Werewolf Mafia Endgame Town Wins.

[Iron Butterfly]

vote Iron Butterfly

Somebody must pay for the events of yesterday. Since saf (the hammerer) is dead, the wagon starter is next.

You are either mafia or just plain dumb. Making "someone pay" has nothing to do with the logic of the situation.

I started the case yes. I did not however expect such a speedy lynch. The game of mafia starts with simple day one cases like the one I made. I have no control how others vote. My vote put him at two votes. I am perplexed that safari and gostly did not give Jonty a chance to claim. While mass claiming is a no no in this game players are still allowed to claim.

Also keep in mind that because Doom made a joke vote that started the thing does not for a minute rule him out as mafia. He just happened to make a joke vote on someone who got speedily lynched.

As far as Animaniac. The case on him is pure WIFOM, for the moment. If jonty flipped mafia I would have defiantly suspected Animaniac as mafia. That does not rule him out as he could have been going for Town cred as well.

Now who to focus on??

If you wish to focus on me feel free but as i have stated the only thing I can be accused of being guilty of is in trying to build a day one case.

My top suspects would be those who speed lynched him. Safari would have been tops but hes dead. Ghostly would be my top suspect.

I would be curious as to why Ghostly voted Jonty to put him at L1 with out hearing from jonty.

[ghostly447]

I'll hop on IB's case actually. Saying "we" gives off a town vibe (even if you're unaware of it), yet is subtle enough to go unnoticed. I do this 90% of the time whenever I'm scum, rarely as town. Vote jonty.

Though I do it all the time, I am normally town doing it. But I will Unvote and Vote Jonty purely because I think he reacted in an obscure way (kind of sarcastic for a serious case, and not really addressing the point at all) and I will also FOS anamainiacks because he seems keen on quickly dismissing anything against Jonty with the old "Its not really a case" even though it D1, therefore very difficult to even build a case. I havent seen anamainiacs before, so maybe he is an old player coming back (maybe someone else can fill me in?), but trying to defend a scum mate (should this be the case) subtly as he is doing here, is a new players mistake on a lot of occasions.

Well, I did say he reacted in an obscure way. People dont normally react how he did unless somethings up.

[rishaed]

Vote Count:
Iron Butterfly- Doomyoshi
With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch.
Deadline is April 1st.

[Iron Butterfly]

I'll hop on IB's case actually. Saying "we" gives off a town vibe (even if you're unaware of it), yet is subtle enough to go unnoticed. I do this 90% of the time whenever I'm scum, rarely as town. Vote jonty.

Though I do it all the time, I am normally town doing it. But I will Unvote and Vote Jonty purely because I think he reacted in an obscure way (kind of sarcastic for a serious case, and not really addressing the point at all) and I will also FOS anamainiacks because he seems keen on quickly dismissing anything against Jonty with the old "Its not really a case" even though it D1, therefore very difficult to even build a case. I havent seen anamainiacs before, so maybe he is an old player coming back (maybe someone else can fill me in?), but trying to defend a scum mate (should this be the case) subtly as he is doing here, is a new players mistake on a lot of occasions.

Well, I did say he reacted in an obscure way. People dont normally react how he did unless somethings up.

Normally I would agree, and I did BUT why would you not wait until jonty spoke up to claim as your vote put him at L1.

To me that is the key issue.

[ghostly447]

I'll hop on IB's case actually. Saying "we" gives off a town vibe (even if you're unaware of it), yet is subtle enough to go unnoticed. I do this 90% of the time whenever I'm scum, rarely as town. Vote jonty.

Though I do it all the time, I am normally town doing it. But I will Unvote and Vote Jonty purely because I think he reacted in an obscure way (kind of sarcastic for a serious case, and not really addressing the point at all) and I will also FOS anamainiacks because he seems keen on quickly dismissing anything against Jonty with the old "Its not really a case" even though it D1, therefore very difficult to even build a case. I havent seen anamainiacs before, so maybe he is an old player coming back (maybe someone else can fill me in?), but trying to defend a scum mate (should this be the case) subtly as he is doing here, is a new players mistake on a lot of occasions.

Well, I did say he reacted in an obscure way. People dont normally react how he did unless somethings up.

Normally I would agree, and I did BUT why would you not wait until jonty spoke up to claim as your vote put him at L1.

To me that is the key issue.

Honestly, the last time I played here, L-2 is when we forced claims. So the only thing I can say is that I miscounted the votes on him and compared it wrong to the total amount of players. Dumb excuse, but I dont know what else could have happened. If thats not good enough, dont vote me or mafia could speed lynch until after I claim, etc.

[Iron Butterfly]

something that clears Doom a little for me is that his Jonty vote was during the joke phase and wasn't really part of the piling on. In fact that is the reason I think the last vote went so fast, Doom had voted and not unvoted, so I would suggest that it was only 4 votes that killed Jonti with one of those being Safari who is dead. I lean very heavily to either aage or ghostly now with some suspicion left for IB for leading the initial vote. What does the rest of the town think?

I guess Doom did not learn from his past mistake. He is first vote on jonty (joke wise) and then I build a day one case, which leads to a speed lynch.

The whole idea that Doom threw people off vote count wise is a great excuse and a rather sloppy one. From the time I made my "un jokey jonty vote" till his lynch was two friginn pages. This idea that people screwed up the vote count is stupid because they were confused does not wash with me.

A vote is a vote. I have played many games where people had a combination of joke votes and real ones and the vote count has never been an issue. People who play mafia know what the rules are and to always be conscious of the vote count.

Something I do find odd, actually two things.

First, you would think Doom would learn from the mistake from day one. The only difference between his vote today and yesterday was the joke factor. I hope people don't get confused again....

Seeing how quickly things went yesterday and the possibility there may be three mafia adds more to my original theory about Doom. Why would one put out a vote so quickly knowing there may be three mafia and a week to deadline after being part of what happened yesterday?

[aage]

Honestly, the last time I played here, L-2 is when we forced claims. So the only thing I can say is that I miscounted the votes on him and compared it wrong to the total amount of players. Dumb excuse, but I dont know what else could have happened. If thats not good enough, dont vote me or mafia could speed lynch until after I claim, etc.

There are no rules for when you should claim. You cast a vote on Jonty because you wanted to know his role or you wanted him to die. The only time I've seen a day 1 lynch conclude this fast was twoish years ago when I quicklynched my scumbuddy to win the game on pure town cred.

Saf's hammer was unexpected, but he died and flipped town. We'll never know his reasons. I actually think it's smart of the mafia to kill Saf as it leaves us completely in the dark.

the order of voting:
4.Doom Yoshi
2. Iron Butterfly
1.aage
6.Ghostly447
9.Safariguy5

Scum would kill Saf only if they were okay with drawing attention to either IB or Ghostly. I discount myself because technically I was second on the wagon, but I could have been a target too. This means that no more than one of us three can be scum; otherwise it would have been a pretty stupid move to kill the hammer. Doom cannot be a target as he never seriously voted, and this wagon is no direct argument in a case against him. Doesn't say anything about his alignment though.

This then means that the other two scum are among the four people left:

3.Dibbler
8.Anamainiacks
7.Blakebowling
4.Doom Yoshi

50% is a better bet than 33%, I think. Therefore I believe we should lynch among these four.

Doom's latest post is strange but I wouldn't know why he would post that at all, regardless of his role.

And aage - just because you agreed with IB on his tell doesn't clear him from suspicion. In fact, that's a logical fallacy, and makes me wonder if you're scum buddies trying to clear each other.

I'm not clearing him, I'm saying that I don't have a reason to suspect him without being a hypocrite. Not so much a logical fallacy, if I were to suspect him for it that would be a logical fallacy.

Blake I simply haven't seen much of yet. Flying under the radar.

Dibbler uses the exact same thing we attacked Jonty for ("What does the rest of the town think?") which makes me suspicious of him.

[DoomYoshi]

GAH! this fucking game moves too fast for me. You are right ghost, I was skimming. I didn't realize there was a page 5 and I thought my post was the first from the day.

Anyways, I am the seerin. I get to look at player's cards. I know the roles of aage and ghostly. That means of the last 4, we have a 0.75 chance of getting scum. I would rather start on the wagon than off, so 100% I am not switching from IB today.

[DoomYoshi]

BTW, I'm kinda ticked that I had to claim, ghost and aage for sure should've seen the cop hints. Who starts a day at LYLO with an aggressive vote? Careless players and cops.

[Iron Butterfly]

GAH! this fucking game moves too fast for me. You are right ghost, I was skimming. I didn't realize there was a page 5 and I thought my post was the first from the day.

Anyways, I am the seerin. I get to look at player's cards. I know the roles of aage and ghostly. That means of the last 4, we have a 0.75 chance of getting scum. I would rather start on the wagon than off, so 100% I am not switching from IB today.

That would not rule out that you joke voted as mafia and got extremely lucky that I started my day one case while aagee and ghostly band wagoned for a quick lynch, meaning the other two are mafia as well. Ghostlies only excuse is that he misread the vote count, which I find suspect.

If Doom is who he says and has cleared aagge and ghostly that does not automatically make me mafia. I have no trouble claiming.

[DoomYoshi]

Flail defense.

[rishaed]

Mod note:DoomYoshi has been chosen as the Birgermeister.

[ghostly447]

GAH! this fucking game moves too fast for me. You are right ghost, I was skimming. I didn't realize there was a page 5 and I thought my post was the first from the day.

Anyways, I am the seerin. I get to look at player's cards. I know the roles of aage and ghostly. That means of the last 4, we have a 0.75 chance of getting scum. I would rather start on the wagon than off, so 100% I am not switching from IB today.

That would not rule out that you joke voted as mafia and got extremely lucky that I started my day one case while aagee and ghostly band wagoned for a quick lynch, meaning the other two are mafia as well. Ghostlies only excuse is that he misread the vote count, which I find suspect.

If Doom is who he says and has cleared aagge and ghostly that does not automatically make me mafia. I have no trouble claiming.

Then shall I claim to keep the peace? I will confirm I am town and will back it up if need be. I dont know exactly why doom claimed though, and then said crap about it, but I didnt ask for his claim.

With that said, I still think aage's method of finding mafia would be good. This is a personal thing, because only really me, doom, and aage can confirm then that we are town, but since I know for a fact I am town I will go ahead with the day until someone requests a claim from me. So in my mind, doom is clear out of the 4 listed by aage, so that leaves dibbler, anamainiacks, and blake.

It may be nothing, but here goes. Dibbler and Blake start the day off joke voting each other, and not saying anymore that day. Dibbler comes in with the following (which I will make some thoughts on during your reread of this) I will make it clear, I am seeing this from my perspective that I am cleared as well as aage and doomyoshi, so there may be assumed statements that make it seem like I am accusing. I am not doing such, but instead opening all possibilities to be looked into:

Wow this game is moving way faster then the only other mafia game I was in. I was very busy this weekend and only had time for my normal games and no real time for Mafia so I was very surprised that we went from joke votes to a lynch in about 2 days.

I do feel that the swiftness of the lynch indicates a very high likely hood of werewolf involvement. So the main question I have is do we think it more likely that a werewolf would start the lynch or pile on? Personally i'm not sure Iron Butterfly is a werewolf. His argument for lynching feels much more like a first round stab in the dark looking for some reason to vote and I am far more suspicious of those who piled on then the one who started it. That doesn't completely rule out Iron Butterfly as werewolf but I'm more inclined to go after someone who piled on.

Ghostly notes: First paragraph, little bit of a reason for his absence, etc. Second Paragraph, Begins by stating the obvious that everyone already agrees with, blends in. semi-dismisses IB (remember this, I am coming back with it soon)

I have to give this more thought and re-read some posts.

something that clears Doom a little for me is that his Jonty vote was during the joke phase and wasn't really part of the piling on. In fact that is the reason I think the last vote went so fast, Doom had voted and not unvoted, so I would suggest that it was only 4 votes that killed Jonti with one of those being Safari who is dead. I lean very heavily to either aage or ghostly now with some suspicion left for IB for leading the initial vote. What does the rest of the town think?

More notes: Very next post 12 minutes later, Subtly dismisses doomyoshi's presence in the wagon (perhaps attempting to attach to a towny so if he is lynched his scum mates can follow up with a lynched towny?) while giving a decent reason to do so, then inflicts the normal reaction throughout the game, "I would say saf, but he is dead" that we all have stated or would have prior to him posting it if we were on, then picks out 3 players. Aage, myself, and a little bit of IB. Aage and myself have been deemed clear, and I am still willing to claim if needed, which leaves IB who as I said before just above who is semi-dismissed. Dibbler goes from "It doesnt rule him out completely" to "with some suspicion left for IB". A subtle change in opinion, but it is present, and within 12 minutes a subtle change is considered peculiar in my book.

FOS Dibbler - First in line for my vote
FOS IB - Could be a simple association like doom, but there is a little extra association via the change in his opinion
FOS Blake - For being under the radar with the exception of a joke vote on D1 against dibbler

Lots of FOS's but get over it. lol

[Iron Butterfly]

Ok Bergermeister must be town correct??

That would clear Doom, aggee and Ghostly. They are Town.

Now from my perspective. LOL I am not going to say I am Town BUT for a moment lets say I am. That would mean the other three are mafia.

Before the Bergermeister appointment, from MY perspective either the Doom faction or Diggler faction are mafia. I am not asking for anyone to believe I am Town, I am however asking that you look at my reasoning if I really was Town.

What do we have to go on?? Not much.

1) My guilt is the fact I started the case against Jonty. Nothing more and nothing less. Everyone agreed and everyone piled on...rather TOO quickly I might add. DUH. From my perspective those who expedited the lynch were prime suspect. Their excuse was they misread the vote count.

2) Before the Bergermeister appointment the Doom faction was either Town or Mafia. The diggler faction was the same. they were either Mafia or Town.

Now there are two choices. The Doom faction is clear with Doom as the Bergermeister.

1) Now the two choices would be lynching me as mafia and finding the two out of three left.
2) I am Town and the other three are mafia.

Choose wrong and game over.

What one should notice is the absence of anything from any of the other three. I am sure they will give lip service now that they have been called out.

Vote Diggler

[rishaed]

On a different note,

Burgermeister- Has a doublevote if the votes are tied. Is chosen by the first dead player in the game. Afterwards passed by "former" Burgermeistern to player of choice if lynched/NK'd.

It can be either Town or Mafia. It is chosen simply by the 1st dead player.

[ghostly447]

I dont really know how to proceed with this until the other players come on in. So I will wait for that to happen.

[aage]

If you really are the seerin, this is the only hint you have made in the entire game:

vote ghostly

for being a werewolf

I'm going to wait for Blake, Dibbler and Anamainiac to respond. One of them surely will come up with a counterclaim, valid or no. Currently I am sceptical of Doom's claim of being the seerin, call me for wifom but that is exactly how I would start off the day if I were scum. His current claim in no way dismisses him from the list.

[DoomYoshi]

No ghost don't claim. Massclaims are death. You are confirmed-town cop-cleared.

[DoomYoshi]

Oh wait, bergermeister isn't actually a confirmed town.

unvote

I don't a quick lynch. I suggest all town unvote until we reach a consensus on our plans.

[ghostly447]

Oh wait, bergermeister isn't actually a confirmed town.

unvote

I don't a quick lynch. I suggest all town unvote until we reach a consensus on our plans.

You are the burgermeister.

[DoomYoshi]

Yes but burgermeister is a secondary role. When the original burgermeister dies, he passes on his role to the next.

I don't know if I started as the burgermeister, or if saf was the burgermeister and gave it to me when he died. Either way, I found out at the same time everyone else did.

[aage]

Yes but burgermeister is a secondary role. When the original burgermeister dies, he passes on his role to the next.

I don't know if I started as the burgermeister, or if saf was the burgermeister and gave it to me when he died. Either way, I found out at the same time everyone else did.

We know, we read the role description.

[Iron Butterfly]

GAH! this fucking game moves too fast for me. You are right ghost, I was skimming. I didn't realize there was a page 5 and I thought my post was the first from the day.

Anyways, I am the seerin. I get to look at player's cards. I know the roles of aage and ghostly. That means of the last 4, we have a 0.75 chance of getting scum. I would rather start on the wagon than off, so 100% I am not switching from IB today.

What players use cards or are you playing Magic the Gathering? Be that as it may i would love you to point out how you hinted you were a cop and why would just aagee and Ghostly recognize it??

You are just noticing that mafia can pile on if you really are Town and that it may be a good idea to reach a consensus first?

Well done sir ..well done

[Iron Butterfly]

Sorry for the extra post.

"Serrin is essentially a cop". The description says nothing about you being a role cop, which is what you said.

[Iron Butterfly]

Sorry for the extra post.

"Serrin is essentially a cop". The description says nothing about you being a role cop, which is what you said.

unvote geez louise