greenoaks wrote:Funkyterrance wrote:I see where you guys are coming from with the "ancient history" argument but please hear me out on this?
I'm saying that historically, conquerors have been able to bend the rules/cheat and these players are still talked about as "conquerors" as though they are the same caliber of those players who didn't commit gross abuse of the game. If these players were stripped of their medals after the fact, it would convey the message that yeah, you may be able to become conqueror by bending the rules but it won't "count" in the long run. I feel this would deter cheating on the high end of the spectrum because the goal of most conquerors is to make some sort of hall of fame so to speak. Take away this reward and future cheaters just won't bother.
you mean like how the death penalty has eliminated severe crimes in the states that still have it.
No, not like that at all.
For the most part people don't commit crimes that get them the death penalty in order to become famous/infamous. You are focusing on the punishment after the fact(if you can even call stripping of the conqerer medal from a non-deserving player a punishment), I'm not. The suggestion is more akin to the removal of something that wasn't deserved in the first place. I'm talking about eliminating the motivation to do the crime in the first place. See the difference?
jsnyder748 wrote:I mean there is always going to be a new way to reach conqueror. some of the ways people used to do it were not thought of as a gross abuse of the game until....we all realized it was.
Finding a legit conqueror is impossible. There would be a new one every day if everyone was on the same playing field. People who deserve it wouldnt get it, but those who walk the borderline of edging out points would eventaully get it and we consider this to be cheating. (farming, playing with really low ranking people on your team only)
Not tht cheaters shouldn't loose their ill begotten gifts, but what we all want is someone who plays at a high level while playing good opponents on a map/settings everyone respects as legit. To be able to reach 4500 points playing this way is currently impossible. If I were to play doubles on das schloss (A popular team game amongnst clans) there would be no way to get to a high enough score. I may be good at the map and I may win 50 percent vs other teams who know the strategy.
That is why it is impossible to get to conqueror while not bending the rules/what others find as fair play and get there.
this wasn't very well worded ,but maybe you will get my point.
The suggestion is good but this line "More players will strive for this position if they know it can only be achieved and retained without bending the rules" is the essence of who conqueror is. A rule "bender" or innovator, if you will. There is no way to get enough points without it.
I think it was worded well enough for me to get what you mean.
It sounds to me like what you are saying that it is the rule benders are the ones who prevent the legit people from getting to the top. If that's true, then this change would be a severe demotivating factor to those who are doing the bending. They would take care not to bend the rules because if they are discovered all of their hard work would be for nothing. It's not worth the risk of wasting all that effort.
As far as "no way to get enough points without it" part, those people who got such high scores ought to be "adjusted". Otherwise, you are suggesting that in the future only cheating conquerors will exist since no one can possibly get 4500 points without rule-bending. Is this really what we want to have as the future of CC?
If the "more players will strive" part should be "more legit players will strive" I am not opposed to changing the wording.
In conclusion, I'm being told that:
1. Those players who reach 4000+ points most likely gained a good deal of those points by rule bending.
2. Legitimate players have no way of reaching this score.
3. We have to accept the fact that there is no way that a legitimate player can possibly attain the position of conqueror since these "old" scores will not be removed.Wow, there has to be something seriously wrong with the system because this sounds totally screwed up.
Greenoaks, what is your suggestion as to how to extricate CC from this predicament? Focusing on future conquerors is apparently not going to solve a thing.