TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby grifftron on Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:48 am

Man VOL. Its really important to you to push for people elected mods. What if it does happen someday and those mods end up being people that you don't like once again... than what?

They are not going to change the system because 2-3 people don't like the current mods.

-griff
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:23 am

grifftron wrote:Man VOL. Its really important to you to push for people elected mods. What if it does happen someday and those mods end up being people that you don't like once again... than what?

They are not going to change the system because 2-3 people don't like the current mods.

-griff


Whatever, dude. I've made no case for voting based upon simply not liking the current mods. Some of us believe that voting creates the fairest system possible. But, I guess I can say that over and over and people like you will still come with your false accusations anyways. And more often than not, these false accusers, such as yourself, are people from certain clans who are all too happy to keep insider politics as the status quo.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby angola on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:31 am

You think The Pack is apart of insider politics in relation to the CDs? Are you new to the clan scene?
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby grifftron on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:35 am

For the record, I don't know, or talk to any of the current CD's...

So your talking about making false statements... there is no "inside" clan world.. its all in your head bhra.. its a risk gaming site, we come here to play games. If there is by chance, a 5-6 people scene of a so called "insider politics", I don't see how this will effect wars, and it for sure wont effect how your dice roll in a game... time to move on

edit: opps hold on.. i see your in the CDF... THAT WOULD BE THE INSIDE CLAN WORLD... your more inside than me my friend.

-griff
Last edited by grifftron on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:37 am

angola wrote:You think The Pack is apart of insider politics in relation to the CDs? Are you new to the clan scene?


I can't tell you exactly what each and every clan's sway is behind the scenes. But, to me, that's the problem. The system needs to be above board. That CC4 crap was just hours of arguing while the CDs were giving more merit to certain clan's criticisms behind the scenes. That can't happen any more. All clans need to be respected equally and things need to be done above board. And there needs to be a mechanism in place for the clan world to get who they trust and not merely the picks of insiders.

grifftron wrote:For the record, I don't know, or talk to any of the current CD's...

So your talking about making false statements... there is no "inside" clan world.. its all in your head bhra.. its a risk gaming site, we come here to play games. If there is by chance, a 5-6 people scene of a so called "insider politics", I don't see how this will effect wars, and it for sure wont effect how your dice roll in a game... time to move on

edit: opps hold on.. i see your in the CDF... THAT WOULD BE THE INSIDE CLAN WORLD... your more inside than me my friend.

-griff


CC4 was rife with insider politics and that's well documented, dude. Why do you continue to come at me with your ignorant statements?
Last edited by ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby TheMissionary on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:46 am

Look at the American government. Everyday people are complaining about Congress, the President, Laws, Bills, ect. The people elected these people, and then as soon as it doesn't go their way, the are the first ones to point the finger. The majority rarely takes the time to research their votes. They just expect things to be 'different'. The only way things change is when people come together and address things as a whole. Let your opinion out, and a seed is planted. This doesn't mean it will be in effect over night. Just like a tree, an idea has to grow. As things grow they change, adapt to their surroundings. This site has been around for a while, there is still a lot of growing to do. So I say, instead of lashing out at the imperfections(that will always be there), put forth the effort to change things. Sitting around complaining and lashing out, at a system that does it's best to find a median for everyone, isn't going to solve anything.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:51 am

TheMissionary wrote:Look at the American government. Everyday people are complaining about Congress, the President, Laws, Bills, ect. The people elected these people, and then as soon as it doesn't go their way, the are the first ones to point the finger. The majority rarely takes the time to research their votes. They just expect things to be 'different'. The only way things change is when people come together and address things as a whole. Let your opinion out, and a seed is planted. This doesn't mean it will be in effect over night. Just like a tree, an idea has to grow. As things grow they change, adapt to their surroundings. This site has been around for a while, there is still a lot of growing to do. So I say, instead of lashing out at the imperfections(that will always be there), put forth the effort to change things. Sitting around complaining and lashing out, at a system that does it's best to find a median for everyone, isn't going to solve anything.


This is a nice flowery speech. But, realistically, it's not an argument for or against elections per se. My view on elections is not that it makes everything better or perfect; merely that it's the right step in the right direction and the first step in truly offering equal sway for each and every clan. CC4 made it clear to me, that insider networks have more power than the clans as a whole.
Last edited by ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby TheMissionary on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:54 am

ViperOverLord wrote:
TheMissionary wrote:Look at the American government. Everyday people are complaining about Congress, the President, Laws, Bills, ect. The people elected these people, and then as soon as it doesn't go their way, the are the first ones to point the finger. The majority rarely takes the time to research their votes. They just expect things to be 'different'. The only way things change is when people come together and address things as a whole. Let your opinion out, and a seed is planted. This doesn't mean it will be in effect over night. Just like a tree, an idea has to grow. As things grow they change, adapt to their surroundings. This site has been around for a while, there is still a lot of growing to do. So I say, instead of lashing out at the imperfections(that will always be there), put forth the effort to change things. Sitting around complaining and lashing out, at a system that does it's best to find a median for everyone, isn't going to solve anything.


This is a nice flowery speech. But, realistically, it's not an argument for or against elections per se. My view on elections is not that it makes everything better or perfect; merely that it's the right step in the right direction.


I am not saying I am for, or against elections. I am simply stating that elections do not change things, people do. This isn't a totalitarian system, why fight against it? Everyone's considerations are taken into account. You can't please all the people, all the time, but you can please some of the people, some of the time.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby TheMissionary on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:56 am

CC4 is a thing of the past, CDs are only human. Isn't the CDF designed to offer equal sway for each and every clan?
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:58 am

TheMissionary wrote:
ViperOverLord wrote:I am not saying I am for, or against elections. I am simply stating that elections do not change things, people do. This isn't a totalitarian system, why fight against it? Everyone's considerations are taken into account. You can't please all the people, all the time, but you can please some of the people, some of the time.


If you setup the system to be as fair as possible from the outset; then the inevitable problems are minimized later. Systems without proper rigors are destined for chaos. So, frankly, I find your well intentioned rhetoric to be apathetic and misguided.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby grifftron on Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:01 am

VOL bhra... you don't agree with anything anyone says... maybe its you?

just a thought from a friend.

-griff
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:01 am

TheMissionary wrote:CC4 is a thing of the past, CDs are only human. Isn't the CDF designed to offer equal sway for each and every clan?


In theory the CDF was to give us a greater voice. But, then when a vote didn't go the way of the insiders, then it was scrapped. You can think that's a thing of the past; but what changed? If anything, they just learned to be more sly and bypass us if we might be a roadblock to what they want. An election (to say nothing of bylaws) at least creates an overarching accountability that they'll be more desirous to engage the community (and I'm not saying that they don't in a great many instances as it stands).
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby TheMissionary on Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:04 am

ViperOverLord wrote:
TheMissionary wrote:You can't please all the people, all the time, but you can please some of the people, some of the time.


If you setup the system to be as fair as possible from the outset; then the inevitable problems are minimized later. Systems without proper rigors are destined for chaos. So, frankly, I find your well intentioned rhetoric to be apathetic and misguided.


This is what this debate is over isn't it? We have a handful of people, within the masses, who feel they are discriminated against by a so called "inner circle". Therefore they want an election of 'power' (which in reality is delegated to volunteers), to be distributed to people who could potentially be of the same resolve. Makes sense to you I guess, but I'm not sure I can understand your logic.

Edit: Maybe it is just a way to give you verification of what you will point your finger at next. Knowing something exists as opposed to assuming, doesn't make any situation easier to resolve.
Last edited by TheMissionary on Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:05 am

grifftron wrote:VOL bhra... you don't agree with anything anyone says... maybe its you?

just a thought from a friend.

-griff


Who is anyone? The three people who are online chatting right now? Perhaps, I am in the minority. Perhaps, I'm in the silent majority. I fight for what I think is right either way.
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Re: TeamCC Callout: Clan Director Position(s)

Postby ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:09 am

TheMissionary wrote:
ViperOverLord wrote:
TheMissionary wrote:You can't please all the people, all the time, but you can please some of the people, some of the time.


If you setup the system to be as fair as possible from the outset; then the inevitable problems are minimized later. Systems without proper rigors are destined for chaos. So, frankly, I find your well intentioned rhetoric to be apathetic and misguided.


This is what this debate is over isn't it? We have a handful of people, within the masses, who feel they are discriminated against by a so called "inner circle". Therefore they want an election of 'power' (which in reality is delegated to volunteers), to be distributed to people who could potentially be of the same resolve. Makes sense to you I guess, but I'm not sure I can understand your logic.

Edit: Maybe it is just a way to give you verification of what you will point your finger at next. Knowing something exists as opposed to assuming, doesn't make any situation easier to resolve..


I think it's a mistake to minimize this debate to a matter of margins on the performance of potential CDs. The community as a whole that gets to vote for who represents them on important matters, gets respect out of the gate and that sets a proper tone.

As for finger pointing; I really don't know what you're talking about. I've largely argued for a fairer system and minimized talk regarding individuals. Nor do I know what this even refers to: "Knowing something exists as opposed to assuming, doesn't make any situation easier to resolve."
Last edited by ViperOverLord on Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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