[Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (7/3/14)

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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Gilligan on Sun Mar 16, 2014 7:23 pm

I don't see how that's possible with our XML restrictions, do you have an idea?
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:29 pm

Gilligan wrote:I don't see how that's possible with our XML restrictions, do you have an idea?


Oh yea ... that came to mind just after I posted the idea... hmmm...how hard can it be to add conditional bombards ... honestly ;)

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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Armandolas on Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:43 am

One other question. Im playing a poly game. I have one player who does not hold aquatic, but is holding an aquatic bonus(adjacent to seas)
Is that possible? (i have another player who is also not aquatic but controling 2 territs that borders a sea and so not have that bonus)

I like your suggestions of being able to reinforce from kingdoms and give the connections from chasms to all players
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:11 am

Armandolas wrote:One other question. Im playing a poly game. I have one player who does not hold aquatic, but is holding an aquatic bonus(adjacent to seas)
Is that possible?

I don;t see how they would be getting that bonus unless they had aquatic. I am not sure how poly works, do they hold aquatic on one of their other positions?

Armandolas wrote:I like your suggestions of being able to reinforce from kingdoms and give the connections from chasms to all players

Thanx =) I am trying hard to make the map more fun and fair but still keep the flavor and story I was going for.

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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:08 pm

dolomite13 wrote:
Gilligan wrote:I don't see how that's possible with our XML restrictions, do you have an idea?


Oh yea ... that came to mind just after I posted the idea... hmmm...how hard can it be to add conditional bombards ... honestly ;)

=D13=


I think we will forget bringing back the bomb and cultists and just go with the proposed changes I posted above.

With the current xml I am having trouble thinking of a creative way to use a territory like "the bomb".

Perhaps a conditional border. Instead of having 2 radiation grant access to other radiation and forbidden lands their could be a territory "Energize!" that radiation can assault that unlocks the connection between them.

Or maybe this ...

Energize starts with 3n
Radiation +1 bonus each
2 radiation and Energize! = radiation are adjacent
3 radiation and Energize! = radiation can assault forbidden lands
Energize! = +1 bonus per radiation

=D13=
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Armandolas on Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:34 pm

dolomite13 wrote:
Armandolas wrote:One other question. Im playing a poly game. I have one player who does not hold aquatic, but is holding an aquatic bonus(adjacent to seas)
Is that possible?

I don;t see how they would be getting that bonus unless they had aquatic. I am not sure how poly works, do they hold aquatic on one of their other positions?


=D13=


Nop. Aquatic is either held by opposition or is neutral.(fog)None of my players is holding it
(poly works like any team game)
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:41 pm

Armandolas wrote:
dolomite13 wrote:
Armandolas wrote:One other question. Im playing a poly game. I have one player who does not hold aquatic, but is holding an aquatic bonus(adjacent to seas)
Is that possible?

I don;t see how they would be getting that bonus unless they had aquatic. I am not sure how poly works, do they hold aquatic on one of their other positions?


=D13=


Nop. Aquatic is either held by opposition or is neutral.(fog)None of my players is holding it
(poly works like any team game)


The bonus requires that Aquatic be held so if they don;t have it then it should be impossible for the game to apply that bonus.

Code: Select all
<continent>
   <name>Aquatic - Adjacent to Seas</name>
   <bonuses>
      <bonus required="3">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="5">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="7">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="9">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="11">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="13">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="15">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="17">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="19">1</bonus>
      <bonus required="21">1</bonus>
   </bonuses>
   <components>
      <territory>D2</territory>
      <territory>D3</territory>
      <territory>D4 - Radiation</territory>
      <territory>F2 - Crypts</territory>
      <territory>F4</territory>
      <territory>J2 - Crypts</territory>
      <territory>J4</territory>
      <territory>M2 - Caverns</territory>
      <territory>M3</territory>
      <territory>M4 - Minions</territory>
      <territory>P2 - Crypts</territory>
      <territory>P3</territory>
      <territory>P4 - Radiation</territory>
      <territory>S2 - Minions</territory>
      <territory>S3</territory>
      <territory>S4 - Caverns</territory>
      <territory>T2 - Mines</territory>
      <territory>T3</territory>
      <territory>T4 - Caverns</territory>
      <territory>V3</territory>
      <territory>V2</territory>
      <territory>V4 - Mines</territory>
      <territory type="mandatory">Aquatic</territory>
   </components>
   <required>3</required>
</continent>


<territory>
   <name>Aquatic</name>
   <borders>
   </borders>
   <coordinates>
      <smallx>505</smallx>
      <smally>44</smally>
      <largex>676</largex>
      <largey>52</largey>
   </coordinates>
</territory>


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Re: Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby -=- Tanarri -=- on Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:25 am

dolomite13 wrote:Kingdoms
- change kingdoms to be able to reinforce to favored territories you control.
This would be one way and would not work the opposite direction.
- change kingdoms so they can not assault favored territories that border blood towers.
This would decrease the possible starting territories from 4 to 3 but also limit access to the 8 most important territories on the map.


I like all the proposed changes except for not allowing kingdoms to attack near the blood towers. My main concern with this is you end up potentially screwing someone who has Undead. Three of their four bonuses are on blood tower territories, whereas only one of each other special feature's territories are on the blood towers. Otherwise I think it's a good idea to help slow things down a bit, just seems unfair to the Undead player as the crypt bonuses are currently laid out.
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby SiriusCowKing on Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:49 pm

We are unable to attack the barbarian horde from our favorite land right now. I seen that in 2 games already, one of which my friend is dragonkin, the other one my friend is human. Both games they have the barbarian power and can't take the horde.
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Donelladan on Tue Mar 18, 2014 1:44 pm


You start with 3 troops on your Kingdom, and 3 troops on your Special feature. On your first turn your kingdom will gain 1 troop automatically and you will be granted a +2 deployable bonus. This will result in 6 troops on your kingdom that may assault any of your favored territories to give you a foothold.


Could you update the first post with last rules ? this one at least is wrong.

I have a question concerning the blood towers, is written that having 2 regions that borders 2 differents blood tower will unlock its impassible border. It means, if I do have 2 regions that borders 2 different blood tower that :
M2 could attack T4 ans S4 ?
D4 could attack V1 and P4?
etc...
Am I right?
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Donelladan on Thu Mar 20, 2014 6:41 am

I think I found a bug. Game 14124287

One player has sphinx, Cosmic, and D4.
D4 is favored territory from sphinx so +1.
Cosmic give you +1 for regions with radiation symbole, so D4 should give him a +1.
Total, Sphinx + cosmic + D4 = +2
But he is droping 4 instead of 5.
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby BENCLUB on Sun Mar 23, 2014 4:49 am

D3 doesn't work with comic's bonus

and M2 doesn't work with dwellers' bonus

cf; http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=14182831
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Sun Mar 23, 2014 4:37 pm

The fix for the issues you are all reporting was posted in January and again a few weeks ago and it has not been uploaded yet.

viewtopic.php?f=64&t=177769&start=630#p4443281

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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby b00060 on Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:02 pm

The best thing about this map, is that it is quite large and allows for a few turns before you really get into it, meaning you have a little better chance of not being obliterated by the time you take your first turn in my opinion. I do have one request for the map though. The key and the board itself are extremely small, so small that I have to struggle to really understand what is what to determine how the bonuses work. Overall though, great addition!
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:51 pm

dolomite13 wrote:The fix for the issues you are all reporting was posted in January and again a few weeks ago and it has not been uploaded yet.

viewtopic.php?f=64&t=177769&start=630#p4443281

=D13=


Gilligan any chance we can see this uploaded to the test server?

=D13=
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Gilligan on Tue Apr 01, 2014 11:38 am

dolomite13 wrote:
dolomite13 wrote:The fix for the issues you are all reporting was posted in January and again a few weeks ago and it has not been uploaded yet.

viewtopic.php?f=64&t=177769&start=630#p4443281

=D13=


Gilligan any chance we can see this uploaded to the test server?

=D13=


I sent it off to tnb for live upload a while ago.
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby betiko on Wed Apr 02, 2014 6:08 am

i don't get the new barbarian and demonic... do they reset to neutral? do they autodeploy? none of the above? are they basically both the same thing now?
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby blindman30 on Tue Apr 08, 2014 5:36 am

playing the map and have a question. BoB shows F1 and T4 being able to attack each other but in the game its a one way assault. F1 can attack t4 but T4 can not attack F1
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Donelladan on Tue Apr 08, 2014 5:59 am

BOB is wrong for this map.
Read everything carefully and you will understand the connection.

BOB can't because some connnection are only there under certain conditions. BOB doesn't understand the condition so it is telling you can, why you can't.

But the map is correct for the connections.
The bonus on the other hand, still waiting for the XML updates :)
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Tue Apr 08, 2014 10:02 pm

betiko wrote:i don't get the new barbarian and demonic... do they reset to neutral? do they autodeploy? none of the above? are they basically both the same thing now?

In the proposed changes they start neutral and when you take them you have them just like any territory. They are a way to slow initial expansion just a bit especially in trench games. And you give the added bonus of an off map territory that you can assault from that cant be seen by your opponents at all in fog games except by the forbidden lands.

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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Tue Apr 08, 2014 10:03 pm

Does anyone think allowing a connection from your special feature to your kingdom provided you have a kingdom would help in allowing you to move troops that get stuck there when you turn in a set and help make it a bit more fair and balanced?

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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Frogmanx82 on Tue Apr 08, 2014 10:06 pm

I'm playing a game and have caverns but the bonus doesn't seem to be applied as indicated on the map. I had to have 3 of them just to get 1 bonus.

I don't think allowing the use of the special feature troops works with the intention they were made for. Its still fair. Stranding troops from turning in a set is like not having a match territory so its not a problem.
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby Donelladan on Wed Apr 09, 2014 3:27 am

Can the special feature be nuked? I think you can connect special feature to kingdom. That wouldn't change anything to me, and would help people that deploy there at their first turn.
But not really important stuff for me.
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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (3/14/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Wed Apr 09, 2014 2:31 pm

Frogmanx82 wrote:I'm playing a game and have caverns but the bonus doesn't seem to be applied as indicated on the map. I had to have 3 of them just to get 1 bonus.


Their are a few bugs that we hope to get resolved shortly.I am currently awaiting a deployment to the test server so I can test the bonuses and get those fixes into production.

Frogmanx82 wrote:I don't think allowing the use of the special feature troops works with the intention they were made for. Its still fair. Stranding troops from turning in a set is like not having a match territory so its not a problem.


So very true. It could be said that those stranded troops represent the extra troops you could rally from the indigenous people based on your special feature. I know its a strategy in games where you can redeploy anywhere to reinforce from those territories early in the game. I think I saw it used that way in several 1v1 games I have played.

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Re: [Beta] - Krazy Kingdoms - Proposed Changes (4/10/14)

Postby dolomite13 on Thu Apr 10, 2014 11:08 pm

Don't Panic

I know there is a lot to digest here but I think that the changes I am proposing here will make the map even more playable. Please read my notes to see my reasoning.

All comments are welcome.

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========================================================================================

Bonuses
+1/3 (Min +3) attached to basic lands (as it should have been).
- No standard Territory Bonus back in effect.
This change should smooth out the early game just a bit so it is harder to knock someone off the map early and pretty much keep them off the map.

Wizards
- Require holding territories that border 2 blood towers to allow the teleport (instead of 2 territories that border a blood tower)
Right now its too easy to take 2 territories and jump around the map for wizards. This will make it just a bit slower.

Barbarians
- Horde 3n (down from 5n)
- Horde required to grant the +1 per 3 basic land added bonus
This will make it necessary to take the horde to get the added bonus and may promote use of the horde as a way to travel around the board easier. I rarely see anyone use the horde as it is currently implemented.

Demonic
- Underworld 3n (down from 5n)
- Basic bonus +1 per minion (removed the added +1/2)
- Underworld required for an additional +1 per minion bonus
Similar to the horde the underworld seems to be unused by players. By tying an added bonus to it, it may now start seeing play.

Dwellers
- change the 4 caverns +2 to "for every cavern and crypt you hold you get +1" (max +4)
Being able to jump around the map for free is powerful but spreading out around the map can also work against you. This change will now only grant you more bonus troops if you also focus on holding crypts and will put some pressure on the undead player.

Cosmic
- change the 2 radiation +1* to "for every mines and radiation you hold you get +1" (max +4).
Cosmic gets some nice abilities once they get to 2 territories this change will make them want to branch out a bit and make the "miners" a bit nervous.

Seas
- changed to start 1n down from 2n
- now killer 1 down from 2
With land being 3n and people leaving 1 troop behind quite often it can be much more attractive to go around seas that to cut through them for the aquatic player. This drop to 1n may make it worthwhile.

Kingdoms
- change kingdoms to be able to reinforce to favored territories you control.
This would be one way and would not work the opposite direction.
- change kingdoms so they can not assault favored territories that border blood towers.
This would decrease the possible starting territories from 4 to 3 but also limit access to the 8 most important territories on the map.

Chasms
- removing chasms and connecting the land permanently across them for all player
because the start areas are no longer the #1 of each basic land type (S1, M1, T1 etc...) players can no longer exploit the short routs between them so the extra complication is unnecessary

Blood Towers
- these were moved to the outer edge of the map and now have much more space between them.
This change will force players to start closer together because of the change to kingdoms and make it harder to get the two blood towers required to assault the forbidden lands. I also think that wizards may be able to manage a +2 bonus early but getting to that second tower will not be easy and will balance it out a bit.

Badlands
- I added two new territories near the center of the map that are killer 5.
This will take a bit of the pressure off of J3 and F3 as they are serious choke points and often stopped teammates from getting from one side of the map to the other. The high cost will dissuade early use and the fact that they are "Killer" will make them situational use only. It is possible they should only be killer 3 or 2 and this is open for discussion.

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