Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby Frito Bandito on Fri Nov 22, 2013 12:01 am

Great map!
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby Oneyed on Sat Nov 23, 2013 5:58 am

I play it now the first time. will see how great it is...

I think if text: "each landingship held (L1-L13)..." can not be changed to: ...(L01-L13).

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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby HardAttack on Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:25 am

players with no land territories left will be eleminated ...
how is this going to work in terminator games ?

2ndly, yes amazing map mate, congrats. =D>
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby cairnswk on Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:46 am

HardAttack wrote:players with no land territories left will be eleminated ...
how is this going to work in terminator games ?

2ndly, yes amazing map mate, congrats. =D>

Thank-you HardAttack.
Take a look here...Game 13497703
it doesn't seem to have been a problem...and remember that essentially it is almost a terminator map
What do others think?
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby thenobodies80 on Mon Nov 25, 2013 4:49 pm

cairnswk wrote:
sempaispellcheck wrote:Very minor territory naming issue:
The territory labeled Nibruseni Point on the map itself is called Nubresi Point in the XML.

sempai

Thanks sempai...new file attached and will be forwarded. :)


This is available for testing
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby cairnswk on Mon Nov 25, 2013 5:07 pm

thenobodies80 wrote:...
This is available for testing

Huh :?:
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby thenobodies80 on Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:13 pm

I've updated the file 07gallipoli.xml on the test site. According to bigWham, all files must go on the beta site before to go live, even if it's a minor change, like a name change.
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby Armandolas on Tue Nov 26, 2013 3:14 am

Ive only been playing doubles lately and my quads is still going on.Im enjoying the map and definitly that change making L06 connect to KK beach makes the game play more interesting in the south
I just wish one of the 7 boats in the north could be more close to BS majestic. If played wisely its hard for the team holding bs majestic to beat the other team.
There is also something that still concerns me but i have not started a quads recently. Do we still have the issue of 1 player get killed in the 1st round?
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby cairnswk on Tue Nov 26, 2013 3:47 am

Armandolas...L06 has always linked to KK Beach since the map first went into BETA, so not sure what you're talking about there...
No we don't have the issue of 1 player getting killed in first round...at least no-one has reported it since the xml was changed.
as for BS Majestic, why, what is it you're on about there.

Now i know there is doubt as to whether BS Majestic landed troops at Y Beach, but for the sake of creativity and gameplay not making this an overly huge epic...
For your ref. http://archive.iwm.org.uk/upload/package/2/gallipoli/pdf_files/YBeach.pdf
The purpose of the landing on Y Beach was to assist the main operations at Helles by putting
a small force ashore at an unexpected spot where it could threaten Turkish communications
with the toe of the Peninsula and guard the left flank of the British line as it advanced north.
The spot chosen for the landing may initially appear an unusual one due to the 150-foot high
cliffs, but two breaks in the cliff face offered a comparatively easy access to the summit, while
the lack of rocks near the shore allowed vessels to approach to within a few yards of the
narrow beach. An additional benefit was that the Turks were not expecting a landing at this
location and had therefore failed to provide any defensive measures. The nearest Turkish
troops were two platoons of infantry more than a mile away to the south, near the mouth of
Gully Ravine.
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby Armandolas on Tue Nov 26, 2013 5:35 am

Ok, not sure why i had that strange idea about L06

About majestic, i didnt suggest u move it, i just wished one of the other boats could be closer to it, or at least a bit more separated from the other 6
I understand u want to be loyal to historical fact.Im just giving my gameplay experience input.

Acording to your starting positions map in the OP, the player who holds Sufren stil holds 2 spots that can be bombarded by main ships. Maybe that map is outdated?

1 more thing, did u haver considered to lower 1 of the northern Crossing points? Something like u did in Tekke(3) and In tepe (6). Sugg: Chanak(3) Madios(6)

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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby cairnswk on Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:00 am

Armandolas wrote:Ok, not sure why i had that strange idea about L06
:?

Acording to your starting positions map in the OP, the player who holds Sufren stil holds 2 spots that can be bombarded by main ships. Maybe that map is outdated?

Yes, that map is possibly outdated...i'll fix in the morning.

1 more thing, did u haver considered to lower 1 of the northern Crossing points? Something like u did in Tekke(3) and In tepe (6). Sugg: Chanak(3) Madios(6)

That possibly was discussed at one point, but ian and I did the balancing on this...no-one else bothered to participate in that process that i recall...
so in the end what ian came up with was how it is quite today.
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby HardAttack on Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:57 am

cairnswk wrote:
HardAttack wrote:players with no land territories left will be eleminated ...
how is this going to work in terminator games ?

2ndly, yes amazing map mate, congrats. =D>

Thank-you HardAttack.
Take a look here...Game 13497703
it doesn't seem to have been a problem...and remember that essentially it is almost a terminator map
What do others think?


ahha, i see now;
unlike middle ages/pot mosbi maps,
if a player holds no more any land territory then elemination is immediate, means not one round after. !!!
EXCELLENT O:)

impatient to start playing,
thanks.
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [26.11.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby cairnswk on Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:31 am

OP starts map is updated
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [26.11.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby Armandolas on Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:02 am

cairnswk wrote:OP starts map is updated

Thanks ;)
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby Dukasaur on Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:55 am

HardAttack wrote:players with no land territories left will be eleminated ...
how is this going to work in terminator games ?
It goes like this: Game 13571796 :D

2ndly, yes amazing map mate, congrats. =D>
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Gallipoli :: first player starting points

Postby delibekir on Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:40 am

Very nice map, thanks to cairnswk and all contributors :)

A question:
I'm playing 3 games on this map (one is a team game), what I have seen is I am the first player in all three games and I got the starting regions [BS Majestic, L01, Kum Kale, MS3] in all three of the games. Is this coincidence or does the first player always get this group?
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Re: Gallipoli :: first player starting points

Postby Gilligan on Tue Dec 10, 2013 10:40 am

delibekir wrote:Very nice map, thanks to cairnswk and all contributors :)

A question:
I'm playing 3 games on this map (one is a team game), what I have seen is I am the first player in all three games and I got the starting regions [BS Majestic, L01, Kum Kale, MS3] in all three of the games. Is this coincidence or does the first player always get this group?


Well, the first player doesn't always get those starting regions. But if you start with Majestic, you'll always get L01, Kum Kale and MS3. Any player can get that start.
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby dan the general on Sun Jan 12, 2014 4:09 pm

when can we play?
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Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby cairnswk on Sun Jan 12, 2014 4:11 pm

dan the general wrote:when can we play?

you can play now, the map has been in beta for some time now and there are near 700 completed games :)
kinks have been ironed out...as far as i am concerned anyways.
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby delibekir on Mon Jan 13, 2014 2:56 am

I have played several games with this map and I feel like Kum Kale bombarder is too strong to begin the game with. Whenever a team has Kum Kale initially, they easily secure the south west of the map and usually win. More importantly, opponent's L ships in south-west can be bombarded which cuts their income (especially in non-escalating games).

What do you think?
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby Dukasaur on Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:51 am

delibekir wrote:I have played several games with this map and I feel like Kum Kale bombarder is too strong to begin the game with. Whenever a team has Kum Kale initially, they easily secure the south west of the map and usually win. More importantly, opponent's L ships in south-west can be bombarded which cuts their income (especially in non-escalating games).

What do you think?

I've been thinking about this for a while.

Earlier on some people thought that Gendarmerie was overpowered. I disagree, and with careful husbanding of the troops on the battleship, even if someone starts with Gendarmerie and gets a lucky bunch of bombardments, the advantage can be overcome.

Kum Kale is different, because most of the SW landing boats have no battleship support. Sometimes a lucky start that includes Kum Kale is difficult to break, indeed. I'm wondering if L2, 3, 4, and 5 could start with 1 troop more? Not L1, because it has battleship support, and not L6 because it would just make it easy to take Kum Kale and pass the problem to someone else.

Anyway, it's not a huge thing, but maybe a tiny tweak is possible.
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby cairnswk on Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:03 pm

delibekir wrote:I have played several games with this map and I feel like Kum Kale bombarder is too strong to begin the game with. Whenever a team has Kum Kale initially, they easily secure the south west of the map and usually win. More importantly, opponent's L ships in south-west can be bombarded which cuts their income (especially in non-escalating games).

What do you think?


Thanks for popping in.
I think that the massive five games you've played or are in progress with are not enough sample population to draw a conclusion such as "usually win" from.
I've only played 7 games myself, and have found this not to be the case i.e. Kum Kale being too strong.
If you'd play many more and still have that inference, i'd be more prepared to listen.
Also, please offer your solution to balance what you perceive as an issue i.e should KK Beach be bombardable from a Battleshhip.
You'll see that this is quite reasonable request since Dukasaur has 47 of these maps played or in progress.
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby cairnswk on Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:25 pm

Dukasaur wrote:
delibekir wrote:I have played several games with this map and I feel like Kum Kale bombarder is too strong to begin the game with. Whenever a team has Kum Kale initially, they easily secure the south west of the map and usually win. More importantly, opponent's L ships in south-west can be bombarded which cuts their income (especially in non-escalating games).

What do you think?

I've been thinking about this for a while.

Earlier on some people thought that Gendarmerie was overpowered. I disagree, and with careful husbanding of the troops on the battleship, even if someone starts with Gendarmerie and gets a lucky bunch of bombardments, the advantage can be overcome.

Kum Kale is different, because most of the SW landing boats have no battleship support. Sometimes a lucky start that includes Kum Kale is difficult to break, indeed. I'm wondering if L2, 3, 4, and 5 could start with 1 troop more? Not L1, because it has battleship support, and not L6 because it would just make it easy to take Kum Kale and pass the problem to someone else.

Anyway, it's not a huge thing, but maybe a tiny tweak is possible.


Appreciate your request for that tweak, Dukasaur.
I'd like to hear from others though if they think the same. :)
Also, i must point out, that in the real battle, a lot of the fighting in that Cape Helles region was historically twarted and didn't last long, the objectives of capturing the forts was never reached. In some ways, and in some games that can reflect the difficulty of that fighting.
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Re: Re: WWI: Gallipoli [21.9.13] V38 (p22) - BETA

Postby Armandolas on Mon Jan 13, 2014 5:13 pm

i dont think kum kale is overpowered, ive been able to hold it and and ive been able to break it. That depends on what your priorities are.
I do believe that the nothern entrance to the southern regions should be balanced like the ones near kum kale.
I also wished that bs majestic would have a ship closer to it instead of a 4 vs 3+1 ships, but it seems that is impossible due to historical reasons
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