Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

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Want "Fog of War" to really "Fog up" ("?")?

Yes, please "Fog up" (place a "?") in the number of regions category.
6
29%
No, keep "Fog of War" as it is.
15
71%
 
Total votes : 21

Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby Queen_Herpes on Mon Dec 07, 2009 2:55 pm

The new integrated system which displays game player's number of regions, number of armies, and number of spoils has a flaw. When the game is foggy (Fog-of-War has been chosen) the number of territories is sunny (not foggy) and visible to opponents.
Concise description:
  • Fog-up the number of regions when Fog-of-War is chosen as a game setting.

Specifics:
  • Make Fog of War how it should be, and used to be for non-script users
  • Prevent opponents from knowing how many regions you have
  • Put the work in the hands of the opponent to scroll the Game Log for your number of regions

This will improve the following aspects of the site:
  • This will make the game truly fog-of-war as it was before the new integration was added to the game board. While certain scripts might allow players to know how many regions an opponent has in fog-of-war, it would be vastly more interesting and challenging to have the number of regions fogged up by the actual game interface.
  • Keeps Fog-Of-War truly foggy. By allowing us to see our opponents number of regions, we can intuitively determine how many armies they will receive on their turn. Certainly some players may start a game with a bonus, but we can see that in the game log. If we're required to look to the game log for data about bonuses, then put us in the position of determining the number of teritories by looking at the Game Log as well.
  • xxxxxxx
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Re: Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby yeti_c on Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:09 pm

No - you probably only want this so you can farm people who aren't as experienced as you.

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Re: Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby Choco on Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:10 pm

Either fog the log, or let it be as it already is.
There should be no disadvantages for not knowing about the scripts, for that just gives you a really cheap advantage.
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Re: Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby Queen_Herpes on Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:16 pm

yeti_c wrote:No - you probably only want this so you can farm people who aren't as experienced as you.

C.


Fail on your part. This has nothing to do with farming. I want the honus put on the player to count or check the log. That's what I had to do before this interface was added and I think it is good to require players to be more actively involved in the game in this manner.
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Re: Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby Queen_Herpes on Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:18 pm

Choco wrote:Either fog the log, or let it be as it already is.
There should be no disadvantages for not knowing about the scripts, for that just gives you a really cheap advantage.


IT isn't about NOT KNOWING ABOUT SCRIPTS. Some players, like me, cannot use scripts.

This suggestion is about making players do the work to determine the number of territories in a fog game.

Fogging the log is a separate suggestion and I support it.
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Re: Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby karelpietertje on Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:37 pm

Queen_Herpes, both the replyers in this thread are right.
This change would only make that there is an advantage for those who use BOB over those who cannot use BOB, like you.
Imagine a freestyle terminator fogged game, where the player with BOB knows in 2 seconds if his target has another territory elsewhere, and can start moving immediately, where a player without BOB has to check the log of last round to decide if he can go for it.

So as a matter of fact, this wíll be about some people knowing about scripts and other not knowing, or not being able to use, them.
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Re: Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby Queen_Herpes on Mon Dec 07, 2009 4:40 pm

karelpietertje wrote:Queen_Herpes, both the replyers in this thread are right.
This change would only make that there is an advantage for those who use BOB over those who cannot use BOB, like you.
Imagine a freestyle terminator fogged game, where the player with BOB knows in 2 seconds if his target has another territory elsewhere, and can start moving immediately, where a player without BOB has to check the log of last round to decide if he can go for it.

So as a matter of fact, this wíll be about some people knowing about scripts and other not knowing, or not being able to use, them.


And again, NO, that is not what this is about. If there is an issue with speed freestyle being problematic to have to scroll, then why aren't you watching the game when it happens? You wouldn't need to scroll to the game log as you watch your enemies region count increase. Your point is moot anyways. This takes one aspect of the challenge and one aspect of the fun out of the game. When you play the board game you have to finger count your opponents territories. In this version, you can finger count with the log and track it with a post to yourself in the game chat (if need be.)

And if speed freestyle fog is the only problem, then there should be a separate option to fog the region count OR speed freestyle fog should keep the count on there.
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Re: Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby karelpietertje on Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:02 am

Of course there is an issue in speed freestyle games!
In those, it happens that 2 players are rushing to kill a third one, and you are waiting with another player to be the one who takes the last territory.
So as the targetted player is getting killed at about 2 territories per second, I will have a great advantage with my BOB, who tells me exactly what the target is at.
My competitor, who is also waiting, has no BOB, so he has no way of keeping up with the kill.
I have an unfair advantage.

And in the other gametypes, taking away the stats still means some need less time to decide what to do, and others have to take more time for it.
This is just unfair.

I know it wasn't about these scripts when you thought of this suggestion, but you just can't ignore the fact that the scripts will be there.

Well, I guess we can't agree about this. We can just let the topic die like 90% of the sugs in this forum. :roll:
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Re: Fog up # of regions in "Fog of War"

Postby Queen_Herpes on Tue Dec 08, 2009 11:07 am

karelpietertje wrote:Of course there is an issue in speed freestyle games!
In those, it happens that 2 players are rushing to kill a third one, and you are waiting with another player to be the one who takes the last territory.
So as the targetted player is getting killed at about 2 territories per second, I will have a great advantage with my BOB, who tells me exactly what the target is at.
My competitor, who is also waiting, has no BOB, so he has no way of keeping up with the kill.
I have an unfair advantage.

And in the other gametypes, taking away the stats still means some need less time to decide what to do, and others have to take more time for it.
This is just unfair.

I know it wasn't about these scripts when you thought of this suggestion, but you just can't ignore the fact that the scripts will be there.

Well, I guess we can't agree about this. We can just let the topic die like 90% of the sugs in this forum. :roll:


But its been played that way for so LONG. I don't have scripts and I play and win freestyle games. Even Freestyle fog games...so why now should everyone have a "pointer" that relatively few players held in the past? I get it that it is an unfair advantage, but that unfair advantage has been around for a while and there are still others in the scripts that make the game "unfair" as you might say. To me...it makes the game more challenging. I like playing a speed game against a player who has clickable maps. I feel like a stronger player for having beaten them. I also like to NOT KNOW how many regions my opponents hold because I believe that challenge is a GOOD ONE. I feel better after having won a game where I didn't know how many regions my opponents held. Now, it is boringly easy and I know exactly when I need to attack my opponent to knock them down below an army threshold. The same goes for them...I'm just wondering why bonuses are fogged because that is still comething you can intuitively determine from the game log.
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