Paris - V10 (May 28) (pgs. 1 & 9) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby swimmerdude99 on Thu May 03, 2012 1:00 am

I haven't read through everything but I suggest you extend the flag to go all the way down the map's basis, and maybe a little less diverse colors? try to stick with more red, blue, white/gray territs so it isn't so diverse?
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby koontz1973 on Thu May 03, 2012 1:45 am

Much better and much cleaner. I like it.

You legend are is very bland. Try to do something with it. Maybe the flag, or a nice picture of paris can be added to it.
Your pictures still need to be worked over. Try drawing them yourself.

Will have a long look later today for you but the best advice is to practise with your programme.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Thu May 03, 2012 9:21 am

swimmerdude99 wrote:I haven't read through everything but I suggest you extend the flag to go all the way down the map's basis


That was my initial idea, but isaiah said it detracted from the playable area somehow. He's got blue shoes, so I'll take his word for it. I tried lowering the opacity, but it didn't really look good.

swimmerdude99 wrote:maybe a little less diverse colors? try to stick with more red, blue, white/gray territs so it isn't so diverse?


I could. I kind of like the colors I have, though. We'll see.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Thu May 03, 2012 9:23 am

koontz1973 wrote:Much better and much cleaner. I like it.


Thanks! :D

koontz1973 wrote:You legend are is very bland. Try to do something with it. Maybe the flag, or a nice picture of paris can be added to it.


OK, I can do that. I'll probably have to draw something, though, since most of the images I've found online contain one or more of the landmarks already illustrated on the map itself.

koontz1973 wrote:Your pictures still need to be worked over. Try drawing them yourself. ... the best advice is to practise with your programme.


OK. I'll do my best. It might take some time, though.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby swimmerdude99 on Thu May 03, 2012 9:59 am

I very much like the shafting/scraped look you have on the territs by the way.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Thu May 03, 2012 10:05 am

Thanks! It's a texture called "oil paint" - appropriate, is it not, for the home of one of the world's most famous art museums? :D
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby koontz1973 on Mon May 07, 2012 11:51 pm

Here is a link to a youtube video for you. Take a look and it might give you a background and map style that will work for paris.

It is the same one I looked at for Jakarta.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eG5abY2NRKo

Here is a link given to me by natty for a download for gimp. It takes your image and turns it into a painting. Give it a go. (make sure it is on a copy and not the original)
http://gmic.sourceforge.net/
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby ComposerNate on Tue May 08, 2012 9:23 am

Hi there! I have a couple comments.
-I generally like the look of the map itself a lot more than the legend. The text of the legend is pretty distracting and odd. Specifically, the way the part on the left starts in the flag but goes beyond it. I would probably vote for a return to the flag covering the full background, or at least a little more of it, enough to be standard flag proportions. Another point about the text: I don't think the explanation of the ND abbreviation is necessary over on the right. You could work it in with the part on the left: +2 autodeploy on Notre Dame (ND)
-I can imagine it might be confusing to some players as to which territories they need to hold for the victory condition, because the army circle for l'Arc de Triomphe metro station is closer to the picture of the Arc than the circle for the territory itself (which is presumably the one that needs to be held). The same problem could occur to a lesser degree with Bastille and Sacre-Coeur.
-The bridge symbol is a little bland. Maybe you could do something with a graphic of an actual Paris bridge?
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby ComposerNate on Tue May 08, 2012 9:25 am

One more thing: what's the deal with the Asian characters in the upper left?
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Tue May 08, 2012 10:08 am

ComposerNate wrote:-I generally like the look of the map itself a lot more than the legend. The text of the legend is pretty distracting and odd. Specifically, the way the part on the left starts in the flag but goes beyond it. I would probably vote for a return to the flag covering the full background, or at least a little more of it, enough to be standard flag proportions.


What if I moved the text down a little more so it didn't start in the flag? Or made the flag less wide, so it's kind of in the top right corner?

ComposerNate wrote:Another point about the text: I don't think the explanation of the ND abbreviation is necessary over on the right. You could work it in with the part on the left: +2 autodeploy on Notre Dame (ND)


That's a good idea. I think I'll do that. Thank you.

ComposerNate wrote:-I can imagine it might be confusing to some players as to which territories they need to hold for the victory condition, because the army circle for l'Arc de Triomphe metro station is closer to the picture of the Arc than the circle for the territory itself (which is presumably the one that needs to be held). The same problem could occur to a lesser degree with Bastille and Sacre-Coeur.


The métro stations are connected by the métro lines, though. I would hope that would eliminate any confusion. I could switch the two circles so that the lower one was the métro station, though.

ComposerNate wrote:-The bridge symbol is a little bland. Maybe you could do something with a graphic of an actual Paris bridge?


Don't see why not. It might be a little more difficult, but I could figure it out.

ComposerNate wrote:One more thing: what's the deal with the Asian characters in the upper left?


That's the "sempai" in "sempaispellcheck." :D
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby koontz1973 on Tue May 08, 2012 12:19 pm

sempaispellcheck wrote:What if I moved the text down a little more so it didn't start in the flag? Or made the flag less wide, so it's kind of in the top right corner?

you are going to have to redo your whole legend from scratch. It is hard to read, looks blurred and is just plain ugly. Not to worry though, it is a very easy thing to fix as you have all of the elements there.

A couple of things to maybe consider is...
Remove the translation of river and put a small portion of the river.
Having bridges there is self explanatory so remove this. Also, you can cross the river by the trains so is also wrong.
Move the playable part of the map up to the top right.
Title, top left.
Bottom right, box it in and place your legend text here. Turn the glow of completely for now.
Bottom left - nice picture. ;)
It does not matter if the map covers part of the flag but this is a lot of wasted space here.

sempaispellcheck wrote:
ComposerNate wrote:Another point about the text: I don't think the explanation of the ND abbreviation is necessary over on the right. You could work it in with the part on the left: +2 autodeploy on Notre Dame (ND)

That's a good idea. I think I'll do that. Thank you.

If you managed to draw the island bigger (you do have room to make it bigger), you can remove the abbreviation completely. ;)

sempaispellcheck wrote:
ComposerNate wrote:-I can imagine it might be confusing to some players as to which territories they need to hold for the victory condition, because the army circle for l'Arc de Triomphe metro station is closer to the picture of the Arc than the circle for the territory itself (which is presumably the one that needs to be held). The same problem could occur to a lesser degree with Bastille and Sacre-Coeur.

The métro stations are connected by the métro lines, though. I would hope that would eliminate any confusion. I could switch the two circles so that the lower one was the métro station, though.

Switching circles is not going to work. You are going to rethink this whole thing. You have three different types of territ and all have the same army circle. Go and have a look at Portland (viewtopic.php?f=64&t=70975) to see a way of doing it. Not saying you should copy this but it is a lot clearer.

sempaispellcheck wrote:
ComposerNate wrote:-The bridge symbol is a little bland. Maybe you could do something with a graphic of an actual Paris bridge?

Don't see why not. It might be a little more difficult, but I could figure it out.

Not to worry yet. This is an easy fix. Use the square select tool, make a square the right size and use the textures that came with Gimp to fill. Then rotate to the correct angle. ;)
sempaispellcheck wrote:
ComposerNate wrote:One more thing: what's the deal with the Asian characters in the upper left?

That's the "sempai" in "sempaispellcheck." :D

Get rid of it. This is Paris, the city of love, onions and long bread. Not Chinese takeout. :P

That should keep you busy for a while. :lol:
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Tue May 08, 2012 1:21 pm

koontz1973 wrote:This is Paris, the city of love, onions and long bread. Not Chinese takeout. :P


It's Japanese. :x

koontz1973 wrote:That should keep you busy for a while. :lol:


No kidding. :roll:
I don't expect to get any work in on it this week, as it's Finals Week, but I should have a fair amount of time to work on it over the summer.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby koontz1973 on Tue May 08, 2012 1:25 pm

sempaispellcheck wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:This is Paris, the city of love, onions and long bread. Not Chinese takeout. :P


It's Japanese. :x

koontz1973 wrote:That should keep you busy for a while. :lol:


No kidding. :roll:
I don't expect to get any work in on it this week, as it's Finals Week, but I should have a fair amount of time to work on it over the summer.

Chinese or Japanese take out, it all looks and tastes the same after a few pints. :roll:

Loads of time for this so do not worry about it. Good luck with your finals.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Thu May 10, 2012 5:15 am

Good job !
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby ComposerNate on Thu May 10, 2012 7:35 am

koontz1973 wrote:
sempaispellcheck wrote:What if I moved the text down a little more so it didn't start in the flag? Or made the flag less wide, so it's kind of in the top right corner?

you are going to have to redo your whole legend from scratch. It is hard to read, looks blurred and is just plain ugly. Not to worry though, it is a very easy thing to fix as you have all of the elements there.

I tend to agree, I just said it more nicely.

koontz1973 wrote:Remove the translation of river and put a small portion of the river.
Having bridges there is self explanatory so remove this. Also, you can cross the river by the trains so is also wrong.

Seine is the name of the river, not the French word for river. However, I tend to agree that rivers and bridges are self-explanatory. Everyone knows how they work so having them in the legend is probably unnecessary.

koontz1973 wrote:
sempaispellcheck wrote:
ComposerNate wrote:-I can imagine it might be confusing to some players as to which territories they need to hold for the victory condition, because the army circle for l'Arc de Triomphe metro station is closer to the picture of the Arc than the circle for the territory itself (which is presumably the one that needs to be held). The same problem could occur to a lesser degree with Bastille and Sacre-Coeur.

The métro stations are connected by the métro lines, though. I would hope that would eliminate any confusion. I could switch the two circles so that the lower one was the métro station, though.

Switching circles is not going to work. You are going to rethink this whole thing. You have three different types of territ and all have the same army circle. Go and have a look at Portland (viewtopic.php?f=64&t=70975) to see a way of doing it. Not saying you should copy this but it is a lot clearer.

Agreed. If you have special types of army circles for the metro lines it will eliminate the confusion. I would still switch the "Arc de Triomphe" text with the (regular) circle, though, to make the circle closer to the graphic.

sempaispellcheck wrote:
ComposerNate wrote:One more thing: what's the deal with the Asian characters in the upper left?

That's the "sempai" in "sempaispellcheck." :D

Aha! Very clever sig! It should be smaller and at the bottom, though.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Thu May 10, 2012 7:39 am

Merci bien, Lance! Je fais le mieux que je peux! :D

Nate - glad you agree with Koontz - that makes my life easier. :D

The sig shall stay for now - I'll shrink it a bit and put it at the bottom of the legend.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby ViperOverLord on Mon May 14, 2012 9:27 pm

No Eifle Tower?
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Mon May 14, 2012 10:35 pm

La Tour Eiffel = the Eiffel (not Eifle :x ) Tower.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby Flapcake on Tue May 15, 2012 4:26 am

sempaispellcheck wrote:La Tour Eiffel = the Eiffel (not Eifle :x ) Tower.


I think La Tour Eiffel are only known by french people, the rest of the world known it as Eiffel tower, wich I believe would be the correct to call it, as then every one are sure what it is.

"Tour" sounds like something you can ride on, like a bike ;) dont take it to offencive but view it from a turists eye :P In my copenhagen map I had to call the sigths in english, cours no one would have know what the hell Im talking about :?
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Tue May 15, 2012 7:41 am

Flapcake wrote:the rest of the world known it as Eiffel tower


Not true. The Spanish have another word for it, as do the Italians, as do...
Point is, this is a map of Paris, where the people speak French. The territory names are all in French (and few of them translate), so to call it the Eiffel Tower would make it out-of-sync with the rest of the territories.
Put "Tour Eiffel" into Google and the second result is the English-language Wikipedia page for the "Eiffel Tower."

Most English speakers (particularly Americans) will eventually (and I hope soon) have to realize that the rest of the world will not speak English simply because they're too lazy to learn another language.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby cairnswk on Tue May 15, 2012 10:02 am

I agree with sempaispellcheck on this one...
I also know it as la Tour Eiffel (not just it's English derivation) and think it is more appropriate.

Also, you have the Juillet Column in the Place de la Bastille...while i recognise the Bastille no longer stands wouldn't it be more appropriate for an image of the Bastilleto appear there, rather than a monument celebrating the occassion and date. Or at least a floor plan image of the Bastille.

sempaispellcheck, i hope this will go somewhere graphically...i have to say it is not looking too good at present imho. I am sorry to be blunt. i don't like the oriental characters whatever they represent, and for such a huge city like Paris, i think something more/better could have been made of the arrondissements (districts including the outer porte ones), quartiers (quaters e.g. Latin), rive droite (right bank) and rive gauche (left bank) towards the gameplay.

I really want to encourage you to continue and hope you can arrive at a better position. There are so many creative things that could be done with this map. :)
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby Flapcake on Tue May 15, 2012 11:47 am

sempaispellcheck wrote:Most English speakers (particularly Americans) will eventually (and I hope soon) have to realize that the rest of the world will not speak English simply because they're too lazy to learn another language.


(Lets not turn this in to a argument club ;))

But this not true, at ohterhand frensh people refuse to speak any thing but frensh, I have been to france many times and have noted that if you dont speak frensh they dont give a shit about you (mostly old people) English are the largest language in the western world and obligatorical in schools from 3 class in my contry, when french are choice free at college, and very few choose it, kind of same whit germans, when they travel in my contry they expect that we speak german and refuses to speak english or simply cant. I dont get it sorry.

Please note this, I think your english are good and Im not after you as person, but france had and still have I my contry a bad reputation (almost arrogant) about the "refuses to speak any thing but french thing"
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby koontz1973 on Tue May 15, 2012 11:56 am

The map is of Paris, the French capital. Having the territ names in French is more than acceptable and as long as they are correct and consistent, it should be allowed. Having territ names in English may be preferred by some users, but then we would need to Anglicise a lot of maps.

sempaispellcheck, as you are in the USA, it might be wise to send a mass PM to the French users of the site and ask them to come and have a look. Use google translate if you do not speak French and give them a set list of questions. One being correct territ names. Hope that helps.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby sempaispellcheck on Tue May 15, 2012 12:16 pm

cairnswk wrote:Also, you have the Juillet Column in the Place de la Bastille...while i recognise the Bastille no longer stands wouldn't it be more appropriate for an image of the Bastilleto appear there, rather than a monument celebrating the occassion and date. Or at least a floor plan image of the Bastille.


That's a good point, cairns. Not sure how it escaped me, but I think it would probably be a better idea to have an image of la Bastille there - especially since la Colonne de Juillet actually commemorates a totally different event.

cairnswk wrote:sempaispellcheck, i hope this will go somewhere graphically...i have to say it is not looking too good at present imho. I am sorry to be blunt. i don't like the oriental characters whatever they represent, and for such a huge city like Paris, i think something more/better could have been made of the arrondissements (districts including the outer porte ones), quartiers (quaters e.g. Latin), rive droite (right bank) and rive gauche (left bank) towards the gameplay.


Me, too. This is my first map, and I didn't have much graphics experience when I started. koontz has given me a laundry list of things to work on for my next update (I think it's on page 5), but if you want to add to that, I would be most grateful - just please be as specific as possible (what do you mean by "something more/better? for example).
The Japanese characters are the "sempai" in "sempaispellcheck." I was advised to "do something" with my username, and that was what I thought of. It is staying as is (though I might move it and/or make it smaller) until and unless I get another idea that I like better.

Don't worry, koontz - I speak French fluently. In fact, I just got back from Paris in January - was studying there for a semester.
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Re: Paris - V6 (5/2) (pgs. 1 & 4) - FEEDBACK PLEASE!!

Postby koontz1973 on Tue May 15, 2012 12:28 pm

sempaispellcheck wrote:Don't worry, koontz - I speak French fluently. In fact, I just got back from Paris in January - was studying there for a semester.

You lucky lucky bastard. But the idea is one worth doing. Getting fresh eyes onto the map, giving ideas and feedback in general is always good.

You Chinese character has to go though for your sig. Bung your name onto the map with the character behind it. Sort of like cairnswk butterfly.
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