MrBenn wrote:The first two pages of this thread can be summarised thusly:
jiminski - was a good foundry contributor who got pissed off by the Brazil revamp.
squishyg - feels a little intimidated by long threads, doesn't feel he has anything to contribute beyond a certain point
sinctheassassin - feels that nobody cares about the foundry or shows their interest by posting
Danyael - would like more people to comment on maps
sully800 - there are over 100 maps on the site, and there aren't too many niches left to fill
jiminski - some maps gain cult following, but first-timers are likely to struggle to gain recognition
gimil - experienced mapmakers gain support by virtue of being good at making maps
jiminski - determination is vital until you are able to gain a reputation
Woodruff - Had a map idea that was pretty much ignored, and feels non-welcomed as a non-regular
owenshooter - fed up with the foundry being stuffed down people's throats; says few people venture back after visiting
mibi - retired from mapmaking, and there are too many maps to bother to comment on
Bruceswar - Regulars are praised/thanked, newcomers are criticised and never return, so the same people comment on map after map.
gimil - the foundry has its share of problems, but elitism isn't one of them
Bruceswar - everybody has to start somewhere. The foundry process is too anal over small details and is pretty backwards.
sully800 - the process is too long and tedious. The main thing that would help are more comments from more people who stick around
gimil - The 'anality' helps produce high quality maps. Increased quality by being anal is not going backwards. would like the foundry process tightened/sped up and but can't think of a viable solution without reducing quality
owenshooter - where was the tough love for Puget Sound (et al), which should have spent longer in the foundry getting more input. the foundry is elitist and is not inviting. it is a wonderful place that is fun to visit and poke around but the regulars seem to drive fresh faces away in droves
gimil - there are some people who's opinion holds more weight with me, becasue they know what they're talking about. most people in the foundry only aim to contribute to the site
samuelc812 - people get frustrated with the process in the most part because they don't have the graphic ability or their idea is not appealing to the community. perserverance is the key. try picking a promising map that you like provide feedback and be helpful
owenshooter - you are not interested in listening, just like in the foundry. if you ask for an opinion, you should let people give their opinions
samuelc812 - Just because you state your opinion does not mean everyone has to conform and start to have the same opinion.
jbrettlip - you guys are unable to see why nobody goes to the foundry, you are too arrogant to see it. this is exactly why people avoid the foundry.
RjBeals - the foundry has waves of activity depending on who is active. I don't know why people think the foundry is full of snobs. There's lots of ideas posted every week. If there's nobody there to tell these people how it really is, you'd be playing on worse maps than Puget Sound.
owenshooter - the foundry has a very poor reputation in the forums. it is a terrible place to venture into fresh faced and bright eyed if you think you are going to be able to freely speak. the foundry is a good ol' boys club
It looks like there was some fair discussion before owen, brett and gimil jumped in with all guns blazing...
good summary Mr B,
you missed my point on buddy system to ensure at least one respected commenter to bounce off for new map makers. .. (it was really the only reason i mentioned the word 'cult' at all; to say that although some maps get good lip-service due to reputation, the new fellows can just fade into obscurity.)
personally i did not find the foundry elitist .. (except maybe the first times i ventured in after the classic revamp but i was very vocal about that, heh some funny stuff in there having read back through ; ) ) i suppose i've been around a while and i'm quite gobby, sometimes up for a little verbal tussle if push comes to shove. But most people who want to start a new map are not ardent lovers of postal ruckus, many are just in it to make something pretty that they can play on.... If the brand new map maker does not have either an 'edge' or the patience of a saint, they can easily lose heart in finishing a map. Now I don't think the foundry is worse than any other forum. I think actually in most ways it is better suited to action than the other forums. Having tried to get ideas off the ground in Suggestions and Bugs, christ! now that is institutionally a waste of time, filled will trolls and tossers.
The Foundry does not take criticism well, (heheh i can hear them bristling now) i fully understand why. It is slave labour, filled with people who organise themselves for the love of the site and aesthetics, criticised by people who never visit or contribute. (i think map makers should be paid if their maps are quenched)
I get that and i tried to rectify that in my own small way by going to comment there.
I was put off going there by a very specific case, in that Revamps do not follow normal Foundry protocol. The opinion on the Brazil revamp was put to the broader community, voted on in record numbers and the ideal situation of including all the site in a map was finally achieved. There was a huge influx of discussion and excitement and it looked as though the foundry had reached its zenith: fantastic maps; a buzz in the forum and a broader audience!
They blew it royally and nearly lost one of the finest artists on the site in the process. Now if they could get it right in the future, it was a beautiful blueprint for how things could work in a more mainstream format.. maybe.
Last edited by jiminski
on Thu Jun 04, 2009 7:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.