CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [Quenched]

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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby army of nobunaga on Mon May 21, 2012 10:36 pm

cairns... a lot of your maps have to grow on me.


this one is already a GD classic.

I dont know if you are envisioning the gameplay yet, but I am... it is everything atlantis should have been.

please do not split up the bonus like you are thinking.



and also koontz has an Idea.. does the xml allow a tert to be part of 2 different bonuses? because making an inner circle bonus would add depth.


edit
Last edited by army of nobunaga on Tue May 22, 2012 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby AndyDufresne on Tue May 22, 2012 2:20 pm

army of nobunaga wrote:and also koontz has an Idea.. does the xml allow a tert to be part of 2 different bonuses? because making an inner circle bonus would add depth.e

XML allows for a region to be a part of multiple bonuses. Two maps that immediately come to mind are Space (the first) and Eurasia (the most recent I think).


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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby army of nobunaga on Tue May 22, 2012 2:38 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:
army of nobunaga wrote:and also koontz has an Idea.. does the xml allow a tert to be part of 2 different bonuses? because making an inner circle bonus would add depth.e

XML allows for a region to be a part of multiple bonuses. Two maps that immediately come to mind are Space (the first) and Eurasia (the most recent I think).


--Andy



I forgot about space! thanks
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby cairnswk on Tue May 22, 2012 4:19 pm

Industrial Helix wrote:Looking pretty cool, but I'm totally lost on the meaning of the star territories. I don't see a name for them if they are territories, so I'm thinking they might be the bonus value, if so you should use a plus sign or something. That said, the Stars seem very unclear to me and you might want to add a little blurb indicating what they do or mean. If its somewhere on the map and I missed it, sorry, just point me in the right direction.

Thanks IH. i'll fix those bonus numbers
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby cairnswk on Tue May 22, 2012 4:25 pm

army of nobunaga wrote:cairns... a lot of your maps have to grow on me.


this one is already a GD classic.

Thanks. Waht does GD mean?

I dont know if you are envisioning the gameplay yet, but I am... it is everything atlantis should have been.
please do not split up the bonus like you are thinking.
and also koontz has an Idea.. does the xml allow a tert to be part of 2 different bonuses? because making an inner circle bonus would add depth.
edit[/quote]
You mean split up the inner circle bonus into north and south?
I am wanting this gameplay to stay classic in the sense of being classic i.e. no special tricks etc. you simply conquer from territory to territory...as it is a small map.

however, if you care to elaborate on the xml idea you have in mind...i don't see where koontz posted anything about doing something special with the xml ?!
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby army of nobunaga on Tue May 22, 2012 4:40 pm

:D GD= gosh darn

Koontz in maybe the 6th post ( 6th i think) asked if the circle could count also for a bonus as well as the territory bonus that each color in the circle corresponds to. You replied to him.
edit - My eyes were glazing over that font, man.!! lol there is a circle bonus.. nice.

I agree 1000% , I am not a big fan of all the bonus tricks that are in some maps now-a-days.

I think maybe if the circle itself had a bonus that was not insane it would add to the gameplay options without being 'tricky' but even if you decide against this the map will still play like a charm.

One thing you are going to have to watch out for is what I call the "lower Nile effect" I do not know if you play the lower nile but it is exactly what happens when you have -- small map + chokepoints.

what you get is = game is over before it really starts.

What I mean is a lot of times on lower nile, well almost all the time, the game is usually over before you hit round 7 (not actually over, but someone usually has a huge lead by then)

Your larger bonuses on the outside may never even become realitys if a person can grab a quick small bonus because of some of the bridges and impassible's.


Notice I said "may". I am not sure.

edit 2- would it take away from what you were after to have +1 bonuses for owning a pair of colors? for example owning arbat and AI = +1? might even out some of the easier bonuses that people may be able to grab soon and hold easy.


My gut tells me you are fine and this is going to be an instant classic.
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby cairnswk on Tue May 22, 2012 9:19 pm

army of nobunaga wrote:...

edit 2- would it take away from what you were after to have +1 bonuses for owning a pair of colors? for example owning arbat and AI = +1? might even out some of the easier bonuses that people may be able to grab soon and hold easy.



Thanks for reply AoN... :)
I am fine with having any sort of bonus as long as works best for gameplay.
My suggestion of the rings is quite alterable or additionable.
I am happy to have "owning a pair of colours for +1" ...but we need to define "pair of colours":
- is it a pair of same colour inside and outside the inner ring road
- or is it a pair of only two territories of different colours both inside and outside the inner ring road
- or something else

and last question...do you want this to be an addtional bonus to or replace the ring bonuses there now.

Keep in mind that some of those colours may have to change because of CB issues.
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby koontz1973 on Wed May 23, 2012 10:09 am

cairnswk, this deserves a sticky. Will move it up the chain in a couple of days for you.
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [17.5.12] V3-P1

Postby army of nobunaga on Wed May 23, 2012 4:35 pm

cairnswk wrote:
army of nobunaga wrote:...

edit 2- would it take away from what you were after to have +1 bonuses for owning a pair of colors? for example owning arbat and AI = +1? might even out some of the easier bonuses that people may be able to grab soon and hold easy.



Thanks for reply AoN... :)
I am fine with having any sort of bonus as long as works best for gameplay.
My suggestion of the rings is quite alterable or additionable.
I am happy to have "owning a pair of colours for +1" ...but we need to define "pair of colours":
- is it a pair of same colour inside and outside the inner ring road
- or is it a pair of only two territories of different colours both inside and outside the inner ring road
- or something else

and last question...do you want this to be an addtional bonus to or replace the ring bonuses there now.

Keep in mind that some of those colours may have to change because of CB issues.


I like pairing up the colours. A nice small +1 for a pair.

I think if you did this you would need to have one of the pairs start as a neutral to negate a huge uneven drop.

I am getting more and more excite about this.
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [22.5.12] V4-P2

Postby cairnswk on Wed May 23, 2012 5:58 pm

army of nobunaga wrote:...

I like pairing up the colours. A nice small +1 for a pair.

I think if you did this you would need to have one of the pairs start as a neutral to negate a huge uneven drop.

I am getting more and more excite about this.


Thanks for that, but we will have to see where and how much those neutrals are later.

a quick Version 4...

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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby army of nobunaga on Wed May 23, 2012 6:32 pm

=D> brilliant man
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby koontz1973 on Thu May 24, 2012 12:04 am

What are those pink things? Flowers or glazed doughnuts. :P
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby cairnswk on Thu May 24, 2012 1:05 am

koontz1973 wrote:What are those pink things? Flowers or glazed doughnuts. :P

Diamonds covered in pink icing :lol:
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby lostatlimbo on Thu May 24, 2012 1:27 am

I'm sorry, but yuck. Just yuck.
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby cairnswk on Thu May 24, 2012 1:34 am

lostatlimbo wrote:I'm sorry, but yuck. Just yuck.

What the map, or the diamond with pink icing?
Help to clarify what you are yucking at lal ;)
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby Nola_Lifer on Thu May 24, 2012 1:23 pm

cairnswk wrote:
lostatlimbo wrote:I'm sorry, but yuck. Just yuck.

What the map, or the diamond with pink icing?
Help to clarify what you are yucking at lal ;)


I think he is speaking about the colors and the way they are spray painted on. My guess. That is what I thought when I first looked. :)
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby koontz1973 on Sat May 26, 2012 10:49 pm

Having looked at this again, I will admit that the diamonds seem to be not one of your better ideas. Any chance they will come off?
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby cairnswk on Sat May 26, 2012 11:40 pm

koontz1973 wrote:Having looked at this again, I will admit that the diamonds seem to be not one of your better ideas. Any chance they will come off?

The pink icing ones...yes i will proabably replace them with a band of gold or something, but the others...well i don't know
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby koontz1973 on Sat May 26, 2012 11:43 pm

I like the ones in the border, though they could use a little bit of love. But yes, it was the pink frosting I was on about. They just remind me of strawberry ice creams.
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby cairnswk on Sat May 26, 2012 11:44 pm

koontz1973 wrote:I like the ones in the border, though they could use a little bit of love. But yes, it was the pink frosting I was on about. They just remind me of strawberry ice creams.

:lol: :lol:
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [24.5.12] V4-P2

Postby koontz1973 on Sun May 27, 2012 12:50 am

I mean it, bloody ice creams. Had some of the best strawberry ice creams ever yesterday when we went to the Lego show with the kids yesterday. Get your band of gold on and I will kick this upstairs.
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [31.5.12] V5-P3

Postby cairnswk on Wed May 30, 2012 9:49 am

koontz1973 wrote:I mean it, bloody ice creams. Had some of the best strawberry ice creams ever yesterday when we went to the Lego show with the kids yesterday.

That's nice :)

Get your band of gold on and I will kick this upstairs.

Done...

Version 5
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [31.5.12] V5-P3

Postby koontz1973 on Wed May 30, 2012 9:54 am

Thanks cairnswk. Time to kick this one upstairs. Good luck in the main foundry with this one.

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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [31.5.12] V5-P3

Postby cairnswk on Wed May 30, 2012 10:07 am

Thanks koontz :)
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Re: CLASSIC CITIES: Moscow [31.5.12] V5-P3

Postby nolefan5311 on Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:23 pm

Gameplay numbers:

Inner Suburbs looks good, but you could afford to lower it to 5. Spreadsheet indicates it should be 5.75 (see below)

Outer Suburbs looks perfect.

All Suburbs is at 15, and the spreadsheet indicates it should be at 12.42. There's 20 regions to defend, but it's only 8 regions to defend all 20 of them (the same 8 regions to defend the Outer Suburbs). I don't know if you wanted the total bonus to equal the two sub bonuses, but as is it's a little too high. Lowering each bonus by 1 to make it a total of +13, and adding a connection from Khamovniki to Ochakovo would put the suggested bonus at 13.50. That would solve those issues right there.

The South +6 needs to be reduced to a 5.

And the spreadsheet indicates that the 2 +2 bonuses should be under 2, but not by much. Adding the connection from Khamovniki to Ochakovo would solve the westernmost bonus issue, but you would still have an issue with the 2 region +2.

As far as the drop calculator is concerned, in 2 or 3 player games there's an 11% chance that someone drops the 2 region bonus, so you will have to code one of those start positions to be neutral, preferably Akademichesky (coding would Gagarisnkiy neutral would only leave one border region for the other +2 open). There is also a 3.24% chance that someone drops one of the 3 region +3's in the north and NW. Perhaps making one of those regions a 4 region continent and the other a 2, and coding one of the territories in the 2 region continent to start neutral would solve the problem.

What do you think?
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Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (3)
Cross-Map Achievement (4) Beta Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (30) General Achievement (5)
Clan Achievement (13) Challenge Achievement (1) Map Contribution (4) Tournament Contribution (13) General Contribution (4)

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