No points for games on Beta maps

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No points for games on Beta maps

Postby trapyoung on Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:32 pm

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Just a quick thought, I'll fill out the form later if people think this is a good idea - but why are points awarded for games on beta maps? Game play can change because of XML updates that can completely flip the outcome of a game and maps are put into beta to determine if gameplay is balanced, the site even acknowledges how beta maps might be severely skewed. If that's the case, then why award points on beta maps at all?

Some may think that without points people won't play or test beta maps b/c no true incentive but people will continue to do so because (1) people like new maps, (2) those related to the foundry will want to test a map and (3) individuals may want to practice and learn a map before its released from beta. Just makes sense to not do points on beta maps because of the risk of farming, gameplay inequities and massive ad hoc revisions.
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Re: No points for games on Beta maps

Postby drunkmonkey on Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:51 pm

I think this is a great idea.
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Re: No points for games on Beta maps

Postby Arama86n on Mon Oct 25, 2010 3:35 pm

In some ways it's a great idea, but, do we want to give people the option of playing without risking points? I can see especially high ranked people taking full advantage of this...
To be honest I'd sure try out all Beta maps if this was implemented. I mean, pass up a chance to do reconnaissance on new maps risk-free? Any competitive clan player would be mad to pass up such an opportunity.
Also, you'd have to block BETA map games from being eligible towards medals... otherwise... well obvious consequences.

End of the day, I'm very sceptical to tampering with the "there is no gain without risk" philosophy... and when I say gain I don't just mean points and medals, but experience too.

:|
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Re: No points for games on Beta maps

Postby trapyoung on Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:22 pm

Arama86n wrote:In some ways it's a great idea, but, do we want to give people the option of playing without risking points? I can see especially high ranked people taking full advantage of this...
To be honest I'd sure try out all Beta maps if this was implemented. I mean, pass up a chance to do reconnaissance on new maps risk-free? Any competitive clan player would be mad to pass up such an opportunity.
Also, you'd have to block BETA map games from being eligible towards medals... otherwise... well obvious consequences.

End of the day, I'm very sceptical to tampering with the "there is no gain without risk" philosophy... and when I say gain I don't just mean points and medals, but experience too.

:|


There wouldn't be an "option" - any map in beta testing would not have a points transfer, you could not elect to have a game be point-less for maps released from beta. I don't really think many high ranks would play exclusively beta maps to avoid point losses... you then avoid point gains and if they want to do that so be it but too many people here are uber-competitive and like to earn points.

The other problem you mention, though is a pretty good point. I agree that wins/losses on those maps should not go towards determining win percentage, medals, etc. I still think people would test the maps still even without a point incentive, similar to what drunkmonkey pointed out as having the ability to scout maps for future use, etc.
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Re: No points for games on Beta maps

Postby 40kguy on Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:18 pm

as an option yea it would be good but i like some new maps and want to get points off them
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Re: No points for games on Beta maps

Postby shocked439 on Thu Oct 28, 2010 4:16 pm

I play beta maps and prefer them usually. I spend more time on this turns deciding what strategies to use how to best take the turn and now you want to take away any incentive to play them? If I win in a foggy lunar war game did I not win a foggy game should that not count towards a win, and potentially unique defeats in a foggy game?

If you are going to do this because of unbalanced play then any win resulting from a deadbeating player should not count.
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Re: No points for games on Beta maps

Postby sensfan on Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:23 pm

great idea.
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Re: No points for games on Beta maps

Postby trapyoung on Thu Oct 28, 2010 6:15 pm

shocked439 wrote:I play beta maps and prefer them usually. I spend more time on this turns deciding what strategies to use how to best take the turn and now you want to take away any incentive to play them? If I win in a foggy lunar war game did I not win a foggy game should that not count towards a win, and potentially unique defeats in a foggy game?

If you are going to do this because of unbalanced play then any win resulting from a deadbeating player should not count.


The maps change. There was once a topic where someone said wanted a heads up before the map's XML could be changed because on Das Schloss he had stacked AA and the new XML reset it to neutral thus losing 60+ troops. If the maps can change and are for BETA testing where gameplay inequities exist, it's really not right to have point disbursements for them.

You'll have no incentive? Mapmakers and their friends will have incentives to test maps. Curious individuals will have incentive to test maps. People who know (everyone!) that the map will be released from BETA will test it out so that they can form strategies and use them in Clan Wars, Challenges, Private and Public Games. It would be foolish to not test the maps still.
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Re: No points for games on Beta maps

Postby trapyoung on Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:26 am

Your analogy to deadbeats is misplaced. If I have a teammate that deadbeats, I am awarded his territories. Also individuals who deadbeat control whether they deadbeat or not. No one currently can control to prevent an XML change because it will have negative repercussions in current games. There is also no warning (which the attendance rating in profiles can show), thus the gaming inequities are caused from third party sources instead of internally driven.

Ultimately I think that if people like maps it might encourage the Foundry to expedite the process because of demand to release the map from BETA. There is no true drawback besides losing an opportunity to farm and exploit map deficiencies before they are corrected - you should be awarded for good strategy on complete maps, not exploiting current mechanics that warrant an XML update.
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