Ability to see teammates cards/spoils [Pending]

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Postby lackattack on Thu Aug 09, 2007 12:02 pm

The arguement "but team games are about WORKING AS A TEAM" reminds me of the arguement against the check box for team-only comments in the chat. Established teams were using IM for coordination and didn't need that feature. But I'm always in favour of evening out the playing field between established teams and pickup teams.

So IMO the pros are:

* evens the playing field
* simplifies team communication

The cons are:

* may encourage teammates to act unilaterally
* somewhat clutters the game layout

The pros seem to outweigh the cons, but since it's not 100% and a lower priority than other stuff I want to get done, I'm classifying this as pending for now.
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Postby Gilligan on Thu Aug 09, 2007 12:06 pm

Better than nothing :wink:

Thanks lack.
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Postby AAFitz on Thu Aug 09, 2007 9:37 pm

lackattack wrote:The arguement "but team games are about WORKING AS A TEAM" reminds me of the arguement against the check box for team-only comments in the chat. Established teams were using IM for coordination and didn't need that feature. But I'm always in favour of evening out the playing field between established teams and pickup teams.

So IMO the pros are:

* evens the playing field
* simplifies team communication

The cons are:

* may encourage teammates to act unilaterally
* somewhat clutters the game layout

The pros seem to outweigh the cons, but since it's not 100% and a lower priority than other stuff I want to get done, I'm classifying this as pending for now.


I completely agree that we should have it...as well as all the greasemonkey stuff (except the expectations of card armies that based on odds of getting armies, and not an actual number of armies recieved)

I love all the information...its a computer game, and all the info just makes it easier to refine the play of the game(i know im over your head now lack)...

but I have to admit, I do miss the days of looking at the board and having to guess how many armies the opponents had...having to guess how many cards they had...so that it was work to play....now im not about to go back to that anymore than im about to throw away my visa card, and go hunt for food, but part of me will always miss the days of no info.... where you had to rely on pure instinct...or actually manually count the armies and cards...
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Postby firth4eva on Fri Sep 14, 2007 1:58 pm

bump
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Postby ParadiceCity9 on Fri Sep 14, 2007 4:46 pm

Kaplowitz wrote:I like it!
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Postby muy_thaiguy on Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:16 pm

I think it is a good idea. 8)
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Postby Gilligan on Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:18 pm

WOAH it turned into 34 to 11 :shock:

I think it should be implemented, now :wink:
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Postby dcowboys055 on Fri Sep 14, 2007 11:09 pm

muy_thaiguy wrote:I think it is a good idea. 8)
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Postby Gilligan on Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:59 am

39 to 12 now.
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Postby insomniacdude on Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:20 am

I don't get the argument. displaying team cards will eliminate team communication? Sure it will, from the poorly organized team. If I'm going to come up with plan, I always take into account my teammate's strength and cards. Instead of waiting for a reply in chat on what cards they have and THEN formulate the strategy, I can see the cards they have and formulate it then. If anything this will only help team communication because it allows more fluidity of ideas and plans, and it lets them out faster.

To simplify:
I'm on a team with Yellow. I just woke up and somehow have time before class starts, so I decide to check my games. I see that I have a turn in my team game with yellow, and that It's been my turn four about 14 hours. I see that red did a particularly nasty move against us. Normally, I would have to write in chat/PM about what kind of cards my teammate has (if they have 3 or more cards). They respond four hours later, giving me six hours left on my turn. I get my answer and share my thoughts on what to do based on the card set yellow has. Yellow hears my idea and approves...or denies and says we should go with his plan. Either way. After all is sad and done, I have 13 minutes left to take my turn.

If the cards were displayed for the team, that would have completely eliminated one of the steps and saved, potentially, hours of time with which to take my turn.

If anything, this feature could only OPEN communications because you can see your teammate's potential powerbase as a whole instead of what's simply on the map. You can actually invision COMPLETE team tactics on the fly without waiting for a response from your teammate, thus allowing more ideas to come faster.

And yeah, there will be some teammates who end up not saying a thing in the chat. But with or without this feature they aren't very good teammates anyway and deserve whatever loss they might get. Big whup.
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A No Vote

Postby Aerial Attack on Tue Sep 18, 2007 10:48 pm

I don't think that it will actually help communication. Teammates that communicate will do so no matter what aids they have. Teammates that do NOT chat don't chat anyways.

Good teammates express their thoughts (and options) AFTER each turn they take. Usually the only time you need approval BEFORE your turn is before the FIRST turn of the game. Obviously things change ...

Here is an example:

Team 1 Member 1: I had really bad dice and wasn't able to take territory X, so continent A is up for grabs (big bonus). If they take it, you have to do what you can to delay any bonus. Otherwise, go after the large # of outliers with only 1 army
Team 1 Member 2: I just barely managed to get in there and take the bonus away. They can't get it back until before my turn - assuming I'm still there (almost a wasted army if the next person takes me, since they need to then be taken out) deploy to me. Then do what you can about the outliers.
...
Team 1 Member 1: Grrr, I finally got a set of RED cards (two greens) and no bonus terrs.
Team 1 Member 2: I have a MIXED set (on 3 cards) with bonuses on each terr
...
Team 1 Member 1: You know, the only reason I play with you is that your luck is SO much better than mine *lol*
Team 1 Member 2: Yup
...
Team 1 Member 2: Oh yeah, hold off on taking territory Z for 1 turn, I have a set and a bonus on that terr.


Much of the conversation above would not take place if people knew their partners cards.

So, the thing about needing to have your thoughts validated ... bogus.

You need to offer options after each of your turns. If your teammate doesn't follow any of those suggestions, they need to respond with why not (unless it's self evident, like they eliminated an opponent). And your teammates need to express their thoughts/options after each turn as well.

Disclaimer: Some teammates who play with one another a LOT don't always communicate these things in chat. Why, you ask? Mainly because they can almost think like their partners and know what that partner would do or want them to do.
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Postby thedude13 on Thu Sep 20, 2007 4:10 pm

Obviously, joining a team game with people you know is an excellent idea. However, you don't always know people that are playing at the time or might not know anybody at all. Also, as far as the communicating thing, not everybody playing is capable of communicating in everyone else's language or even cares about communication in the first place. Some players are just a**holes. Therefore, being able to see teammates cards is an excellent idea. The Dude abides.

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Re: A No Vote

Postby insomniacdude on Thu Sep 20, 2007 4:23 pm

Aerial Attack wrote:You need to offer options after each of your turns. If your teammate doesn't follow any of those suggestions, they need to respond with why not (unless it's self evident, like they eliminated an opponent). And your teammates need to express their thoughts/options after each turn as well.


You don't think at all that a person can come up with options faster if they know their teammate's cards as they come up with ideas?

I don't disagree with your idea on good teammanship, but displaying cards can only facilitate the free flow of ideas between GOOD teammates. If I have up to five options I could take, four of them are completely dependent on the cards of my teammate, why should I risk the time limit running out and me losing my turn waiting for a reply from my teammate about his cards?
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Postby RobinJ on Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:05 pm

While I know team games are all about communication, it would be nicer to just know what your teammate has by looking. (some can be very uncommunicative). But I'm happy with pending for the moment... as long as it comes
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Postby Ishiro on Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:05 pm

Just use chat. And if your partner won't use chat, PM them. If they don't respond to PMs, they probably make a good ignore candidate.
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