Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby ManBungalow on Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:29 am

I feel that the quality of those big escalating speed games has decreased in the last two years or so. Or at least I don't enjoy them as much now.

From 'my day' (get off my lawn!), speed has been a crucial part of the games, but somehow there was more strategy to it than a simple pissing contest, which it seems to be now. I used to lose an 8-player classic speed escalating game feeling that I'd been out-played or out-smarted, but now I feel like somebody quicker than me has won. Unless, of course, it's me winning. This actually also applies to freestyle 1vs1.

And I'm sure that jumping into your first ever freestyle speed game to be beaten by somebody moving at 90% of the speed of light could scare you off. I can imagine what it's like to lose all of your regions and have no idea what's happened. It follows from this that the current freestyle speed players are part of the same dying group, because nearly everybody else is intimidated off/foed. Is there a solution to this? I don't really think so.
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby betiko on Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:47 am

here's the thing, I know lots of you denied that but it has been proven by some players. CC Servers are in the US/canada; and it's pretty impossible for none north americans to play freestyle speeders vs north americas. even though you hold the B button or whatever, by the time your turn starts the north american has already done a move, because of the better ping. I guess we lose at least half a second and this changes everything. you basically have to rely on BS dice.

About the fact that it has been proven: NOS who is canadian and a really fast speed FS player who is now in an exchange program told me he had to give up because from europe the ping to the cc server had nothing to do with the one he had back home.

Other than this, I disagree, i love casual FS.
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Dukasaur on Tue Mar 26, 2013 9:01 am

I don't like fs speed for the same reason I don't like real-time games of any kind: I want time to think. Maybe that's just because I'm getting old, or maybe not. I recall that even when I was much younger I hated speed chess, for example. So I doubt if you would ever make a fs speed demon out of me.

However, there are young people on this site who probably would get good at it, if they were given some friendship and mentoring. Greenoaks said it best:
greenoaks wrote:you only have yourselves to blame.

the pool of players is already small and then you foe those that wander in.

=D> =D> =D>

Spend some time helping those who might be interested and it will pay off in the long run.
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Mr Changsha on Tue Mar 26, 2013 9:09 am

Dukasaur wrote:I don't like fs speed for the same reason I don't like real-time games of any kind: I want time to think. Maybe that's just because I'm getting old, or maybe not. I recall that even when I was much younger I hated speed chess, for example. So I doubt if you would ever make a fs speed demon out of me.

However, there are young people on this site who probably would get good at it, if they were given some friendship and mentoring. Greenoaks said it best:
greenoaks wrote:you only have yourselves to blame.

the pool of players is already small and then you foe those that wander in.

=D> =D> =D>

Spend some time helping those who might be interested and it will pay off in the long run.


Is speed freestyle a young man's game?
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby anonymus on Tue Mar 26, 2013 9:12 am

well i think OP puts it in sort of a greyish light when he says that speed is not the most important part..
I play some fs speeders but ONLY on conquest-maps where i dont need to keep track of many stacks and there i am SOMETIMES quick enough, but still against experienced FS-specialists im mosty doomed..
as an example i managed to get a few wins on ST-Pat 8 man 1 min fs, but then this is a map where luck is a main factor..

on new world i win 70+% of my sequential games but FS im pretty much lost because i cannot take enough terr per turn to keep my deploy high..

on feudal i am specialized but still i only join fs-games when i am VERY bored because the speed-element is the same here as in new world (even with just 1 mainstack if you are 2nd on the auto-button when you clash you are doomed)

basically the only map im successful in FS speed is ww2 poland and its just because i know every move before i make it and against someone who can take 3 terr last 2 seconds im still lost..

and i think this is the reason why people dont play more fs.. if you are not a specialist and quick as a freaking rabbit (with a great line to the server) you WILL lose even if your strategy is good when faced with a specialist quick as a freaking rabbit with good line to the server..

so.. OP i think you are being a bit naive (or trying to reel more people in saying speed is only part of it.. or as marco pierre white would say (chef) speed can compensate for talent but talent cant compensate for speed (freely adapted to this scenario).

/ :?:
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby rhp 1 on Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:44 am

donelladan wrote:You say there is no farming in freestyle speed.
But what are the chance of a player winning against you if he does not have clickies? I'd say none, and that's why people consider it is a kind of farming. You play against people unaware of it, so you are just gaining easy points.
You may prefer playing players with same abilities than you for the rush and the challenge it gives you of course, but we cant ignore the other part.

And I think, when a noob ( speaking about freestyle) join one of your game, he does not even understand how you can be so fast, he played a game where he recognized he had 0% chance of winning, and probably decide to not play it anymore. I think thats the major reason why people dont play freestyle speed.
If you want it to change, you shoud, I think, always give link to clickies and explained to noobs why you beat them, that way they may learn and come back to kick your ass ;)


well first.... stop hating... sencond, I've shown 100's, yes 100's the link to clickable maps and held a lot of their hands while they implemented them... why would I not? it's in my interest to get them to play fs... second... yea genius, if someone plays fs against me without clicks... well... duh.... but that's not my point... I love to get people to play fs.. more players... more fun.. faster fills on speed games...
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby rhp 1 on Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:49 am

anonymus wrote:well i think OP puts it in sort of a greyish light when he says that speed is not the most important part..
I play some fs speeders but ONLY on conquest-maps where i dont need to keep track of many stacks and there i am SOMETIMES quick enough, but still against experienced FS-specialists im mosty doomed..
as an example i managed to get a few wins on ST-Pat 8 man 1 min fs, but then this is a map where luck is a main factor..

on new world i win 70+% of my sequential games but FS im pretty much lost because i cannot take enough terr per turn to keep my deploy high..

on feudal i am specialized but still i only join fs-games when i am VERY bored because the speed-element is the same here as in new world (even with just 1 mainstack if you are 2nd on the auto-button when you clash you are doomed)

basically the only map im successful in FS speed is ww2 poland and its just because i know every move before i make it and against someone who can take 3 terr last 2 seconds im still lost..

and i think this is the reason why people dont play more fs.. if you are not a specialist and quick as a freaking rabbit (with a great line to the server) you WILL lose even if your strategy is good when faced with a specialist quick as a freaking rabbit with good line to the server..

so.. OP i think you are being a bit naive (or trying to reel more people in saying speed is only part of it.. or as marco pierre white would say (chef) speed can compensate for talent but talent cant compensate for speed (freely adapted to this scenario).

/ :?:



fair points... but you bring up a perfect comparison... I play Malabross (sp) on New World from time to time... fs, fog adj, no spoils... I'm a not small amount faster than him... I have a lot of trouble beating him on that map settings... I know and play the map very well, maprank if you wish, but his settings, and ability to play mistake free and solid every game is more important than the speed differential... but often times you are right...
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby rhp 1 on Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:50 am

Mr Changsha wrote:
Dukasaur wrote:I don't like fs speed for the same reason I don't like real-time games of any kind: I want time to think. Maybe that's just because I'm getting old, or maybe not. I recall that even when I was much younger I hated speed chess, for example. So I doubt if you would ever make a fs speed demon out of me.

However, there are young people on this site who probably would get good at it, if they were given some friendship and mentoring. Greenoaks said it best:
greenoaks wrote:you only have yourselves to blame.

the pool of players is already small and then you foe those that wander in.

=D> =D> =D>

Spend some time helping those who might be interested and it will pay off in the long run.


Is speed freestyle a young man's game?


no.. I'm almost 40.. lol
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Night Strike on Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:34 pm

I prefer to make my moves before the last 5-10 seconds of a round, so I don't play speed freestyle.
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby rhp 1 on Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:13 pm

ManBungalow wrote:I feel that the quality of those big escalating speed games has decreased in the last two years or so. Or at least I don't enjoy them as much now.

From 'my day' (get off my lawn!), speed has been a crucial part of the games, but somehow there was more strategy to it than a simple pissing contest, which it seems to be now. I used to lose an 8-player classic speed escalating game feeling that I'd been out-played or out-smarted, but now I feel like somebody quicker than me has won. Unless, of course, it's me winning. This actually also applies to freestyle 1vs1.

And I'm sure that jumping into your first ever freestyle speed game to be beaten by somebody moving at 90% of the speed of light could scare you off. I can imagine what it's like to lose all of your regions and have no idea what's happened. It follows from this that the current freestyle speed players are part of the same dying group, because nearly everybody else is intimidated off/foed. Is there a solution to this? I don't really think so.



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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby 40kguy on Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:38 pm

I loved speed freestyle, i dont have premium anymore though.

im not fast, but they were fun as hell playing and there is a lot more strategy going on.
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby IcePack on Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:14 pm

I hve tried a few times, have fast computer fast connection in North America. And I get blown out of the water. It's really bad sometimes. So either I'm doing something wrong or I'm just slow as hell.
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby codierose on Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:31 pm

i do miss the fs feudal 4 player assin days chasing around the the lake. :D
stopped playing after got my gold
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby rhp 1 on Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:00 pm

codierose wrote:i do miss the fs feudal 4 player assin days chasing around the the lake. :D
stopped playing after got my gold

]

I set those from time to time... feel free to join bud...
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby AslanTheKing on Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:36 pm

and i was calculating , how on earth could this guy be so fast,
i was moving my mouse like crazy to deploy and attack, and with all the stress and pressure, i misclicked and attacked neutrals or the wrong places,

so whats this clicki thing, and where is the link?

i stopped playing freestyle because i thought i am just too slow
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Paddy The Cat on Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:21 pm

hmmm good topic rhp.

just wanna throw in that it is what makes me renew premium. i dont have anyone on my foe list, and i dont have ANY add ons (i use the automatic clickies that come with the site). im not the fastest. but i win a fair number of these games. yes it is discouraging to learn at first. However, it really gives just about EVERY map a whole new feel! On some settings, the gameplay is totally different than standard sequential 24 hours games. It is a breath of fresh air to me, and is the only game type that gives me a 'rush' so to speak.

id love to relive the glory days with some 20 good fs speed players and get some 8 man classic games going 8-)
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Tenebrus on Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:17 am

What Paddy said =).

I'll start leaving some 8p fs classic esc games up in the afternoons UK time, if people keep an eye out for them, maybe we can get them going again. Quick question for anyone who's interested - what time do people prefer? The games always used to be 5m, but now 1m's a possibility but that's pretty tight for a classic map (unless you do want to make it all about speed, and not speed+strategy). Compromise on 3m? Would be interested to hear people's views.

I'll also do my best to teach anyone who's unfamiliar with the games - all welcome, as long as you listen to what's said in chat.
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Mageplunka69 on Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:44 am

jsnyder748 wrote:I would like to play more speeders. My school laptop/connection leaves me in the dust. Only when I go home do I have as fast a computer as all you speeders.

Plus it takes time to do them. Don't have an excess of time.
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Mageplunka69 on Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:47 am

Mr Changsha wrote:
Dukasaur wrote:I don't like fs speed for the same reason I don't like real-time games of any kind: I want time to think. Maybe that's just because I'm getting old, or maybe not. I recall that even when I was much younger I hated speed chess, for example. So I doubt if you would ever make a fs speed demon out of me.

However, there are young people on this site who probably would get good at it, if they were given some friendship and mentoring. Greenoaks said it best:
greenoaks wrote:you only have yourselves to blame.

the pool of players is already small and then you foe those that wander in.

=D> =D> =D>

Spend some time helping those who might be interested and it will pay off in the long run.


Is speed freestyle a young man's game?

no, im 50 and i am one of the fastest here
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby rdsrds2120 on Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:49 am

Mageplunka69 wrote:
jsnyder748 wrote:I would like to play more speeders. My school laptop/connection leaves me in the dust. Only when I go home do I have as fast a computer as all you speeders.

Plus it takes time to do them. Don't have an excess of time.
alot of time
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8672597 7 second game


He's probably talking about games like this:

Game 6706958

Where ManB sat down for 3 hours and 39 minutes to, in the end, kill ljex after a 290 troop cash ;). Epic stuff, and it's why I love it.

BMO
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Mageplunka69 on Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:55 am

I have to say that freestyle is what keeps me here, not to mention that besides most games played, I was getting bored with the decline of free styling. As some have mentioned, I remember when I personally would set up 10-15 doodle 8 man assassin freestylers, and have at least 5-6 active 5 minute games going at one time.I had to time it to actually go set up another 15 while they were going on. I feel the decline started with the pm notifier changing to the current leaving the waiting games window open.
I want the old system implemented again to bring back the glory days please new owners?

What keeps me here now is the race to be all platinum, after that i mat get bored again ♥
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby rhp 1 on Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:53 am

Tenebrus wrote:What Paddy said =).

I'll start leaving some 8p fs classic esc games up in the afternoons UK time, if people keep an eye out for them, maybe we can get them going again. Quick question for anyone who's interested - what time do people prefer? The games always used to be 5m, but now 1m's a possibility but that's pretty tight for a classic map (unless you do want to make it all about speed, and not speed+strategy). Compromise on 3m? Would be interested to hear people's views.

I'll also do my best to teach anyone who's unfamiliar with the games - all welcome, as long as you listen to what's said in chat.


depends.. most hardcore freestylers would be fine with 1 minute turns, but if we want to "grow the sport" so to speak, and have more people join them and "learn"... then I think 2, maybe even 3 minute turns are probably a good idea...

I'm usually on evenings.. 7-10 pm EST... or in that range somewhere... weekends I'm on at different times.. but I'd hop in if I saw it...
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Tenebrus on Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:12 am

Yeah, that's what I was thinking. There's a 3 minute turn game up now. No-one's joining it though >:/
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Tenebrus on Wed Mar 27, 2013 11:36 am

6 people in one now, join you miserable bunch of scrotum-chewing imbec... I mean EVERYBODY WELCOME!
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Re: Why Don't More People Take Up Freestyle?

Postby Tenebrus on Wed Mar 27, 2013 12:13 pm

Whee, it filled, and the best man won. *coughs modestly*
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