CCup4 Comment Thread

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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby jj3044 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:56 pm

eddie2 wrote:also take into account that aoc empire have also posted that they are talking about joining the newcomers cup. So they want to be classed as a new clan to join that event. but classed as a old clan to join this one take your finger out josko and look at what is happening properly because to me it is looking like they want the best of both worlds.

We are planning on playing in the CC4, not the NC...

NC would only have been applicable if we were denied entrance in CC4 and if the powers at be saw this as a "new" clan, instead of a merge, which is what we see it as. So it is a moot point...
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby shoop76 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:11 pm

I see signups are supposed to end on the 19th. What happens if EMPIRE still has an ongoing war?
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby jj3044 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:31 pm

shoop76 wrote:I see signups are supposed to end on the 19th. What happens if EMPIRE still has an ongoing war?

My understanding is that the particular players who still have (old) clan games ongoing will not be able to play until those are finished. It shouldn't be an issue with the merged clan as there will still be plenty of players that do not have any active clan games (those from AOC) to start off. Plus, I would imagine there will be a play-in round ... so it shouldn't matter anyway.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby shoop76 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:34 pm

jj3044 wrote:
shoop76 wrote:I see signups are supposed to end on the 19th. What happens if EMPIRE still has an ongoing war?

My understanding is that the particular players who still have (old) clan games ongoing will not be able to play until those are finished. It shouldn't be an issue with the merged clan as there will still be plenty of players that do not have any active clan games (those from AOC) to start off. Plus, I would imagine there will be a play-in round ... so it shouldn't matter anyway.


Ok thanks for answering the question. Good luck in CC4 and with the new clan.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby eddie2 on Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:31 am

jj3044 wrote:
eddie2 wrote:also take into account that aoc empire have also posted that they are talking about joining the newcomers cup. So they want to be classed as a new clan to join that event. but classed as a old clan to join this one take your finger out josko and look at what is happening properly because to me it is looking like they want the best of both worlds.

We are planning on playing in the CC4, not the NC...

NC would only have been applicable if we were denied entrance in CC4 and if the powers at be saw this as a "new" clan, instead of a merge, which is what we see it as. So it is a moot point...


well at least you guys understood the rule that you were not eligible for this event.... or you would not of posted in nc.... but please stop calling what you have done as a merger it is not a merger.
merger=acquisition
An acquisition or takeover is the purchase of one business or company by another company or other business entity. Such purchase may be of 100%, or nearly 100%, of the assets or ownership equity of the acquired entity. Consolidation occurs when two companies combine together to form a new enterprise altogether, and neither of the previous companies survives independently. Acquisitions are divided into "private" and "public" acquisitions, depending on whether the acquiree or merging company (also termed a target) is or is not listed on a public stock market. An additional dimension or categorization consists of whether an acquisition is friendly or hostile.

Achieving acquisition success has proven to be very difficult, while various studies have shown that 50% of acquisitions were unsuccessful.[1] The acquisition process is very complex, with many dimensions influencing its outcome.[2] "Serial acquirers" appear to be more successful with M&A than companies who only make an acquisition occasionally (see Douma & Schreuder, 2013, chapter 13).
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby chemefreak on Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:39 am

eddie2 wrote:
well at least you guys understood the rule that you were not eligible for this event.... or you would not of posted in nc.... but please stop calling what you have done as a merger it is not a merger.
merger=acquisition


I guess they don't teach this kind of stuff in those GED classes...

"When one takes over another and completely establishes itself as the new owner, the purchase is called an 'acquisition'. From a legal point of view, in an acquisition, the target company still exists as an independent legal entity, which is controlled by the acquirer."

"In the pure sense of the term, a 'merger' happens when two firms agree to go forward as a single new entity rather than remain separately owned and operated."
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby eddie2 on Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:45 am

Consolidation occurs when two companies combine together to form a new enterprise altogether, and neither of the previous companies survives independently.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby chemefreak on Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:48 am

eddie2 wrote:Consolidation occurs when two companies combine together to form a new enterprise altogether, and neither of the previous companies survives independently.


Actually, that is not true. A consolidation necessarily requires the survival of one of the consolidated entities. At least legally speaking. The Empire-AoC thing is a merger. No question about it.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby eddie2 on Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:00 am

chemefreak wrote:
eddie2 wrote:Consolidation occurs when two companies combine together to form a new enterprise altogether, and neither of the previous companies survives independently.


Actually, that is not true. A consolidation necessarily requires the survival of one of the consolidated entities. At least legally speaking. The Empire-AoC thing is a merger. No question about it.


is it now well lets see.

empire=32 members.
agents of chaos = 22 players.

this equals 54 players.
The Ultimate Agents of the Empire of Supreme Chaos = 34 players

this makes it that there are still 20 players left that have not joined this merger so if these 20 players start a new clan and say they are merging with each other you will have to give them the same option of allowing them entry to this event. could you say these 20 players were not happy with the merger ??? you could also say these 20 players have made both clans not as strong as they were before. you could say there could be more players to leave this new group.
you could say that these 20 players (might be 10 players from each clan wanted to carry on as clans with 10 players each making this new group unable to have either of the stats of any of the 2 clans.) making it you will have to rank every new clan.

were these 20 players that have not joined asked if they wanted to keep there clans as clans or user groups or did you just go with the majority leaving wanting a new clan...
if it was a merger i think we should of seen at least 80 percent of all members going to the new clan which has not happened.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby jetsetwilly on Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:03 am

eddie2 wrote:
chemefreak wrote:
eddie2 wrote:Consolidation occurs when two companies combine together to form a new enterprise altogether, and neither of the previous companies survives independently.


Actually, that is not true. A consolidation necessarily requires the survival of one of the consolidated entities. At least legally speaking. The Empire-AoC thing is a merger. No question about it.


is it now well lets see.

empire=32 members.
agents of chaos = 22 players.

this equals 54 players.
The Ultimate Agents of the Empire of Supreme Chaos = 34 players

this makes it that there are still 20 players left that have not joined this merger so if these 20 players start a new clan and say they are merging with each other you will have to give them the same option of allowing them entry to this event. could you say these 20 players were not happy with the merger ??? you could also say these 20 players have made both clans not as strong as they were before. you could say there could be more players to leave this new group.
you could say that these 20 players (might be 10 players from each clan wanted to carry on as clans with 10 players each making this new group unable to have either of the stats of any of the 2 clans.) making it you will have to rank every new clan.

were these 20 players that have not joined asked if they wanted to keep there clans as clans or user groups or did you just go with the majority leaving wanting a new clan...
if it was a merger i think we should of seen at least 80 percent of all members going to the new clan which has not happened.


Eddie, take the chat away please, it's been done to death and has no place in this thread anymore. It's also got nothing to do with you so please stop trolling.

Most of the other players have either retired, decided to take a break or were already inactive. A couple joined new clans.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby eddie2 on Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:28 am

jetsetwilly wrote:
eddie2 wrote:
chemefreak wrote:
eddie2 wrote:Consolidation occurs when two companies combine together to form a new enterprise altogether, and neither of the previous companies survives independently.


Actually, that is not true. A consolidation necessarily requires the survival of one of the consolidated entities. At least legally speaking. The Empire-AoC thing is a merger. No question about it.


is it now well lets see.

empire=32 members.
agents of chaos = 22 players.

this equals 54 players.
The Ultimate Agents of the Empire of Supreme Chaos = 34 players

this makes it that there are still 20 players left that have not joined this merger so if these 20 players start a new clan and say they are merging with each other you will have to give them the same option of allowing them entry to this event. could you say these 20 players were not happy with the merger ??? you could also say these 20 players have made both clans not as strong as they were before. you could say there could be more players to leave this new group.
you could say that these 20 players (might be 10 players from each clan wanted to carry on as clans with 10 players each making this new group unable to have either of the stats of any of the 2 clans.) making it you will have to rank every new clan.

were these 20 players that have not joined asked if they wanted to keep there clans as clans or user groups or did you just go with the majority leaving wanting a new clan...
if it was a merger i think we should of seen at least 80 percent of all members going to the new clan which has not happened.


Eddie, take the chat away please, it's been done to death and has no place in this thread anymore. It's also got nothing to do with you so please stop trolling.

Most of the other players have either retired, decided to take a break or were already inactive. A couple joined new clans.


hum trolling how is that this event is still open for sign ups and minds can be changed.. what i have just brought up is something that could affect this event. which as a clan leader is something the clan will have to take into account and something which needs to be asked about.

where as you have josko in here going on about something that has happened in another event slagging off that event leader spamming this events convo thread with issues from another event. Have you told him to stop trolling this thread ???? my awnser is no because it involves your clan and fighting on your side....

has there been another issue surrounding this kind of behavior in the past let me see.

ow yes last year i wasnt happy that aka had to play a full round of random games for a stage start i did not know about.. the issue was dealt with and 1 organizer started going off about me questioning it. this was all done via pm and not in public...

so josko is going off about aoc empire being removed from cl5 he has came to ccup4 thread slagging off qwert..

are you clan mods going to issue the same punishment issued to me last year...

which was if kort get to a medal situation in cl5 he will not get 1. if he posts in any thread slagging off qwert further steps will be taken. and he is not allowed to post in cl5 thread again or further steps will be taken.. lets just see if you will issue same punishment to another member doing the same as me last year.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby swimmerdude99 on Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:55 am

Eddie, you aren't really discussing CC4. You are talking about stuff that is completely irrelevant? Why don't you just state your problems and then when there are things brought up to argue against your posts, don't talk about your clan and what happened there. Talk about the clans at hand. Your experiences (if I am correct) Have NOTHING to do with any players in AoC and EMP. If your problem is that you think we aren't capable of holding together... (I assume that is it) Would you like us all to post here saying we approve of our leaders and are all working together well?

I guess... to me its hard to respect what you are trying to discuss when you seem to just be talking off of a grudge? I think? I don't know it seems hard to understand. Maybe try restating your opinion and problems with what is happening and say WHY as related to the group you speak of.

I think the issue you have is that you think we aren't going to stick together and work as a group? Well that should be dissproven rather easily by knowing that both clans have great leadership and that all the players support the group. We support our leaders and no one has any problems... We are like a big family cuddling on the couch... in front of a fire watching "Its a wonderful life" with snow falling outside and popcorn and sugar cookies in our lap.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby eddie2 on Sun Apr 14, 2013 5:15 am

swimmerdude99 wrote:Eddie, you aren't really discussing CC4. You are talking about stuff that is completely irrelevant? Why don't you just state your problems and then when there are things brought up to argue against your posts, don't talk about your clan and what happened there. Talk about the clans at hand. Your experiences (if I am correct) Have NOTHING to do with any players in AoC and EMP. If your problem is that you think we aren't capable of holding together... (I assume that is it) Would you like us all to post here saying we approve of our leaders and are all working together well?

I guess... to me its hard to respect what you are trying to discuss when you seem to just be talking off of a grudge? I think? I don't know it seems hard to understand. Maybe try restating your opinion and problems with what is happening and say WHY as related to the group you speak of.

I think the issue you have is that you think we aren't going to stick together and work as a group? Well that should be dissproven rather easily by knowing that both clans have great leadership and that all the players support the group. We support our leaders and no one has any problems... We are like a big family cuddling on the couch... in front of a fire watching "Its a wonderful life" with snow falling outside and popcorn and sugar cookies in our lap.


swimmer i am talking about this event. but lets list what my problems are about all of this and you can go see why i am pissed of.. ps me using examples for what has happened to me aka and time are not used as a grudge just examples of previous similar issues and the punishments issued.

1)The way they took this event off of dako
2)the way they said all clans could have a say on the format then went the opposite of what the majority of clans voted for.
3)clan mods laying down a law that all clans must join cdf to join events.
4)changing the rules for acceptance to cdf when you merged toghther.
5)changing the rules for signing up to this event when you merged together. to allow you entry.
6)being told i am trolling this thread when what another player is doing is worse but ok with them because they are defending the aoc empire merger.

now what rules for clans have clan mods ignored...
1)the sign ups 1 complete challenge 1 month active which was made easier because it was 2 complete challenges and 3 months active.
2) the fact that all aoc empire players did not join your merger meaning them players who did not have the option to keep empire and aoc as active clans.
3)this one is a big one...
Abandoned Clan Wars: Clans that abandon a challenge will lose clan gaming privileges for 3 months.
this means your merged clan should not be allowed privileges for this event but is once again being over looked.

plz don't get me wrong but i have read and have played against several members of your new clan. and respect you guys.but can you not see there has been major issues in this event and it all boils down to how clan mods have acted.

can you not see that you atlantis and vvv joining this event is showing disrespect for all the other clans that have been victim to the rules that have been in place from day 1.

just now what i am seeing is that clan mods are saying show these guys some respect because they are long time serving members of the clan community. but you guys are not showing respect to the clan community by joining up to this event, when clan mods have twisted and bent so many rules surrounding this event to allow you to take part which they have not done in the past to allow other clans to join.

also you could say that if only one of my problems of this event happened it would be a bit annoying and could be forgotten about but because there has been loads of broken promises and twisting of rules and demands from clan mods put it all together and it is a big issue.

clan mods have admitted that i have been victim of bad organizers but what has happened so fair in this event is worse than all them bad organizers put together.

these are my problems about it all and i think they are fair points.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby jetsetwilly on Sun Apr 14, 2013 5:20 am

Ok Eddie, we know how you feel, it's all been said now many times. Nearly everyone else is moving on. Time for you to do the same. You've elected not to take part so there's not need for you to be involved any further.
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Re: CCup4 Comment Thread

Postby eddie2 on Sun Apr 14, 2013 5:54 am

jetsetwilly wrote:Ok Eddie, we know how you feel, it's all been said now many times. Nearly everyone else is moving on. Time for you to do the same. You've elected not to take part so there's not need for you to be involved any further.


jet set like i have said nothing is set in stone yet. from what i can see there is still 6 days left for sign up..

but let me understand this one from the privs rules

Abandoned Clan Wars: Clans that abandon a challenge will lose clan gaming privileges for 3 months.


did aoc empire not abandon cl5 by merging into a new clan instead of a existing clan during the group stages. instead of end of the first stage...

or is this another rule you are going to ignore because 2 of your members are actually clan mods.

and ps this new thing is something that has been brought up in talks outside of the forums... and not just me..

Abandoned Clan Wars: Clans that abandon a challenge will lose clan gaming privileges for 3 months.

I just noticed this in the clan priviledges section. why hasn't this been brought up? if they abandoned CL5 but are new but the same, doesn't the abandonment count then and keeps them out of CC4? unless they are 100% new, then they should have an abandonment on their record
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