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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby gimil on Sun Oct 09, 2011 4:24 am

porkenbeans wrote:desaturate the colors of the land and lighten and brighten the roads. This should help out in your quest to declutter. Also sense your circles and stars are over the top of the roads mostly, it would be appropriate to drop shadow them as well.


I think porkenbeans may be onto something here.
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby natty dread on Sun Oct 09, 2011 8:06 am

porkenbeans wrote:it DOES need to carry the flavor of the PACK. Just so that it is obvious that they ARE related to each other.


No, it actually doesn't. There's not a single good reason why it should.
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby gimil on Sun Oct 09, 2011 8:09 am

natty_dread wrote:
porkenbeans wrote:it DOES need to carry the flavor of the PACK. Just so that it is obvious that they ARE related to each other.


No, it actually doesn't. There's not a single good reason why it should.


It doesn't have to, but I think that is what isaiah40 is aiming for. Is it not?
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby koontz1973 on Sun Oct 09, 2011 8:12 am

gimil wrote:
natty_dread wrote:
porkenbeans wrote:it DOES need to carry the flavor of the PACK. Just so that it is obvious that they ARE related to each other.


No, it actually doesn't. There's not a single good reason why it should.


It doesn't have to, but I think that is what isaiah40 is aiming for. Is it not?

I would hope so. The map pack may not be the best maps on the site, but as a whole, it would be strange to have them different.

natty_dread asked for one good reason - how about continuity. Changing them so much as it would be unrecognisable, you end up with just another USA map, just bigger.
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby natty dread on Sun Oct 09, 2011 8:15 am

gimil wrote:
natty_dread wrote:
porkenbeans wrote:it DOES need to carry the flavor of the PACK. Just so that it is obvious that they ARE related to each other.


No, it actually doesn't. There's not a single good reason why it should.


It doesn't have to, but I think that is what isaiah40 is aiming for. Is it not?


And why is that? You can have a spiritual successor to those maps, in theme, gameplay etc. Why should you imitate a graphical style that is entirely wrong for a project of this caliber just to make the map "fit in" to some arbitrary definitions?

The USA map pack was made ages ago, and if it were made today it would probably look very different (and it'd be on a different site, heh heh :roll: ) so why should isaiah try to imitate those old maps when the style clearly isn't working for this map?
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby gimil on Sun Oct 09, 2011 8:24 am

natty_dread wrote:And why is that? You can have a spiritual successor to those maps, in theme, gameplay etc. Why should you imitate a graphical style that is entirely wrong for a project of this caliber just to make the map "fit in" to some arbitrary definitions?

The USA map pack was made ages ago, and if it were made today it would probably look very different (and it'd be on a different site, heh heh :roll: ) so why should isaiah try to imitate those old maps when the style clearly isn't working for this map?


I didn't say he had to. What I said was that is what isaiah40 is aiming for. It is his map and I believe he is aiming for that particular graphics style (with Widowmakers blessing). It is his map and if that is what he wants to do, then that is what he want to do.
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby The Bison King on Sun Oct 09, 2011 8:31 am

natty_dread wrote:
gimil wrote:
natty_dread wrote:
porkenbeans wrote:it DOES need to carry the flavor of the PACK. Just so that it is obvious that they ARE related to each other.


No, it actually doesn't. There's not a single good reason why it should.


It doesn't have to, but I think that is what isaiah40 is aiming for. Is it not?


And why is that? You can have a spiritual successor to those maps, in theme, gameplay etc. Why should you imitate a graphical style that is entirely wrong for a project of this caliber just to make the map "fit in" to some arbitrary definitions?

The USA map pack was made ages ago, and if it were made today it would probably look very different (and it'd be on a different site, heh heh :roll: ) so why should isaiah try to imitate those old maps when the style clearly isn't working for this map?

natty_dread wrote:
gimil wrote:
natty_dread wrote:
porkenbeans wrote:it DOES need to carry the flavor of the PACK. Just so that it is obvious that they ARE related to each other.


No, it actually doesn't. There's not a single good reason why it should.


It doesn't have to, but I think that is what isaiah40 is aiming for. Is it not?


And why is that? You can have a spiritual successor to those maps, in theme, gameplay etc. Why should you imitate a graphical style that is entirely wrong for a project of this caliber just to make the map "fit in" to some arbitrary definitions?

The USA map pack was made ages ago, and if it were made today it would probably look very different (and it'd be on a different site, heh heh :roll: ) so why should isaiah try to imitate those old maps when the style clearly isn't working for this map?

I'm on Natty's side. If we can aspire to something higher graphically I say go for it. I think that latching onto the map pack's style will only serve as a hinderence on a project of this scale. Also there are things about that map packs style that I just think fail.
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby isaiah40 on Sun Oct 09, 2011 8:44 am

gimil wrote:I didn't say he had to. What I said was that is what isaiah40 is aiming for. It is his map and I believe he is aiming for that particular graphics style (with Widowmakers blessing). It is his map and if that is what he wants to do, then that is what he want to do.


This!! If I wanted to make it look exact, I would have traced every single state from WM map pack and placed them on mine. If I did, I would not have had them fit into the max supsize small. I would have actually need about 200 px in width more to get them to fit.
koontz1973 wrote:natty_dread asked for one good reason - how about continuity. Changing them so much as it would be unrecognisable, you end up with just another USA map, just bigger.


This again. After my many talks with WM, we came to the agreement that it would be done in basically the same style and theme, with basically the same bonus structure. So, if people want this to continue then this is what is going to happen, this WILL be done as close to the SAME style and theme as the USA map pack as I can get it! If not then I will be forced to stop development of this map, because I WILL NOT break my agreement with WM on it, PERIOD, END OF DISCUSSION!
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby isaiah40 on Sun Oct 09, 2011 10:30 pm

Okay here is a taste of this with Alaska and Hawaii on it (just have the outlines for now), along with the title and more of the secondary roads added in. Colors will be worked on along with some other clarity items.
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Re: Mega USA Map [20 Sept 2011] V6 pg 5

Postby natty dread on Sun Oct 09, 2011 10:34 pm

isaiah40 wrote:This again. After my many talks with WM, we came to the agreement that it would be done in basically the same style and theme, with basically the same bonus structure. So, if people want this to continue then this is what is going to happen, this WILL be done as close to the SAME style and theme as the USA map pack as I can get it! If not then I will be forced to stop development of this map, because I WILL NOT break my agreement with WM on it, PERIOD, END OF DISCUSSION!


1. Why exactly would WM care? Hasn't he already ditched this site for "greener pastures"?

2. Why should WM:s opinion count regarding the creation of a completely new map? WM does not own the copyright on the map of USA.
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby koontz1973 on Mon Oct 10, 2011 1:38 am

isaiah40, please continue. I know that the map pack is not the best work, I know they are not the best in gameplay, but that new update is looking freaking awesome. The mini map is looking good.

Do you have any ideas on how you will deal with Alaska and Hawaii on how they connect.
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby isaiah40 on Mon Oct 10, 2011 6:07 am

koontz1973 wrote:isaiah40, please continue. I know that the map pack is not the best work, I know they are not the best in gameplay, but that new update is looking freaking awesome. The mini map is looking good.

Do you have any ideas on how you will deal with Alaska and Hawaii on how they connect.


Yep.

Alaska Cities:
    1. Anchorage
    2. Fairbanks
    3. Juneau
    4. Tok
Tok will connect to Great Falls Montana (MT) and Bellingham Washington (WA)

Hawaii Cities:
    1.Hilo
    2. Lahaina
    3. Kualapu'u
    4. Honolulu
    5. Waimea
Honolulu will connect to Los Angeles and San Fransisco while all Hawaii cities can attack each other.

Once I get all the states and bonus regions named on the mini-map, I'll be tightening them up a bit.. In the bottom right will be the bonuses for the interstate system.
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby Flapcake on Tue Oct 11, 2011 5:21 am

Hi Isaiah

Your missing a ] at the first page to show the image 8-)

Cool map btw.
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby Gillipig on Tue Oct 11, 2011 10:21 am

Been a while since I looked at the map. Like the "Mega USA" title theme but maybe just make it "Mega U.S." ? I see you're in the process of adding Hawai and Alaska. It looks like you'll be able to create a viewable mini map as well. I tip my hat it looks good and I'm sure it'll be an awesome map come beta time.
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby isaiah40 on Tue Oct 11, 2011 11:10 am

Thanks Gillipig! And I will be able to get in the bonuses for the interstates and capitals in there as well.
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby isaiah40 on Tue Oct 11, 2011 10:49 pm

Ok, here we have completed Alaska and Hawaii!

By my count we now have:
1. All 50 states - the only USA map with all 50
2. 14 Interstates
3. 6 Bonus Regions
For a total of a WHOPPING 70 bonuses that you can choose from - I believe this is the most of any CC map in play.

I was thinking of having a max reinforcement of 18 men. That works out to holding 54 territories, just under a third of the map.

Click image to enlarge.
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby Peter Gibbons on Tue Oct 11, 2011 10:53 pm

This is a bit down the road, but...

isaiah40 wrote:Alaska Cities:
    1. Anchorage
    2. Fairbanks
    3. Juneau
    4. Tok
Tok will connect to Great Falls Montana (MT) and Bellingham Washington (WA)
I understand why you'd use a small city like Tok based on the geography, but shouldn't Juneau connect to the mainland? It's further south than Tok. Perhaps connect Juneau to Bellingham or Seattle via ferry? Then connect Tok to Great Falls or Post Falls? You could also then add Barrow or Nome as a 5th interior Alaskan city since the northern part of the state would be empty.

EDIT: I see you just added Alaska so this isn't that far down the road after all! Seeing how it's been placed, I'm even more convinced now of this suggestion. In fact, given the spacing, I might advocate adding Nome and Barrow. Alaska is mighty big, after all.

And alternative idea, by the way, is making only one land/ferry connection to Alaska and then making Honolulu and Anchorage connected via plane. Not one I prefer, but just throwing it out there.
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby isaiah40 on Tue Oct 11, 2011 11:02 pm

Peter Gibbons wrote:I understand why you'd use a small city like Tok based on the geography, but shouldn't Juneau connect to the mainland? It's further south than Tok. Perhaps connect Juneau to Bellingham or Seattle via ferry? Then connect Tok to Great Falls or Post Falls? You could also then add Barrow or Nome as a 5th interior Alaskan city since the northern part of the state would be empty.

EDIT: I see you just added Alaska so this isn't that far down the road after all! Seeing how it's been placed, I'm even more convinced now of this suggestion. In fact, given the spacing, I might advocate adding Nome and Barrow. Alaska is mighty big, after all.

And alternative idea, by the way, is making only one land/ferry connection to Alaska and then making Honolulu and Anchorage connected via plane. Not one I prefer, but just throwing it out there.


These ideas are good ones. Though I think I will keep Tok connect to Great Falls as it is more of a direct route rather than Post Falls. I was thinking of adding in Nome, but since there isn't a road to Nome, I figured on leaving it out. The Alaska - Honolulu connection could work, as a matter of fact I even thought about it. I decided against it because 1)there is already a lot going on, and 2)I didn't want to start adding in airports all over the place when you are suppose to be traveling by road for the most part. The exception is Hawaii for obvious reasons. But I'll leave it open for discussion and see what others have to say.
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Re: Mega USA Map [11 Oct 2011] V8 pg 8

Postby MarshalNey on Tue Oct 11, 2011 11:18 pm

Juneau is landlocked- surrounded by mountains, at least it was when I visited as a kid. One can only reasonably get there by air or sea, so an overland route doesn't make as much sense. However it might be nice to have a sea route from there to Washington state (that is, Seattle- which incidentally shouldn't be inland at all... being an international port. Not to make a fuss but it's very odd, I lived there for 6 months and it's very much connected to the sea).

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Re: Mega USA Map [11 Oct 2011] V8 pg 8

Postby Peter Gibbons on Tue Oct 11, 2011 11:52 pm

My thoughts on the issues raised above...

1) I understand the fact that Nome (and Barrow, if that's in the discussion) cannot be reached via normal roads and that this is supposed to be a map based on road travel. But with Hawai'i, you are allowing inter-island travel so I think the same sort of exception should be applied to Alaska. You don't have to say how (it could be a snowmobile route), but I don't think anyone would have any complaints if Nome or Barrow were connected. I'd argue for both, with an increase in the bonus value.

2) Looking at both your map and how the geography works, I understand the Tok-Great Falls connection and agree with it. I think the other connection should be Juneau-to-Seattle (either via ferry or air). That would allow for at least 2 entry points into Alaska and wouldn't create a bottleneck in Tok.

3) I would only advocate the Honolulu-Anchorage air route if you grow the size of Alaska and feel the need for it to have a third entry point. It's certainly not an idea I'm wedded to and I completely understand the reluctance to add too many air routes. In fact, if you do add such a connection, it might make sense to remove the Honolulu-San Francisco connection, as California certainly already has enough entry points and Hawai'i doesn't really need three. But again, this issue is one I'm more ambivalent on compared to the others.
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Re: Mega USA Map [11 Oct 2011] V8 pg 8

Postby Flapcake on Wed Oct 12, 2011 4:29 am

Hi Isaiah

Where is the most famous route in the world? route 66
I think it deserves a place on your beautiful map, there are people who travel from the other side of the world only to follow Route 66 across the U.S.

Flap.
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Re: Mega USA Map [11 Oct 2011] V8 pg 8

Postby isaiah40 on Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:40 am

MarshalNey wrote:Juneau is landlocked- surrounded by mountains, at least it was when I visited as a kid. One can only reasonably get there by air or sea, so an overland route doesn't make as much sense. However it might be nice to have a sea route from there to Washington state (that is, Seattle- which incidentally shouldn't be inland at all... being an international port. Not to make a fuss but it's very odd, I lived there for 6 months and it's very much connected to the sea).

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Seattle can be easily changed and the ferry route to Juneau will be added.

Peter Gibbons wrote:My thoughts on the issues raised above...

1) I understand the fact that Nome (and Barrow, if that's in the discussion) cannot be reached via normal roads and that this is supposed to be a map based on road travel. But with Hawai'i, you are allowing inter-island travel so I think the same sort of exception should be applied to Alaska. You don't have to say how (it could be a snowmobile route), but I don't think anyone would have any complaints if Nome or Barrow were connected. I'd argue for both, with an increase in the bonus value.

2) Looking at both your map and how the geography works, I understand the Tok-Great Falls connection and agree with it. I think the other connection should be Juneau-to-Seattle (either via ferry or air). That would allow for at least 2 entry points into Alaska and wouldn't create a bottleneck in Tok.

3) I would only advocate the Honolulu-Anchorage air route if you grow the size of Alaska and feel the need for it to have a third entry point. It's certainly not an idea I'm wedded to and I completely understand the reluctance to add too many air routes. In fact, if you do add such a connection, it might make sense to remove the Honolulu-San Francisco connection, as California certainly already has enough entry points and Hawai'i doesn't really need three. But again, this issue is one I'm more ambivalent on compared to the others.

Good points. I think these will work out better in the long run. Instead of Barrow, how about if I put in Prudhoe Bay? it may be smaller, but to me I;ve heard of Prudhoe Bay more than Barrow, and there is a road that runs from Fairbanks to Prudhoe Bay. To differentiate the connections between Honolulu/Anchorage/Los Angeles and either Fairbanks/Nome or Anchorage/Nome, I think a heliport would be good. I'm leaning towards the Fairbanks/Nome connection. Now that I think about it, I can add in Barrow as well. That will give us 7 cities in Alaska, 3 connected by heliport. Sound good?
Flapcake wrote:Hi Isaiah

Where is the most famous route in the world? route 66
I think it deserves a place on your beautiful map, there are people who travel from the other side of the world only to follow Route 66 across the U.S.

Flap.

Not on this map, it would be way to cramped to add it in.
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Re: Mega USA Map [11 Oct 2011] V8 pg 8

Postby Gilligan on Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:12 am

How come you changed some of the territory names?
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Re: Mega USA Map [9 Oct 2011] V7 pg 7

Postby DiM on Wed Oct 12, 2011 10:01 am

isaiah40 wrote:For a total of a WHOPPING 70 bonuses that you can choose from - I believe this is the most of any CC map in play.



i don't think it's anywhere near.
i'm not sure about other maps but on AoM or AoR the bonus combinations far exceed 70.
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Re: Mega USA Map [11 Oct 2011] V8 pg 8

Postby isaiah40 on Wed Oct 12, 2011 4:45 pm

Gilligan wrote:How come you changed some of the territory names?

Well because when everything got reduced to this size (that is the individual states) some of the name weren't fitting properly.

DiM wrote:
isaiah40 wrote:For a total of a WHOPPING 70 bonuses that you can choose from - I believe this is the most of any CC map in play.



i don't think it's anywhere near.
i'm not sure about other maps but on AoM or AoR the bonus combinations far exceed 70.

I didn't go and start counting bonuses on those maps, that is why I said "I believe". Can anyone say for sure how many bonuses are on thos emaps?
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