Religion vs. Science

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Postby Jucdor on Thu May 04, 2006 12:13 pm

WintersTwilight wrote:I am in fact very ready to hear what others have to say. The concern that I was voicing was that you have not seemed to succeed in saying anything of relevance. Or so it is in my opinion, and I hope that you do not take offense of it.


Fair enough. I think facts are relevant. My opinion is that even belief has to respect facts.

Actually, my intention is not to destroy anyone's belief system. I was hoping that I could possibly help those who have their beliefs not based on anything. I am in fact a Christian, and am not trying to argue against religion at all. I was actually trying to make an apology for the existance of God, but no one seemed interested.


Well if the discussion is limited to circle around God's existance then it is obvious that there are only two worthy opinions - he exists or he doesn't. And that is quite limiting and to my experience not very good ground to continue a debate long.

However I ran into hasty conclusion I admit. I read too much about you in the brief debate you had with fishfleas and I realise that it is evident that you didn't even say such things that my conclusions were. Sorry about that.

But now I didn't get what you meant with "making an apology for the existance of God." Care to clarify that sentence?

I did not know that you thought this a boring debate. The existance of God is, in my opinion, the most interesting debate there is. If you refuse to debate this issue, then I am afraid that I can do no further good.


No, this isn't a boring debate. What I meant was that if the discussion is limited to a mere existance of God then it's very restraining debate & not very fruitful in the long term.

I see things that to fully understand them you need to circle around them. Up, down, left, right, front & rear. All over again to see how things look like. As I've understood, you wanted to just go into the heart of things without the circlying around part at all. So it's not like we disagree on the topic, but on the method of discussion.
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Postby rocksolid on Thu May 04, 2006 12:58 pm

Jucdor, I think WT meant apology in a sense that most English speakers aren't aware of - this is from Merriam-Webster online - "APOLOGIA (apology) implies not admission of guilt or regret but a desire to make clear the grounds for some course, belief, or position."
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Postby WintersTwilight on Thu May 04, 2006 1:36 pm

That is exactly what I meant. Thank you, Rocksolid.
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Postby RabbitCold on Thu May 04, 2006 4:18 pm

hey nate :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Postby RabbitCold on Thu May 04, 2006 4:18 pm

OMG ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Flaming you for life!!! NOOBZZ SIW :shock: 8) :o :lol:
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Postby RabbitCold on Thu May 04, 2006 4:27 pm

Is this the right thread to flame? I dont like to impose on anyone...but yeah im like at school and bored and this was the thinkg that popped up in the off topic stuff...didnt want to ruin anyones game...PLZ dont kick :?: :?: :arrow: :arrow: :lol: 8) :shock:
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Postby WintersTwilight on Thu May 04, 2006 6:32 pm

I will try to rephrase the sentance. "I was actually trying to make a case to show why I believe in the existance of God, but no one seemed interested."
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Postby HighBorn on Thu May 04, 2006 6:50 pm

WintersTwilight wrote:I will try to rephrase the sentance. "I was actually trying to make a case to show why I believe in the existance of God, but no one seemed interested."


I enjoyed it... i just didnt feel smart enough to quote after each :oops: ...lol
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Postby 2dimes on Sun Mar 04, 2007 12:47 am

I can't wait to read this one somewhere in here "Man is compared to chickens".
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Postby CrazyAnglican on Sun Mar 04, 2007 2:06 am

PaperPlunger wrote:Here's a fun one: "Religion v. Evolution, which one is real? Or are they both?" let's argue over it!


My brother would disagree with me, but I don't see these as being mutually exclusive either. I mean take a peasant farmer from the Middle Ages. Suggesting that if he breeds this strong dog with that fast dog he might get a pup that is strong and fast probably wouldn't give him a problem.

But say "Hey, you know you're kind of like God to those dogs." or "You just proved that God doesn't exist because you meddled with creation". Then he might reply "Bllllllaaaaaaaaaaassssssssphemer!!!!!!!!!!!!!". Kind of oversimplified, but see my point?
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Postby lusi on Sun Mar 04, 2007 2:44 am

I agree with Lack completely!

Science and Religion and two separate entities.
Generally most are looking for answers to questions and perhaps need that sense of reality in order to believe it actually exists. We need to know how things work and why - continuously questioning our abilities and surroundings - Science.

If you believe in a religion, you dont have that need to question, you dont need proof of life per se or why He did this and that - you accept the decision.
I support both! :wink:
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Postby unriggable on Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:43 am

lusi wrote:I agree with Lack completely!

Science and Religion and two separate entities.
Generally most are looking for answers to questions and perhaps need that sense of reality in order to believe it actually exists. We need to know how things work and why - continuously questioning our abilities and surroundings - Science.

If you believe in a religion, you dont have that need to question, you dont need proof of life per se or why He did this and that - you accept the decision.
I support both! :wink:


Science and religion aren't two things that cant be together harmoniously UNLESS you take things written in the bible literally, which in my opinion you shouldn't (it's not a biography is a series of stories with morals of what to do and what not to do).
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Postby Xayath on Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:48 am

odd
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Postby Backglass on Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:04 am

WintersTwilight wrote: Have I missed something, or have we already concluded that a Divine Being exists?


You have only concluded that divine beings exist, by explaining away morality as something that must be deity inspired. I believe that the ability to have compassion for ones fellow man is a human trait with no supernatural influence needed.
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Postby SirSebstar on Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:12 am

Freakshow stated that science is better then religion, partly because religion does harm.

You could reverse that. Religion, in one form or another, helps to form communities. Religion is the ties that bind them effectivly to eachothe and give common ground for a value system that enabels a community to survive.
In that sense i dont see much wrong with religion even though i approach religion as a crutch for the masses.

Blind Faith is a problem, wether it´s based on religious or scientific fact. As an example the ´suprematie´ of the german race was supposedly based on scientific facts ( even though we now know there is and was none). On that basis horrible things were done. Ofcourse you could argue that where scientific fact is left for a dogma, you will have faith(religion) instead of science, but in that case this discussion is quickly over. Anything negative we count on religion..

I think of religion as a way of thinking about the fundaments of live and its meaning and getting a result that reads there has to be something out there.
I see Science as a way of asking questions as to why and how something does or does not work.

In thats respect science and religion as mutually exclusive, yet they can co-excist in a form where religion gives a (comferting) awnser on why we are here and what our purpose is (to sustain a sense of community for the sake of that communities survival) and science can help us with day to day scientific facts. The universe does not turn around earth and hell does not lies beneath the earth....

I do believe science can never solve every riddle out there. I dont think it needs to. Religion has a function in my view. But in my view it only has a function as long as we mankind as not far enough to walk without that crutch. However, in the past religion has granted us a better chance of survival and a sense of community that we as mankind need and needed to survive. SO yes, it has its purpose, and it will have one for the comming years...

But all the above it just my personal view.
I hope it was not to much to read
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Postby unriggable on Mon Mar 05, 2007 8:05 pm

I still think that the only god is the god inside each and every one of us, the one who passes judgement.
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Postby Anarkistsdream on Mon Mar 05, 2007 8:06 pm

unriggable wrote:I still think that the only god is the god inside each and every one of us, the one who passes judgement.


I have a hearty agreement in that, although I'm sure the core beliefs differ, that is a great way to describe my own beliefs...
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