New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby skip on Sun Jan 04, 2009 8:32 pm

Why would anyone spend their free time taking part in a game that their opponents don't know how to play correctly? I don't get it. Apparently it's a problem, though, so people who get their rocks off that way must be out there...
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby GENERAL STONEHAM on Sun Jan 04, 2009 8:48 pm

skip wrote:Why would anyone spend their free time taking part in a game that their opponents don't know how to play correctly? I don't get it. Apparently it's a problem, though, so people who get their rocks off that way must be out there...


Yes Skip, some players prey on newbies. It's about their self-esteem and their precious points and rank. Just like Jeff Hardy!
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby porkenbeans on Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:11 pm

skip wrote:Why would anyone spend their free time taking part in a game that their opponents don't know how to play correctly? I don't get it. Apparently it's a problem, though, so people who get their rocks off that way must be out there...
Yes the majority of the top players are Newbie rapers.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby neanderpaul14 on Mon Jan 05, 2009 1:25 am

Mr Changsha wrote:
King_Herpes wrote:
neanderpaul14 wrote:
King_Herpes wrote:It's about damn time. I mean, how long were you going to let that madness continue? It's an outrage I tell ya! Darn farmers, all they care about is points points points...



=D> =D> :lol: :P Awright Herps any ideas what we should do to the farmers??



Well, actually since you asked. I find it kind of imperialistic to just come through and snatch our pride right out of our hands. We were one with the spiritual Conquer Club and we mothered every ? that came into our lives. Just because we appeared to be primitive and not as domesticated doesn't mean we aren't kind, gentle, and giving souls. I personally believe that we are entitled to some form of reservation and casino offerings. I did subtly warn Twill that if we continue to be suppressed and erased from CC history than there will be an uprising where we attack your trains and burn your carriages. However, I've grown a bit depressed and am slowly forgetting what it means to be a farmer *Sigh*. I'm currently drinking my 4th bottle of hairspray while loathing my fallen fellow warriors and spirit ancestors.

-Chief Herp, last of the herpaewa farmers


I think what we need here is a 'farming treatment program'. Responsible members can set up some multis and distribute them liberally around the site on fave farming maps. King_H and his ilk can have fun finding them and enjoy that special satisfaction of beating a deadbeat. It is not as easy as it looks you know! Every month we'll create less multis and gradually wean our favourite farming friends off of their nasty little addiction. It is the only humane thing to do!


So what your suggesting is sort of like a methadone program aimed at newbie farmers???

I can picture the line out the door now "C'mon man just one n00b please, I need one to get right. I'll pay you tomorrow. You know I'm good for it. AWWWW just one cmon *sob* please man."
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby jarrett155 on Mon Jan 05, 2009 4:26 am

GENERAL STONEHAM wrote:Poor lil' Jeffrey Hardy is upset with me. Yep, he sent a p.m. to me to tell me how unfair I am with him....boo-hoo, somebody give me a hankie.

I tell you what Jeffrey, since you think I'm so brutal to you. Why don't we have people here who have posted on this thread to pick several games and with several options and then we'll decide whether a low rank individual like myself and high rank person like yourself is, umm, errr...more qualified as a player here at C.C.

Please, don't back down or come up with some lame excuse, play me with games on those who posted would choose and we'll see, if high rank means anything against a low rank piece of shit like myself.

Are you gamed or cluck, cluck....chicken. Let the games begin!

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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Mr Changsha on Mon Jan 05, 2009 4:35 am

Still no word from Twill with regards to me becoming the new 'Farming Prevention with special attention to Weaning' Moderator.

Just the kind of customer service we've all come to expect from CC.

I've even been working out scripts that'll allow my multis to - every once in a while - throw themselves at neutrals, just to make the experience that much more real for our reforming farmers.

I've shown I care; when is Twill going to show that he cares I care about the care of CC?
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Greeboski on Mon Jan 05, 2009 5:03 am

i joined a few days ago. and have started 6 games in total. 2 of the games have been joint LAST by a mid-ranked player as the only non-noob. i also have joined 2 games started by ranked players. the other 2 games are 100% noob.

from what i have read here 2/3rd's of my games started to date could be farming games.

i do have a grasp of the rules of that board game that is almost similar, but do not know any of the other maps here.
also the interface takes a little getting used to.

i would propose that noob's be "quarenteened" to start with.
untill they have FINISHED playing four noob only games and last 6 turns in each.
ALSO each map should require ONE game against other "first few go's on this map" players. (a win would exclude a player from further unscored games on that map)
this should get them used to the interface in all aspects and not leave people clewless as to the maps.

all of these games should be unscored. and the player would have the rank "trainee" or "???" if you like.

to me this is the only way to STOP the practice, and is more like reality - all soldiers go through basic training even the generals did at some point.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby john9blue on Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:05 am

Greeboski wrote:i joined a few days ago. and have started 6 games in total. 2 of the games have been joint LAST by a mid-ranked player as the only non-noob. i also have joined 2 games started by ranked players. the other 2 games are 100% noob.

from what i have read here 2/3rd's of my games started to date could be farming games.

i do have a grasp of the rules of that board game that is almost similar, but do not know any of the other maps here.
also the interface takes a little getting used to.

i would propose that noob's be "quarenteened" to start with.
untill they have FINISHED playing four noob only games and last 6 turns in each.
ALSO each map should require ONE game against other "first few go's on this map" players. (a win would exclude a player from further unscored games on that map)
this should get them used to the interface in all aspects and not leave people clewless as to the maps.

all of these games should be unscored. and the player would have the rank "trainee" or "???" if you like.

to me this is the only way to STOP the practice, and is more like reality - all soldiers go through basic training even the generals did at some point.


The thing is, lots of newbs deadbeat. That's not a very good first experience, is it?

What we need are unranked games that are available to everyone. Then, New Recruits must play their first five games unranked before they show up on the scoreboard at 1000 points.

Here's an even better suggestion... Lack should make some multis of his own that roll straight sixes against anyone that's a Lieutenant or higher, if they are the only non-newbie in the game. That ought to be interesting. :lol:
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Jeff Hardy on Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:44 am

jarrett155 wrote:
GENERAL STONEHAM wrote:Poor lil' Jeffrey Hardy is upset with me. Yep, he sent a p.m. to me to tell me how unfair I am with him....boo-hoo, somebody give me a hankie.

I tell you what Jeffrey, since you think I'm so brutal to you. Why don't we have people here who have posted on this thread to pick several games and with several options and then we'll decide whether a low rank individual like myself and high rank person like yourself is, umm, errr...more qualified as a player here at C.C.

Please, don't back down or come up with some lame excuse, play me with games on those who posted would choose and we'll see, if high rank means anything against a low rank piece of shit like myself.

Are you gamed or cluck, cluck....chicken. Let the games begin!

General Stoneham

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sounds good

now please dont chicken out stoneham, i love beating haters

btw, did you even bother to look at my games or were you so jealous of my rank that you just had to start flaming?
Last edited by Jeff Hardy on Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby GENERAL STONEHAM on Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:03 am

Ok Jeffrey, just to make sure it ain't luck, but skill, I propose 20 games.

I'll pick 10 maps and options and you'll pick the same amount and options.

I'll p.m. you my 10 games with password and I'll expect the same from you.

We can then tell everyone here on Farming, how over-ranked you are, tee-hee, OR if I'm just full of shit.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Jeff Hardy on Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:06 am

GENERAL STONEHAM wrote:Ok Jeffrey, just to make sure it ain't luck, but skill, I propose 20 games.

I'll pick 10 maps and options and you'll pick the same amount and options.

I'll p.m. you my 10 games with password and I'll expect the same from you.

We can then tell everyone here on Farming, how over-ranked you are, tee-hee, OR if I'm just full of shit.

dont chicken out man

you said that someone should say settings and thats what we'll play

someone has said settings, thats what were playing

and your theory of "i pick 10, you pick 10" is completely flawed and you know it

id win all 10 of my games and at least 6 of yours but id still lose points in total

get up to general (or at least colonel/brig) and then ill do 20 games with you where we pick 10 each

i think ill let my brother (a corporal) play them and just give him advice on how to win and watch you drop your rank to corporal yourself :lol:

he could even get his rank down to private, just for you ;)
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby GENERAL STONEHAM on Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:30 am

Jeff Hardy wrote:
GENERAL STONEHAM wrote:Ok Jeffrey, just to make sure it ain't luck, but skill, I propose 20 games.

I'll pick 10 maps and options and you'll pick the same amount and options.

I'll p.m. you my 10 games with password and I'll expect the same from you.

We can then tell everyone here on Farming, how over-ranked you are, tee-hee, OR if I'm just full of shit.

dont chicken out man

you said that someone should say settings and thats what we'll play

someone has said settings, thats what were playing

and your theory of "i pick 10, you pick 10" is completely flawed and you know it

id win all 10 of my games and at least 6 of yours but id still lose points in total

get up to general (or at least colonel/brig) and then ill do 20 games with you where we pick 10 each

i think ill let my brother (a corporal) play them and just give him advice on how to win and watch you drop your rank to corporal yourself :lol:

he could even get his rank down to private, just for you ;)



Here's my 10 games [which I p.m. you with password]
3976839, 48, 56, 59, 62, 64, 67, 70, 73, 74

BUT! It looks like you are a chicken! Coming up with excuses now.

Lil' Jeffrey Hardy aka Chicken Shit!

As everyone can see by my choices of games, there's a huge variety of maps.

Obviously you have multiple accounts and you use your dummy accounts to raise your precious points and rank.

You are just a coward and also are a over-ranked trans-sexual, transvestite, homosexual, acne plagued kid, who likes to play dress up with Mommy's clothes and make up.

You sicken me and are a disgrace to all high rank and strategic players at C.C.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Jeff Hardy on Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:44 am

like i said before man, id win all 10 of my games and at least 6 of yours

now thats 16-4 but for every game i win i get 7 and for every game i lose i lose 55

now thats 16x7-55x4=-104

so in total i would lose 104 because of your shit rank

so obviously, my answer in NO
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Night Strike on Mon Jan 05, 2009 2:17 pm

General Stoneham, your games and flames don't belong in this thread. Please take them to the appropriate forums.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby thegreekdog on Mon Jan 05, 2009 5:18 pm

I am a relatively new player... love the game, etc. If I receive an email from someone asking me to play a game, I'll say yes, no matter who it is or where it is. I'm not really caring that they are better at this game than I am and that I have a 90% chance to lose. I can learn something from the game and I'm fairly sure I'll have fun.

With that being said, I didn't know what farmers were until a week ago, which happened to coincide with me getting a random message to join a game (I didn't join because it was 3 AM EST and I was a drunk). Anyway my point is that Newbie farmers are only "hurting" people who are not newbie farmers (i.e. the people posting here who think their low ranking comparatively to newbie farmers are because of newbie farming). I don't think newbie farmers are hurting newbies. I got drilled in my first few games, and I get destroyed anytime I change settings or maps to something unfamiliar to me. Yet, I'm still playing. In an effort to anger everyone, I will say that :

(1) People who try to win games against newbies just to increase their point total are hurting themselves because it cannot be fun to beat up on someone who has no clue what they're doing... that's like a 300 pound man beating up a 100 pound guy. Sure, the little guy is hurting, but the 300 pound guy should be ashamed of himself. But, to each their own.
(2) The supposed purpose of banning newbie farming is to get newbies to stay on the site. However, I think the people supporting the ban of newbie farming are not concerned with that so much as they are concerned about eliminating the newbie farmers from the game. The point is that the supports of the newbie farming ban are more concerned with their own advancement than whether or not newbies stay with the site. Newbies are going to stay on this site because playing is fun and distracting and because the maps are really well-done. They are not going to stay just because they win some games.

At any rate, that's the view from the bottom.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby SlayerQC on Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:47 pm

ABOUT TIME!!

Thanks, cant wait to see king herpes leave the game or become a cook :)
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Mr Changsha on Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:53 pm

thegreekdog wrote:I am a relatively new player... love the game, etc. If I receive an email from someone asking me to play a game, I'll say yes, no matter who it is or where it is. I'm not really caring that they are better at this game than I am and that I have a 90% chance to lose. I can learn something from the game and I'm fairly sure I'll have fun.

With that being said, I didn't know what farmers were until a week ago, which happened to coincide with me getting a random message to join a game (I didn't join because it was 3 AM EST and I was a drunk). Anyway my point is that Newbie farmers are only "hurting" people who are not newbie farmers (i.e. the people posting here who think their low ranking comparatively to newbie farmers are because of newbie farming). I don't think newbie farmers are hurting newbies. I got drilled in my first few games, and I get destroyed anytime I change settings or maps to something unfamiliar to me. Yet, I'm still playing. In an effort to anger everyone, I will say that :

(1) People who try to win games against newbies just to increase their point total are hurting themselves because it cannot be fun to beat up on someone who has no clue what they're doing... that's like a 300 pound man beating up a 100 pound guy. Sure, the little guy is hurting, but the 300 pound guy should be ashamed of himself. But, to each their own.
(2) The supposed purpose of banning newbie farming is to get newbies to stay on the site. However, I think the people supporting the ban of newbie farming are not concerned with that so much as they are concerned about eliminating the newbie farmers from the game. The point is that the supports of the newbie farming ban are more concerned with their own advancement than whether or not newbies stay with the site. Newbies are going to stay on this site because playing is fun and distracting and because the maps are really well-done. They are not going to stay just because they win some games.
At any rate, that's the view from the bottom.


The second point is absolutely right. I've found few people in life who give a shit about the little guy, yet I have met many who pretend to when it fits in with an argument they are having. Considering most people in my generation are intolerably self-centred (I'm in my late twenties) and those in the next generation even worse, this idea of players here saying "think of the poor new player, think of his enjoyment!" has always been, in the main, utter tosh. "Think of MY ranking, think of MY points!" is a far more likely sentiment to come from Thatcher and Reagan's children. However, I would say that the number of people who have written about the 'poor player's enjoyment' while figuratively swigging back the champagne of a high rank can only have come from the Blair/Clinton/Bush era.

King_H cold attain ten thousand points in any way he so chooses and it wouldn't effect my sense of self-worth one little bit. I know I am a good player. I could be number 500, number 300 or number 1,000 and it wouldn't effect the fact that I know I'm a bastard to beat on a Risk board. I can imagine chaps like porkenbeans and farangdemon going through the leaderboard counting up those they consider farmers and saying to themselves "I would be in the top 250 (or whatever) if all these farmers weren't farming." That's pretty sad, but understandable. What's so infuriating is that they then pretend they write 'for the good of the site'. Highly unlikely. Like most people in our decadent Western societies, they write for their own good and their own interest always.

Change the rules by all means Lack, for it might well make the site better...and hence be in your self-interest to do so. I would hope you're not fooled by the bleating of a bunch of pampered little babies that are prime examples of the 'me, me, me!' generation, with a bit of champagne socialism thrown in just to be sadly fitting of the times we live in.
Last edited by Mr Changsha on Tue Jan 06, 2009 12:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Sun Tzup on Tue Jan 06, 2009 12:14 am

Soo... just for my info Im wondering, does this count as farming?

Im mean this guy seems to play only team games, dubs trips with high ranking partners and play against mainly low ranking 2000+ opints below him players.

Heres a few examples ...


http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3975143
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3981172
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3975524

here are some more to the point examples...
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3966958
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3973872
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3973217
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3968634
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3971085
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3966147
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3957128
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3955616
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3953313
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=3952931


And I only looked at the first page and a half.

I guess my question is how do we tell whats farming and whats not farming? If you start a bunch of games that are dubs and trips with other 3000+ rating individuals and sit and wait for the games to fill is that farming? Anyone can join right?

I guess I am just unsure as to how one would clarify farming lines.
The reason I got the impression this guy is a farmer is that he refused to play me or anyone else in callouts unless it was a dubs or trips game against him and his big friends.. that seemed a little suspicious to me personally so I checked his record and lo... but eh I dont know that he PPMs the victims, I guess that would be farming if he invited them to play because they were low ranks... hmmm but he wouldnt do something like that right?
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby porkenbeans on Tue Jan 06, 2009 1:34 am

Mr Changsha wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:I am a relatively new player... love the game, etc. If I receive an email from someone asking me to play a game, I'll say yes, no matter who it is or where it is. I'm not really caring that they are better at this game than I am and that I have a 90% chance to lose. I can learn something from the game and I'm fairly sure I'll have fun.

With that being said, I didn't know what farmers were until a week ago, which happened to coincide with me getting a random message to join a game (I didn't join because it was 3 AM EST and I was a drunk). Anyway my point is that Newbie farmers are only "hurting" people who are not newbie farmers (i.e. the people posting here who think their low ranking comparatively to newbie farmers are because of newbie farming). I don't think newbie farmers are hurting newbies. I got drilled in my first few games, and I get destroyed anytime I change settings or maps to something unfamiliar to me. Yet, I'm still playing. In an effort to anger everyone, I will say that :

(1) People who try to win games against newbies just to increase their point total are hurting themselves because it cannot be fun to beat up on someone who has no clue what they're doing... that's like a 300 pound man beating up a 100 pound guy. Sure, the little guy is hurting, but the 300 pound guy should be ashamed of himself. But, to each their own.
(2) The supposed purpose of banning newbie farming is to get newbies to stay on the site. However, I think the people supporting the ban of newbie farming are not concerned with that so much as they are concerned about eliminating the newbie farmers from the game. The point is that the supports of the newbie farming ban are more concerned with their own advancement than whether or not newbies stay with the site. Newbies are going to stay on this site because playing is fun and distracting and because the maps are really well-done. They are not going to stay just because they win some games.
At any rate, that's the view from the bottom.


The second point is absolutely right. I've found few people in life who give a shit about the little guy, yet I have met many who pretend to when it fits in with an argument they are having. Considering most people in my generation are intolerably self-centred (I'm in my late twenties) and those in the next generation even worse, this idea of players here saying "think of the poor new player, think of his enjoyment!" has always been, in the main, utter tosh. "Think of MY ranking, think of MY points!" is a far more likely sentiment to come from Thatcher and Reagan's children. However, I would say that the number of people who have written about the 'poor player's enjoyment' while figuratively swigging back the champagne of a high rank can only have come from the Blair/Clinton/Bush era.

King_H cold attain ten thousand points in any way he so chooses and it wouldn't effect my sense of self-worth one little bit. I know I am a good player. I could be number 500, number 300 or number 1,000 and it wouldn't effect the fact that I know I'm a bastard to beat on a Risk board. I can imagine chaps like porkenbeans and farangdemon going through the leaderboard counting up those they consider farmers and saying to themselves "I would be in the top 250 (or whatever) if all these farmers weren't farming." That's pretty sad, but understandable. What's so infuriating is that they then pretend they write 'for the good of the site'. Highly unlikely. Like most people in our decadent Western societies, they write for their own good and their own interest always.

Change the rules by all means Lack, for it might well make the site better...and hence be in your self-interest to do so. I would hope you're not fooled by the bleating of a bunch of pampered little babies that are prime examples of the 'me, me, me!' generation, with a bit of champagne socialism thrown in just to be sadly fitting of the times we live in.
You are misrepresenting my views and motives. You know very well that I have championed the cause, for the integrity of the leaderboard, to make it fair to everyone. I admit and proclaim loudly that it is not fair to me or anyone else. Of course my motivation for going on this crusade, was because I felt it was not fair to me. And yes if it were not for the Newbie Farmers and multi-cheaters, I would be on page 1 right now. If your rank or your place on the leaderboard does not mean that much to you, that is fine with me. But, if it DOES mean something to others, you should let that be fine with YOU. Yours is NOT the only interest that counts. For the life of me I can not understand why anyone would waste so many hours on a gaming site that is not fair. What in the world is wrong with wanting to play a fair game, and eagerly trying to be the best ? After all, isn't that what a leaderboard is for ?
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby FarangDemon on Tue Jan 06, 2009 2:17 am

Mr Changsha wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:I am a relatively new player... love the game, etc. If I receive an email from someone asking me to play a game, I'll say yes, no matter who it is or where it is. I'm not really caring that they are better at this game than I am and that I have a 90% chance to lose. I can learn something from the game and I'm fairly sure I'll have fun.

With that being said, I didn't know what farmers were until a week ago, which happened to coincide with me getting a random message to join a game (I didn't join because it was 3 AM EST and I was a drunk). Anyway my point is that Newbie farmers are only "hurting" people who are not newbie farmers (i.e. the people posting here who think their low ranking comparatively to newbie farmers are because of newbie farming). I don't think newbie farmers are hurting newbies. I got drilled in my first few games, and I get destroyed anytime I change settings or maps to something unfamiliar to me. Yet, I'm still playing. In an effort to anger everyone, I will say that :

(1) People who try to win games against newbies just to increase their point total are hurting themselves because it cannot be fun to beat up on someone who has no clue what they're doing... that's like a 300 pound man beating up a 100 pound guy. Sure, the little guy is hurting, but the 300 pound guy should be ashamed of himself. But, to each their own.
(2) The supposed purpose of banning newbie farming is to get newbies to stay on the site. However, I think the people supporting the ban of newbie farming are not concerned with that so much as they are concerned about eliminating the newbie farmers from the game. The point is that the supports of the newbie farming ban are more concerned with their own advancement than whether or not newbies stay with the site. Newbies are going to stay on this site because playing is fun and distracting and because the maps are really well-done. They are not going to stay just because they win some games.
At any rate, that's the view from the bottom.


The second point is absolutely right. I've found few people in life who give a shit about the little guy, yet I have met many who pretend to when it fits in with an argument they are having. Considering most people in my generation are intolerably self-centred (I'm in my late twenties) and those in the next generation even worse, this idea of players here saying "think of the poor new player, think of his enjoyment!" has always been, in the main, utter tosh. "Think of MY ranking, think of MY points!" is a far more likely sentiment to come from Thatcher and Reagan's children. However, I would say that the number of people who have written about the 'poor player's enjoyment' while figuratively swigging back the champagne of a high rank can only have come from the Blair/Clinton/Bush era.

King_H cold attain ten thousand points in any way he so chooses and it wouldn't effect my sense of self-worth one little bit. I know I am a good player. I could be number 500, number 300 or number 1,000 and it wouldn't effect the fact that I know I'm a bastard to beat on a Risk board. I can imagine chaps like porkenbeans and farangdemon going through the leaderboard counting up those they consider farmers and saying to themselves "I would be in the top 250 (or whatever) if all these farmers weren't farming." That's pretty sad, but understandable. What's so infuriating is that they then pretend they write 'for the good of the site'. Highly unlikely. Like most people in our decadent Western societies, they write for their own good and their own interest always.

Change the rules by all means Lack, for it might well make the site better...and hence be in your self-interest to do so. I would hope you're not fooled by the bleating of a bunch of pampered little babies that are prime examples of the 'me, me, me!' generation, with a bit of champagne socialism thrown in just to be sadly fitting of the times we live in.


You have summed up my motives correctly, except for the personal attack and name calling you peppered in there at the end.

I believe farming should be done away with because I think the #1 ranked player should tend to beat the #2 ranked player. I want something to work towards. Its depressing to know that the upper echelon of players refuse to play me because I have not inflated my score by farming unskilled players.

I thought everybody who is good would feel this way?

In some posts, I have provided examples of farmers joining games with noobs who have complained about it. The reason was to provide another reason to convince people why farming is bad. So I am a bogeyman or something?

The strength of an argument is not about who is on what side of an argument. It is about the strength of the argument. It is not about FarangDemon, unless you choose it to be, Mr. Changsha.

For me, it is about #1 ranked player should tend to beat the #2 ranked player. Agree or not?

I challenge you to answer.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby King_Herpes on Tue Jan 06, 2009 2:31 am

FarangDemon wrote:
You have summed up my motives correctly, except for the personal attack and name calling you peppered in there at the end.

I believe farming should be done away with because I think the #1 ranked player should tend to beat the #2 ranked player. I want something to work towards. Its depressing to know that the upper echelon of players refuse to play me because I have not inflated my score by farming unskilled players.


Game 3909663,Game 3909644, & Game 3909666 Would you like fries with that?

FarangDemon wrote:I thought everybody who is good would feel this way?

In some posts, I have provided examples of farmers joining games with noobs who have complained about it. The reason was to provide another reason to convince people why farming is bad. So I am a bogeyman or something?

The strength of an argument is not about who is on what side of an argument. It is about the strength of the argument. It is not about FarangDemon, unless you choose it to be, Mr. Changsha.

For me, it is about #1 ranked player should tend to beat the #2 ranked player. Agree or not?

I challenge you to answer.



Game 3399423 This is Burger King, and I do want you to have it your way...
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Mr Changsha on Tue Jan 06, 2009 2:46 am

porkenbeans wrote:
Mr Changsha wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:I am a relatively new player... love the game, etc. If I receive an email from someone asking me to play a game, I'll say yes, no matter who it is or where it is. I'm not really caring that they are better at this game than I am and that I have a 90% chance to lose. I can learn something from the game and I'm fairly sure I'll have fun.

With that being said, I didn't know what farmers were until a week ago, which happened to coincide with me getting a random message to join a game (I didn't join because it was 3 AM EST and I was a drunk). Anyway my point is that Newbie farmers are only "hurting" people who are not newbie farmers (i.e. the people posting here who think their low ranking comparatively to newbie farmers are because of newbie farming). I don't think newbie farmers are hurting newbies. I got drilled in my first few games, and I get destroyed anytime I change settings or maps to something unfamiliar to me. Yet, I'm still playing. In an effort to anger everyone, I will say that :

(1) People who try to win games against newbies just to increase their point total are hurting themselves because it cannot be fun to beat up on someone who has no clue what they're doing... that's like a 300 pound man beating up a 100 pound guy. Sure, the little guy is hurting, but the 300 pound guy should be ashamed of himself. But, to each their own.
(2) The supposed purpose of banning newbie farming is to get newbies to stay on the site. However, I think the people supporting the ban of newbie farming are not concerned with that so much as they are concerned about eliminating the newbie farmers from the game. The point is that the supports of the newbie farming ban are more concerned with their own advancement than whether or not newbies stay with the site. Newbies are going to stay on this site because playing is fun and distracting and because the maps are really well-done. They are not going to stay just because they win some games.
At any rate, that's the view from the bottom.


The second point is absolutely right. I've found few people in life who give a shit about the little guy, yet I have met many who pretend to when it fits in with an argument they are having. Considering most people in my generation are intolerably self-centred (I'm in my late twenties) and those in the next generation even worse, this idea of players here saying "think of the poor new player, think of his enjoyment!" has always been, in the main, utter tosh. "Think of MY ranking, think of MY points!" is a far more likely sentiment to come from Thatcher and Reagan's children. However, I would say that the number of people who have written about the 'poor player's enjoyment' while figuratively swigging back the champagne of a high rank can only have come from the Blair/Clinton/Bush era.

King_H cold attain ten thousand points in any way he so chooses and it wouldn't effect my sense of self-worth one little bit. I know I am a good player. I could be number 500, number 300 or number 1,000 and it wouldn't effect the fact that I know I'm a bastard to beat on a Risk board. I can imagine chaps like porkenbeans and farangdemon going through the leaderboard counting up those they consider farmers and saying to themselves "I would be in the top 250 (or whatever) if all these farmers weren't farming." That's pretty sad, but understandable. What's so infuriating is that they then pretend they write 'for the good of the site'. Highly unlikely. Like most people in our decadent Western societies, they write for their own good and their own interest always.

Change the rules by all means Lack, for it might well make the site better...and hence be in your self-interest to do so. I would hope you're not fooled by the bleating of a bunch of pampered little babies that are prime examples of the 'me, me, me!' generation, with a bit of champagne socialism thrown in just to be sadly fitting of the times we live in.
You are misrepresenting my views and motives. You know very well that I have championed the cause, for the integrity of the leaderboard, to make it fair to everyone. I admit and proclaim loudly that it is not fair to me or anyone else. Of course my motivation for going on this crusade, was because I felt it was not fair to me. And yes if it were not for the Newbie Farmers and multi-cheaters, I would be on page 1 right now. If your rank or your place on the leaderboard does not mean that much to you, that is fine with me. But, if it DOES mean something to others, you should let that be fine with YOU. Yours is NOT the only interest that counts. For the life of me I can not understand why anyone would waste so many hours on a gaming site that is not fair. What in the world is wrong with wanting to play a fair game, and eagerly trying to be the best ? After all, isn't that what a leaderboard is for ?


Might I gently suggest you stop trying to compare yourself to others who play an entirely different game style to the one you play? You're never going to have as high a rank as players involved in quads freestlye speed settings, unless you start playing that way yourself. Now YOU might well say they are farmers, but I think I've shown in other threads that these catergorisations are far too subjective to be valid. So accept that fact and expand your mind a little. I also know that I'll never achieve such a high score playing 8 man no cards games. However, within my own mind, I know that if I can achieve colonel rank playing those kinds of games then I am doing well at my chosen discipline. You don't find players much past 2,5oo points in the games I play. Are the top (large game) singles no cards players being cheated by the system? I would say not. I know who are the best players that play my style of game and if I compare myself to anyone (and to be honest with you I really don't think about it that much), then I compare myself to those players. Do I compare myself by score? Again not really. Most of the best no cards singles players are captains, majors and the top few are colonels. Do I automatically assume that the colonel is better than the captain? Of course not.

The difference between us, to be perfectly frank about it porkenbeans, is that I play one of the most challenging styles of play you can find on CC, while you play 1vs1 sequential. I naturally therefore have far more confidence in my inherent abilities and so don't feel the need to define myself by score or rank, or criticise others about how they play the game. You quite obviously do.

You've just admitted the central point from my previous post - that you primarily care about your place on the leaderboard. If you re-read my last post you'll see that I felt such an spiration was a little sad (yes from my perspective) but understandable . The second point is the key bit though...

What's so infuriating is that they then pretend they write 'for the good of the site'. Highly unlikely. Like most people in our decadent Western societies, they write for their own good and their own interest always.

That's the reason I make a point of criticising you in the threads you make. NOT because you want to be at the top of the leaderboard (my pal fruitcake has a similar ambition and I applaud his efforts), but rather because you claim the changes you want to make to CC are for the good of the site rather than being motivated by your own narrow self-interest.

I am well aware that I am in the minority on this issue, at least judged by the comments on this thread. As I am sure you are aware porkenbeans, I couldn't give less of a shit about being a minority on any issue.

Farming is 'not cool', true enough. However, neither is claiming one is 'working for the intersts of the common man on CC' (i.e the farmed) when in fact one's motivations are as clear, to me at least, as the blazing sun. To move up 100 or so places on a leaderboard. If that means the Cheating and Abuse Forum is going to be littered with accusations of cheating (farming) and a poisonous atmosphere is going to be created on CC then, I suppose, that is a small price to pay.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby Mr Changsha on Tue Jan 06, 2009 3:04 am

FarangDemon wrote:
Mr Changsha wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:I am a relatively new player... love the game, etc. If I receive an email from someone asking me to play a game, I'll say yes, no matter who it is or where it is. I'm not really caring that they are better at this game than I am and that I have a 90% chance to lose. I can learn something from the game and I'm fairly sure I'll have fun.

With that being said, I didn't know what farmers were until a week ago, which happened to coincide with me getting a random message to join a game (I didn't join because it was 3 AM EST and I was a drunk). Anyway my point is that Newbie farmers are only "hurting" people who are not newbie farmers (i.e. the people posting here who think their low ranking comparatively to newbie farmers are because of newbie farming). I don't think newbie farmers are hurting newbies. I got drilled in my first few games, and I get destroyed anytime I change settings or maps to something unfamiliar to me. Yet, I'm still playing. In an effort to anger everyone, I will say that :

(1) People who try to win games against newbies just to increase their point total are hurting themselves because it cannot be fun to beat up on someone who has no clue what they're doing... that's like a 300 pound man beating up a 100 pound guy. Sure, the little guy is hurting, but the 300 pound guy should be ashamed of himself. But, to each their own.
(2) The supposed purpose of banning newbie farming is to get newbies to stay on the site. However, I think the people supporting the ban of newbie farming are not concerned with that so much as they are concerned about eliminating the newbie farmers from the game. The point is that the supports of the newbie farming ban are more concerned with their own advancement than whether or not newbies stay with the site. Newbies are going to stay on this site because playing is fun and distracting and because the maps are really well-done. They are not going to stay just because they win some games.
At any rate, that's the view from the bottom.


The second point is absolutely right. I've found few people in life who give a shit about the little guy, yet I have met many who pretend to when it fits in with an argument they are having. Considering most people in my generation are intolerably self-centred (I'm in my late twenties) and those in the next generation even worse, this idea of players here saying "think of the poor new player, think of his enjoyment!" has always been, in the main, utter tosh. "Think of MY ranking, think of MY points!" is a far more likely sentiment to come from Thatcher and Reagan's children. However, I would say that the number of people who have written about the 'poor player's enjoyment' while figuratively swigging back the champagne of a high rank can only have come from the Blair/Clinton/Bush era.

King_H cold attain ten thousand points in any way he so chooses and it wouldn't effect my sense of self-worth one little bit. I know I am a good player. I could be number 500, number 300 or number 1,000 and it wouldn't effect the fact that I know I'm a bastard to beat on a Risk board. I can imagine chaps like porkenbeans and farangdemon going through the leaderboard counting up those they consider farmers and saying to themselves "I would be in the top 250 (or whatever) if all these farmers weren't farming." That's pretty sad, but understandable. What's so infuriating is that they then pretend they write 'for the good of the site'. Highly unlikely. Like most people in our decadent Western societies, they write for their own good and their own interest always.

Change the rules by all means Lack, for it might well make the site better...and hence be in your self-interest to do so. I would hope you're not fooled by the bleating of a bunch of pampered little babies that are prime examples of the 'me, me, me!' generation, with a bit of champagne socialism thrown in just to be sadly fitting of the times we live in.


You have summed up my motives correctly, except for the personal attack and name calling you peppered in there at the end.

I believe farming should be done away with because I think the #1 ranked player should tend to beat the #2 ranked player. I want something to work towards. Its depressing to know that the upper echelon of players refuse to play me because I have not inflated my score by farming unskilled players.

I thought everybody who is good would feel this way?

In some posts, I have provided examples of farmers joining games with noobs who have complained about it. The reason was to provide another reason to convince people why farming is bad. So I am a bogeyman or something?

The strength of an argument is not about who is on what side of an argument. It is about the strength of the argument. It is not about FarangDemon, unless you choose it to be, Mr. Changsha.

For me, it is about #1 ranked player should tend to beat the #2 ranked player. Agree or not?I challenge you to answer.


The #1 should beat the #2 at what? Assume I am a decent example of a no cards singles player and Fabled is a decent example of a singles escalating player. What style of setting should we play on?

CC is not chess with one set of rules that everyone plays. Yet we all sit on the same leaderboard. How can we possibly determine who are truly the best players?

We cannot and not because of farming but due to the sheer number of styles available on CC. Once one accepts that, the leaderboard becomes something of an irrelevence even if farming was somehow eliminated from CC. So no, CC IS NOT about the #1 players being able to beat the #2 player.

What's so tedious is that, and I have to be frank about something again, is that I am able to see things in a deeper way than you are. Sounds arrogant, huh? Yet I know that the next inevitable step from where we are right now is to have a campaign to make quads freestyle speed banned. This is obvious to me. I know you'll be there screaming for it too. I also know you'll probably be foiled on that one. You'll then move on to another style you think is against your own narrow self-interest and you'll start screaming for that as well. What's so sad, is that you'll also complete ignore the possibility that you might be affecting other player's enjoyment of the game as you do so. You find the idea of YOU being the bogey man so unlikely? I don't. That's why you will continue to see me defending King_H's view of CC over your own. I know you've looked at my record and I know you can't possibly understand why I would defend farming. I've tried to explain it here, though I fear I may have failed yet again...
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby porkenbeans on Tue Jan 06, 2009 3:20 am

Mr Changsha wrote:
porkenbeans wrote:
Mr Changsha wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:I am a relatively new player... love the game, etc. If I receive an email from someone asking me to play a game, I'll say yes, no matter who it is or where it is. I'm not really caring that they are better at this game than I am and that I have a 90% chance to lose. I can learn something from the game and I'm fairly sure I'll have fun.

With that being said, I didn't know what farmers were until a week ago, which happened to coincide with me getting a random message to join a game (I didn't join because it was 3 AM EST and I was a drunk). Anyway my point is that Newbie farmers are only "hurting" people who are not newbie farmers (i.e. the people posting here who think their low ranking comparatively to newbie farmers are because of newbie farming). I don't think newbie farmers are hurting newbies. I got drilled in my first few games, and I get destroyed anytime I change settings or maps to something unfamiliar to me. Yet, I'm still playing. In an effort to anger everyone, I will say that :

(1) People who try to win games against newbies just to increase their point total are hurting themselves because it cannot be fun to beat up on someone who has no clue what they're doing... that's like a 300 pound man beating up a 100 pound guy. Sure, the little guy is hurting, but the 300 pound guy should be ashamed of himself. But, to each their own.
(2) The supposed purpose of banning newbie farming is to get newbies to stay on the site. However, I think the people supporting the ban of newbie farming are not concerned with that so much as they are concerned about eliminating the newbie farmers from the game. The point is that the supports of the newbie farming ban are more concerned with their own advancement than whether or not newbies stay with the site. Newbies are going to stay on this site because playing is fun and distracting and because the maps are really well-done. They are not going to stay just because they win some games.
At any rate, that's the view from the bottom.


The second point is absolutely right. I've found few people in life who give a shit about the little guy, yet I have met many who pretend to when it fits in with an argument they are having. Considering most people in my generation are intolerably self-centred (I'm in my late twenties) and those in the next generation even worse, this idea of players here saying "think of the poor new player, think of his enjoyment!" has always been, in the main, utter tosh. "Think of MY ranking, think of MY points!" is a far more likely sentiment to come from Thatcher and Reagan's children. However, I would say that the number of people who have written about the 'poor player's enjoyment' while figuratively swigging back the champagne of a high rank can only have come from the Blair/Clinton/Bush era.

King_H cold attain ten thousand points in any way he so chooses and it wouldn't effect my sense of self-worth one little bit. I know I am a good player. I could be number 500, number 300 or number 1,000 and it wouldn't effect the fact that I know I'm a bastard to beat on a Risk board. I can imagine chaps like porkenbeans and farangdemon going through the leaderboard counting up those they consider farmers and saying to themselves "I would be in the top 250 (or whatever) if all these farmers weren't farming." That's pretty sad, but understandable. What's so infuriating is that they then pretend they write 'for the good of the site'. Highly unlikely. Like most people in our decadent Western societies, they write for their own good and their own interest always.

Change the rules by all means Lack, for it might well make the site better...and hence be in your self-interest to do so. I would hope you're not fooled by the bleating of a bunch of pampered little babies that are prime examples of the 'me, me, me!' generation, with a bit of champagne socialism thrown in just to be sadly fitting of the times we live in.
You are misrepresenting my views and motives. You know very well that I have championed the cause, for the integrity of the leaderboard, to make it fair to everyone. I admit and proclaim loudly that it is not fair to me or anyone else. Of course my motivation for going on this crusade, was because I felt it was not fair to me. And yes if it were not for the Newbie Farmers and multi-cheaters, I would be on page 1 right now. If your rank or your place on the leaderboard does not mean that much to you, that is fine with me. But, if it DOES mean something to others, you should let that be fine with YOU. Yours is NOT the only interest that counts. For the life of me I can not understand why anyone would waste so many hours on a gaming site that is not fair. What in the world is wrong with wanting to play a fair game, and eagerly trying to be the best ? After all, isn't that what a leaderboard is for ?


Might I gently suggest you stop trying to compare yourself to others who play an entirely different game style to the one you play? You're never going to have as high a rank as players involved in quads freestlye speed settings, unless you start playing that way yourself. Now YOU might well say they are farmers, but I think I've shown in other threads that these catergorisations are far too subjective to be valid. So accept that fact and expand your mind a little. I also know that I'll never achieve such a high score playing 8 man no cards games. However, within my own mind, I know that if I can achieve colonel rank playing those kinds of games then I am doing well at my chosen discipline. You don't find players much past 2,5oo points in the games I play. Are the top (large game) singles no cards players being cheated by the system? I would say not. I know who are the best players that play my style of game and if I compare myself to anyone (and to be honest with you I really don't think about it that much), then I compare myself to those players. Do I compare myself by score? Again not really. Most of the best no cards singles players are captains, majors and the top few are colonels. Do I automatically assume that the colonel is better than the captain? Of course not.

The difference between us, to be perfectly frank about it porkenbeans, is that I play one of the most challenging styles of play you can find on CC, while you play 1vs1 sequential. I naturally therefore have far more confidence in my inherent abilities and so don't feel the need to define myself by score or rank, or criticise others about how they play the game. You quite obviously do.

You've just admitted the central point from my previous post - that you primarily care about your place on the leaderboard. If you re-read my last post you'll see that I felt such an spiration was a little sad (yes from my perspective) but understandable . The second point is the key bit though...

What's so infuriating is that they then pretend they write 'for the good of the site'. Highly unlikely. Like most people in our decadent Western societies, they write for their own good and their own interest always.

That's the reason I make a point of criticising you in the threads you make. NOT because you want to be at the top of the leaderboard (my pal fruitcake has a similar ambition and I applaud his efforts), but rather because you claim the changes you want to make to CC are for the good of the site rather than being motivated by your own narrow self-interest.

I am well aware that I am in the minority on this issue, at least judged by the comments on this thread. As I am sure you are aware porkenbeans, I couldn't give less of a shit about being a minority on any issue.

Farming is 'not cool', true enough. However, neither is claiming one is 'working for the intersts of the common man on CC' (i.e the farmed) when in fact one's motivations are as clear, to me at least, as the blazing sun. To move up 100 or so places on a leaderboard. If that means the Cheating and Abuse Forum is going to be littered with accusations of cheating (farming) and a poisonous atmosphere is going to be created on CC then, I suppose, that is a small price to pay.
Listen carefully, I really want you to understand where myself and others are coming from.
WE WANT A FAIR LEADERBOARD
I do NOT give a rats ass what your views are on who is the better style of players.
I do NOT care what your predictions are of my success, or lack there of.
Your attempt to color people in a bad light because their motives are selfish is plain ludicrous.

FAIR IS FAIR....plain and simple.
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Re: New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby King_Herpes on Tue Jan 06, 2009 3:28 am

Mr Changsha wrote: How can we possibly determine who are truly the best players?


That's why I like this guy. He understands that just because I currently have the #1 rank, that doesn't make me the best player. There is no such thing as the best player. It is a myth. There are far too many outstanding players on this site from all ranks that demolish players on their individual settings/maps. You would be comparing apples to oranges to say that one is better than the other.

Mr Changsha wrote: So no, CC IS NOT about the #1 players being able to beat the #2 player.
....and it never will be. There's too many variables when including the many different styles and combination's of game play.

Don't worry yourself into a hernia Mr. C. Most of us are hearing you. The one's that are still being humorous and the many who don't respond because they don't like talking to walls...
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