Surrender/Resign/Forfeit Button

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Postby niMic on Mon Apr 03, 2006 1:14 pm

How about effectivly booting that player from the game, but still have his color on the territories and his cards remaining? That way, he can go on to play another game, and whoever wanted to take his cards can do so.
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Postby Jota on Mon Apr 03, 2006 1:50 pm

That seems like a logical solution to me. As far as the other players are concerned, it'd be exactly the same as if that person just stopped taking turns. The only differences would be that A) they wouldn't be holding up the game by letting the round time out every time, and B) it wouldn't be taking up a space in their list of active games anymore.
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Surrender Button

Postby thegrimsleeper on Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:18 pm

So there's a really great thread going on here...
:arrow: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=811

the back story can be found here...
:arrow: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=156

It seems that the general consensus of those posting in these two threads is:

There should be a surrender button. When you hit it, you forfeit the game. Your armies stay the same color, and your cards are not lost, but still able to be taken by whoever conquers the remainder of your lost armies.

We took out the surrender button in the first place because people were abusing it, but it seems that now that it's gone, there are more deadbeats.
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Postby moz976 on Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:23 pm

Would a person who surrenders still lose points?
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Postby AndyDufresne on Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:31 pm

To me, the surrender buttons seems to support poor sportsmanship. If you are losing in a game of baseball, soccer, sorry, yahtzee, anything...you don't just quit. It's frowned upon there and should be frowned upon here. I've been in a few games already where I have been screwed over early on, but still kept playing on the off chance something went my way. I do see the advantages of the surrender options, getting people out of the games they don't want to play, lessening flaming etc. Also allowing the person to get into more fun games where they have a chance, but sheesh...it's RISK. You've got to take the chance that you are going to get your rear handed to you.

--Andy
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Postby moz976 on Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:38 pm

I agree with Andy I have been beaten down to one man only to come back and win the game.
I won't be using the surrender button if it ever comes back but if it was brought back it might help with the ever present deadbeat issue.
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Postby thegrimsleeper on Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:39 pm

Yes, if you surrender, you still lose points.

Andy, don't think of it so much as poor sportsmanship... I prefer to think of it as if you were playing a game of Poker, and you fold, because you know you're not going to win.

Now, me personally, I never used the Surrender button when it was an option, but I do know some people who did use it and are still playing on the site today. I just think that it was a good idea to begin with that needed a bit of tweaking.

Besides, if lack brings it back, and it turns out to be a disaster, he can always jsut take it out again.
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Postby AndyDufresne on Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:42 pm

I see what you are getting at Grim, but folding seems more like a forfeit of a particular round rather than the whole game. But I guess it'd be worth a shot to implement it again, but I'm still not for it.

--Andy
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Postby lackattack on Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:12 pm

I'm concerned that if we bring back the surrender button people will use it to go game hopping. Conquer Club isn't like watching T.V. and flipping the channel when you're bored. You are playing games with real people who want to see some action. The fact that a game consumes one of your 4 precious spots is an incentive to play competitively, which makes CC more fun for everyone. That's my theory, at least.
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Postby mikey6rocker on Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:33 pm

i agree, but if you know you will loose and it is your last couple turns, you should be able to surrender and get it off your 4 game chart. when you know you are going to loose there is no point in having the game take space. especially when your opponent is taking very long between turns and taking to long to eliminate you already.
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Postby zorba_ca on Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:07 pm

If you want a surrender button move to France.

Once you are in a game you should be in a game till the end. If a player chooses not to play they should be a deadbeat after 3 rounds (same as now), but here are my two amendments:

1. The game should not come off the player's list (i.e. until the player is eliminated it should count as an active game) so it is a penalty on a player for not playing out his/her game; and

2. The player's cards should still remain up for grabs. The idea about the cards going to the "neutral" player is not bad, it needs some fine tuning. For example, what would happen if two players become deadbeats? Does the nuetral player get both of their cards? Maybe the better suggestion was to keep the colours, and when you eliminate that colour you get the cards.
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Postby Fangz on Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:25 pm

I agree.

Also, if all surviving players but one have surrendered, the game should end automatically.
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Postby zorba_ca on Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:20 am

Since there are two active threads about this topic I'm reposting my response from the other thread:

If you want a surrender button move to France.

Once you are in a game you should be in a game till the end. If a player chooses not to play they should be a deadbeat after 3 rounds (same as now), but here are my two amendments:

1. The game should not come off the player's list (i.e. until the player is eliminated it should count as an active game) so it is a penalty on a player for not playing out his/her game; and

2. The player's cards should still remain up for grabs. The idea about the cards going to the "neutral" player is not bad, it needs some fine tuning. For example, what would happen if two players become deadbeats? Does the nuetral player get both of their cards? Maybe the better suggestion was to keep the colours, and when you eliminate that colour you get the cards.
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Postby Aladriel on Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:23 am

You know what I have noticed? People who join a game, see where their men are positioned, and then abandon the game when they don't like what they see. I've even seen this happen during team games! Then, of course, the rest of us have to wait for 24 hours for 3 days till this person gets kicked out. They don't get penalized because they are a deadbeat. But, their partner gets royally hosed. Can we do anything about those people???
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Postby Mjolnirs on Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:38 am

Aladriel wrote:You know what I have noticed? People who join a game, see where their men are positioned, and then abandon the game when they don't like what they see. I've even seen this happen during team games! Then, of course, the rest of us have to wait for 24 hours for 3 days till this person gets kicked out. They don't get penalized because they are a deadbeat. But, their partner gets royally hosed. Can we do anything about those people???

I've seen something along these lines in the last few days. I was in a game where one player was down to 1 army on 1 country. Rather than make a play so the game could move on, he made us all sit for 24 hours before someone could eliminate him.
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Postby colin cool on Thu Apr 06, 2006 9:56 pm

if people surrender in the first three rounds they should lose more points. they could either deadbeat like they would or lose more points so that might help stop the game hopping
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"End game" option

Postby Banana Stomper on Tue Apr 25, 2006 6:46 pm

I think an option to prematurely end games might be a nice option, like, if one player could propose a draw or something of that nature. I'm not sure if or how it might be abused, but i think it could definitely be used to save some people some trouble. Me for instance :D .
I jumped into a game with one opening hoping to just get started right away, and where i found myself was in a game with three friends who were waiting for their fourth, but alas, i found my way there before the lost friend. Because i was not the desired competitor, my three opponents decided to not play at all, and therefore not take their turns, so i'm left with a game slot taken by one in which i can hardly play. Hopefully my plan to take one of them out before going deadbeat comes to pass though :lol: .
Back to the point, if they didn't want to play, and an end game option existed, i'd be brimming with action packed conquering, and not settling for a mesely three games. I guess i could just get a premium membership...but thats beside the point.
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Postby Banana Stomper on Thu Apr 27, 2006 2:50 pm

Well, i settled my problem. I bought a premium membership. Lack, this site rocks. But..i still think the end game option might be a decent idea. And my chances of getting a guy out before he goes deadbeat are looking good.
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Postby .SCuD. on Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:33 am

I like the idea of this, especially for large deadbeat games.

A game can of course be ended only if all remaining players agree... all scores remain unaffected (so even if you went out early you lose no points)

I played a game a few days back where 2 players went deadbeat early in a 5 person game and I would have liked to end it early. Thankfully I won, but the principle remains the same.

Also a post on deadbeating to follow...
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Leaving a game partway through.

Postby Lord Paradise on Sat May 06, 2006 9:18 am

I know it's kinda stupid that I want to, but aside from deadbeating till I'm eliminated, can't I ditch my fourth game for a new one?
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Postby Aladriel on Sat May 06, 2006 11:07 am

Nope. My advice? Play your heart out. Take as many armies from your enemies as you possibly can in the process.
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Postby qeee1 on Sat May 06, 2006 11:13 am

I never get people who want to quit mid way through a game. If I'm gonna get knocked out in the next turn or two then it's not going to take long. And if I'm not going to be knocked out that quickly I reckon I'm still in with a chance of winning... oh and comebacks are the sweetest.
Frigidus wrote:but now that it's become relatively popular it's suffered the usual downturn in coolness.
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Postby Twill on Sat May 06, 2006 6:48 pm

The surrender button was removed intentionally because people would "steal" cards from players right before they would take them out. This was a bigger problem in doubles games than in singles, but was a problem all around.

If you can come up with a way to have surrenders in without this problem, feel free to suggest it :)

Have a great day, may it be fought to the last man
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Postby juggalonw on Sun May 07, 2006 11:55 am

might be a stupid Idea, But could you make it so if a person surrendered that there controled land turned into white and allowed the other teams to fight over them, removing any unused cards from the surrendering player?
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Postby Derwiddle on Sun May 07, 2006 12:06 pm

We used to have that feature, but it was abused too much and really annoyed people who actually wanted to play a full game of RISK. So to the desires of the people, Lackattack removed it. Clicky
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