[Abandoned] War of the Roses

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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:29 pm

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This is an alternative placement of the areas.

Please Let me know if you like where the areas are in the map above better or in the map below better.
Above the areas are about 60% accurate to what I'm using as my main guide and below they are 85% accurate.
(Will not be able to get any more accurate then what I have below... But even with this accuracy - the areas are bunched up in places where as above they are spread out... But I'll let you all be the judge of which layout you like better...

This link is what I'm basing all of the area placement by: (focusing on churches and shields)
http://brummbar.com/brummbar/board_game ... er_Map.pdf

I do now that the either map still have a few issues such as Exeter in the bottom map is not a port but a church and Penzance is not yellow but brown... But what I need to know right now is should I fix the map above and move forward - of fix the map below and move forward... Which map has better placement or areas as far as game play goes - in your all opinion?


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Last edited by Aleena on Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:46 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Metsfanmax on Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:34 pm

I don't have any specific comments right now -- just wanted to say that you've done an awesome job transforming this from an MS Paint idea into a map I'd love to try!
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Tue Jul 02, 2013 3:11 am

Ty Metsfanmax, I hope I'll be able to get out of draft and through this stamping process so that you could play it..

I do not like wasting time, and since I had the options for these layouts up all day and no one said anything - I decided to move forward with the new layout...

Below is the completed version of the new layout - many changes made - Please would love your feed back, comments, suggestions...

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Last edited by Aleena on Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby rdsrds2120 on Tue Jul 02, 2013 8:50 pm

One thing I notice is that it's hard to tell the bonus sections apart. Perhaps instead of coloring in the icons, you could make them uniform, a tad smaller, and use that extra room to add colored glows to territory names? This would also make the names easier to see (especially ones that span over multiple colors, such as Carisbrooke, Calais, Beaumaris, etc).

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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:56 pm

Ok, I added a green glow behind the Names of the Green Areas... (The one's in the northern part of the map)

What do you all think? If you like I'll do it through out - but I think I did this before - and players didn't like it because it takes a lot away from the map since their are so many long names all over the map.

But if you like it - I can add it - just need the word....

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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby waauw on Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:28 am

Aleena wrote:Ok, I added a green glow behind the Names of the Green Areas... (The one's in the northern part of the map)

What do you all think? If you like I'll do it through out - but I think I did this before - and players didn't like it because it takes a lot away from the map since their are so many long names all over the map.

But if you like it - I can add it - just need the word....

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These namebackgrounds look a lot better then the last ones.
Though I disagree with rds. Imo it was already clear what belonged to what bonuszone.
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:52 am

If it is clear with-out placing the background color glow behind the words then I prefer to go with out... The less we clutter the map the better in my opinion...

So, I'm at a waiting game again - for either more players to say add the back ground glow behind names, other suggestions/comments, or a stamp so I can try to focus my attention more at game play then graphics..
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby waauw on Wed Jul 03, 2013 11:01 am

Aleena wrote:If it is clear with-out placing the background color glow behind the words then I prefer to go with out... The less we clutter the map the better in my opinion...

So, I'm at a waiting game again - for either more players to say add the back ground glow behind names, other suggestions/comments, or a stamp so I can try to focus my attention more at game play then graphics..


you could always maybe just try out a glow, as in a coloured shadow behind the letters
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Wed Jul 03, 2013 11:21 am

will do
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Dukasaur on Mon Jul 08, 2013 2:49 pm

I'm wondering if there can be just a very light glow? Perhaps with just 25% saturation or something?
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Bruceswar on Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:39 am

Few quick points. Tone down that water you have around the edges of the land. Maybe make it slightly smaller? Also I agree... Try some glow on the words.
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Mon Jul 15, 2013 3:27 pm

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Sorry it took so long - I to not have a text editor - so I had to draw and outline glow all the text by hand...

Look as if Bruce wants me to play with the water again - so maybe in the next day or two, I'll adjust the water a little...
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Tue Jul 16, 2013 11:57 am

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I made the coastal waters not soo bold...
and played with the water a bit...

What you all think now?
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Bruceswar on Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:41 am

The purple text is hard to read.... maybe try a lighter purple? Also your bonus values are way high.
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby DoomYoshi on Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:18 pm

This reminds me of the old days.
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:47 pm

Doom, is that good or bad?
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby cairnswk on Wed Aug 07, 2013 4:20 pm

Aleena. would it be a good thing to change the gameplay a little...
and include the three main woman involved in this
Elisabeth Woodville
Margaret Beaufort
Anne Neville
plus the houses of Lancaster, York and Tudor?
Have these as "buildings"
Just a suggestion :)
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:12 pm

Ty for the suggestion cairnswk...

I'll try to see what I can do - with adding those when I get to the GamePlay Stamp stage....
Right now, I'm struggling just to achieve completion of the basic DRAFT stage....

This DRAFT stage is so hard to pass - I can just imagine how hard GAME PLAY stage and even GRAPHIC stage will be....
Since it appears it takes a lot of graphic work just to complete DRAFT stage, - I can just assume the GRAPHIC stage is then going to be a killer - for Based on it's name - that is the stage where this sight will really focus on the graphics, as if they are not all ready.....
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:58 pm

Waited all most a full month for any and all suggestions of what should be done to fix this map, only suggestion I received was that the purple outline around some text maybe should be lighter....

Ok... I made it lighter.... Here's what it looks like now....

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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Mishalex on Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:45 am

Hi Aleena, i'd just discover this map, so i'm just going to give you my opinion:
First thing is that i have some difficulties to read and "print" the map, and as i like simple map or really lisible one, i'm a bit confuse here... For example, is church part of the land bonuse? 'cause, if holding a church leads to a less 2, it's gonna be hard to take the bonus.
What's the idea with the ship? Are they autodeploy? Are they neutral at start?
I'm sorry but i'm not a huge fan of the graphic, but there are pleany of comics map such as Conquer (looks like PacMan) so players should like it ! Hope you'll find an end to this ! )
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:31 am

It seems like 1/2 the players like this sort of style graphics, at least as for having it as a change from all the other maps that all look like maps on paper... So it's ok, if your not partial to this style, for one can not please everyone...

Yes, this game is a little more complex then the standard ones that seem to keep making the strong - stronger and the weak - weaker... Here, it's sort of vise versa - for it is to help establish a balance battle for the throne.

Churches do give a negative deploy - the reasons for this is that they are the gateway to the throne. I do not wish players to try to stockpile or horde them until they absolutely need to. Then when they do it'll be more of a struggle to hold onto them and the throne.

Yes they do work with the land bonuses - all spaces do, even ships.. So if you have 10 lands and 2 of them are churches - you'll get +2 per area for the lands for a total of 20 units - but then -2 for each church of a total negative of 4, making your over all Bonus only 16 units instead of 20.

I know the Quantity of units seem high, but it will be high evenly across the board - so to illustrate both major blood bath battles, and the randomness of a few good men.

The ships are neutral to start. No they are not auto deploy. What makes them special is their connections to the other ships and harbors. Using them will allow you to travel across the map much faster then trucking through the lands. They also open up a multitude of attack angles onto each other and harbor towns. Because of the ships, London for example has 10 different access points that they can be attacked from.

Ty, for visiting and for hoping the best... I wish you happy gaming...

Oh, though the concept and idea to insure a struggle and blood bath for the throne will remain in this game, aspects on Qty of Bonuses and penalties most likely will change and be tweeked once on the game play stamp - and will dedicate more of my time to that facet.

One Idea that I'm tossing around is to have the first player that set up the game to start as the King of England, and as such have a different victory goal then the other Lords (Players) whom all want to capture his throne. So this way not only are the Lords fighting with each other for the chance to become King, but the King itself will be smarter then a neutral player and will be fighting to keep hold of his throne. Two of the reasons I'm thinking of making this change in the Game play stamp stage is because I read on another thread that players can have different victory conditions, and because the game does not offer neutral auto deploy so neutral players can never get stronger.

I was thinking from the other suggestion about adding:
Elisabeth Woodville
Margaret Beaufort
Anne Neville
To the game for their historical rules in this war...
Well, All players in this game should be acting the Rules of all the Lords and Ladies of that time...
So, the player themselves may adopt these personas, for it is the players that are the Lords and Ladies, not an area on the map.
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby isaiah40 on Fri Aug 09, 2013 2:09 pm

This is coming along good. I like cairns suggestion and yours about having the Lords, Ladies and King fight it out. Suggestion, since we will have 12 player games in the future, can you work this out so that it will be ready for 12 player games? You can have 12 Lords/Ladies/King as starting positions and each one have their own winning condition which overlap each other in some areas. This should work out really good. Anyways since you have everything need to be considered a working draft, I'm going to sticky this for now. :D
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Fri Aug 09, 2013 2:21 pm

Since I've made all the Graphic changes requested of me - and many of them I made multiple times changing them around due to opposing opinions and poor clarity in explanations of why/or what is needed to be done...

Guess I'll play around a little more with the Game Play aspect - even though I'm not on that Stamp yet - This system is Crazy and a little Dumb... I understand that it did help in increasing the Quality of the maps on this site, which is a good thing, but the system over all needs work (or in the vary least a clearer check point guidelines for the stages. For most of the work that was been asked of me so far, seems to be a Graphic Stamp stage issue and not a draft Stamp stage issue.. And as far as I can see, I've passed the Draft point a long time ago, yet see no progress...)

GAME PLAY - New Idea
Player #1 Starts with London
Victory Condition:
Maintain control of London and have control over 11 different shields (not matching)

All Other Players:
Would still like them to start as Random If possible else:
Player 2 starts Douglas
Player 3 starts Carlsbrooke
Player 4 starts Richmond
Player 5 starts Compton
Player 6 starts Arundel
Player 7 starts Chillingham
Player 8 starts Ogmore

Their victory condition is to control London for one full turn.
To access London they must control 4 Churches.

Before I go any further - I need to know can the other positions be random or if I have multiple victory conditions, I need to actually assign these spots?

Another question is if I have to assign them, can I assign them with different Qty of starting locations.. Example Player one starts with London, but Player 2 starts with Douglas and Beaumarls...

Or even Player one starts with London and the other players get random land dealt out to them from 27 shield locations on the board .. ?
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Fri Aug 09, 2013 2:29 pm

isaiah - ok...

I'll assign 12 of the 27 shields as starting positions...
That should not be difficult at all...

What Lord Name a player wishes to be - is all subjective, so I'll leave that up to the actual players to role play on their own...

But they will all be considered to be a Lord or Lady (or King Henry) who want to control and maintain the throne of England.

King Henry is the only one that needs a different victory condition - since the rest are targeting his one city of London (which they can not even touch unless they gain the support of the churches) this will overlap all the players struggles for the Throne. And to make it balanced for King Henry - Not only is his Capitol secured through the churches, I'll give London a Larger Auto Deploy to allow King Henry a fair fight against the other 11 players that are all after this throne....

(And actually I think it would be pretty cool to play King Henry with 11 other players targeting against me, but yet they must fight each other just to get to me.)

1 versus 11 sounds like fun to me...

Should have a new update with in the next 24 hours stating the new set-ups and rules
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Re: War Of The Roses

Postby Aleena on Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:31 pm

These are the Lords and Ladies I think I'll have in the game... Though there where many others....
If any History buffs think others would be better, I'm willing to listen...

Also the red circles on the map indicate starting points...
So I'll be slowly connecting a Lord or Lady to a starting point...

Most of them freely roamed the lands so really they all could start pretty much anywhere...

If you have any suggestions or comments please let me know...
I selected these locations as starting points for their distance from other players as well as either having a Church or a ship in between them and another player... I'll make churches and Ships a little harder to capture to insure that no player could be wiped out before they even get a move.

Henry VI -------------------------------- starts in London
Richard Neville Earl of Warwick - Start in Calais
Richard Duke of York -------------- Start in Sandal
Margaret of Anjou ------------------ Start in Compton
Edward of Westminster ------------ Start in Chillingham
Edward of York ----------------------- Start in Helmsley
Richard III ------------------------------ Starts in Wessle
Henry Percy Earl of Northumberland - Starts in Douglas
John de la Pole 1st Earl of Lincoln ---- Starts in Newcastle
Elisabeth Woodville ------------------------- Starts in Arundel
Margaret Beaufort ------------------------- Starts in Cockermouth
Lady Anne Neville -------------------------- Starts in Warwick

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