Post Any Evidence For God Here

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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby crispybits on Wed May 22, 2013 2:34 pm

Dr Lawrence,

How do you define separate kinds? By your posts I am forced to conclude that you mean that kinds are groupings of animals that cannot interbreed, say horses, dogs, cats, rodents, etc are all "kinds" of animal. The test (one of them, at least) of whether an animal is of the same kind as another animal is whether or not the sperm of that animal will successfully fertilise the egg of the other animal. If the two animals cannot interbreed then does this mean they are definitely different kinds of animal, or are there additional criteria and the failure of interbreeding is just one indicator amongst others? If there are other factors, please could you explain what they are.

In order to accept your evidence for God, I need to make sure I understand it. I could be operating under a different definition for "kind" than you are.

Sincerely,
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby waauw on Wed May 22, 2013 2:38 pm

universalchiro wrote:All [when ever someone says "all", you must throw a red flag and study what they say to except or refute], All creatures that mutate too far away from their kind, are sterile. Hence, ending any further movement away from their kind.


Ending any further movement away from their kind? The problem you are forgetting is that animals keep mutating and they keep passing their mutations to the others through procreation. And as a wild animal in Europe can't mate with an animal in South-east asia due to distance issues, differences occur after a while between the same animal species between different regions. In time they will keep procreating with animals from their own region and they will keep moving further and further away from each other. This process never stops.


universalchiro wrote:But even if they weren't sterile, their pituitary gland releases hormones that cause that particular kind of creature to seek and pursue only their same kind. Also, pheromones released by all creatures are receptor specific to attract their same kind.


Why mention this? This is the exact same story as with the sperm cells.

universalchiro wrote:Putting this all in perspective:
1. Only the male sperm of the same specific kind has the enzyme to dissolve the egg shell of the same specific kind.
2. The pituitary gland of each kind of creature, produce desire for the same kind.
3. Pheromones released to attract a mate by the females, is receptor specific for their same kind.
4. When a creature mutates too far from their kind, they are sterile.
5. When a female sheep or goat is in heat, and a male dog is overwhelmed with desire to copulate outside their kind, the dog sperm still lacks the enzyme to dissolve the ovum of other kinds, except their own kind.


How does this prove the existence of God or disprove Evolution? You have not addressed evolution whatsoever. Maybe you are trying to make a point and I don't see it. It's always possible, but please start connecting the dots instead of drawing more dots without explaining your line of thought.

universalchiro wrote:For 5,000 years that mankind has been keeping records, there is never and never will be a record of sheep giving birth to a half dog, or a female dog giving birth to a half goat. Why? All creatures have been sealed to reproduce after their own kind. Genesis 1:24 "Then God said, "Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind; cattle and creeping things and bests of the earth after their kind; and it was so. God made the beasts of earth after their kind, and the cattle after their kind; and everything that creeps on the ground after its kind;.. vs 26 Then God said, ' Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; ... God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.


Actually mankind has been keeping records for between 5,500 and 6000 years(ancient sumeria) and counting in wallpaintings its even more.
Also how in hell does this prove the existence of a God? Because some guy in ancient times saw the exact same thing everybody else saw and wrote it down in a so-called holy book does not make it proof of the rest of the crap in the book being true.

universalchiro wrote:To think otherwise, is a religion. Why? Their is no evidence, their is only faith that dogs evolved from cats, or sheep evolved from wolf, or cats evolved from squirrels, or humans evolved from apes, or etc... purely faith based.
Put this another way:
1. We could soak a cat ovum in a pool of dog sperm and nothing will happen.
2. We could take a female dog in heat, with a herd of male sheep/goat/cats and no fertilization occurs.


purely faith based? I agree that evolution is just a theory, but it is strongly based on evidence. Because something isn't fully proven yet, does not make it a form of faith. As long as a person can give a rational reason for why he or she believes in it, then it's not based on faith. Then it's based on probability.
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby waauw on Wed May 22, 2013 3:04 pm

universalchiro wrote:
CreepersWiener wrote:I am looking for evidence of God. If any of you have any...please post it here.


People believe the age of the earth is billions of years old. Why? Well that's what scientist are telling us. Why do scientist tell us that the earth is billions of years old?

There are several assumptions that are built upon to come to this conclusion. We'll address one today.

They see how much space debris is added to earth each year. This is a known and accepted fact that 80,000lbs of space debris is added to the earth each year. Now what the scientist do with that information is where there is a breakdown in discernment.

For they see all the layers of the earth. And at the current rate of debris being added to the earth, in deed it would take billions of years for all the layers to form. But there is a major problem with this belief/theory.


I don't think you understand what the theories are. The earth didn't grow year by year through little pieces of dust. According to the big bang theory there must've been a lot more debris flying out there at the start of our universe. In other words the earth didn't grow layer by layer. At the beginning it grew rather fast due to many large pieces of rock flying into each other, creating chemical reactions etc.

Also I do agree people rely on scientists based on some form of faith. However people are able to get the knowledge these scientists acquired. In other words people are able to learn these fields of science and actually reproduce many of the tests, calculations, etc. And as we live in a capitalist world people do actually continuesly check and re-check everything, because that's just what happens in free societies. Keeping this in mind there should've been tons of rational arguments and decent proof that scientists were wrong, however that is not always the case, especially with the theory of evolution. With the big bang theory that's a whole other story. There is tons of proof this might be wrong.


universalchiro wrote:Petrified trees

Petrified trees are said to take 500,000 years to form. But for petrified trees to occur, there needs to be lots of soil covering, moisture, pressure and heat covering the trees in a relatively short period of time. Why a short period of time and what is a short period of time. Time as in not longer than a year to cover the tree. Why? if the time to cover the tree is longer than a year, the tree will decay and dissolve to a stump.

So what, why is this significant to debunking a billion year old earth? There are 100's of vertically standing petrified trees on multiple continents that transcend through 20 layers of soil. If it took millions of years for each layer of soil to build up, there would be no vertically standing petrified trees. For they would have long since decayed by the time a layer built up above it's stump. Therefore, vertically standing petrified trees are remnant byproducts of soil settling fast (within a year) covering the tree.

What event in earth's history fits a scenario with soil settling quicker covering trees in about a year, versus the current evolutionary model of soil building up over millions of years to cover the trees? The Biblical global flood. Genesis 7. Not only did it rain for 40 days and 40 nights, but huge water caverns burst violently open.Genesis 7:11 all the fountains of the great deep burst open, and the floodgates of the sky were opened.... Now if water is bursting out of the earth, that water will be filled with clay, rock, dirt, sedimentary soil, silt, etc. And that water with high turbity (lots of earth mixed with it), the dirt will settle in layers according to density.

This explains why there are layers on the earth and why petrified trees transcend multiple layers. This is strong evidence that what the Bible describes is spot on accurate and give evidence of God since He is the author of the Bible. It's God's own testimony of what He did and what He requires of us.

Sincerely,
Dr. Lawrence


I think you need to learn more about the sciences outside of biology. You clearly have no grasp on Physics and Geology. Not all pieces of soil keep getting covered continuesly with new layers. Take a look for example at hills and mountains. Land continuesly gets washed off them by wind and rain. This process is called erosion.

On top of that a few hundred even a few thousand, tenthousand or hundredthousand is nothing compared to the man billions, trillions and even quadrillions of trees that might existed throughout the many era the earth has existed. In fact because of the large numbers of trees that have existed, the chances of one tree fossilizing is actually quite probably.
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby tzor on Wed May 22, 2013 8:45 pm

universalchiro wrote:Evolution would not do that. Evolution does not allow for exclusivity of any kind of creature on earth. For with evolution there would be creatures evolving, devolving and with no changes (ie moving laterally).


I would invert the argument. In fact it might better explain the "origin of species" (as opposed to subspecies). Once the enzyme evolves to the point of incompatibility, interbreeding with previous strains cannot occur and significant genetic separation can occur in a relatively short time. Without this, changes could always be diluted by previous generations.
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby BigBallinStalin on Wed May 22, 2013 9:05 pm

Nordik wrote:
universalchiro wrote:give evidence of God since He is the author of the Bible.


And now I know you're just trolling. Nice try though. :lol:


Nordik, on behalf of CC, we admire your desire for an honest debate--even until the moment of truth (discovery of unviersalio's trolling/stupidity). For your efforts, please enjoy the following:


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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby Gillipig on Thu May 23, 2013 2:23 am

Here is my evidence of GOD'S EXISTENCE

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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby crispybits on Thu May 23, 2013 4:06 am

I will see your Jesus toast and raise you:

Pastafarian toast
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"Darwinist" toast
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Atheist toast (by far the most common toast worldwide, thus proving that most toasters are atheists, and who are we to call millions of toasters wrong!)
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby waauw on Thu May 23, 2013 4:27 am

crispybits wrote:Atheist toast (by far the most common toast worldwide, thus proving that most toasters are atheists, and who are we to call millions of toasters wrong!)
Image


hahahahha that last one cracked me up :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby universalchiro on Thu May 23, 2013 11:33 am

waauw wrote:
universalchiro wrote:
CreepersWiener wrote:I am looking for evidence of God. If any of you have any...please post it here.


The human female ovum (egg) has a shell around it to seal and protect the chromosomes from being fertilized by the wrong kind of creature. There is only one kind of creature on earth that has the proper enzyme to dissolve this shell for fertilization. It's the human male.

At the tip of the spermatozoa, is a capitulate enzyme that when it comes in contact with the ovum shell, this enzyme dissolves the shell for fertilization.

No other creature on earth has this enzyme to dissolve the human ovum for fertilization.

In fact each kind of animal, the male of that kind, is the only creature on earth that has the enzyme to dissolve the ovum of their female kind for fertilization. For example: all male dogs have the enzyme for all female dogs.
And all male equine have the enzyme to dissolve the female ovum shell of only their female same kind.

Evolution would not do that. Evolution does not allow for exclusivity of any kind of creature on earth. For with evolution there would be creatures evolving, devolving and with no changes (ie moving laterally).

But since all mankind was created in the image of God, God sealed His creation, protected His creation. So that even when mankind practiced beastiality, God's creation of His own image, would remain pure, clean, sealed, protected.

Since we are created in the image of God, we perform the same acts with our creations:
When humans write a book, to protect their book, they will copyright it.
When humans paint a painting, they will sign the bottom corner to seal it and protect their ownership.
When an inventor invents something, they will patent their invention to seal it, protect it.

You wanted evidence, this is very strong evidence.
Sincerely,
Dr. Lawrence


Anyway you state that Darwin's theory doesn't add up because of the fact that animals can't crossbreed because of some enzyme. However if that very enzyme would mutate, as animals do in time, doesn't that mean the enzyme stops working? Or if I would rephrase this, doesn't that mean that evolution is the cause of animals not being able to crossbreed?

As far as I understand animal reproduction functions a bit similar to gravity. The further you are from the gravitational field the less influence that field will have on you. So the more animals have mutated away from each other, the higher the probability that they won't be able to mate. The reason for this being that the the probability of their enzymes or membranes having mutated might have mutated too.

The problem is in fact that to fully comprehend how animals functions, one ought to understand the entire DNA-sequence of the creature. However science hasn't gotten that far yet. We are still decades away from fully mapping our own DNA-sequence(and especially from having clear insights into them), let alone those of other animals. So why state that it is proof of there being a god if the basic building blocks of our body aren't even understood? In my honest opinion, the best we can do is say "I don't know".

Another point I'd like to bring to your attention is that if we do assume life on earth was created(just an assumption). What proves that we were created by a divine entity(I interpret it as all powerfull and all knowing). Why not believe we were created by aliens? Even if you got conclusive proof that animals were intelligently designed, you still have no proof of who did it.


Great questions waauw, Let me tackle them one at a time:
1. if that very enzyme would mutate, as animals do in time, doesn't that mean the enzyme stops working? Or if I would rephrase this, doesn't that mean that evolution is the cause of animals not being able to crossbreed? Mutations are usually sterile, or lack physical attributes that a female would select for breeding. The female selects the male, if the male has mutations, she will not accept him. If the mutations are significant, the mother from birth will reject or kill the mutation. But usually the mutants are sterile. So the reality is the mother either kills the newborn mutant or rejects helpless newborn thereby it dies 100% of time. Or the adult mutant is not desired by adult female, so that she won't accept it's advances. Or the mutant is to weak to ward off the alpha male and can't spread it's mutant genes. But let's take your hypothetical scenario to the end: Let's say that the enzyme of a male kind mutates and can't dissolve the female ovum shell. Then that mutant kind dies off w/o offspring. Therefore, ending further mutations. This keeps the kinds the same.

2. The problem is in fact that to fully comprehend how animals functions, one ought to understand the entire DNA-sequence of the creature. However science hasn't gotten that far yet. We are still decades away from fully mapping our own DNA-sequence(and especially from having clear insights into them), let alone those of other animals. So why state that it is proof of there being a god if the basic building blocks of our body aren't even understood? In my honest opinion, the best we can do is say "I don't know". If the best people can say is, "I don't know", then why is Evolution is taught as fact, yet it's a conjecture, a best guess if you will. But here are some counter points to think about: We have mapped the human DNA sequence. Mapping animal DNA sequence is probably years away, not decades. But that doesn't matter. But see if this moves you: By your above statement we are in accord that the DNA structures of life is more vastly complex than thought possible. Life is so complex that life can reproduce and self heal, this is a complexity that still eludes us even as advanced we think we are. So evolution teaches that life spontaneously come into existence in a primordial pool of complex chemicals and amino acids and proteins. And that with enough time, the simple single cell that spontaneously formed became more complex and evolved into the complexities of today. Yet Physics, has laws that can't be violated. One of them is Entropy. This law says that all, everything, no exception, always, all life, all matter, all mass goes from order to disorder. The two are incompatible. And that's one area where evolutionist take a leap of faith and stop being science based and start being faith based.

It's illogical to think that matter and energy, since both have limited life spans and are not eternal, to take the leap of faith that both matter and energy have existed forever in eternity past. It's logical to say that an eternal God, has always been eternal.

Whenever we see even the simplest forms of design, we assume a designer. For example, archeologist see small rocks in a circle in a dig, and they'll say, "that's orderly, therefore, this is possible evidence that man organized this thousands of years ago. But when we get to complexities of life (ie mapping the DNA structures), we don't draw the same conclusion. Why? Because there is a fear of saying there is a God. For if there is a God, then we are accountable by His commandments.

3. Another point I'd like to bring to your attention is that if we do assume life on earth was created(just an assumption). What proves that we were created by a divine entity(I interpret it as all powerfull and all knowing). Why not believe we were created by aliens? Even if you got conclusive proof that animals were intelligently designed, you still have no proof of who did it? The Bible was written over a period of 3,000 years by 35 different authors. The Bible describes the earth being a sphere in Isaiah 40 in 650BC way before mankind new the earth was a sphere. The Psalms talk about the Sun drags the planets across the galaxies 1,000's of years before mankind figured out that the earth is not the center of our solar system. There 300+ prophecies regarding Jesus alone that were written 500 years before he was born that were fulled. So those writers claimed God inspired them and what they wrote came true, so there is something beyond human ability in the Bible. All the archeology discoveries corroborates what the Bible discussed in history. The Bible discussed hygiene and dietary laws 1000yrs before science discovered germ theory and sanitation concepts. The Bible discusses the hydrological cycle 1000's of years before science discerned how. So the Bible has shown knowledge beyond human abilities to know those things. The Bible even foretold of humans believing that they evolved from of sources of life. Jeremiah 2: “As a thief is disgraced when he is caught, so the people are disgraced- they, their kings and their officials, their priests and their prophets. 27 They say to wood, ‘You are my father,’ and to stone, ‘You gave me birth.’ They have turned their backs to Me and not their faces;
yet when they are in trouble, they say, ‘Come and save us!’ 28 Where then are the gods you made for yourselves?
Let them come if they can save you when you are in trouble!".. Written 2,500 years before Darwin.

Jesus believed in a literal Adam and Eve and so did all the other writers in the Bible. What options do we have if the Genesis account of creation is wrong and evolution is correct? Since it was written that Jesus knew all things, then either Jesus didn't know there were errors in the Genesis creation account. Then Jesus couldn't be God in the flesh and Jesus was a fraud a charlatan. If Jesus knew there were errors in the Genesis creation account, but covered them up, then Jesus is not the savior, he is the Devil. The other option is Jesus was correct and the Genesis creation account is His own testimony of what He did with His Father in the beginning.
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby universalchiro on Thu May 23, 2013 12:20 pm

Nordik wrote:
universalchiro wrote:
CreepersWiener wrote:I am looking for evidence of God. If any of you have any...please post it here.


The human female ovum (egg) has a shell around it to seal and protect the chromosomes from being fertilized by the wrong kind of creature. There is only one kind of creature on earth that has the proper enzyme to dissolve this shell for fertilization. It's the human male.

At the tip of the spermatozoa, is a capitulate enzyme that when it comes in contact with the ovum shell, this enzyme dissolves the shell for fertilization.

No other creature on earth has this enzyme to dissolve the human ovum for fertilization.

In fact each kind of animal, the male of that kind, is the only creature on earth that has the enzyme to dissolve the ovum of their female kind for fertilization. For example: all male dogs have the enzyme for all female dogs.
And all male equine have the enzyme to dissolve the female ovum shell of only their female same kind.

Evolution would not do that. Evolution does not allow for exclusivity of any kind of creature on earth. For with evolution there would be creatures evolving, devolving and with no changes (ie moving laterally).

But since all mankind was created in the image of God, God sealed His creation, protected His creation. So that even when mankind practiced beastiality, God's creation of His own image, would remain pure, clean, sealed, protected.

Since we are created in the image of God, we perform the same acts with our creations:
When humans write a book, to protect their book, they will copyright it.
When humans paint a painting, they will sign the bottom corner to seal it and protect their ownership.
When an inventor invents something, they will patent their invention to seal it, protect it.

You wanted evidence, this is very strong evidence.
Sincerely,
Dr. Lawrence


So please explain to me breeds of dogs. And please explain to me how dogs can mate with wolves, jackals and various other very distinct species.

While we may not be able to mate with the various ape species today (not sure anyone has tried for a while), there is certainly a wealth of evidence that we could reproduce successfully with other Hominidae species before they died out.

There are a large amount of examples of evolution that has been observed in living history. Evolution that has created completely new species which cannot mate with the founder species. The easiest example of course are Darwin's finches, but there are many, many others.

For a simplistic diagrammatic representation of how this occurs, see below.

Image

Is it so difficult to for you to imagine that one of these species which has evolved no longer really needs the use of their wings and when a slight mutation causes the wings to become more limb like this makes them better at surviving?

Or lets go from the other direction. While they are in the vast minority, there are plenty of humans that have webbed feet and hands. Before the advent of relatively modern medicine (and lets neglect the fact that they were put to death by various religious institutions for a moment) they would have issues gripping basic tools. Today of course, it is a relatively simple procedure to correct this for the most part. However, what if humans were more reliant on food from the sea? Would not this mutation make them a lot better at surviving?

Humans are even now evolving. Just a few centuries ago, the Vikings were seen as giants by the people that they were raiding, but by today's standards they were really rather short. In 1954 the four minute mile was first achieved. But by today's standards for top athletes, that is actually pretty slow. That is evolution. We are biologically placing more and more emphasis on being tall and fast.

The whole idea that humans were "made" by a supreme being doesn't even slightly take into account observable facts and today, the majority of people that believe in creationism only believe in creationism insofar as that god made the spark that created life and hence ultimately created us. It is a kind of semi-creationism sell out version to be honest.


So please explain to me breeds of dogs. And please explain to me how dogs can mate with wolves, jackals and various other very distinct species.
They are the same kind... The term species is invented by man. As animals adapt to environment and lets say they can't reproduce because of size limitations (ie great dane and maltese) or geography or disease or etc, they are still they same kind.

While we may not be able to mate with the various ape species today (not sure anyone has tried for a while), there is certainly a wealth of evidence that we could reproduce successfully with other Hominidae species before they died out.
This is ironic that you would mention other hominidae, as though they actually existed. When I was growing up, there was a missing link called "Lucy". She was bipedal lower extremity with ape upper body. It took 25 years to discover that the archeologist falsified his evidence. He took a monkey 1 mile away from a human and combined the two claiming he found both in one location. Very sad state, but he isn't alone. Archeorator, the missing link of dinosaurs and birds, was also proven to be falsified... Same with Haekel's embryo drawings that is still in text books today. He was jailed for falsifying his drawings.
Click image to enlarge.
image
. Your wealth of evidence is not there. This is faith based on what others have told you. You have not researched and found out what was true or falsified.

Image There is no evolution here. This is called adaptation or specialization. For they are still gnats.

Humans are even now evolving. Just a few centuries ago, the Vikings were seen as giants by the people that they were raiding, but by today's standards they were really rather short. In 1954 the four minute mile was first achieved. But by today's standards for top athletes, that is actually pretty slow. That is evolution. We are biologically placing more and more emphasis on being tall and fast.
. That is not evolution. This again is adaptation or specialization. Even after all this adaptation, we are still the same kind. HUMAN. Jesse Owens the fastest man on earth in 1936 Olympics. If he raced today, he would lose to Usain Bolt by 20 meters. But we are still humans. This is the classic error that most people make, they see settle changes and bypass the natural adaptation to environment and diseases and take a huge leap of faith into evolution of different kinds. No where in history and no where today and no where in the future, will adaptation change the kind.

All dogs can trace their heritage back to one dog, probably the wolf. But it's still a dog. Same with all kinds. No matter how many times a creatures sperm gets on a Pistal of a plant flower, there will never be fertilization. No matter how many times a flowers Stamen brushes up against a passing female animal in heat, there will be no fertilization. Why? because they are different kinds. Same with all birds, fish, creatures. Different kinds never fertilize different kinds. Another proof of no evolution. Sure there are ample examples of adaptation, but the kind will always stay the same. Don't confuse evolution (changing of kinds) with adaptation (changes within kinds, but still the same kind).
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby Symmetry on Thu May 23, 2013 12:28 pm

universalchiro wrote:
Nordik wrote:
universalchiro wrote:
CreepersWiener wrote:I am looking for evidence of God. If any of you have any...please post it here.


The human female ovum (egg) has a shell around it to seal and protect the chromosomes from being fertilized by the wrong kind of creature. There is only one kind of creature on earth that has the proper enzyme to dissolve this shell for fertilization. It's the human male.

At the tip of the spermatozoa, is a capitulate enzyme that when it comes in contact with the ovum shell, this enzyme dissolves the shell for fertilization.

No other creature on earth has this enzyme to dissolve the human ovum for fertilization.

In fact each kind of animal, the male of that kind, is the only creature on earth that has the enzyme to dissolve the ovum of their female kind for fertilization. For example: all male dogs have the enzyme for all female dogs.
And all male equine have the enzyme to dissolve the female ovum shell of only their female same kind.
Evolution would not do that. Evolution does not allow for exclusivity of any kind of creature on earth. For with evolution there would be creatures evolving, devolving and with no changes (ie moving laterally).

But since all mankind was created in the image of God, God sealed His creation, protected His creation. So that even when mankind practiced beastiality, God's creation of His own image, would remain pure, clean, sealed, protected.

Since we are created in the image of God, we perform the same acts with our creations:
When humans write a book, to protect their book, they will copyright it.
When humans paint a painting, they will sign the bottom corner to seal it and protect their ownership.
When an inventor invents something, they will patent their invention to seal it, protect it.

You wanted evidence, this is very strong evidence.
Sincerely,
Dr. Lawrence


So please explain to me breeds of dogs. And please explain to me how dogs can mate with wolves, jackals and various other very distinct species.

While we may not be able to mate with the various ape species today (not sure anyone has tried for a while), there is certainly a wealth of evidence that we could reproduce successfully with other Hominidae species before they died out.

There are a large amount of examples of evolution that has been observed in living history. Evolution that has created completely new species which cannot mate with the founder species. The easiest example of course are Darwin's finches, but there are many, many others.

For a simplistic diagrammatic representation of how this occurs, see below.

Image

Is it so difficult to for you to imagine that one of these species which has evolved no longer really needs the use of their wings and when a slight mutation causes the wings to become more limb like this makes them better at surviving?

Or lets go from the other direction. While they are in the vast minority, there are plenty of humans that have webbed feet and hands. Before the advent of relatively modern medicine (and lets neglect the fact that they were put to death by various religious institutions for a moment) they would have issues gripping basic tools. Today of course, it is a relatively simple procedure to correct this for the most part. However, what if humans were more reliant on food from the sea? Would not this mutation make them a lot better at surviving?

Humans are even now evolving. Just a few centuries ago, the Vikings were seen as giants by the people that they were raiding, but by today's standards they were really rather short. In 1954 the four minute mile was first achieved. But by today's standards for top athletes, that is actually pretty slow. That is evolution. We are biologically placing more and more emphasis on being tall and fast.

The whole idea that humans were "made" by a supreme being doesn't even slightly take into account observable facts and today, the majority of people that believe in creationism only believe in creationism insofar as that god made the spark that created life and hence ultimately created us. It is a kind of semi-creationism sell out version to be honest.


So please explain to me breeds of dogs. And please explain to me how dogs can mate with wolves, jackals and various other very distinct species.
They are the same kind... The term species is invented by man. As animals adapt to environment and lets say they can't reproduce because of size limitations (ie great dane and maltese) or geography or disease or etc, they are still they same kind.

While we may not be able to mate with the various ape species today (not sure anyone has tried for a while), there is certainly a wealth of evidence that we could reproduce successfully with other Hominidae species before they died out.
This is ironic that you would mention other hominidae, as though they actually existed. When I was growing up, there was a missing link called "Lucy". She was bipedal lower extremity with ape upper body. It took 25 years to discover that the archeologist falsified his evidence. He took a monkey 1 mile away from a human and combined the two claiming he found both in one location. Very sad state, but he isn't alone. Archeorator, the missing link of dinosaurs and birds, was also proven to be falsified... Same with Haekel's embryo drawings that is still in text books today. He was jailed for falsifying his drawings.
Click image to enlarge.
image
. Your wealth of evidence is not there. This is faith based on what others have told you. You have not researched and found out what was true or falsified.

Image There is no evolution here. This is called adaptation or specialization. For they are still gnats.

Humans are even now evolving. Just a few centuries ago, the Vikings were seen as giants by the people that they were raiding, but by today's standards they were really rather short. In 1954 the four minute mile was first achieved. But by today's standards for top athletes, that is actually pretty slow. That is evolution. We are biologically placing more and more emphasis on being tall and fast.
. That is not evolution. This again is adaptation or specialization. Even after all this adaptation, we are still the same kind. HUMAN. Jesse Owens the fastest man on earth in 1936 Olympics. If he raced today, he would lose to Usain Bolt by 20 meters. But we are still humans. This is the classic error that most people make, they see settle changes and bypass the natural adaptation to environment and diseases and take a huge leap of faith into evolution of different kinds. No where in history and no where today and no where in the future, will adaptation change the kind.

All dogs can trace their heritage back to one dog, probably the wolf. But it's still a dog. Same with all kinds. No matter how many times a creatures sperm gets on a Pistal of a plant flower, there will never be fertilization. No matter how many times a flowers Stamen brushes up against a passing female animal in heat, there will be no fertilization. Why? because they are different kinds. Same with all birds, fish, creatures. Different kinds never fertilize different kinds. Another proof of no evolution. Sure there are ample examples of adaptation, but the kind will always stay the same. Don't confuse evolution (changing of kinds) with adaptation (changes within kinds, but still the same kind).


So your proof that evolution does not occur rests on a definition of evolution that nobody else accepts? Way to knock down the strawman you set up dude.
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby AndyDufresne on Thu May 23, 2013 12:28 pm

universalchiro wrote:Jesus believed in a literal Adam and Eve and so did all the other writers in the Bible. What options do we have if the Genesis account of creation is wrong and evolution is correct? Since it was written that Jesus knew all things, then either Jesus didn't know there were errors in the Genesis creation account. Then Jesus couldn't be God in the flesh and Jesus was a fraud a charlatan. If Jesus knew there were errors in the Genesis creation account, but covered them up, then Jesus is not the savior, he is the Devil. The other option is Jesus was correct and the Genesis creation account is His own testimony of what He did with His Father in the beginning.


I always feel like there are more options than those you seem to identify for a lot of things. Just sayin'.


--Andy
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby chang50 on Thu May 23, 2013 12:49 pm

Jesse Owens the fastest man on earth in 1936 Olympics. If he raced today, he would lose to Usain Bolt by 20 meters. But we are still humans. This is the classic error that most people make, they see settle changes and bypass the natural adaptation to environment and diseases and take a huge leap of faith into evolution of different kinds. No where in history and no where today and no where in the future, will adaptation change the kind.



Simply untrue Owens ran 10.2 in 1936 and Bolt's best time is 9.58,he would not win by 20 metres since Owens was not 20% slower over 100 metres.If you carelessly throw out misinformation like this why should we take anything you say to be reliable?
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby BigBallinStalin on Thu May 23, 2013 1:11 pm

chang50 wrote:Jesse Owens the fastest man on earth in 1936 Olympics. If he raced today, he would lose to Usain Bolt by 20 meters. But we are still humans. This is the classic error that most people make, they see settle changes and bypass the natural adaptation to environment and diseases and take a huge leap of faith into evolution of different kinds. No where in history and no where today and no where in the future, will adaptation change the kind.



Simply untrue Owens ran 10.2 in 1936 and Bolt's best time is 9.58,he would not win by 20 metres since Owens was not 20% slower over 100 metres.If you carelessly throw out misinformation like this why should we take anything you say to be reliable?


Because it confirms what he wants to take on faith.
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Re: Post Any Evidence For God Here

Postby universalchiro on Thu May 23, 2013 2:53 pm

chang50 wrote:Jesse Owens the fastest man on earth in 1936 Olympics. If he raced today, he would lose to Usain Bolt by 20 meters. But we are still humans. This is the classic error that most people make, they see settle changes and bypass the natural adaptation to environment and diseases and take a huge leap of faith into evolution of different kinds. No where in history and no where today and no where in the future, will adaptation change the kind.



Simply untrue Owens ran 10.2 in 1936 and Bolt's best time is 9.58,he would not win by 20 metres since Owens was not 20% slower over 100 metres.If you carelessly throw out misinformation like this why should we take anything you say to be reliable?

Honest mistake of 20feet versus 20 meters. My bad , good catch.
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