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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Tue Jul 08, 2008 3:51 pm

Visaoni wrote:2) Do we have any agnostics so far? If not then it might not be worth pursuing that angle. As far as I can tell, they are going to be in the extreme minority, and to some degree may feel a little left out and might not be totally comfortable within the clan.


No worries, you ain't heavy,... you're my brother....
We'll make sure that Agnostics always have a place. Don't ever think you don't belong.

Visaoni wrote:I'm very partial to the teapot idea, or something similar. Perhaps somebody can find a creative way to associate God and the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

:lol:

Visaoni wrote:And I think the quote was something along the lines of "I can think a garden is beautiful without believing their are fairies living in it." I don't think that is exactly right, but I'm pretty sure it is close.

Make a nice banner quote....

Visaoni wrote:I agree with Haggis again. You did all this, so you might as well take the lead role. Once the clan is up and running we can have elections for how we want to run it from there.

That's exactly how I feel. I'm not electing myself supreme chancellor of anything.


Visaoni wrote:Oh, don't worry. We'll find something. "Atheist Clan" won't be it for sure.

I hope not too, but really, you can't make a joke out of Atheist/Agnostic clan. It would really hurt flame wars.

Visaoni wrote:I think the hardest part of all this is going to be finding a reference everybody is going to get. Many people who are well-read in their Atheist literature will get many of the ideas suggested already, but we need to find something that doesn't require any previous knowledge. The JCers had it easy. Anybody able to get online knows who Jesus is.


Ditto, that's my hang-up too. it's hard to be witty if you're the only one who gets it.
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby MeDeFe on Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:27 pm

Oh well, I'm in, just for the hell of it. (pun Pun PUN)

As for names... I rather liked the "loyal opposition" one. But in order to appear constructive I will make a suggestion of my own as well.

The Faithful Nonbelievers

A nice paradox and a wonderful starting point regarding what one can have faith in (humanity? taxes and death? cheeseburgers?), and I think the name's FW compatible as well. More than "The Atheist Clan" at any rate.


The only thing still needed is a clan for every other major religion out there, then we could have religious wars and stuff. World history played out all over again on World 2.1, and USApocalypse, too, just for jay.
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:47 pm

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MeDeFe wrote:The Faithful Nonbelievers
I like this one too. This one and the Loyal Opposition one. It is pretty important to be FW compatable isn't it?
Someone has to educate me on the Teapot one!!!!!

And calling ourselves the spagetti monsters or whatever was funny too. I have only really belonged to one club afore this one. While I was in jail my cellys and I called ourselves Team Awesome. The cell next to us was "Team Alright I Guess." Good chess games, I tell you what. It's important to have an awesome name. It's permanent.

MeDeFe wrote:The only thing still needed is a clan for every other major religion out there, then we could have religious wars and stuff.

Yeah, I mention this in my very first post ever. If there are enough Atheist/Agnostics here that can band together, then surely we should see 'The Army of Islam,' 'Buddah's Buddies,' and such. Of course the Pagan/Wiccans clan is slowly coming together too.

Packrat says we should just start a callout for "the leftovers."

MeDeFe wrote:USApocalypse, too, just for jay.

:lol: :lol:


I have been tearin' up the web looking for quotes or jokes or anything that can be used to find a good name. My search isn't going to hot. I even asked some friends and their best idea was "The Big Bangs." Funny, but stupid.

Here are the first couple of sites with quotes that I visited, but I didn't find anything useful. Even the already established Atheist groups out there have crap for names. Except of course, for "the Brights."

http://www.chrisbeach.co.uk/viewQuotes.php
http://www.atheistempire.com/greatminds/index.php
http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/qframe.htm
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Ray Rider on Tue Jul 08, 2008 6:44 pm

Visaoni wrote:To be honest I think it would be fun if the two clans constantly had a couple games going on. Those who cared could keep track of who had won more games, but there wouldn't have to be an official score or anything. Hopefully after a bit some usual players would emerge, and people would know enough other enough to get some good natured banter going back and forth. Although I do think CC would need to see an official tournament sometime.

I'm interested :)
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Tue Jul 08, 2008 7:07 pm

Ray Rider wrote:
Visaoni wrote:To be honest I think it would be fun if the two clans constantly had a couple games going on. Those who cared could keep track of who had won more games, but there wouldn't have to be an official score or anything. Hopefully after a bit some usual players would emerge, and people would know enough other enough to get some good natured banter going back and forth. Although I do think CC would need to see an official tournament sometime.

I'm interested :)


Good RAY RIDER! I don't speak for everyone, but I don't think the clan as a whole is ready to commit to said games. However, we will be! I don't even know how many of us would like to be competative. Right now I'm only lookin' at three.
If you want to discuss it with THE JESUS FREAKS that is fine by me. I don't know that they as a whole are down with it, ya know? But I bet that they know this callout is here.

Anyway, not now, but soon?

First things first, we need a name and description.
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Visaoni on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:01 am

Juan_Bottom wrote:
Visaoni wrote:2) Do we have any agnostics so far? If not then it might not be worth pursuing that angle. As far as I can tell, they are going to be in the extreme minority, and to some degree may feel a little left out and might not be totally comfortable within the clan.


No worries, you ain't heavy,... you're my brother....
We'll make sure that Agnostics always have a place. Don't ever think you don't belong.


I'm not sure if you got the impression I was one, but I'm not. I'm just thinking that if we don't have any so far, I don't think we'll find too many joining. And if we there are say, 2 people who think a god/supernatural power/whatever might exist and the rest of us really are quite devoted to the idea that there isn't, I'm just not sure how it'll work out for them. Well, actually, never mind. They'd still have fun making fun of how some people have such an extreme faith in something without any real thought. Yes I know JCers, you'll tell me you have, but personally I find it hard to believe anybody has truly thought about it just for themselves, excluding outside influences, without finding themselves an Atheist or at the very least an Agnostic.

Juan_Bottom wrote:Someone has to educate me on the Teapot one!!!!!


If somebody told you there was a tiny teapot out in orbit in the solar system, but it was so small no telescope could see it, would you believe it? Because that is exactly what religion asks of you. I can't remember who came up with that originally (I know I first encountered it in Dawkin's book, but I think it was originally from somebody else) but it instantly became a favorite of mine. Like the last "quote" this one is not exact, but fairly close.

Names... hm...
Voice of Reason. I don't really like it, but I suppose it is at least accurate and easy to understand.
We Don't Label Our Ignorance. Don't Label Your Ignorance. Don't Label Ignorance. ("If the history of science has shown us anything, it is that we get nowhere by labelling our ignorance "God." -Jerry Coyne) Of the three I prefer the first one, but it is kind of long, semi-hard to get (the exact reference will be lost on most people, but if they know it is an Atheist clan they'll at least get the gist of it), not really funny. Although the first one isn't funny, it has a humorous quality that is hard to pin down.
Dinosaurs Ate my (you may include "Great"s to your hearts content) Mother. Poking fun at creationism. Not so great.
Devoted Skeptics. It needs some tweaking, but if somebody could come up with a more elegant way of putting it I think it would have great potential. My example is not obvious enough, but the basic idea is that although we are skeptical of religion, hypocritically we are skeptical of our own lack of religion. You guys know what I mean.
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Haggis_McMutton on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:32 am

The teapot was originally coined up by Bertrand Russell( which is why it`s called Russell`s teapot :P)

Here`s what he said( thanks wiki)
If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is an intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time.

This later led to the creation of the term "teapot agnostic", for the people who are strictly agnostic about the existence of the teapot :lol:


Also I found that Adams quote:

“Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?”
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby MeDeFe on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:59 am

Maybe we could be the "Faery Garden" then. But that's almost as gay as the name of a certain bounty-offering clan...
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Neoteny on Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:14 am

MeDeFe wrote:Maybe we could be the "Faery Garden" then. But that's almost as gay as the name of a certain bounty-offering clan...


It would make a lovely banner...
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Neoteny on Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:47 am

Also, I'm cool with teapot references if we can get something that sounds nice. We might run into the problem of recognition though. How many non-atheists are familiar with Russell?
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:12 am

Visaoni wrote:I'm not sure if you got the impression I was one, but I'm not.

My bad. I know that UNIT_2 is, and I believe GDEANGEL is too. I believe most Agnostics are, because they will never know just where we come from. Though they've already ruled some "stuff" out. lol....



WAIT GDEANGEL, ARE YOU IN????



Thank you both for educating me on a "teapot agnostic."

MeDeFe wrote:Maybe we could be the "Faery Garden" then. But that's almost as gay as the name of a certain bounty-offering clan...

Probably more. And that's pretty difficult to pull off. But Faeries wear boots I hear.

Neoteny wrote:Also, I'm cool with teapot references if we can get something that sounds nice. We might run into the problem of recognition though. How many non-atheists are familiar with Russell?

I am an Atheist, and I'd never heard of it. Not that it wasn't pretty.
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Haggis_McMutton on Wed Jul 09, 2008 10:22 am

Just remembered a Carl Sagan quote that i used a lot in sigs a while ago, might work in the description

"For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
- Carl Sagan

Replacing me with us probably.

Btw. while searching for that said quote, i discovered another Sagan quote which apparently confirms that he also was an apple pie enthusiast.

"In order to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe."
- Carl Sagan

Mmm, pie.
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Wed Jul 09, 2008 10:41 am

So just to have all suggestions in one place...

Neoteny wrote:
The Loyal Opposition

"To you I'm an atheist; to God, I'm the Loyal Opposition."

gdeangel wrote:There is nothing comical about calling a clan "Atheist Clan" or the "Islamist Clan". That's just factional.

Visaoni wrote:I'm very partial to the teapot idea, or something similar. Perhaps somebody can find a creative way to associate God and the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

MeDeFe wrote:The Faithful Nonbelievers

Visaoni wrote:Voice of Reason.

Visaoni wrote:Dinosaurs Ate my (you may include "Great"s to your hearts content) Mother.

Visaoni wrote:We Don't Label Our Ignorance. Don't Label Your Ignorance. Don't Label Ignorance.



We're definitly lacking in the creativity area. Spagetti Monster, Teapots, Faeries, or even somehow calling ourselves 'the Davids." I don't know, they're great suggestions, but no one has a good way to turn them into our name.

And In my travels looking for a name these past two days, I've also stumbeled upon churches calling Atheist movements "the Big Secular Agenda." Made me laugh.

Followers of Gosh seems like a fair suggestion. Though prolly not worthwhile.
I think I'll believe in Gosh instead of God. If you don't believe in Gosh too, you'll be darned to heck.
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It's like David and Goliath, only this time David won!-- Homer Simpson

I've found dozens of decent Ideas, but nothing that I think works 100%. This is harder than I thought...

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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Wed Jul 09, 2008 10:42 am

Haggis_McMutton wrote:Btw. while searching for that said quote, i discovered another Sagan quote which apparently confirms that he also was an apple pie enthusiast.

"In order to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe."
- Carl Sagan


:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Haggis_McMutton on Wed Jul 09, 2008 12:17 pm

What about Hank. Is he decently well known? if yes we could make a Hank reference in the name perhaps.

Or just add something about "wieners in buns, no condiments" somewhere as a really obscure insider joke that 0.01% of the general population will get :lol:

P.S. from the posted names i equally like Loyal opposition and Faithful nonbelievers.
If we could only add a joke/obscure reference somewhere in there it`d be perfect :P
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby MeDeFe on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:00 pm

What's wrong with "Faerie Garden"?
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby kagetora on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:00 pm

I'll join an Athiest clan
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Visaoni on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:00 pm

So far my favorite is Faithful Non-believers, but as Haggis said, I would really like to see some sort of joke in it. Faithful Non-believers is getting there, but somehow it just doesn't have the right kind of ring. The first time I heard Jesus Freaks I thought it rather funny and astonishingly honest. From a fairly anti-religious perspective obviously. I think we need to go for the same thing. As usual, these are not refined enough, but what about something along the lines of the Satanic Atheists or Strictly Religious Atheists? It's amazing how often religious people lump Satanism and Atheism together as the same thing.

Actually, that makes me think of a question. Perhaps our occasional JC visitors can answer it for me. What is worse to Christians, Satanism or Atheism? Satanism worships your God's antagonist while Atheism flat out denies your God exists.

I've been doing some web research of my own, and I just found a name that I don't particularly like, but I feel it's on the right path.. sort of. OMG There is No God.
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:10 pm

kagetora wrote:I'll join an Athiest clan


Wonderful! If you have any awesome name ideas, we would love to hear them.

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MeDeFe wrote:What's wrong with "Faerie Garden"?


Welp, In my all-important OPINION..... It is almost too easy to insult, and it is too indirect a statement about Atheism. Plus, it has the word "Faerie" in it. And while sure, it is demoralizing to lose to a "faerie," it really isn't that intimidating.....
Plus, Faerie is slang for another worldly minority....<---no offence or anything!
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby kagetora on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:16 pm

Godless Heathens
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:19 pm

kagetora wrote:Godless Heathens

:lol: :lol: :lol:


I don't know if that was a joke or not, but it was awesome!!!!
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Visaoni on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:19 pm

Hm... What about "We Didn't Start the Crusades" ("The Crusades? Wasn't Us") or "We Never Burned Anybody at the Stake"? Just pointing out well known extreme things religious groups have done and (sort of) making fun of it.
"Apollo? Inti? Ra? Surya? Jesus? What's the Difference?" Names can be changed/added/removed as needed, but the idea is both obvious and somewhat obscure. The obvious is that they are all gods of various cultures and each religion somehow knows that it's god/gods are the real ones, but we just denounce them all. The more obscure is that they are all sun gods. If you've seen the Zeitgeist you'll know what I mean about Jesus being a sun god.

And another big problem with Faerie is that it isn't spelled that way. ;)
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby kagetora on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:22 pm

I think I saw part of that, but I had to go so I couldn't finish.

As for Godless Heathans, I was serious. I've heard it in movies and stuff like that, often said by people like Crusaders swearing at Muslims and stuff like that
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby Visaoni on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:23 pm

Juan_Bottom wrote:
kagetora wrote:Godless Heathens

:lol: :lol: :lol:


I don't know if that was a joke or not, but it was awesome!!!!


Actually, I think it was a name idea... and I kind of like it. I wish we could fit an obscure reference in the name, but if not... Godless Heathens is great.
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Re: Atheists!?!

Postby kagetora on Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:25 pm

Burned Godless Heathens

(referencing witch trials)
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