CC Clan League 5 - Question going here

[josko.ri]

What I very like qwert is listening discussions and he change his ideas, if he see that majority of players and/or majority of arguments support other opinion. I have feeling that are missing in CL4, many players suggested many things, but TOs always decided by their own opinion. qwert, if you have wish to make this project for CL5, you have my total support, just listen majority of suggestions and implement them. I will also say my suggestions, but am short of time for now.

[qwert]

Thanks for support josko, its not going to be easy to be new official CL, because some things in official rules need to be change.
Like Clan Eligibile for Competition. This is first rule who need to be change, because in mine system ,every clan are eligibile for competition. Ofcourse need to have minimum of 10 player.

Participants must be CLA-eligible members meaning they have completed at least one 40+ challenge and adhere to the 1 competitive clan rule.

This need to be change on:
1.For Premier and First League,Participants must be CLA-eligible members meaning they have completed at least one 40+ challenge and adhere to the 1 competitive clan rule.
2.For qualification Tournament ,PArticipants must to adhere to the 1 competitive clan rule.

3.All clans need to have minimum 10 registered players,to be eligibile for competition.

[qwert]

Ok,i think that Competition format are build very good.
===========================================
Competition format

The competition format follows the usual double round-robin format. During the course of a season, each clan plays every other clan twice, once at home and once away, for a total of 26 games. Clans receive two points for a win, one point for a draw, and no points for a loss. Clans are ranked by total points, with the highest-ranked Clan at the end of the season crowned champion.

The Clan Leagues are divide in 3 lvl
1.Premier League [level 1,14 clans] botom 3 clans are relegated to First League
2.First League [level 2,14 clans] First 3 are promoted to Premier League, botom 3 are relegated to Qualification Tournament
3.Qualification Tournament [level 3, all clans who are not ranked in first 28 clans] Winner,Runer up and Winner for 3rd place are promoted to First League.

promotion:
premier league/league 1: 3 teams from premier league will drop to league 1, and top 3 teams from league 1 will advance to premier league. if one team decide not to participate in premier league before season start, their place will fill 4th team from league 1. if two or more clans decide not to participate, their places will be filled with equal number of best teams from league 1.

league 1/Qualification Tournament: 3 teams from league 1 will drop to Qualification Tournament, and their places will be filled with finalists and winner of match for 3rd place from league 2. if one or more teams from league 1 decide not to participate, empty places in league 1 will be filled with best teams from Qualification Tournament (acording to finished positions)

for example: if 1 clan from premier league and 2 clans from league 1 decide not to participate, premier league will then have all the clans that stayed in premier league plus 4 best teams from league 1. league 1 will then have all the clans stayed in league 1, plus 3 teams who dropped from premier league, plus 3 best teams from Qualification Tournament, plus 4th best clan from Qualification Tournament to fill a place for 4th clan advance to premier league, plus 5th and 6th clan in Qualification Tournament to fill the places from clans that dropped out from league 1.


TIEBREAK
If points are equal between two or more Clans, the rules are:

1.tiebreakers between two clan are applied in the following order:

a)Game difference for the entire season
b)Head-to-head results.

2.If the tie is between more than two clans, then the tie is broken, using the games the clans have played against each other:
a) head-to-head points
b) head-to-head game difference
c) head-to-head game scored

3.If the tie is still not broken, it will be resolved with a tie-break match[TBD]

[WPBRJ]

Not if you simply allow turn skipping or timing out (because neither of these things can be proven to be done with intent so it's impossible to enforce). If a player wishes to skip a turn or timeout in a nuke game then it should be his or her prerogative - treated just like a turn in no spoils - and the penalty to that player is of course an inability to fort and a missed card opportunity, so it's really not a great advantage to play it this way.

In Nukes timing out is absolutely a great advantage to play that way. That is a basic strategy.

In escalating it is pretty dumb, but can be advantageous at certain times. I think timing out should come with rules against, like the CL4 has.

So you are prepared to penalise someone for losing his internet connection? And if so, just what manner of penalty would be written in the rules?

As I say.....too hard to prove and too difficult to come up with any fair punitive measure.

And in angola's own words re timing out in nukes: "That is a basic strategy"

We are playing a strategy game after all.

I have timed out in the past, and it made me uncomfortable. Yet I did it.

I own up to that.

That doesn't make it right going forward.

I hope this league goes in front of the CLA, so I can vote that the rules for timing out from CLA4 goes into effect for this league as well.

this setting has no business in any clan event!!!! there loopholes and to say its a strategy is BS. one of my clan mates had a complaint filed against him on this setting and was warned if he continued to time out further action would be taken on him by admin. so to say this is a strategy is bull shit when the site it self is warning players not to do it or else.

and if someone want to play all 104 home games on trench, then i dont have nothing against this.

I would, and I expect all my fellow clan members would too, which may prompt us to withdraw.

You can't have a clan choosing 100% trench, that's just crackers.

'Trench League', by qwert.

Suddenly I am no longer enthused by qwert's ideas & ability.

wow now that its a setting you don't like it should be limited? you adamantly voiced your opinion for your crony friend on unlimited setting and said it should be allowed. now you are saying on another skilled setting that it should be limited i don't understand. i certainly have not played a lot of trench but it seems to be very popular so far and i have not herd of any loophole as of yet. it absolutely take a certain skill level to be successful at it but some how you feel this setting should be limited.

[Chariot of Fire]

Wow, what a tosser

[lynch5762]

Not if you simply allow turn skipping or timing out (because neither of these things can be proven to be done with intent so it's impossible to enforce). If a player wishes to skip a turn or timeout in a nuke game then it should be his or her prerogative - treated just like a turn in no spoils - and the penalty to that player is of course an inability to fort and a missed card opportunity, so it's really not a great advantage to play it this way.

In Nukes timing out is absolutely a great advantage to play that way. That is a basic strategy.

In escalating it is pretty dumb, but can be advantageous at certain times. I think timing out should come with rules against, like the CL4 has.

So you are prepared to penalise someone for losing his internet connection? And if so, just what manner of penalty would be written in the rules?

As I say.....too hard to prove and too difficult to come up with any fair punitive measure.

And in angola's own words re timing out in nukes: "That is a basic strategy"

We are playing a strategy game after all.

I have timed out in the past, and it made me uncomfortable. Yet I did it.

I own up to that.

That doesn't make it right going forward.

I hope this league goes in front of the CLA, so I can vote that the rules for timing out from CLA4 goes into effect for this league as well.

this setting has no business in any clan event!!!! there loopholes and to say its a strategy is BS. one of my clan mates had a complaint filed against him on this setting and was warned if he continued to time out further action would be taken on him by admin. so to say this is a strategy is bull shit when the site it self is warning players not to do it or else. I tend to agree with this.

and if someone want to play all 104 home games on trench, then i dont have nothing against this.

I would, and I expect all my fellow clan members would too, which may prompt us to withdraw.

You can't have a clan choosing 100% trench, that's just crackers.

'Trench League', by qwert.

Suddenly I am no longer enthused by qwert's ideas & ability.

wow now that its a setting you don't like it should be limited? you adamantly voiced your opinion for your crony friend on unlimited setting and said it should be allowed. now you are saying on another skilled setting that it should be limited i don't understand. i certainly have not played a lot of trench but it seems to be very popular so far and i have not herd of any loophole as of yet. it absolutely take a certain skill level to be successful at it but some how you feel this setting should be limited.

But not this... You don't have to limit trench as long as....... you don't mind having week 1 games still going on during week 36

[The Voice]

Com'on, guys. No single person is going to get everything he or she wants. If I'm not mistaken, the CLA exists so that every competitive clan can have a voice if it so chooses. If we can't be reasonable, at the very least civil, this thread will soon be archived and locked, and we'll have to start from square one again. Let's not make this about who can put the most exclamation points in a post or throws the most insults.

EDIT: Didn't see lynch's post. More should be like this. So, what if round limits were mandated for every trench game?

[uckuki]

trench problem is easily solved by round limit. 20 or 25 rounds should do it.

I don't think we need a limit on number of games for nukes or unlimited,
just don't see the point.

[qwert]

people i expect constructive discussion, not quarrel in circle.

Trench and NUke and Unlimited forts are open for constructive disscusion, how many games to allow, and in what way to solve possible long games on trench settings. Some normal option who will be accepted for everybody its need to be implemented.
If you have some need to continue with this, then please continue in PM. This discusion its not constructive at all.
Thanks.

[qwert]

Com'on, guys. No single person is going to get everything he or she wants. If I'm not mistaken, the CLA exists so that every competitive clan can have a voice if it so chooses. If we can't be reasonable, at the very least civil, this thread will soon be archived and locked, and we'll have to start from square one again. Let's not make this about who can put the most exclamation points in a post or throws the most insults.

EDIT: Didn't see lynch's post. More should be like this. So, what if round limits were mandated for every trench game?

Im creator of this topic,and im very civil,and very polite , and speak normal with people. Its not mine fault if some person want to start some insult war here, then i need to be punished, because i want to try to create something good.
Mods need to send warning to this person not to lock mine topic.

[The Voice]

Com'on, guys. No single person is going to get everything he or she wants. If I'm not mistaken, the CLA exists so that every competitive clan can have a voice if it so chooses. If we can't be reasonable, at the very least civil, this thread will soon be archived and locked, and we'll have to start from square one again. Let's not make this about who can put the most exclamation points in a post or throws the most insults.

EDIT: Didn't see lynch's post. More should be like this. So, what if round limits were mandated for every trench game?

Im creator of this topic,and im very civil,and very polite , and speak normal with people. Its not mine fault if some person want to start some insult war here, then i need to be punished, because i want to try to create something good.
Mods need to send warning to this person not to lock mine topic.

I know, qwert. This was an (unofficial) warning to those who have flamed, i.e., not you. In any case, people don't even have to listen to me, as I have no power to lock a thread. My suggestion is for everyone to take a deep breath before typing and then review it before submitting it.

[Ace Rimmer]

Big problem with teams and round limits which would affect the suggestion to add round limits to trench games: the round limit just looks at most troops per INDIVIDUAL, not per TEAM. Vote here to show your support to change this: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=172014

Ace

[Ace Rimmer]

Double post!

Qwert wants feedback on the penalties for breaking the rules.

Violations to be penalized for:
1.Use same map more then once
2.In one round play more then 3 game
3.Use nuclear settings more than limit
4.Use trench settings more than limit
5.Use Unlimited fort more than limit

I don't think there should be separate penalties for each separate violation. I think it should be a sliding scale, taking into account all violations. I also think it should be clear that it is not up to the organizer(s) to watch for violations, but they will address them if they are brought to the organizer's attention.

First violation: warning
Second violation: remake of game
Third violation: forfeit of game
Fourth violation: replacement of clan member as main contact
Fifth or more violations: forfeit of game

EDIT: Forgot to mention I don't think #3 (nuke limit) or #5 (unlimited limit) should be in here. I feel clans should have enough experience with these games that they should not be limited at this point. A great clan can play and win with no limitations. I agree with a trench limit due to long games, but I'm not sure if it should be limited to certain map sizes or types instead of a game number limit.

[Ace Rimmer]

The main objection people raised against fixed divisions was that it creates issues if a high-ranked clan does not participate then wants to join in a later season - they would then have to play through the leagues or a clan in a higher division gets unfairly relegated.

Has there been a high ranked clan that skipped a year in the clan league? I know THOTA skipped the CC, but hasn't the Official Clan League (OCL, I just made that up) always had all the top clans participating? I think that if a clan avoids the OCL, then they either have too few members participating or are on the decline, and I do not see an issue with a clan needing to start over at the bottom the next year to prove themselves again. Why would you have a clan and choose NOT to join the only official clan event?

in reply to CoF/qwert discussing game size: I see both points of view about an even number with wins/draws and an odd number with wins only. I am leaning towards qwerts proposal for having wins/draws because I think a clan should be recognized for playing well enough to earn a draw. I agree that 8 games is best (I agree 6 is too small of a sample size), 2d/3t/3q. I am torn on 2 pts or 3 pts for a win. I'm leaning towards 3pts, because I think that if you win a week, you should get a bigger advantage than a draw. You should get more than 1 extra point for winning a week instead of a draw, because it is much tougher to win a week.

With the schedule, it should be easy to set it up so a clan does not have two home weeks in a row, to negate the work that CoF was talking about.

[qwert]

damn, no2 are change to be apply for all competitions(Premier-First-Qualification)
"
Brake rules penalties (under construction)
1.if clan use same map more then once
-[rule description]
2. if one player plays more then its allowed (week-round)
-[rule description]
3.if clan uses nuclear settings more times then its allowed
-[rule description]
4.if clan uses trench settings more times then its allowed
-[rule description]
5.if clan uses unlimited settings more times then its allowed
-[rule description]
6.--[add more if miss something]"