Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby strike wolf on Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:29 am

Oh I do kind of like how Yahweh basically trolled Satan in the final scene. I was gonna write how me and Pancake betrayed Satan at the last moment. Again I have to say this wasn't an easy one to win. Just about everyone we tried to recruit, either didn't use their action or ended up unrecruited lol. I guess since Chap and Iliad were deprogrammed the same night they were recruited they never even learned that they had been recruited.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby jak111 on Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:46 am

Haha, that "roleblock" I first had I would have been recruited had lived long enough to use it. But I gotta say, glad to see I was right about Aage in my first life XD After that I was a bit worried the scum were falling apart when I came back. I think that last lynch was an all or nothing one. If saf decided to kill me like Rodion asked, we'd have lost completely. Even that though was luck, Edoc filled me in on what Strike was so I only had hopes that he would execute when he saw what I was doing. I was surprised to see Violet vote for Rodion though, I thought we would have all had to be out to get a lynch.

Also... inactives screwed both sides over...
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby aage on Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:48 am

strike wolf wrote:We never gifted vigs because honestly, we never trusted them not to vig us

This mainly. Plus, I was highly paranoid town was going to figure out the gifts were poisoned so they had to look good. Don't know if I ever said this to the team though. Also thanks for your compliments, but in my opinion I played horribly at least half the time and made some serious mistakes.

pancakemix wrote:GG everyone!

I'm amazed I never drew much fire the way I scummarined through this game. I had the benefit of not being on "the list", (which I seriously thought was going to do us in, wp to chap on that bluff) and once we saw the fakeclaim list, Joan of Arc popped out and was handed to me immediately. So even though I was forced to claim at the end, it would have take too long to put two and two together.

Definitely props to Chap. I never once even considered that his role might have been one-shot until he died. That clever bastard.
Last edited by aage on Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby aage on Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:50 am

Fastposted,
jak111 wrote:Haha, that "roleblock" I first had I would have been recruited had lived long enough to use it. But I gotta say, glad to see I was right about Aage in my first life XD After that I was a bit worried the scum were falling apart when I came back. I think that last lynch was an all or nothing one. If saf decided to kill me like Rodion asked, we'd have lost completely. Even that though was luck, Edoc filled me in on what Strike was so I only had hopes that he would execute when he saw what I was doing. I was surprised to see Violet vote for Rodion though, I thought we would have all had to be out to get a lynch.

Also... inactives screwed both sides over...

Yes, you were an absolute pain before you died and an absolute asset after you revived ;)
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby strike wolf on Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:02 am

aage wrote:
strike wolf wrote:We never gifted vigs because honestly, we never trusted them not to vig us

This mainly. Plus, I was highly paranoid town was going to figure out the gifts were poisoned so they had to look good. Don't know if I ever said this to the team though.


I believe you did. I was paranoid about it after Pancake claimed. I was pretty sure that by process of elimination if I died that night and town saw that mafia was still alive they would figure out that it had to be pancake, if they hadn't already figured it out.

Not sure if we're doing MVP but if I had to pick one from town it might actually have been Chap if he hadn't gone inactive. I guess since that's a disqualifier I will go with Rodion. For scum, I'm going to nominate Pancake. Always helpful in deciding night actions and for staying under the radar and not getting himself lynched/killed.
Iliad wrote:The upside of calling everyone scum and making 1000 predictions is that statistically you should get a few right.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby F1fth on Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:01 am

First, let me say good job to the scum team who played this game brilliantly. I am proud to say that I called out Strike long ago and PCM more recently and was completely right on both counts. This was also a wonderful setup so thank you Edocsil for that and for dealing with some of the roadbumps that plagued this game.

Now, that said there are unfortunatly a few things about this game that really left a sour taste in my mouth.

<rant>
1. Inactives/Modkills. If you think are going to be too busy to play at ANY point during the game... DON'T SIGN UP!!! If you aren't as interested if you're not a power role... DON'T SIGN UP!!! If you sign up... THEN PLAY THE WHOLE DAMN GAME!!! Doing anything else is extremely disrespectful to the mod and other players. Speaking of inactives, it's almost funny that Violet would drop a hasty vote on the last day and just leave it there. Once again burned by an inactive.

Another thing is to look at the spread of modkills. We have 5 killed town vs 1 killed convert that was about to be lynched. Not something that Edoc can control obviously but not really fair.

2. Chap's death. I used my one-shot power to protect Chap and the advantage of it was utterly destroyed by a modkill. Who knows how many more actions would have been throw his way? His death was an extraordinary advantage for the scum. My "power role" became as useful as a un-subvertable VT without my protection and it's a shame that something outside the game ruined it. Not really fair.

3. The mistake in the scene. I read that part about "six" angels at least two dozen times over the last two game days. I could not figure out how there could be eight angels with that statement staring me in the face. I actually had a post written out theorizing that there were actually eight angels but deleted it because I keep coming back to the statement about the six (plus one dead). Without it I would have gone after Strike with a vengeance (and I'm sure Rodion, Violet, Saf would have been right behind it). To only have it clarified immediately after the game is already over is really not fair.

Really, between the kills and the misinformation, Edocsil almost did more to help scum then they did themselves. It was fun that the game was kept so close but I felt like it was artificially so.

I think I am retiring from mafia here indefinitely. It's bullshit that people sign up again and again and just bail with impunity. It's why I went on my first hiatus and it will also be why I go on my last. Anyway, there's my bitchfest for better or worse. Agree or disagree, I'm sure you can see some truth in my words. If you want this community to survive, I would highly recommend to those that still remain to find a way to curb this issue.
</rant>

Again, thanks to Edoc and to those who actually played.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby rishaed on Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:14 am

I would have loved to come back in the game. The only problem was that I couldn't >.>. That being said I feel that Modkills really did hurt Town, much more than it did Scum. I think that that more than anything made you guys say screw the list, seeing as you were at LYLO even knowing that there was 1 scum on it...
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby aage on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:23 pm

F1fth wrote:<rant>

Really, between the kills and the misinformation, Edocsil almost did more to help scum then they did themselves. It was fun that the game was kept so close but I felt like it was artificially so.

I think I am retiring from mafia here indefinitely. It's bullshit that people sign up again and again and just bail with impunity. It's why I went on my first hiatus and it will also be why I go on my last. Anyway, there's my bitchfest for better or worse. Agree or disagree, I'm sure you can see some truth in my words. If you want this community to survive, I would highly recommend to those that still remain to find a way to curb this issue.
</rant>

Again, thanks to Edoc and to those who actually played.

Modkills almost always only occur among townies. That is why we do not lynch them and ask for a modkill.
Edocsil did not drastically help us. He provided us with a list of names that weren't in the game already to fakeclaim, and only after Jonty died did he provide the converts with our names... whoever they were. We hadn't a clue who was converted and who wasn't between all the inactivity. I was actually under the impression that he helped town a lot, especially with several of the day/night scenes he posted. It seems it's a matter of perspective.

Also, I wanted to ask Strike, why did you claim busdriver?
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby rishaed on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:26 pm

It was the only logical claim to save Soundman. I only realized after my lynch that it might have been a small mistake, since afterwards PCM was the only one off of "the list".
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby aage on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:31 pm

rishaed wrote:It was the only logical claim to save Soundman. I only realized after my lynch that it might have been a small mistake, since afterwards PCM was the only one off of "the list".

Busdriver is a highly risky claim in my experience, though. When I saw it, I highly wondered whether it was worth it.

Of course, in the end it was, but still.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby strike wolf on Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:03 pm

I thought we would have been close to winning by then and we only needed to couple days to buy. It was never meant to be a claim that lasted more than a couple days but then Sound got lynched and things didn't really turn out that way and I kept BSing and BSing lol and somehow I managed not to get lynched. It was risky but I felt confident that I could pull it off for a limited amount of time. I thought being forthcoming with my actions (without pressure) would buy some town credibility at the risk of getting myself caught in a lie. A gamble of course but I felt I knew who was a likely N1 watch and we knew who was watched N2. I delayed releasing info on N3 of course, I felt I could get by on the excuse that it was recent enough that saying I wanted to withhold and possibly reveal someone in a lie later.

I definitely took some risks in this game. Pointing fingers at Aage in an attempt to delay jak and Vodean's lynches. Didn't work out. Busdriver claim...worked out well enough. Pushed for a couple questionable lynches (turning town's attention away from doom on Day 9 though that didn't work and nudged the idea on JG though didn't follow through but I felt I also played it safe in many situations. I bided my time for most of the first three days.

Honestly, I don't think any of us like to address it but a lot of what F1fth said is right...I may add a topic in discussions regarding inactive players.

As far as the execution, I used it as soon as F1fth voted and I got the chance to follow up but Edoc initially hadn't noticed Jak's vote in thread so it was delayed.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby edocsil on Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:18 pm

strike wolf wrote: As far as the execution, I used it as soon as F1fth voted and I got the chance to follow up but Edoc initially hadn't noticed Jak's vote in thread so it was delayed.


Yeah. it was only half red, and the "vote" part wasn't colored or anything so I totally missed it.

Fifth, I agree on many of your points. This game would have been so different if there had another 6 active players at the start. However, as for chap the scum weren't going to target him, not with that obvious of a scene. He had nothing left to bring to the table with his faked claim, and he was just drawing town protective actions like mad. If the scum had started pegging angels then the town would have been toast.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby jak111 on Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:29 pm

edocsil wrote:Yeah. it was only half red, and the "vote" part wasn't colored or anything so I totally missed it.


I just went back to re-read that :oops: I thought I had it all highlighted before clicking red from the colour codes :P
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby VioIet on Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:43 pm

jak111 wrote: I was surprised to see Violet vote for Rodion though, I thought we would have all had to be out to get a lynch.


Well he said that I was lying when I obviously wasn't, and it just came across as really scummy that he would try to draw attention to me when I thought pcm was more of an issue. I just feel my role really should've been obvious at that point. And since Jak had already voted him, I thought it would be an easy lynch. I had no idea we were in a Lylo situation. I thought their were two mafia amongst us at best- not three. Strike was the one that really had me fooled- I was onto jak and pcm already.

I figured two mafia were left. But when pcm said that he was a role-gifter, and I knew I had been gifted by him, so I gave him the benefit of the doubt. So I thought the final two were then Jak and Rodion. But I was wrong.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby safariguy5 on Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:32 pm

Man, I really thought we only had one demon left. I could have vigged jak, but I thought that subverted saints didn't count against the endgame limit given that my WC didn't need me to kill them. If we had lived another day, I would have given jak the chance to jump ship and win with town.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby strike wolf on Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:48 pm

Jak couldnt win with town. Technically only mafia did count against you but it was 3 v 3 and double voter on our side. Me and PCM had made it abundantly clear that we would simply force your lynch as town couldnt force one and edoc decided to end the game early.
Iliad wrote:The upside of calling everyone scum and making 1000 predictions is that statistically you should get a few right.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby Rodion on Sat Mar 30, 2013 12:54 am

VioIet wrote:
jak111 wrote: I was surprised to see Violet vote for Rodion though, I thought we would have all had to be out to get a lynch.


Well he said that I was lying when I obviously wasn't,


Except that you did lie (I still do not understand why you said your saint was alive). It's not even like I was threatening you, as I was holding my vote until I felt 100% certain of the path to take. I reckon you could have gotten out of that situation by simply admitting you screwed up. PCM, on the other hand, had some serious explaining to do on why he'd given Yoshi a cop gift after Yoshi fakeclaimed angel. Unfortunately, CC's bad habit of voting too soon did not allow me to continue my inquiry. :cry:
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby strike wolf on Sat Mar 30, 2013 12:57 am

Rodion wrote:
VioIet wrote:
jak111 wrote: I was surprised to see Violet vote for Rodion though, I thought we would have all had to be out to get a lynch.


Well he said that I was lying when I obviously wasn't,


Except that you did lie (I still do not understand why you said your saint was alive). It's not even like I was threatening you, as I was holding my vote until I felt 100% certain of the path to take. I reckon you could have gotten out of that situation by simply admitting you screwed up. PCM, on the other hand, had some serious explaining to do on why he'd given Yoshi a cop gift after Yoshi fakeclaimed angel. Unfortunately, CC's bad habit of voting too soon did not allow me to continue my inquiry. :cry:


Honestly I think you were being a bit harsh on both of those accounts. There were multiple fake angel claims in the game and they all turned out to be misguided saints and whether Vio's saint was alive or not was a rather trivial detail from my point of view.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby aage on Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:36 am

strike wolf wrote:Jak couldnt win with town. Technically only mafia did count against you but it was 3 v 3 and double voter on our side. Me and PCM had made it abundantly clear that we would simply force your lynch as town couldnt force one and edoc decided to end the game early.

You had a double voter and an executioner. You could have forced a lynch if there were 9 people alive. :p
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby DoomYoshi on Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:47 am

I still don't understand why Rodion considered my play to be trying to buy the mafia time. I wasn't recruited yet at that point.

Also, I'm totally surprised droz was town. It became more obvious later on, but I would've bet that he was scum.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby Rodion on Sat Mar 30, 2013 1:04 pm

Strike, I never said it wasn't trivial (remember I never voted or suggested we lynch Violet), but it had to be asked nonetheless as it could indicate a fakeclaim.

DoomYoshi wrote:Sry 4 double:

Yesterday I softclaimed angel. Rodion can investigate me and I can't claim to be human. That will verify me 100%


DoomYoshi wrote:Ok, I'm not an angel lmao. I am Brigit of Kildare, a saint.


Fakeclaim shown above.

To be totally honest, though, I was working under the influence of the wrong night scene (the one that implied there were 7 angels, not 8 ). Since there were 5 angels out in the open, I had found / as the 6th and I was the 7th, I "knew" you couldn't possibly be an angel. That's mainly what made me unmask you.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby VioIet on Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:31 am

Rodion wrote:
VioIet wrote:
jak111 wrote: I was surprised to see Violet vote for Rodion though, I thought we would have all had to be out to get a lynch.


Well he said that I was lying when I obviously wasn't,


Except that you did lie (I still do not understand why you said your saint was alive).


Wow Rodion, I still don't get you. And no, I didn't screw up when claiming. I think you just thought too hard about it when nothing was there. Here is my role pm:

edocsil wrote:You are Catherine of Genoa, you are a simple saint trying to live life by your ideals and your faith.

You are a Backup Doc. You will become a full doc if Avitus of Vienne, the Doctor, dies.

To win all the Demons must be dead.

Confirm in the game thread, and PM me if you have any questions.


So yes my Saint was still alive as I said. It was you who said/thought/believed my saint to be dead for whatever reason. I remember you bringing up a point about 1512, which didn't even make sense, as it's 2013. All of the characters would be dead, if you think about it like that.

This was a game. It is not real. It's not real life! It's a game! Edoc has the right to bring up characters from all different time periods and put them all in the same universe/world/game if he chooses. You can't let details like that throw you off from the flow of the game.


Rodion wrote:It's not even like I was threatening you


I don't even know why you brought up a non-issue in the first place. If you were more concerned about pcm at the time, then that is who you should've inquired about.


Anyway, I'm not trying to be too critical of you Rodion as I think you played well and almost single-highhandedly kept the game active at certain points. But from my point of view, you being unrealistically picky about my role-claim, when I felt there were bigger issues at the time seemed to be scummy. That's why I voted you. I was wrong as well, I can admit that. But wrong about voting you, not wrong about my claim. That was 100% honest at all times.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby aage on Sun Mar 31, 2013 3:41 am

VioIet wrote:Wow Rodion, I still don't get you. And no, I didn't screw up when claiming. I think you just thought too hard about it when nothing was there. Here is my role pm:

edocsil wrote:You are Catherine of Genoa, you are a simple saint trying to live life by your ideals and your faith.

You are a Backup Doc. You will become a full doc if Avitus of Vienne, the Doctor, dies.

To win all the Demons must be dead.

Confirm in the game thread, and PM me if you have any questions.


So yes my Saint was still alive as I said. It was you who said/thought/believed my saint to be dead for whatever reason. I remember you bringing up a point about 1512, which didn't even make sense, as it's 2013. All of the characters would be dead, if you think about it like that.

This was a game. It is not real. It's not real life! It's a game! Edoc has the right to bring up characters from all different time periods and put them all in the same universe/world/game if he chooses. You can't let details like that throw you off from the flow of the game.

Okay, that's just bullshit. You threw the town off balance by your claim. Want to know why?
Wikipedia wrote:Saint Catherine of Genoa (Caterina Fieschi Adorno, 1447 – 15 September 1510) is an Italian Roman Catholic saint and mystic, admired for her work among the sick and the poor.


Obviously all the characters are dead, only dead people are canonized. One of the prerequisites of becoming a saint is performing miracles after you died. This meta junk you're defending yourself a posteriori with now is highly confusing and irrelevant. According to you, we shouldn't even care if the mod confirms someone is God, because who cares about flavour?
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby jak111 on Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:43 am

I think what she means is Sam was still alive, that's what I gather from it.
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Re: Golden Pantheon - Angels and Demons - Endgame

Postby aage on Sun Mar 31, 2013 4:34 pm

jak111 wrote:I think what she means is Sam was still alive, that's what I gather from it.

Hmm. In that case, weird prhasing, but more logical from Violet's point of view.
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