Land locked units

Information on tactics, scenarios, and all that you'll need to be successful in-game!

Moderators: Global Moderators, Discussions Team

Forum rules
Please read the Community Guidelines before posting.

Land locked units

Postby Gweeedo on Sat Nov 23, 2013 2:29 pm

I have seen it many times.

Players with well over 5000 games, land-locking their forces.
Of course their skill (%) is low.

Very few situations where A player should land lock his units ( i would tend to believe).
Take a classic game, for example: other than not wanting to threaten somebody (pose a threat), would there be any other reason you would want to land-lock your units?
I am not talking a small amount of units (not sure the situation is any diff regardless of how big or small).
Usually it is well over 100 units.

I would guess that players who have a low % and over 1,000 games, are slow to learn...if they are one of those players who habitually land lock their units.

Better Example:Classic, escalating spoils (spoils are currently at 75), three players, three cards, 175 units while somebody on the board has less than 22 terits and fewer than 50 units.
Any reason at all to land-lock your forces?

Land locking your forces is never a good idea.
Last edited by Gweeedo on Mon Nov 25, 2013 4:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Corporal Gweeedo
 
Posts: 288
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:49 pm
Medals: 8
Standard Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2)
Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Land locked units

Postby Jippd on Sun Nov 24, 2013 6:08 am

You are correct if given the option to land lock or not to land lock you should always pick not to landlock.
Image
User avatar
Colonel Jippd
 
Posts: 1373
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2008 9:05 pm
Medals: 102
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (3) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (4) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (3)
Cross-Map Achievement (4) Beta Map Achievement (1) Bot Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (15)
General Achievement (6) Clan Achievement (17) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (11)

Re: Land locked units

Postby agentcom on Sat Nov 30, 2013 12:43 pm

Jippd wrote:You are correct if given the option to land lock or not to land lock you should always pick not to landlock.


never say always ...
Image
User avatar
Colonel agentcom
 
Posts: 3715
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:50 pm
Medals: 69
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (13) General Achievement (6) Clan Achievement (8)
General Contribution (2)

Re: Land locked units

Postby Gweeedo on Sun Dec 01, 2013 4:10 am

never say never...
User avatar
Corporal Gweeedo
 
Posts: 288
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:49 pm
Medals: 8
Standard Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2)
Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Land locked units

Postby agentcom on Sun Dec 01, 2013 5:06 am

Gweeedo wrote:never say never...


always say never ...
Image
User avatar
Colonel agentcom
 
Posts: 3715
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:50 pm
Medals: 69
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (13) General Achievement (6) Clan Achievement (8)
General Contribution (2)

Re: Land locked units

Postby SuicidalSnowman on Sun Dec 01, 2013 10:08 am

Right off the top of my head I can think of two reasons to do this:

1) Fog games. Especially in no spoils or flat spoils, you may not want to reveal you true strength.

2) Trench games. It often makes sense to leave 1 troops on a border territory. The enemy can go through that one territory only, and thus you can preserve your stack for later use.
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class SuicidalSnowman
 
Posts: 1020
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:40 am
Medals: 27
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1)
Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (1)
Clan Achievement (1) Training Achievement (1) General Contribution (1)

Re: Land locked units

Postby Gweeedo on Sun Dec 01, 2013 6:04 pm

Yes there are situations where it might be acceptable.
But when I see somebody with over 5,000 games landlocking 175 units while the two other opponents have 85 combined.

Not utilizing that force to go for somebodies elimination is bad enough...but to landlock them as well! knowing you have a set to turn in on your next turn?

Think some people can not help themselves. I do not understand it. what is it they are trying to protect?
For the most part landlocking your units is never a good Idea. I think they would be better used for defense or assault..not sitting in your rear used for reinforcements, while having nothing out on the battlefield.
User avatar
Corporal Gweeedo
 
Posts: 288
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:49 pm
Medals: 8
Standard Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2)
Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Land locked units

Postby Timminz on Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:23 pm

Gweeedo wrote:Players with well over 5000 games, land-locking their forces.
Of course their skill (%) is low.


% is not equivalent to skill. It's more a function of game-types played. Some of the very best players have % in the 20's and 30's.
jay_a2j wrote:lets not be so quick to judge Hitler
User avatar
Captain Timminz
 
Posts: 5505
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:05 pm
Location: At the store
Medals: 55
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (4) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (6) General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (1)

Re: Land locked units

Postby Gweeedo on Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:05 pm

How does that work with players who play 'only' Classic map?
Or any single map.
User avatar
Corporal Gweeedo
 
Posts: 288
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:49 pm
Medals: 8
Standard Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2)
Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Land locked units

Postby iAmCaffeine on Tue Dec 03, 2013 1:12 pm

The map doesn't really make a difference..

If someone plays exclusively 1v1 games they should win 50% at a minimum. If they player four player games then 25% minimum, and so on.
Image
User avatar
Captain iAmCaffeine
 
Posts: 2625
Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2013 5:38 pm
Medals: 63
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (2) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (3)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (6)
General Achievement (5) Clan Achievement (3) General Contribution (2)

Re: Land locked units

Postby OliverFA on Wed Dec 04, 2013 5:12 pm

SuicidalSnowman wrote:Right off the top of my head I can think of two reasons to do this:

1) Fog games. Especially in no spoils or flat spoils, you may not want to reveal you true strength.

2) Trench games. It often makes sense to leave 1 troops on a border territory. The enemy can go through that one territory only, and thus you can preserve your stack for later use.


+1

But are they really landlocked? Or could this be considered more like "stationed next to the border"?
Welcoming the long awaited Trench Warfare Setting (Previously Adjacent Attacks).

My Maps:
Research and Conquer - Civilization meets Conquer Club

Best score: 2,346 - Best position: #618 - Best percentile: 4.87%
User avatar
Lieutenant OliverFA
 
Posts: 2345
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2008 4:30 am
Location: Somewhere in Spain
Medals: 32
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (1)
Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (1)
Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (2) Beta Map Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (1)
Clan Achievement (3) Training Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (2) General Contribution (5)

Re: Land locked units

Postby Gweeedo on Thu Dec 05, 2013 2:53 pm

When I see somebody with a lower % than me and plays muti player games equivalent to my own...I consider their skill to be low.
Same, when I see people land-locking their forces...consider them to have little skill.
It is just plain silly to land-lock your forces..does more harm than good. Not a good habit.
I continually observe such game play by some players that have better score than my own...that is perplexing.
User avatar
Corporal Gweeedo
 
Posts: 288
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:49 pm
Medals: 8
Standard Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2)
Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Land locked units

Postby degaston on Fri Dec 06, 2013 1:41 am

SuicidalSnowman wrote:Right off the top of my head I can think of two reasons to do this:

1) Fog games. Especially in no spoils or flat spoils, you may not want to reveal you true strength.

2) Trench games. It often makes sense to leave 1 troops on a border territory. The enemy can go through that one territory only, and thus you can preserve your stack for later use.
+2

Gweeedo wrote:I continually observe such game play by some players that have better score than my own...that is perplexing.

Maybe they have a better score because they understand when it is appropriate to use such a strategy and when it is not. Instead of making a blanket statement like "Land locking your forces is never a good idea.", perhaps you should attempt to learn something about how to use it.

Manipulating the actions of your opponents by choosing how much of your troop strength to reveal to them is an important part of multiplayer fog games. The player who appears to be in the lead (by some combination of bonuses and visible troop strength) is often the target of all the other players. Making yourself appear weak can get others to fight the presumed leader who has large stacks on his border while you build and wait for the right time to unleash them.

If you have all your troops at your borders, then what happens once someone breaks through and sees nothing but 1's? It's an invitation to go on a rampage and wipe out your interior. Having some landlocked stacks held in reserve can minimize the damage and allow a counterattack. And after discovering that you do that, an opponent may be reluctant to attack even your weak borders, knowing that it could release a large army (though he doesn't know how large).

SuicidalSnowman is right about trench games. If you have 1 troop bordering an opponent, and he has a border with someone else with a stack, who is he going to focus on? He can only kill your 1 troop, and will probably use the rest of his deploy to attack the more threatening border.

In all of these situations, (and probably others that I haven't mentioned), leaving all your troops on your borders is an invitation to have large numbers of your troops killed. Sometimes that's necessary, especially in 1v1, escalating, non-fog or non-trench games, but in many situations land locking some troops will lead your opponents to attack each other more than they attack you. Add to that the dice advantage you get from attacking more and defending less, and it can make a big difference in your win rate.

I looked at your dice stats - you attack 5.2% more than you defend. I attack 13.7% more than I defend. This could be because I'm a more aggressive player, but I suspect that you are actually much more aggressive than me because you attack 8.01% of the time when the odds are against you (2v2 dice or worse) compared to my 1.83%. I think the main reason for the difference is that you are attacked a lot more than I am because you don't land lock your troops.
Image
Whodunnit? map now looking for gameplay comments.
User avatar
Colonel degaston
 
Posts: 375
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:12 am
Medals: 12
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) General Achievement (2)

Re: Land locked units

Postby Gweeedo on Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:34 am

True. I understand that sometimes it is wise to hold your forces back.
I find it extremely perplexing when I see somebody landlock their forces in a Classic game no fog, escalating.
I have run into this three time in one day.
That is the reason for this post. I was not sure if I was missing something.

My dice stats are askew. I have been in many games where I have to assault at crazy odds. Too many!
I can not seem to win battles, even with the odds in my favor.
Been going on about three weeks after I got premium.

SO you can view my dice stats. But they will tell you very little.
Being that my battles are dictated , due to circumstance.

SO we have no fog classic game escalating spoils...any reason to landlock your forces (other than not wanting to pose a threat to others)?
Last edited by Gweeedo on Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:24 am, edited 3 times in total.
User avatar
Corporal Gweeedo
 
Posts: 288
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:49 pm
Medals: 8
Standard Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (1) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2)
Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Land locked units

Postby degaston on Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:05 am

I never said that it was always a good idea - just that it's not "never a good idea". ;) I'm sure it's misused sometimes, like any strategy, and I'm often conflicted about choosing between two entirely different ways to position my troops, so sometimes it's just a crap-shoot anyway. I play a lot of fog, and prefer large maps and non-escalating spoils, so my perspective may be a bit different from yours.

I know I was probably reading too much into the dice stats. Though it might be an interesting feature to be able to filter them by game type.
Image
Whodunnit? map now looking for gameplay comments.
User avatar
Colonel degaston
 
Posts: 375
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:12 am
Medals: 12
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) General Achievement (2)

Next

Return to Strategy

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Login