis called their murdering centers "concentration camps".

Then again, some people would rather pretend history never happened, but if we forget we cannot learn from their mistakes.



=D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

Thank you Natty. A little PC is fine but your getting carried away with this suggestion jefjef. This is a historical map, there were slaves in Jamaica.{Sarcasm alert} Maybe we should just delete all of the World War 2 maps because they glorify the nazis, who were evil. {End of sarcasm}. The map is just fine the way it is.
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby cairnswk on Thu Dec 31, 2009 4:20 pm

Guys, thanks for the viewpoints both sides.
PC has its place in some cases, this is not one of them.
History shows Jamaica had slaves, so they stay. :)
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby the.killing.44 on Thu Dec 31, 2009 4:34 pm

cairnswk wrote:Guys, thanks for the viewpoints both sides.
PC has its place in some cases, this is not one of them.
History shows Jamaica had slaves, so they stay. :)

There's a difference between being PC and prude to history. Good call ;)
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Re: Jamaica [D.GP.GR.X] V30 (P25) submitted for BETA

Postby natty dread on Fri Jan 01, 2010 8:54 am

One thing that bothers me...

The starting points (the ships) in the map are in the form "Spain, Columbus" and "England, Morgan" but in the XML they're the other way around: "Columbus, Spain" and "Morgan, England". This is kinda confusing. Sure, it's not a big deal, but it'd be a lot easier to find them from the drop down menu if they were named the same way in the map and in the XML.
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