The Official Clan Sitting Rules (Old Version)

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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Funkyterrance on Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:52 pm

Nicky15 wrote:I am not sure what fun is being ruined, unless you get your fun from sharing accounts with your friends :? If you want to discuss your turn with your teammates, what is stopping you..... :? You cannot and could never have had under the old existing rules, someone come into your account and leave chat in your games. take your own turns, play your own games, that is all we are saying. If you can't take your turns that is what the rules are for.


Yes!!!
The reason these new rules were enacted was due to people abusing the privilege of being able to take turns for someone else in their unexpected absence. Some people were treating this privilege like an open-to-interpretation right to take turns for someone else whenever it was convenient. Again, I say don't blame admin, blame the people abusing the system.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Funkyterrance on Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:59 pm

uckuki wrote:wouldn't sharing accounts be 2 people using 1 account. if a player already has an
account and logs into friend's acct to take a look at the game, leave a note, take the
turn or whatever, that's cooperation not account sharing. :?:
first time I hear about it being against the rules and I don't see a good reason why it
shouldn't be allowed. Account sharing should be forbidden and I have no problem with that.

what kills fun is having more and more rules and regulations instead of
it being just a game of chance & rolling dice. :(


The reason it's forbidden is that in the clan setting you could end up getting one player making decisions for everyone else and thus not reflecting the clan's skill as a whole but merely the skill of a few choice players. This defeats the whole purpose of clanwars and even clans in general.
There is a reason there is a limit to how many games each player can partake in during a war: to prevent puppet mastering of clans.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby stahrgazer on Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:33 pm

Nicky15 wrote: Can we please stop the drama, and give these rules a chance to settle. In the future you can judge us on how we deal with reports and you will see we are fair. If we aren't then you can be as dramatic as you wish.
But please lets stop creating a fuss about all the what ifs and maybes and see how this goes 1st.


CDs are creating the "drama" by posting hour restrictions on turn-sitting rather than looking for abuses by folks, as you say:
Nicky15 wrote: If we look and player A did in fact take some of his own turns in that 12 hours, played a few speed games, had a nice long chat in LC, posted in the forums. etc etc Then quite obviously that will be an infraction as player a was clearly able to take his own turns.


And as you indicate, the other restrictions already existed, so why the need to repost them?

And when you have folks with the "sense of humor" as you refer to chemefreak, who continually thinks it's just fine to post in the same threads first as a mod/director then when called on things, claim he's now posting as "just a member/leader of his own clan" you've got to be kidding if you think folks like that give evidence that we can trust them to be 'fair.'

Still looks like power play but omg, ppl who call what they see are "creating drama" for you. :roll:
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Nicky15 on Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:01 pm

It's not a power play. All we have done is clear up the grey areas so everyone knows what is and is not allowed. And created a framework so that we can actually punish people who abuse the system.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Nicky15 on Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:03 pm

Squirly wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:
These rules will come into force Monday after we have had the chance to pm all clan leaders and make sure everyone is aware.

Thanks

The CD team.


so when do these rules come into effect?
I haven't received any pm's from any of you. My co leaders haven't either.
Maybe you've only sent pms to the clans that have caused the need for all these additional rules?
that would actually make sense.


I have looked it up. Ishihara received one on behalf of ID
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby stahrgazer on Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:03 am

Nicky15 wrote:It's not a power play. All we have done is clear up the grey areas so everyone knows what is and is not allowed. And created a framework so that we can actually punish people who abuse the system.


Overly restricting when someone can, and cannot, sit in for an away player is not "clearing up a grey area."

Not sitting in on a game while the original owner is in chat, etc. was already part of the rules, so again, not "clearing up a grey area."

Site already supposedly had a framework to punish people who abuse the rules, so again, not "clearing up a grey area."
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Nicky15 on Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:13 am

stahrgazer wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:It's not a power play. All we have done is clear up the grey areas so everyone knows what is and is not allowed. And created a framework so that we can actually punish people who abuse the system.


Overly restricting when someone can, and cannot, sit in for an away player is not "clearing up a grey area."

Not sitting in on a game while the original owner is in chat, etc. was already part of the rules, so again, not "clearing up a grey area."

Site already supposedly had a framework to punish people who abuse the rules, so again, not "clearing up a grey area."


We are not restricting sitting when it is prearranged "with permission." We are only restricting emergency cover when you have had no contact.

Many people are/were unaware of even the existing site rules, as proven by the posts in this threads. So yes we have cleared up grey areas for many.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby macbone on Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:44 am

Nicky15 wrote: The hour rule is being discussed with Clan reps and whatever the majority decide in regards to that will determine if that is changed or not.


Nicky, I like this a lot. I hope in the future other clarifications of what's acceptable behavior will also be dealt with by surveying the people involved and getting their feedback.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Nicky15 on Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:46 am

macbone wrote:
Nicky15 wrote: The hour rule is being discussed with Clan reps and whatever the majority decide in regards to that will determine if that is changed or not.


Nicky, I like this a lot. I hope in the future other clarifications of what's acceptable behavior will also be dealt with by surveying the people involved and getting their feedback.


Indeed. This will be one of the primary uses for our new group CD and Friends, every clan has been invited to put forward a rep, and all clan issues will be discussed in there.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby chapcrap on Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:37 pm

Nicky15 wrote:It has always been against site rules to be in someones account for any other reason than to sit a turn.

Does this include not logging in for people who are inactive so that you can edit their forum posts with the private clan forum?
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Nicky15 on Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:42 pm

chapcrap wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:It has always been against site rules to be in someones account for any other reason than to sit a turn.

Does this include not logging in for people who are inactive so that you can edit their forum posts with the private clan forum?


Editing war threads is fine, as long as you are not involved in games
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby crispybits on Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:53 pm

Nicky15 wrote: The hour rule is being discussed with Clan reps and whatever the majority decide in regards to that will determine if that is changed or not.


Can I just ask why our nominated clan rep for clan FISO hasn't been invited to any new usergroup or discussions yet please?

(not having a go, I'm sure it's just an admin oversight)
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby stahrgazer on Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:43 pm

Nicky15 wrote:Many people are/were unaware of even the existing site rules, as proven by the posts in this threads. So yes we have cleared up grey areas for many.


Making a new set of rules to restate existing rules isn't clearing up a "grey area" and especially when some of the directors are claiming you guys "put alot of thought into these." You put alot of thought into how to repeat what the site already says?

I appreciate you reviewing the 1-hour thing. If someone's abusing existing site rules by taking turns excessively when they were not specifically asked to do so, they can do that excessive taking at 1 hour till as easy as 3 hours till; but if someone says, "I'm not sure if I'll be on tonight, will you watch my games for me?" it can be mighty inconvenient to have to wait (to avoid any questions).

When I read through the comments in this thread, it looks like no one's objecting to cracking down on excessive use of "sitting." I'm not the only one, however, who objects to the idea that it's not excessive at 1 hour but it's excessive at 3 hours, which is what these rules currently imply.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Nicky15 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:33 am

stahrgazer wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:Many people are/were unaware of even the existing site rules, as proven by the posts in this threads. So yes we have cleared up grey areas for many.


Making a new set of rules to restate existing rules isn't clearing up a "grey area" and especially when some of the directors are claiming you guys "put alot of thought into these." You put alot of thought into how to repeat what the site already says?

I appreciate you reviewing the 1-hour thing. If someone's abusing existing site rules by taking turns excessively when they were not specifically asked to do so, they can do that excessive taking at 1 hour till as easy as 3 hours till; but if someone says, "I'm not sure if I'll be on tonight, will you watch my games for me?" it can be mighty inconvenient to have to wait (to avoid any questions).

When I read through the comments in this thread, it looks like no one's objecting to cracking down on excessive use of "sitting." I'm not the only one, however, who objects to the idea that it's not excessive at 1 hour but it's excessive at 3 hours, which is what these rules currently imply.


Last response as i don't think it really matters what I say this may carry on forever. The rules are there so everyone is aware of what they are old, and new. Anyone can see by reading this thread that many people were not even aware of existing rules, so we are quite justified in putting them in black and white. These rules are not hard to follow. They are not here to punish honest players. Have a Merry Christmas.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby eddie2 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:48 am

Nicky15 wrote:
Squirly wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:
These rules will come into force Monday after we have had the chance to pm all clan leaders and make sure everyone is aware.

Thanks

The CD team.


so when do these rules come into effect?
I haven't received any pm's from any of you. My co leaders haven't either.
Maybe you've only sent pms to the clans that have caused the need for all these additional rules?
that would actually make sense.


I have looked it up. Ishihara received one on behalf of ID


who recieved it for aka
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Nicky15 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:58 am

eddie2 wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:
Squirly wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:
These rules will come into force Monday after we have had the chance to pm all clan leaders and make sure everyone is aware.

Thanks

The CD team.


so when do these rules come into effect?
I haven't received any pm's from any of you. My co leaders haven't either.
Maybe you've only sent pms to the clans that have caused the need for all these additional rules?
that would actually make sense.


I have looked it up. Ishihara received one on behalf of ID


who recieved it for aka


Bruce has the list of people pmed and I am waiting for him to pass it along. I will re-issue the pms when I get the list. As a bunch seem to have gone unread/lost.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby ViperOverLord on Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:01 am

Bruceswar wrote:
ViperOverLord wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:We are not trying to make things difficult, less fun.....


And yet, that's precisely what a rule that says you are only to account sit when a game has one hour or less does. Do you know how freaking annoying that is?


The one hour rule was put into place so it gives the player every chance to take his own turn. I think we both know that this is why we have it at an hour. This is to keep the abuse from happening.


I don't know if any progress has been made in the last 18 pages. Assuming not__ The one hour rule is a freaking terrible rule. I'm not going to sugar coat it. All of the sudden, account sitters need to get up at 3 in the morning if the turn is ending at that time? That's just freaking terrible. That'd be worse than not allowing account sitting at all.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Bones2484 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:17 am

ViperOverLord wrote:I don't know if any progress has been made in the last 18 pages. Assuming not__ The one hour rule is a freaking terrible rule. I'm not going to sugar coat it. All of the sudden, account sitters need to get up at 3 in the morning if the turn is ending at that time? That's just freaking terrible. That'd be worse than not allowing account sitting at all.


If you are a legit account sitter (meaning someone is away from the site) you can take the turn at any time. I know you didn't read the last 18 pages, but you could have at least read the first post.

As for the one hour, that is only when you do not have explicit permission from that person to cover turns for the immediate future. One hour is being generous as you really shouldn't ever be on someone's account without permission.

I know it sucks to have missed turns, but thinking back to G1's recent wars it happens to us maybe once per war? It's a team competition and part of the team dynamic is knowing you can trust people to take their own turns. A missed turn is part of the overall (lack of) strength of the clan. But seriously... is it THAT big of a deal to have a rare missed turn? You guys are arguing over something that should not happen more than in extremely rare circumstances anyways.

Are your clanmates that unreliable that they disappear without asking someone to cover for them on a regular basis? Maybe you shouldn't be placing those individuals in important games.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby ViperOverLord on Fri Dec 21, 2012 2:26 pm

^^^

Who the heck is concerning themselves with whether advance permission was given for account sitting? And even if he/she/they did, it'd require a tedious investigation. If over-use of account sitting is a problem, then I have no problem with discussing potential options. But this current rule does not seem to even be practical.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby SirSebstar on Fri Dec 21, 2012 2:54 pm

considering it is to eliminate excessess, its then perfect.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Funkyterrance on Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:18 pm

Bones2484 wrote:I know it sucks to have missed turns, but thinking back to G1's recent wars it happens to us maybe once per war? It's a team competition and part of the team dynamic is knowing you can trust people to take their own turns. A missed turn is part of the overall (lack of) strength of the clan. But seriously... is it THAT big of a deal to have a rare missed turn? You guys are arguing over something that should not happen more than in extremely rare circumstances anyways.

Are your clanmates that unreliable that they disappear without asking someone to cover for them on a regular basis? Maybe you shouldn't be placing those individuals in important games.


Watch out bones, your attempt to cut through bullshit will not be well received. ;)
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby Bones2484 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:56 pm

Funkyterrance wrote:Watch out bones, your attempt to cut through bullshit will not be well received. ;)


I'm used to it by now! But someone has to call out the obvious.

I just have an extremely hard time grasping why so many of these hyper-competitive clans appear to have "issues" getting their own turns taken or merely letting someone know they will be away from the site. I consider G1 to be exceptionally casual and, like I said, we very very very rarely have missed turns.
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby eddie2 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:01 pm

ViperOverLord wrote:
Bruceswar wrote:
ViperOverLord wrote:
Nicky15 wrote:We are not trying to make things difficult, less fun.....


And yet, that's precisely what a rule that says you are only to account sit when a game has one hour or less does. Do you know how freaking annoying that is?


The one hour rule was put into place so it gives the player every chance to take his own turn. I think we both know that this is why we have it at an hour. This is to keep the abuse from happening.


I don't know if any progress has been made in the last 18 pages. Assuming not__ The one hour rule is a freaking terrible rule. I'm not going to sugar coat it. All of the sudden, account sitters need to get up at 3 in the morning if the turn is ending at that time? That's just freaking terrible. That'd be worse than not allowing account sitting at all.


some has been made certain rules have been made more clear but as per usual the op thread has not been updated to what else has been said
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby rh-headhunter on Fri Jan 18, 2013 10:32 pm

my two cents,i have asked to have people watch my acct from time to time,and have sat for people who were travelling..it is extra work to cover for people in a busy life..i really dont have time to sit and wait for last hour,,if i can log on and make extra plays in a 24 hour timeframe,i feel like im helping a friend and that should be the end of story,,,if somebody is unemployed and running all four in a quads game ,then let him or boot him off site if people cant accept it,,the poor guy has no life and wants to do the best he can at a gameing site..there are worse things to deal with in life..getting four people to play coordinated as a team is a challange and maybe one person taking all the turns is an advantage,,but i dont want to be dealing with any more rules than we already have,,please keep it to a minunum. O:)
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Re: The Official Clan Sitting Rules

Postby SirSebstar on Sun Jan 20, 2013 1:39 pm

rh-headhunter wrote:my two cents,i have asked to have people watch my acct from time to time,and have sat for people who were travelling..it is extra work to cover for people in a busy life..i really dont have time to sit and wait for last hour,,if i can log on and make extra plays in a 24 hour timeframe,i feel like im helping a friend and that should be the end of story,,,if somebody is unemployed and running all four in a quads game ,then let him or boot him off site if people cant accept it,,the poor guy has no life and wants to do the best he can at a gameing site..there are worse things to deal with in life..getting four people to play coordinated as a team is a challange and maybe one person taking all the turns is an advantage,,but i dont want to be dealing with any more rules than we already have,,please keep it to a minunum. O:)


if you are sitting for someone who cannot play for himself, and you arranged that, thats fine.
these rules are only to limit those with acces to your pw to take games you could have taken yourself
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